Informative thread about today's Italian Constitutional Referendum.
What the referendum actually means (ita):
>Marco Travaglio - Perchè No Tutte le bugie del Referendum -
youtube.com
tl;dw
>Perché NO Tutte le bugie del Referendum (di Marco Travaglio) - Estratto a Di Martedì 21 giu 2016
youtube.com
Turnout update (in 30m):
elezioni.interno.it
Other urls found in this thread:
discord.gg
camera.it
referendumcostituzionale2016.it
en.wikipedia.org
referendumcostituzionale.online
youtube.com
en.wikipedia.org
en.wikipedia.org
youtube.com
elezioni.interno.it
twitter.com
Previous: >Italian Sup Forums Discord - Sup Forumsiticamente Scorretti
discord.gg
>PDF sulla nuova legge elettorale (in Italiano)
camera.it
>Sito Ufficiale sul referendum (in Italiano):
referendumcostituzionale2016.it
>Information on upcoming referendum (in English):
en.wikipedia.org
>Sito ufficiale del comitato per il No (in italiano)
referendumcostituzionale.online
youtube.com
Translation of the summary (first 3 minutes) is the following (1/2):
Let's see how the new Senate works, folks, because the fastest Matteo has taken an easy process, take two system and multiply them by 5: 10 systems. The snakes and ladders game, stuff for psychiatric departments naturally, will increase out of proportion the contentious between Chamber of Deputies (CoD) and Senate (S), Parliament and Regions, with infinite conflicts of power that will all end in front of the Constitutional Court. It's the "Office for Complications of Simple Affairs". Please, follow me in these 10 stages of the snakes and ladders game.
1. For Constitutional Laws, the system remains the same
- Perfect bicameralism between CoD and S
2. For Ordinary Laws, absolute chaos:
- Approval is up to the CoD and S can always give its 2¢
- Montecitorio Palace (CoD) approves, sends the law to Madama Palace (S) where within 10 days 1/3 of senators' votes are enough to review the text
3. In case of review by S, there're 2 options:
- S can leave everything as it was decided by CoD or amend the law within 30 days
4-5. If they amend within 30 days, the law goes back to CoD who have last word and there, there're 2 options:
- Receive and approve the amendments by S
- Ignore the amendments by S and restore the original text approved by CoD with the Simple Majority (half +1)
6. Completely different procedure for laws about Territorial Autonomy's Matters:
- If the government decides to activate them, there's the Clause of Supremacy (don't ask me what it is because it's too complicated )
- S has again 10 days to review or ignore them, then 30 more days to approve eventual changes
- If S doesn't touch anything, it passes as CoD decided.
7-8-9. If S changes anything, the text goes back to the CoD:
- CoD can discard the amends done by S, but in this case the Simple Majority won't be enough, that would be too simple, they need Absolute Majority vote (half +1 of the elected)
- In case S's amends were done with Simple Majority, CoD can also overcome it with Simple Majority vote, maybe, this is not very clear because they're still arguing about it.
- Without majority in the CoD, the law passes as S amended it.
10. The Financial Law follows yet another different process:
- CoD approves it then sends it to S
- S automatically votes it but have only 15 days to amend it
- If S amends with Simple Majority, CoD can re-amend the amendments with Simple Majority
- If S amends with "Complicated" Majority and CoD doesn't reach a "Complicated" Majority, nobody knows how the fuck we're going to figure it out. Then, if there're conflicts or appeals, presidents of both chambers meet to find a resolution, but, the presidents are 2 people: if one has an idea and the other has another idea, who wins? the most beautiful one? or do we go in front of the constitutional courts? about these "silly issues" the reform doesn't care, thus leaves everything suspended.
This way We have gone from Perfect Bicameralism to Bullshit Bicameralism/Crazy Bicameralism (2/2).
tl;dr for everything else:
>Reduce senate members from 315 to 100
This makes corruption easier. It's more easy to bribe 51 senators than 158 and much cheaper. The original law writers decided it would be 315 in order to make corruption harder and prevent the creation of a echo-chamber.
>Increase of signatures from 50'000 to 150'000 required for Citizens' Initiative law proposal.
This blatantly reduces the power of taxpayers, it's already hard enough as it is now to find 50'000 signatures, figures 150'000.
en.wikipedia.org
en.wikipedia.org
if you don't vote with NO,
i will go to Italy and take your job.
You'd better believe me, I am used to working for peanuts.
FUCK THE EU.
The hofer guy seems to be losing in austria, it's a good result for us?
Daily reminder that Italians are Kek's chosen people
Don't forget gianni druidi.
youtube.com
He conceded. The other guy is merkel 2.0. Maybe they will start accepting more shitskins at the brennero again, I don't know.
More "refugees" will be able to go to Germany though Austria
austria lost the chance to elect someone who could fight against merkel's forceful policies, it's not good, though it allows us to send more immigrants to the north, those who want to move away from here at least (most of them want to go in germany or sweden where the benefits are higher).
this is the worst referendum I've every seen, coming from an American leftist
Still learning how to use a keyboard, Jamal? How are things going there at the refugee center?
confirmed.
