Why did Bryke try to retcon their own series?

Why did Bryke try to retcon their own series?

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There wasn't an origin yet. You don't use the word "retcon" when it's making new material, it's for when someone contradicts an earlier story.

>Bending came from nature and emulating the animals
>Nah senpai a turtle did it.

That's a retcon

There was a pretty clear origin for bending. You know, the old "the first x-benders observed y".

Not to mention "The time before the Avatar, we would bend the energies in our own bodies" stuff.

No, that's an in-universe mythology invented by the people who had long forgotten the real origins of their powers

i hope Wan and the tapeworms get retconned if there's another series.

Aaron Ehasz came up with most of the original lore, studying Eastern religions and mythologies.
Bryke just winged it without him.

for korra, they had total control over the story and lore. i guess it went to their heads and they tried to change everything they didnt like, even if it destroyed the last serie.

i take korra as an alternate universe fanfiction.
sacking the sifu was a huge mistake, all martial art in korra look like generic animu fighting.

They're idiots and wanted LoK to top Atla. That's why the stakes are higher on the surface and why we get more setting information that isn't really needed but that people kinda wanted to know.

Sounds like a retcon though since it wasn't considered mythology in the original.

>be nonbender
>look at moon at night
>become waterbender
It was a nice folklore origin but taking it literally doesn't make sense. Not that lion turtles were much better.

That doesn't actually explain where bending came from. People observed the original benders to have a better understanding of their element, it's not like observing the badgermoles gave Toph earthbending. We were just suppose to assume it was spiritual mumbo jumbo that some people have magic powers.

While we don't know exactly why or who got bending, we do know it wasn't from the lion turtles. The lion turtle in Atla said there wasn't elemental bending before the avatar, so they can't have been handing it out like they did in Beginnings. Because we see in Beginnings that Wan isn't the first elemental bender, the hunters get at the same time and it is implied this isn't their first hunt meaning they got fire before that time.

Watching the Badgermoles for toph did however make her a better earthbender, possibly the best so there is a hierarchi benders in relation to the source of bending. Which also gels well with the inspiration for bending being magical kungfu. The original source and understanding gives you a boost in ability. That had nothing to do with Lion turtles, and all to do with Toph understanding earth bending in a fundamental way due in part to learning from the Badgermoles. It's the same reason why Zukos firebending returns stronger than before after seeing all the colours of fire.

> People observed the original benders to have a better understanding of their element, it's not like observing the badgermoles gave Toph earthbending.

All autists please see this. Bending is like punching. Any dipshit can throw punches like wild, but by studying something like a martial art, you get better at punching. Bending is the same and you can see it in the Wan saga., They get fire and all they do is blast it around a bunch. It isn't until Wan learns from the dragons that he truly learns fire bending. The hunters even comment on it "he uses fire unlike anyone else, like it's a part of himself"

tl;dr Turtles gave people element control, bending was learned later by studying animals/moon.

>retcon
he didnt retcon anything

That's still a change/retcon from the original since they always bent elements which is not what the lionturtle said in the original where they bent energy before the elements.

>All autists please see this. Bending is like punching. Any dipshit can throw punches like wild, but by studying something like a martial art, you get better at punching.
Thank you for this, sweetie. Now no one can be upset at Korra for using fire, earth, and water bending as a small child.

hay buddy she is THE AVATAR she can use all of them because of that how is that so hard for idiots to understand if somebody told aang as a kid he was the avatar he would be able to do it too

Do you not understand how stupid this is?

It was an attempt to awkwardly and unnecessarily fit an "origin" story into an established mythos.

You're essentially telling me that bending is no longer an extension of the characters body, mind, personality, and philosophy. It is instead something that is gifted to you, and you have to "learn" how to use it.

This directly contrasts with The Last Airbender, in which bending is very much a part of the character, and that your personality and philosphy has some play in your affinity for a certain element.

Remember when Aang tried to learn Earthbending, and he struggled with it because of the differences between his personality and the philosophy needed to properly learn Earthbending?

