Redpill me on the electric car

Is it a Sup Forums approved gadget or is it a blue pilled SJW thing led by the biggest fraudster of them all - Elon Musk?

Electric is definitely one of the next steps. Kind of a niche right now but wasting time worrying about it is pretty degenerate. Just buy whatever suits your needs or what you want and go worry about things that actually matter.

It's definitely a blue pill type of vehicle. It presents a false view of reality.

Libs love it thinking that it's so clean and friendly for the environment, yet they're clueless that the power source is their local power plant, something that is most likely coal or nuclear.

The lithium used in the batteries is mined by child slaves in sweltering hot mine pits in Africa.

Defend this libturds.

If you buy electric cars, you support Israel

Fully mechanical diesel is the way to go.. no electricity needed

Right now they're stupid, just buy an internal combustion vehicle.

However, when oil runs out in about 80 years, they're going to be the only alternative.

I feel like a cheap clean gasoline car is probably better than a 100k tesla

>by jewlectic car
>costs shittons more than gas version
>requires government subsidies to become affordable
>still ends up being more expensive even after subsidies


Bluepilled as fuck

>nuclear

real dirty source of energy

The entire field of "sustainable thinking" is a way to push globalism and socialism. That's the only thing I took away from a sustainability and ethics course I had to take to complete my degree.

>nuclear.
Nuclear is the most environmental friendly energy source we have, desu senpai. Zero emissions of whatever nature, just a bit of water vapor that hurts no one.

Yea but you have to do something about the radioactive waste.

until one plant shits the bed, then you have entire cities abandoned.
there are some pretty good designs like thorium reactors but traditional nuclear is only good until it's fucked.

Bury it in the desert, or use breeder reactors to make use of the waste

Don't forget the heat, nigger.

>Yea but you have to do something about the radioactive waste.
Box it up, put it into a salt mine, problem solved. It is being done right now this way.

The heat is the point

>until one plant shits the bed, then you have entire cities abandoned.
that is a story the oil and gas companies want you to believe. Starting with second generation nuclear reactors in the 1980s, nuclear is so safe, there is just no way for shit to blow up.

There has been what, 3 major nuclear accidents, out of literally hundreds of reactors built

It's incredibly safe assuming the staff are well trained and the reactor isn't designed by a communist

>You should import saudi oil, instead ofof making your electricity from coal and dams
How is this anti-globalist?

Not that great of a deal when you consider what goes into lithium ion battery production, that their power source is mostly coal power in the US, and how they start at 30k for the base model Leaf. I'll stick with my 15 year old Honda CRV that I paid $1000 for and just help the environment other ways like carpooling, recycling, and riding my bicycle whenever I can. Not going to put myself in debt just to fall for the "green" meme.

Yes but those accidents are catastrophes.
And how the fuck do you guarantee that the waste will be stroed safely for 1000s of years when we can barely hold society together.
It also requires a centralised grid. decentralizatin and liberty are our future you dirty fucking gommie.
Nuclear fission as a fuel source is fucking moronic.

Nuclear energy is green energy, you idiot

Electric cars mean nothing without fusion level power plants. The hundred million cars here would overtax conventional green energy. Plus battery technology is lagging behind so you can't drive to another city without having to plan out a 6 hour charging stop.

I rather drive an electric car than give these raghead goatfuckers any more money.

It still runs on energy that has to be produced somewhere. In effect it just moves the problem away from the consumer, which might be good enough to convince most people.

Electric cars are only interesting if you can't use petrol but have cheap electricity from nuclear power plant. Until then, they're another toy for rich hippies to show off how much greener than you they are.

You just pulled those arguments out of your ass, didn't you?

Molten salt reactors can be built to run off of the radio active waste from uranium fission.

This. Nuclear waste is manageable.

>Implying nuclear is dirty
wew

First of all, they do not believe coal (including clean coal) is sustainable and despite the societal impact (which they tout so much) would rather put all of those people out of jobs.