Sure. Cucked Austria, stronger Italy, why not?
You know nothing about italian politics.
They are almost at a consensus here, and rome isn't burning.
Hopefully this referendum works out for you, so this day isn't complete shit
If it does just drop all of your shitskins over here, cause we apparently love getting raped and killed
FUCK AUSTRIA
Things will eventually turn out better, austriabro. Godspeed.
My condolences.
So who is exactly behind this referendum? Do some people actually want this?
I have no idea what goes on in SpaghettiLand, you guys are really quiet and never talk about yourselves. Even some Italians I've talked to on games have no idea what goes on in the political side of things and they don't seem to give a shit, pretty much just like most Canadians.
>So who is exactly behind this referendum?
(((JP MORGAN)))
Oh man, they're not even being subtle this time huh.
Funnily enough this. If the yes win the EU is going to buy many bonds. But if the yes wins we're doomed.
Faster law approvation times and a bonus for parties are the most important things. The latter would help a smaller party take over the government. This wouldn't turn out nicely. Also a lot of other stuff. It's a mess, it's about a lot of arguments from the economy to the sanity.
Well it is pretty creepy how they released a document a year ago complaining about the constitutions in southern european countries giving the citizens too much protection
>Someone trying to be le funny man XD made up a comedy show explaining why you should vote no
>his arguments are basically "it's not gonna be like the reform says because I tell you so!"
>people actually post him as a source of proper information
This explains the rise in followers of a certain laughable party over the past few years
Nazi BTFO
Really makes you think...
>simply stating facts
>"not a source of proper information"
>implying you can't verify in 5 minutes with google
Ayyy time for another Anschluss? After we are done uncucking our country we will try to help the rest of you.... In case someone is even left there in the first place.
I hope things go in your favour. Italians are decent people, I can't see you guys wanting to screw yourselves over.
I'm a little confused as to why (((they))) think this referendum will end in (((their))) favour, let's hope there's no loop-holes or something.
Rate.
I'm worried about italy after what happened in Austria, good luck
Almost 50% turnout so far (updated):
elezioni.interno.it
07-12 = 20%
12-19 = +30%
Is this turnout good or bad for NO?
That's a lot. Impressive.
We are voting to modify the constitution (not the first part) to reform the Senate, abolish useless shit like CNEL and modify the relationship between state and regions (our country is divided in regions).
In Italy there are the Chamber of Deputies and the Senate that have the same power. They have to agree both on the law before making it real. This results in an enormous delay on promulgation of laws. Only 3% of the laws are made by both Chambers and the rest is done without problems by the government (decreti legislativi).
In the new Senate (315-->100), made by mayors and regional counsellors, Senate will discuss laws for the regions, important things like constitutional law and many other things.
There are many other things to talk about but this should be enough to understand that we should to vote "YES"
Shadilay, Praise KEK
That's concerning, the more undecided voters go the worse since the question on the ballot is bullshit
I'd expect to be 70% when the referendum closes, I don't know honestly if it's a lot or not.
Whether it's good or bad, depends what that 70% voted for (not known yet).
11/10
So they get angrier and they spawn a new Hitler. It's exactly what volkish europe needs. Good plan user.
>made by mayors and regional counsellors
This should be enough to understand why you should vote NO
>Il fronte del no dice che il primo ministro avrà potere assoluto dopo la riforma
>somehow this is a fact
I see... I'm gonna assume everything else he says debating a puppet set up in his favor is the truth then
Whoops, forgot the name, didn't actually sage.
Yeah why represent regions in the fucking Parliament when you can just ignore them porco dio
>represent regions
*represent the party
Sorry
I meant
Represent regions in the Senate
>tfw the consulate sened me two ballots
>tfw voted no two times
hai mai parlato con un sindaco, o con qualcuno che lavora in posizioni con simile importanza, in regioni o comuni? oltre al fatto che sanno praticamente nulla di legge, la maggior parte sono corrotti sfacciati.
That would mean that the polls were way off so we have no idea what to expect (big surprise, the polls were amazing all over the world this year)
I hope so too. My condolences Austria, as a leaf, I feel your pain.
>Il fronte del no dice che il primo ministro avrà potere assoluto dopo la riforma
Lo è. Il premio di maggioranza permette al partito con piu posti in Parlamento di fare quello che gli pare senza impicci dal Senato (che non potrà piu respingere le leggi ma solo modificarle su competenze comuni, cioè meno del 3%).
Hanno anche dei difetti
A parte gli scherzi
Manderanno sicuramente quelli che ne sanno altrimenti che senso ha, dai
Non li vota il popolo per andare in senato, proprio per questo è positivo
Poi boh si vedrà con la legge elettorale nuova
Cambia la legge elettorale dopo
>I hope so too. My condolences Austria, as a leaf, I feel your pain.