Nope, you can learn Earthbending, all you need is to study the animals, and have the gift!

Ain't that some dumb shit.

hold on do people think you need to know how to fight to bend

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so your telling me a person from the fire nation can go to the earth kingdom change his ways and personality look at a badger mole then know how to be a earthbender

>You're essentially telling me that bending is no longer an extension of the characters body, mind, personality, and philosophy. It is instead something that is gifted to you, and you have to "learn" how to use it.
Which was a little weird in ATLA since Guru Pathik came across as someone who would have possibly airbending but he wasn't gifted with it in his genetic makeup. Same with Piandao and how he conducts himself, like he would be a candidate for a bending discipline.

No, but you can apply things that you've learned from other benders into your personal bending style, even if you have no affinity for the actual element.

Remember Uncle Iroh learning how to redirect lightning from applying what he learned from the waterbenders?

I'm simply saying that you have to have an affinity for the element, and this is typically represented in your core personality and philosophy.

I'm not saying you can overhaul yourself and theoretically learn a new style of bending.

His spirit wouldn't change so no he wouldn't be able to. The Avatar's spirit was an avatar of the Earth which encompasses all the elements letting him bend every element.

Now the avatar is an avatar for Rava or some shit so he gets all the powers because Wan was the only one smart enough to try and scam the lion turtles.

Not to mention, this is also why Zuko's source of flame went out in Season 3.

Zuko needed a different source core to his own beliefs and personality for him to firebend again.

Fuck off Korra apologists. The Wan backstory is some major bullshit and the origin of bending is completely retarded.

cry more

Not an argument

>calmly explain something that should be obvious but is constantly brought up regardless in these threads
>WAAAH YOU'RE A KORRA APOLOGIST
k

By now I just hope they'll make another Avatar and we can all pretend Korra never happened.

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Repsponding to the original post:

Was it necessary to show the origin of bending in any meaningful fashion? What purpose did it serve?

That's like explaining the origin of those sensitive to The Force in Star Wars; in the grand scheme of things it shouldn't matter, because that's the mythos and fundamental idea of the series.

Don't fucking explain the magic.

they wont

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I disagree. I think with Korra, Avatar has overstayed its welcome, and should just die quietly.

It's like a piece of rotten fruit; it once was sweet and tasty, and now is rotten and sour.

let me tell you something guy just becues you and a small amount of guys on Sup Forums hate the show means nothing you will bring up the nick shit still nick fucked it up themselves with the air times people liked the show take your hate and fuck off already

taking legends they said to heart they even said in the show they where legends come on guys stop this shit

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If they liked it so much then why did they fuck it over with scheduling? Don't be delusional, user.

>Lion turtle granted bending
>Said they'll stop when Wan made the spirits fuck off back to their own world
>Ten thousand years later there are still benders around
>One week later air benders popping out of nowhere, from old fucks to little niglets

Please explain.

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Patently not true. Korra was experiencing what I assume were "memories" of the First Avatar, not legends or stories being passed down.

hell i dont know why did nick pass on adventure time for fanboy and chum chum

>>Lion turtle granted bending
>>Said they'll stop when Wan made the spirits fuck off back to their own world
>>Ten thousand years later there are still benders around
the fuck are you talking about

I don't care about this worthless pile of garbage, does anything as good as the original Avatar: The Last Airbender exist?

The answer is "no".

well according to Sup Forums book 3 was shit

Being able to control water by staring at the ocean doesn't really make sense to be honest.

If that was how it was then literally anyone could become a Waterbender

hunter x hunter

Book 3 of Korra was much better than the previous Books, but the underlying premise was still shit.

It was just prettier looking shit.

I didn't like Beginnings either. I never like those sort of episodes, where they introduce really convoluted out-of-left-field elements into their show just for the sake of explaining something or for an "exciting" big storyline.

Though it's also dumb how whenever this is brought up people argue observing dragons and fish and badgermoles and sky bison somehow gave benders powers. That isn't how it works. I guess it makes sort of sense that energybending would be how people originally got it. The thing I find dumb about Wan's episodes is Raava/Vaatu, that did not jibe with me.

