Nationalism

Nationalism is retarded. It's being proud of something you had no control over or that someone else did. At best it's being proud of nothing and at worst stealing credit. And before you try calling me a liberal or a leftie, I am not either.

Other urls found in this thread:

i.4cdn.org/pol/1480360152645.jpg
youtube.com/watch?v=140Y-QqBRG4
abc.net.au/news/2016-11-28/south-sudanese-parents-sending-kids-to-africa-to-avoid-crime/8064540
twitter.com/AnonBabble

I'm sorry I thought it was the flag of Sweden...
Then dissolve your nation, your heritage, your culture.
Your politicians seem to be speeding it up, why not help create a mass void of nothing where your heritage once was?

Do you have a favorite sports team in any league whatsoever?

Do you root for your country in any Olympics ever?

>Finland

I wouldn't be proud either

You can never be proud of your kids either

Nationalism can involve policy positions rather than simply believing your country is great. How focused should your nation be on helping other nation, adjusting taxes and tariffs to encourage domestic production over importation, etc.

I get you OP

I wouldn't be proud of my nation if my nation was Finland.

Except the success of your kids is usually indirectly tied with you personally, whereas the success of a sports team or country is not tied to you at all.

...

this

Just as you share blood with your child you share a country, a culture, and a heritage with your countrymen..

>be born somewhere
>decide that defending the interests of the place you were born is better for you than endorsing a worldwide government run by people who despise you
>retarded

Nationalists DO have control over their country.

How do you think Trump won?

Why do you think brexit won?

Why is China and Japan kicking the world's ass right now?

Why is Saudi Arabia and the UAE also kicking the world's ass?

That's right, nationalism.

Thank god your country wont last another 6 years.

It's basically WE WUZ KINGS for white people

Being happy for a sports team success is different than being proud of it. The latter would require you being a part of the victory.

This actually sounds reasonable, but most nationalists take it further.

Also, all these people trying to dismiss my argument by saying I'm finnish. Sad!

False

Nationalism is not only being proud of something it is focusing on holding on to it and defending what made it possible. Mexico is shittyi.4cdn.org/pol/1480360152645.jpg because of mexicans, Denmark is/was peaceful because it has always been over 95% white european.

...

shitty b8 but I'll bite

Nationalism is simply the idea of group survival. You protect the social, cultural, and economic identity of your group (aka nation) because you believe those things work for you and your group's survival.

Without the common idea of an identity or ideology you are just an individual with no identity and are subject to a stronger force's will to keep you alive since you have no means of taking on the world on your own.

>Not being proud of your past generations

Why not they are a part of who you are no matter what you think.

Being proud over things that don't matter is the only sensible use of pride. That's why sports are good. It's one of our best ways of building camaraderie, and creating meaning out of the chaos of existence.

it's about being proud of your home, your friends, family, the environment, your history, good and bad, all the lessons learned over countless generations.

if you own a house, you trim the lawn, you paint the porch, you grout your bathroom. because you're proud of your house. did you build the house? 99% of the time you didn't. it probably existed before you did. you didn't pour the concrete or decide what the room plan would be. but the house is yours, by inheritance or earned through legal means. by maintaining your house, you create a place that is enjoyable to live in.

to disavow nationalism is to disavow pride and care over the people and the place that nurtured you and brought you the few civilised virtues you possess. a nation without nationalism is a man living in a house where the garbage piles up, the maggots breed and multiply, the timbers rot and foundations crumble because once upon a time some malefactor told them that there was no value in doing so, and they were stupid and short-sighted enough to actually believe them.

it's your house. it's all you have to live in. you can pretend there's no value in maintaining it, until it fucking collapses and kills you and everyone you love because you didn't care enough until it was too late.

It's not a matter of choice, a country won't be hold itself together if it isn't somewhat nationalist.

Nationalism > globalist cuckoldry
And heres why

>Nationalism is retarded
>Some bullshit about pride

No, you are retarded because you do not understand the concept of Nationalism. You have never actually thought about the concept but just rehash what you have been told.

It is more so preserving the vision the elders before you had, and working towards that vision but with the agenda of the current generation with the good will of the nation and it's future generations at mind. You can be proud for what your forefathers did, I agree that it's stupid but Humans do a lot of stupid mindtricks to themselves, if you are going to exclude one of them, and in turn make a blanketstatement for an ideology, you'll have to do the same to everything else.
Finland has a lot to be proud of, and a somewhat degenerate but very charming culture.