Second, sustainability these days is not just about the environment (shockingly) - SJWs have taken over the field of sustainability/climatology too. Now they are pushing "equality" between economics, environment and what they call the >social aspect.

To sum it up, they believe the solution to all our problems is that we need a world government, more taxes/regulations, a redistribution of wealth to poorer countries (for some reason China is often cited as a country we need to send aid to). Oh, and we need forced population control. Etc, etc, etc...

>Yes but those accidents are catastrophes.
Three mile island, no deaths, no increase in cancer in the surrounding area
Chernobyl is well, Chernobyl
Fukishima had no deaths but major irradiation of the surrounding area

And that's out of hundreds of reactors around the world.

That's interesting

Max range for current pure electric cars is the model S which has (allegedly) 240 miles of range, so assuming you want to drive from Houston to Dallas (also 240 miles) you might JUST manage to slide into town, but realistically you're talking a 30 minute "supercharger" stop (that reduces battery life), or a 4 hour regular charge

The sustainability/environmentalist concern is that nuclear is unsustainable in terms of the fuel. I'm pretty sure that's false from a post I once read here, but I don't personally know anything about it.

Basically the other posted said that it was trivial to convert some common material or spent material into something that can be used as fuel.

Also all the lithium and mining involved in making their batteries... one day electric cars might be worth it, but not right now.

I am still unsure if, for sake of argument, a power plant running off oil, supplying electric cars, is more green than cars running off gasoline directly, probably...but the infrastructure changes needed for more electric cars, and their inconvenience for charging speed etc is a problem.

Yea the max range on those things is very optimistic.

If you have to use the AC or Heater at all it destroys your range.

Burning oil and generating power, and transferring it to power lines to recharge your battery has considerably more overhead than just burning the gas in your engine.

They get tons of money through the mining, assemble, transportation, manufacturing process.

is it fuck

Electric cars are more expensive than they're worth, ironically cause more pollution than they prevent currently, and are a bitch to use because they have to charge for hours at a time instead of just a five minute trip to the gas station.

>Molten salt reactors can be built to run off of the radio active waste from uranium fission.
It is not so much a "can" but a "must". You need feeder fuel to start a thorium reactor.
---
Thorium (Th-232) is not itself fissile and so is not directly usable in a thermal neutron reactor. However, it is ‘fertile’ and upon absorbing a neutron will transmute to uranium-233 (U-233)a, which is an excellent fissile fuel materialb. In this regard it is similar to uranium-238 (which transmutes to plutonium-239). All thorium fuel concepts therefore require that Th-232 is first irradiated in a reactor to provide the necessary neutron dosing to produce protactinium-233. The Pa-233 that is produced can either be chemically separated from the parent thorium fuel and the decay product U-233 then recycled into new fuel, or the U-233 may be usable ‘in-situ’ in the same fuel form, especially in molten salt reactors (MSRs).Thorium fuels therefore need a fissile material as a ‘driver’ so that a chain reaction (and thus supply of surplus neutrons) can be maintained. The only fissile driver options are U-233, U-235 or Pu-239. (None of these is easy to supply).

Electric cars are just better cars in general. And yes they are greener so long as they are made properly.

Not to mention, leftist here wont approve new plants so many are running on old intrastructure, which makes them more dangerous. Its a self-fulfilling prophecy. Its like they want a plant to melt down.

Same with pipelines, no new pipelines thanks to leftists, so old ones run at full pressure, and trains tip over and crash spilling oil.

more wank nonsense from the cheese weasel
Fossil fuels burned at power stations cause far less pollution than the ice

t. kock brother

putting aside the very point made in your pic a bout where energy comes from-

lithium batteries are dirty as fuck. Lithium is a non renewable resource, that has to be mined.And Lithium mines rival coal operations for 'dirtiest extracted mineral". so already, you are using a non renewable resource extracted from the earth in a very dirty way, to make batteries that die very quickly and cost a fortune to replace, and then have to go to a landfill anyway.

its like having to replace your entire gas tank every 6000 miles, and that gas tank was made of coal

Koch bros wanted hillary

>Electric cars are more expensive than they're worth
how so?