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> Implying that staring at water is all that it takes to be a waterbender

Get out of here with that weak shit.

i dont get where people got that from they got the bending fighting styles from them not the bending

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Not Sup Forums but Fullmetal Alchemist exists.

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With all of korra's problems, the setting was absolutely god tier. Just wanted to say that.

The Lion Turtle said "they"(as in Lion Turtles) bent the energy within before the Avatar.

>You're essentially telling me that bending is no longer an extension of the characters body, mind, personality, and philosophy. It is instead something that is gifted to you, and you have to "learn" how to use it.
No, use of the element is what is inherent. Bending is an artform. It IS tied to things like philosophy, mood, etc. You learn a style, just as real life martial artists do. This is why we see groups with different styles of bending (e.g. foggy swamp style waterbending or Toph's mantis style to the average tiger style. If the bending itself was inherent, we wouldn't see different forms, or even formless bending as with Bumi just using his face and rolling up a hill or the airbender's flying. As for the personality stuff, again, same as real life. I can be a decent martial artist, but if I suddenly get all self conscious, depressed, over angery, etc it will affect my ability to perform. Same thing with learning other disciplines that don't mesh with my core philosophies.

You mean 1920s America? Forget being inspired by a variety of Asian cultures, we're gonna do the roaring 20s, cuz we like it!

Oh! Lets also add analogues to our own world's technology, despite the fact that BENDING helped the world move in the 70 years prior.

Didn't stop it from being cool

I get what you're trying to say I do. Within the world, its unlikely that the the characters would know past 100% accurately. BUT that is a double edged sword. It undermines the narrative of A:TLA. Its essentially saying Toph, Zuko, and everyone else were wrong so it leaves a sour taste when attempting to rewatch A:TLA. I hope this explains why so many are pissed about retcons.

>I can be a decent martial artist, but if I suddenly get all self conscious, depressed, over angery, etc it will affect my ability to perform. Same thing with learning other disciplines that don't mesh with my core philosophies.

This being the case, WHY IS WAN ABLE TO BEND?? He was literally gifted the power to "bend" fire, and immediately produces flame. It doesn't speak anything about his character, or his core personality. It just says "he can firebend now".

Contrast this with Zuko, who goes through a metamorphosis where he is cut off from his bending because the source of his previous power was gone.

He had to re-examine himself and draw upon a new source. It was heavily tied to who he was as a character.

That's all it takes for you to be impressed, huh? Bet you liked The Last Jedi.

Oh I'm sorry, were you trying to imply that "generic asian setting" is somehow superior?

Except each nation drew clear inspiration from various Asian countries.

So, no, it's not "generic".

Well, to be fair I think Wan does sort of embody what a firebender is pretty well. Though I don't think it really matters, from what we've seen the lion turtle can give anyone their bending element regardless of their personality.

Though I do think you're right that who you are impacts your bending ability. I don't think it's a coincidence that e.g. the two lavabenders we've met have very similar laid-back personalities (Bolin & Ghazan). Or how Bolin couldn't metalbend because he's not rigid and stubborn. Or who got airbending—i.e. two of the most naturally spiritual characters (Bumi & Zaheer) got it, or Kai who embodies the element, or that shut-in neet who just wanted to do whatever he wanted but could use a change in lifestyle. P'Li seems quiet and solemn like Combustion Man. All the bloodbenders have that trademark nefarious side to them. etc etc.

All very consistent except Beginnings. It's probably why Korra had a natural disposition towards fire & earth too.

>The thing I find dumb about Wan's episodes is Raava/Vaatu, that did not jibe with me.
I think it's because it went against the philosophy of the first show. Since instead of the eastern philosophy of viewing the world with Raava and Vaatu it made straight black and white, good vs evil, god vs satan and no area in between.

That's one of my biggest issue with it, you had several episode about good and evil being pretty much everywhere, but in Korra, nope, an ancient chinese evil awoken

> Well, to be fair I think Wan does sort of embody what a firebender is pretty well. Though I don't think it really matters, from what we've seen the lion turtle can give anyone their bending element regardless of their personality.