Herro fin

Name a non-nationalist country that achieved anything great

>thinking "you" are anything but a part of an information system
>thinking "you" have "free will"
>thinking "you" are some special monolith within the course of events that need justify its existence with expressions of individuality

Come home mongoloid man

>Nationalism is retarded

The german people are like family to me, in a greater sense. You are proud of your fathers deeds and it is the same with your nation. It is something healthy and logical and only the leeching jew claims otherwise.

Also Nationalism/Patriotism protects your people from pic related.

>Not being proud of what your ancestors have done for you
>Not being proud of all that your nation, your tribe - your family has accomplished.
>Not honouring what your forefathers have died for.

What is a country without a nation? Without a nation, there is nothing.

GET OUT LI

THIS

Humans are an amalgamation of their genes and environment. Nationalism is takong pride on your country and your people, the two deciding factors of most peoples lives.

Nice argument.

This

reminder
finns
are
not
white

Nationalism is for plebs.

FINLAND IS WRITU YOU PIGGU
DERETE THIS

>It's being proud of something you had no control over or that someone else did

But niggers taking credit for Egyptian civilization is perfectly fine right?

Thats not an argument, OP.

"FUCK YOUR OWN SHIT UP!
BECAUSE MY FEELS!"

Nationalism has its flaws.
I could even help you out and give you an argument to work with.

But you have to start.

Nationalism makes at least as much sense as communism. Lets find out about YOUR loyaltys. Are you a communist?

>On the other hand, the cheapest form of pride is national pride; for the man affected therewith betrays a want of individual qualities of which he might be proud, since he would not otherwise resort to that which he shares with so many millions. The man who possesses outstanding personal qualities will rather see most clearly the faults of his own nation, for he has them constantly before his eyes. But every miserable fool, who has nothing in the world whereof he could be proud, resorts finally to being proud of the very nation to which he belongs. In this he finds compensation and is now ready and thankful to defend, … all the faults and follies peculiar to it.


Unless you've actually worked to improve your nation or whatever, being proud of that is as retarded as being proud of being left handed. You didn't choose that nation, you didn't do anything to deserve being a part of it, you just happened to be born into it.

Pride is no friend to mankind. In itself, It's only a good feeling about the state of something -- and even when it's applied to things you personally did, it's usually unearned. There's a reason Christianity and many other religions and many strains of philosophy hold that pride is undesirable. Pride may lead to protection, it may decrease worrying, it may help build appreciation, it makes some people feel obligated, but it just often, if not more often leads to anything from annoying assholes to the ruination of countries. It tends to be the downfall of man, the thing that leads people to boast, to overstate, to overreach, to underestimate, rest on their laurels, etc.

I helped make my country what it is, I had input to it, and a modicum of control over it. Are you 12?

>And before you try calling me a liberal or a leftie, I am not either.

I encourage you to read the post before replying.

nationalism also means that you want to keep degenerates away from your country

I can agree with your points, Slovenia-chan,
and from this point,
set a point of civil discourse, having considered the position at least a little.

I _AM_ a low-born, doomed bastard of a single mother, fatherless and failed by the state and the dissolution of the traditional family.

My achievements are few, and my prospects low.

I do, however, have a mind and values, all shaped by the world around me, not the least of which my nation.

I have no claim to the victories of my national heros, but they exist, and other nations know of them.

I have no role-models.
...
But for the media? ...and but for my nation.

My nation has an identity, and, to a degree, a right to pride.

You call out pride, and you're right to do so, but I will make our disagreement about pride.
I have the right as an individual to hold myself to prideful standards, and perhaps, in some way distinguish my future self as a name to be remembered among national heros that ARE.

I need a sense of self and identity from somewhere, and the one I draw is hardly soley from my nation...
And yet, it can be drawn there in part.
I AM proud of how our nations government is more democratic than yours.
I AM proud of our secular nation, and how Jews (Not really, just using the word as a placeholder) have little to no power here.
I AM proud that we're not a gun-toting warzone like the states.
I AM proud of how my nation basically stresses the ends of the bellcurve for freaks of all kinds.

MY nation.
We're full. Fuck off. :)

Nationalism =/= Blind unchecked pride

Everything is questionable. A huge aspect of national pride to me and a lot of people is noticing the flaws in your country and helping to fix them.