We cannot save you, but we can avenge you Austria. And we will
>[spoiler]We will also send you another boatload of niggers because better to you than me psht notin personlel Austria[/spoiler]
Se in un elezione nazionale è già difficile non far shillare piddini o gente blue-pillata o evitare frodi elettorali (ho appena sentito che sono arrivate segnalazione di matite cancellabili da qualche parte in italia) cosa ti fa pensare che lasciando le cose in mano alla politica locale con settordicimila elezioni e situazioni di merda le cose possono migliorare? a parte che se glielo fai passare il PD ha il senato con una buona maggioranza (qui difatti il motivo di aver proposto questo referendum)
Good luck guys. When will you get the results?
Come il trota?Grande esperto della politica?
E non è l'unico figlio di politici da occhi di pesce .
Oppure persone come Gelmini?
>"Dum spiro, spero."
Isn't this the slogan of Sarawak?
>Manderanno sicuramente quelli che ne sanno altrimenti che senso ha, dai
Fare assegni in bianco ai sinistri non è mai una buona idea. Hai votato SI, ti sei bevuto i memi del Bomba, va bene così che oggi ti salviamo il culo noi altri.
In futuro potresti non essere così fortunato
Vote Yes
You outjewed them, bravo!
kys you tax evading piece of shit
>monaco (poland soil) shill still trying to pay for his family
0.002€ were deposited in your account
Le matite cancellabili, sei grillino dio cane?
Dio porco cosa mi triggerano queste cose
Se qualcuno prova a cancellare la matita anche se cancellabile si vede il solco e l'inchiostro della scheda si scolorisce
Si dovrebbe usare la matita apposita ma quella è solo garanzia, anche con la matita cancellabile non si riesce a cancellare se premi
Comunque vota il tuo no in penna coglione mi raccomando
It will all get better austria, just hold on
What is the referendum all about, can any Italybro give me a tl;dr?
Now that I think about it, it ain't that bad for Italy to a have a cucked neighbor: our shitskins will finally be free to cross the border.
>ho appena sentito che sono arrivate segnalazione di matite cancellabili da qualche parte in italia
LOL
A me domani mattina crescono le tette
Yes will win and you broke, NEET racists will lose. I love multiculturalism and being rich as fuck thanks to it. Lmao
ti dico solamente che tra tutti gli architetti e ingegneri che ho conosciuto nel periodo nel quale ho lavorato presso uno studio tecnico, tutti sapevano delle mazzette del sindaco come se fosse un fatto normale, stesso per il presidente della regione, ogni 2 anni almeno un sindaco si dimette per scandali, almeno qui nella mia zona tra i comuni vicini. Per un periodo breve perfino un mio conoscente è stato sindaco e ti garantisco che di legge ne capisce un tubo. Questa è la gente che deve essere incaricata col senato? anche se hanno collaboratori esperti, la mela non cade mai troppo lontano dall'albero, sono persone con mentalità simili.
>sei grillino dio cane?
Maybe
yet you are posting here and advertising for free instead of living your rich life
Rejoicing at your neighbor's misfortune?
Like , you are the chosen people, i.e., Jews
it just wasn't time yet
(cont)
UPDATED AGAIN: 57%
I guess they just finished gathered last informations.
By this rate, it might actually go over 70% which is pretty gud.
Just because I'm ill and stuck at home. Doesn't change the fact that you will be BTFO
Ammazzati bestia
Save the night per favore Italia. You can do it!
tell me that tomorrow morning jewlet, you're gonna cry like shillary supporters
No
REEEEEEEEcount.
To be fair, i didn't do shit, the consulate is just beyond inkompetent.
In EU election 2014 i also got a ballot from them and i could vote in the local polling station.
Voted for AfD and Lega, so im fine with it tho
>he actually believes no will win
Screencapped for tomorrow morning's tears
Missguided brother. I can feel your anger and frustration but you're being tricked.
But first i shall feast upon your tears tonight when NO gets 70%
I voted No as well, you fucking faggot. It's just that M5S are autistic fools, you gotta vote proper right wing populist.
Like... Lega?
LOL
my bad, connection lagged, didn't see the reply.
My district turnover went from 15% at 12 to 53% at 19, it's good?
Hoping and pray for a LN-FdI-others right wing coalition to vote for. M5S aren't THAT bad but there's a few leftist fetishisms of them I just can't stand (muh pacifism, muh no nuclear, muh veganism, muh must help niggers).
You're dumb.
You're still dumb.
>a weeabo
AHAHAHAHAHA
>101503132
>You're dumb.
Quoting yourself?
The more the better.
Speaking on referendums, was the one in 2011 rigged?
Força Itália!
Don't let us down like Austria, only you can save the night.
Nah I still remember the reverse-psychology ads everywhere, also Silvio pretending to be retarded on tv trying to discourage people from going to vote, they were trying so hard there's no way they would have allowed anyone to rig it against their objectives.
Still, only merely above 50% actually voted in 2011? this referendum on the other hand is almost at 60% and it's not even over yet, pretty nice.
Yes, we'll do it again after reelecting Merkel to create a paradise for shitskins.