...Which to me really embodies the problems of Beginnings.

It goes against something previously established in the series: the idea that having an affinity for an element is based, in some form or fashion, on who they are as a person, and that they don't necessarily get to pick their affinity with an element.

For what it's worth, I guess it does sorta? I don't think it's a coincidence that the first airbenders were all pacifists and calm and spiritual. And the people near the fire turtle were noticeably more aggressive/militaristic than the other groups.

>And the people near the fire turtle were noticeably more aggressive/militaristic than the other groups.
I don't recall meeting water and earth people living on the turtles, just the fire and air humans.

I don't remember too, but we know the fire people are the only group that actually started fighting back against the spirits and they had weapons unlike the air people. And just generally looked like early Fire Nation.

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No, it actually sounds like an ambiguous plot element that they knew they could fill in later.

Story-telling 101.

...

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>avatar state was just supposed to be the Avatar using all the knowledge of his/her past life
>Lol it's just a spirit power up that was never mentioned before

>The first earthbenders were supposed to be a couple who studied badgermoles making tunnels
>Lol the first earthbenders were actually gifted magic powers by lion turtles

It's not fucking ambiguous you retard they learn fucking firebending from the last two dragons alive therefore that shit fucking works so you can't pretend like it doesn't make sense to retcon it

It was always an explicit power boost, not just using the knowledge of the past avatars but their power as well.

To add to this, Roku mentioned to Aang that it was a self-defense mechanism, triggered when the Avatar was in grave danger, allowing the Avatar to use the combined power of all previous Avatars.

Roku never mentioned Raava, or that the actual source of the Avatar's power was the "spirit of the Avatar".

That was the story for how they trained to USE bending and is still true, not an explanation for where superpowers came from.

Yeah because that's totally the interpretation given, considering Lion Turtles are well known as elemental benders and not, yknow, the fucking human he was talking to.

It is. The Lion Turtle tells Aang that before the Avatar, the Lion Turtles energybent.

"In the era before the Avatar, we bent not the elements, but the energy within ourselves. To bend another's energy, your own spirit must be unbendable, or you will be corrupted and destroyed."

I guarantee you nobody watching the finale read that as the Lion Turtle literally referring to only Lion Turtles. He addresses Aang with "we" as a broad way of saying "people", because that's the only people we've ever seen bending aside from specific animals. They also considerably DON'T bend the energies within themselves, but within humans.

That's what the Wan episodes did. Reinterpreted wordings and statements to give an unnecessary elaboration that raises more fucking questions than it answered. "Oh the animals DID teach bending but only the form, not the ability." being the most egrigious rules-as-written interpretation that ignores any sense of subtlety and grace the original animal myths had.

Dante is worst girl.

>you need to have peace of mind in order to lightning bend
>azula clearly going crazy still lightning bends without a hitch

>aang doesn't listen to jeong jeong talking about the mindset of firebending at all
>produces flame like its nothing

I don't know why people treat this mindset philosophy bullshit as gospel when there's more instances of it being ignored than it being true

While I agree with what you're trying to say, I disagree with the specific examples you gave. I always thought those two examples were meant to show just how talented Azula and Aang were, such that Azula can lightning bend even in the middle of a nervous breakdown, or that Aang is capable of picking up the basics of a bending discipline in only a single lesson.

Don't think he was making one.

Which still means elemental bending didn't take place before the avatar. Which it clearly did in Beginnings.

I always thought that the lightning was supposed to represent Azula's sociopathic and generally uncaring nature.

You know, the "cold flame" and all.

>Aang produces flame
>Flame grows out of his control
>Flame hurts Katara
>Aang develops a crippling fear of firebending until the end of Book 3

Aang's free-sprited personality and his inability to show patience and temperance contributed to Katara being hurt, and Aang vowing to never firebend ever again.