Australia is in the worst time period its been in decades if you ask a lot of people.
But i love my country and i love a lot of the people here. I want to makr it better not follow everyone blindly.

It's not about being proud.

Congratulations, you've destroyed white guilt forever

>talks about patriotism
>calls it nationalism
Swedish education

this

You can easily turn this thing around:
>Blacks under the age of 70 have no reason to take pride in Civil Rights. Neither should any woman alive today feel pride in Suffrage. No one alive participated in it, so who cares?

Not that i agree with these things, but i believe you'll begin to see the double standards.

Nationalism has been central in shaping Finland and finnish identity in our history. Shamefur dispray my fellow finn.

Eh, Ill cut them some slack. The two are intuitively linked. Perhaps my english has failed me, but the examples I can think of where the two terms aren't interchangeable are on a govt. beurocratic level (policy/fiscal).

I just want to call out Slovenia-poster because I don't want to put words in his (fairly intelligent, it seems) mouth, but his anti-nationalist sentiment has a hell of a lot of the trappings of
COMMUNIST NHILLISM to it.
I'm offering this as a critique, and want to see how he responds to being called a COMMIE NIHILIST that 'just wants to destroy it all!' :)

You idiots might think you're smarter than OP, but you're fucking retarded.

Skimmed trough the thread and I see a lot of you idiots fall for what OP did.
All he did was make fun of patriotism and call it nationalism. You fell for it hard, people like this faggot just take OPs bullshit and they run with it.

Nationalism is about protecting the people of your nation. A nation is the people with shared heritage, culture, language and race.
Nationalism is about preserving it. It's about rejecting foreign cultures, limiting immigration and if someone from another culture is in your country they have to assimilate. That's nationalism.

Price has nothing to do with this.
You're defending yourself from a strawman and you got outsmarted by a fucking moron Finn.

This is why you idiots always lose arguments. You were put inside a frame, and you didn't question the framing.
You are arguing for patriotism (which is pretty dumb and all about muh feelings) thinking you're arguing about nationalism.
This is one of the oldest jewish debate tricks.
If you don't see it and you can't recognize it, you are fucked.

I do agree with those statements. Just because I dislike nationalism doesn't mean I'm a liberal/leftie/whatever the enemy strawnan of Sup Forums is called.

SO then go tell the same thing to the Basketball Americans demanding reparations and the leftists shilling white guilt.

Go on. I'm waiting.

Also, your pic is stupid. It makes a claim, but offers no support.

No, you fucking faggot. Give them the tip, they'll take your whole dick.
Framing is important. OP did not make a mistake.
See
It's 100% deliberate, and if you ''cut him some slack'' you've already set yourself to losing the argument.
Not that important on Sup Forums, but when you get into arguments in real life you're going to be destroyed.

>whereas the success of a country is not tied to you at all.
Erm yes it is, you are part of that country. You work there, pay taxes and hopefully participate within the community. How you conduct yourself within society combined with everyone elses interactions inevitably affects the character of a nation...

I admit I was mistaken in calling it nationalism, but what I described (patriotism I guess) is still a belief many anons here seem to hold.

>Nationalism is retarded
ok

>It's being proud of something you had no control over or that someone else did.
lost me

sage and hide

You were not mistaken, you're a (((Finn))). The greatest ally. Oy vey to you, my good Semite Parasite. Tip of the kippah to you.

...

gj triggering so many morons.

It's the memes like pic related that got you. You might just be young and nihilistic, i was like you too.
youtube.com/watch?v=140Y-QqBRG4

But that's not what nationalism is you shit-for-brains tard.
You're making up bullshit about your opponents to attack said bullshit. I think there's a name for this.

Liberals need to die.

>hating people you've never met
what does it matter, if you never have any contact with them and don't go to war against them? most "nationalism" in the west in the 21st century is hating people that have infested the streets in your country, you know them all too well
abc.net.au/news/2016-11-28/south-sudanese-parents-sending-kids-to-africa-to-avoid-crime/8064540

This os the most retardes image ever. Replace 'nationalism' with literally any -ism, or really any word at all, and it makes just as much sense

No, he is flat out lying. He used a very common and fairly well executed framing device to set people up for a losing argument. He knows what he is doing.
When confronted he flat out lies about it and plays dumb.

It's pic related.