Have any other examples?

it still doesn't change how bullshit it is

who that

It was that the first benders learnt it from x. It didn't say that they got it from them in the first place. It still fits fine, there was no retcon.

Does it even matter? We have one scene of her as a kid bending, then we cut to her at age 17 having learned 3 elements, the same three she had as a kid, whereas by the time he was 13, Aang had learned not only all 4 regular elements, but energybending as well. If you want to go strictly be numbers that sounds a lot more bullshit to me.

Wow, it's almost like Aang had to push himself over the course of a few months to learn all of the elements, while Korra is basically just given them as a kid for no reason other than "she's the avatar". Doesn't that sound more bullshit to you?

Don't really see the problem, it's not the thing she had issues with anyway why does it matter?

That's not a retcon at all. Nothing in Korra contradicts the original series.

The origin of bending was the lion turtles, but people didn't have styles or use powers creatively. Air benders used it to hover, fire benders just threw fireballs, ect. Eventually people learned styles from natural teachers, air benders watched the Sky Bison and learned new ways to bend air, fire benders saw the artful way Dragons (and the sun) used fire, water benders learned to take advantage of the ebb and flow like the moon, and earthbenders watched animals like the badgermole to see how to efficiently move earth.

If anything it explains some stuff the original series never got to. We already learned that the people's myths about the origins of bending were not fully correct in the original series, because even Prince Zuko wasn't sure if firebending came from the sun or dragons first. It came from both, but before any of that the power of fire was granted by lion turtles.

Because it turns Aang's entire struggle into something so trivial even a small child can do it, it makes people think "If this young girl could learn the 3 elements this early, why couldn't Aang?"

user, THE MOMENT Aang tried to move around other elements, he could (except earth). He could easily create fire and move water around.

Moving stuff around, and being a master martial artists with them, are different things.

Actually, Aang had trouble with Earth bending due to it's position opposite his native element.

>Thank you for this, sweetie. Now no one can be upset at Korra for using fire, earth, and water bending as a small child.
That made sense though. Obviously every person across the water tribes was aware that the new avatar would be about Korra's age, and the obvious way to test that is to try and test the kid. Korra would have realized she was the avatar after breaking a hole in the wall when she stubbed her toe, and then she'd go all-in on learning the elements and would practice a little display of power for before people showed up to train her. It doesn't take more than a few days to learn basic element control for elements that are inside of you, are you forgetting Aang knew how to bend fire in a small ball instantly and only stopped trying because he couldn't control it? Korra aligned perfectly with the physical elements, only air was against her nature. It was the same for Aang, did you forget that Aang passed Katara in natural waterbending on his FIRST lesson from her? Aang was a natural at all elements but earth, his opposite, just like korra was a natural at all elements but air.

Networks are retarded.

Not just his native element, but opposite his entire nature.

Katara even explained this, and Toph showed him that his normal solutions for everything would not allow him to Earthbend.

Aang was able to make Fire two whole books before he was supposed to after one lesson. Being able to perform the most basic ability of a bending art (creating it for Fire, manipulating it for Air, Water, and Earth) was never a problem for any Avatar we've seen except in the case of Earth for Aang and Air for Korra because it was diametrically opposed to their worldviews.

>that Azula can lightning bend even in the middle of a nervous breakdown

>lightning bending requires peace of mind
>can do it in the middle of a nervous breakdown
that's not talent if you're not supposed to be able to do it. people are too willing to use talent and >muh prodigy to handwave any bullshit Azula does

>toph has trouble with sand because it's hard to read the vibrations
>no trouble with mud

>dragons are supposed to be the proper firebending
>99% of firebenders don't use dragon bending but do fine

Aang picked up all the other elements in a day.

Korra may have been able to bend since being 3, but she didn't master thm until nearly an adult and still didn't know how to airbend.

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>Wan was the only one smart enough to try and scam the lion turtles
Nobody said that. There could have been millions that scammed the lion turtles, but none of them could have become avatars because a human host can only hold 1 element. Rava held the other 3 for Wan, they very clearly explained this in the series. Do you have any complaints that wouldn't be answered by watching the show?