If you people don't start learning to recognize all the little moves, all the word play and tricks these kikes do we are fucked.
We really are fucked if you don't learn them.

I can safely say that you are white and naive, because your mind is filling gaps to strengthen his stance, it's when someone gets something completely wrong or flat out lies to you and you go ''oh, you must have been confusing it with this other thing''. Fortune tellers use this against you, like if they tell you ''your mom died'', but your mom is alive you'll fill the gap by saying that the fortune teller was actually referring to your mother's mother.

Come on, guys. Stop fucking around.

THIS.

I already said I was mistaken. It, however, doesn't matter what I call it, as having pride in your country is the action I described in the OP. This is done by many people here.

I also like how many people immediatly assume I'm a liberal or a leftie even though I clearly stated the contrary.

please share on twitter I'm a poor refugee
ZUCKwwwZUCKgofundmeZUCKcomSLASHfund-raise-against-racism
>NO REFUNDS

you arent proud of something you dont choose, you have to be proud of being powerful and good to your country, so you country can rise and be more good and powerful

I already exposed you for the lying manipulative kike you are, but if you needed more, here's more
>I also like how many people immediatly assume I'm a liberal or a leftie

I did a ctrl+f on ''liberal'' and ''leftie''.
No one called you that. You're flat out making shit up hoping I won't read the posts.

One guy said ''Liberals need to die'' to no one in particular hoping he'd trigger you or something and one person asked if you are a communist.
You are flat out making shit up. You are not a human. You're a kike.

Dude, its okay if you want to be a pussy your hole life and not try to fix the country your great grandparents left us, cause i will do it for you. You can just stay home, focusing on learning how to suck your own dick while your thumb is up in your ass.

Oh and move to sweden. Its clearly best place for you.

Multiple people have assumed I also hold typical liberal or leftie beliefs.

10/10 answer
/thread

How many times do we need to repeat this?

Nationalism is not about "taking credit" for what your forefathers did. Nationalism is about appreciating the sacrifices they made, the societies they built. We appreciate the deeds of our forefathers by nurturing the crop that is our nation, our people.

Nationalism is the idea that any society benefits from living with people as similar as possible to each other.

White swedes are mostly atheists. Black "swedes" are mostly muslim. The marxist way to go is to mix us up and teach us to """tolerate""" our differences, while the nationalist way to go is to live among people you already tolerate. In a society of similar and like-minded people, what huge struggles are there?

Also OP, you need to read up on Robert Putnam's scientific studies. And J.P. Rushton's "Race, Evolution and Behavior".

Moving goal posts. As expected from vague language. There's a reason you used the word ''assume'', because you know that if you get called out you can simply claim that what you mean is that people judged you as a leftie - a statement that doesn't need defense because you can claim to know what people assume without any evidence.

We're onto you, kike.

No you retarded mongol, it's being a steward and taking pride in your stewardship.

what if one actually likes their country? and not for any inborn or brainwashed upbringing, but you like it because it genuinely is a good place to live, worth fighting for, and preserving?

because that's nationalism, too.

you think you're hot shit because you watched some philosophy video about how growing too attached to ideals is unhealthy and destructive, but there is brainwashed, romantic, overidealized nationalism that is indeed a threat to living well, but then there is realistic nationalism, which is necessary to feel a sense of belonging and pride in one's self and their peers.

so suck a dick, you oversimplifying, pseudo-intellectual prick.

you have no friends here.

Well, regardless of all that, do you agree that taking pride in your country is retarded? You seem to believe so as you claim people can't win if they argue for it.

Everything you have is because of people who never had your attitude. You have inherited wealth technology, traditions, systems, culture and architecture among many other things. it is this that gave their lives meaning.
Nothing is meaningful without sacrifice and without effort because everything with no effort or sacrifice is not worth anything.

A country is only as great as the people, who are native to them, run it. Different races have their own identity, own culture, own group intelligence.
Do you believe that if Somalians replaced the people of the UK a few hundred years ago, do you think the replaced British people would have still conquered most of the world and put them in colonies along other nations?
No.
Nationalism is in part, the respect and adoration of your nation history and the mindset of persevering and protecting the said nation for the future.

You should see them as your priority because they belong to you and you belong to them. I know it is hard to have this mindset if other people dont view me as a part of a "bigger family" to them but thats because they have their culture taken from them and replaced with individual needs and wants that only reach out to children and grand children.

why do you belong to them why do these things belong to you? because of the historical threads maintained by your ancestors. nobody else is going to look after my race and culture. it is my responsibility and mine alone. you dont have the right to abandoned them.

I am a nationalist, not a patriot.
Patriotism is either dumb or redundant depending on where you are born.

If you're in a great country - of course you're going to take pride in your country. The country is amazing, why not love it? It's redundant to call it patriotism.
If you're born in a shit country - why take pride in it? Patriotism makes no sense then. It's basically deluding yourself into claiming the shitheap you live in isn't as bad as it is.

I am still onto you, kike. I know you know this. This is more for the dumbasses who fell for your framing and are reading this thread.

Why is nationalism always depicted as blindly following? Every single group identity shares in common the capacity for individuals to be overtaken by the group. The only alternative is radical individualism. I can tell you one thing: any time radical individualism is being promoted, it's being promoted in order to fragment and destroy a group. Who would do such a thing, and for what purposes, I'll leave to your imagination.

Many people have posted similar things so I'll reply. I agree that some countries, races or people are better in certain things, but I don't think it's reasonable to be proud of the advantage. I think finding reasons to be proud is a lot easier if you live in the UK than in Somalia, but you need to use your advantage too.

Nice trips. I'm not a jew though.

Is this OC, because its good OC

well you didn't answer me as to if you're a communist or not.
I'm going to assume by your silence that theres something sinister and anti-establishment going on in motivating you.

I'm anti-establishment myself, but that doesn't mean I want to fuck my own nation over just because its the largest local establishment,thats a non sequitur.

I'm anti establishment, but If I have to back one, I'll back the one that doesn't give a flying fuck about religion or race, as long as you conform, consume and pay taxes.

^^^ This is an argument against nationalism. There you go. I'm putting it down in FAVOR of Nation.

OC, friendo, OC.

thank you

You're a confirmed liar and a manipulator. Saying ''I am not a jew, silly goyim :DDD'' is completely meaningless.

You should just come clean and give us some insight into the jewish parasitic mind. You're probably like a 40% ashkenazi jew anyway, which is why you're so bad at this.

Do you guys think jews even know that they're lying?
Maybe they aren't even aware.

you are literally your ancestors. they worked hard to provide you with the comfy lifestyle you are accustom to.

talking like this 50 years ago would mean a whooping.

You forgot the most important thing:
>being proud, when you can be part of preserving it, and always trying to strive for even better
The key is not past, but future

This thread has turned to shit, and OP won't answer a straightfoward question about his own loyaltys. I'm part Dutch. Whats the weather like over there, Dutchbro? Its been wellshit and rainy here in Wellingtron.

That's patriotism, you stupid nigger.
They aren't the same thing.
Nationalism is a political ideology.

I stated I am not a leftie (that means communist too) in the OP. Sorry for being so slow. It's late as fuck and I'm typing on a phone. Don't know if I'll reply to anything today anymore.

>inb4 that latvian starts boasting about how he made the jew finn run away.

Why dont you think it is not reasonable to be proud of an advantage? Because you, yourself was not a part of the makings of the advantage?

I can see where your coming from but give this perspective a try.
You come from the UK and it is undeniable that the UK has made many innovations that people from around the world benefit from them. you should be proud that you come from a nation of such success and perhaps live up to the expectation and do something that will make you in the spotlight one day. It could be this push of motivation that makes someone achieve the rocket or the the new plane design that answer to the old problems.

All of this can be intensified if the current political system is Nationalism, where people believe that they are a part of something bigger, where the country unifies as one people and all fall back to or help push forward the man behind them.

I saw an analogy. user show the picture if you have it. It was that nationalism is owning a house and wanting it to be beautiful for your children. And one day that house will be theirs to fix, perfect, and pass on to their kid. And just because you didn't make it doesn't mean that we can't fix and be proud of it. I doubt that you built your own home.

>Unless you've actually worked to improve your nation or whatever, being proud of that is as retarded as being proud of being left handed

True, if one thinks just the past, and if one really does not contribute.
But almost everybody contribute in countries like Finland: by being peaceful and obeying laws, working and paying taxes, having order and getting along with neighbors. Not everybody has to be a superhero of the nation to lift the mean, and unseen goes helping the ones at the bottom.

Again it`s about future - and one must remember and give credit to ones that made it possible for you to carry on the work for making it better yet.