> and are a bitch to use because they have to charge for hours at a time instead of just a five minute trip to the gas station.
Yeah.... at night. In your own fucking house. One of the massive advantages of electric cars is that you don't need to piss around driving to a petrol station every week or so to top up.

>Lithium is a non renewable resource
100% wrong. lithium is completely recyclable.

>most environmental friendly energy source we have

how is asse 2 doing for you fritz?

Once we become reliant on recycling lithium, it will be way more expensive than now.

Fossil Fuels are recycled too if you want to play retard.

By the time there's enough to be a problem we'll be able to just launch it into the sun.

>100% wrong. lithium is completely recyclable.
Absolute bs. Lithium is extremely hard to recycle, which makes it virtually uneconomically to recycle lithium batteries to extract the lithium.

In any event, ultra capacitors are the future for electric cars ,not batteries.

>recycling lithium, it will be way more expensive than now.
says who? economies of scale and technological advancement is a thing.

Leftists wont approve different nuclear plant designs that create less waste by reusing some of what would have been waste.

>ultra capacitors are the future for electric cars ,not batteries.
says increasingly nervous man for 3rd decade in a row

The difference between an electric car and a gasoline sedan can be as much as 20k and I don't know about potatonigger land but here in America there's gas stations everywhere. I have at least four right around the block from my home.

They are scary fast. Rode on a Georgia Power EC IN 1990. Only noise was the cheap ass tires road noise. Acceleration was Fucking BEAST!

I'd buy one today especially a Tesla.

Look at this badass! Nothing can hang in speed. Nothing except maybe a Von Braun Saturn V.

This image is my next purchase. Get outta my way, nigga! Thank you American Capitalism! Do you think you could have such in a Socialist Country? Fuck no.

>economies of scale and technological advancement is a thing
Thanks to fossil fuels.

Say's common sense. It costs money to grind up old batteries safely, and purify the lithium. Lots of equipment and chemicals to do that, which will also have waste product.

The real world is a lot messier than leftist sterile day dreamings.

>how so?
for one thing, replacing their batteries once they die often costs more than the car is worth. Also if anything breaks, a conventional mechanic can't help you, and the dealer will cost you an arm and a leg.

>Yeah.... at night. In your own fucking house.
>implying I have a driveway or a fancy garage to mount that stupid charging station

anyone who doesn't live in a HOUSE with a GARAGE or at the very least some kind of driveway, is fucked and has to charge their car at a public charging station. and you're fucked if there aren't any in your neighborhood

Potato batteries way of the future kek

I agree tesla bringing performance is a big win for electric car future.

electric cars are cool (if are are a smug cunt) but you can't replace anything in them unless you go through a dealer. I'll take my saudi prince credit depository for the ability to replace and fix parts myself, thank you.

>live in MA
>coal plants in New England region being shut down
>population continues to increase
>grid is dangerously close to overload - utility companies say rolling brownouts are a future reality if we don't plan for future energy use
>natural gas heats/powers most of the region
>NIMBY limousine liberals block new natural gas pipeline because feels
>current pipeline is running at max capacity - or will be shortly
>put a few solar panels on the side of the highway to feel good, despite MA getting a laughably low number of sunny days/solar irradiance reachimg the surface
>people complain when utility companies raise rates by 30% at a time, citing greed

For a state with a high IQ, I'm surrounded by fucking monkeys. Don't even get me started on the nuke plants from the 60s that will be decommissioned soon with no replacement plan.

>I don't know about potatonigger land but here in America there's gas stations everywhere.
no shit, and you have to drive to them every week to keep your car working. Not needed for electric.

Also the model s certainly isn't overpriced for what you get.

Electric is fine as a technology, but they could really do with smaller batteries and onboard power production.

Perhaps a void for Thorium to fill

Buy one if you like them and can afford one.

Who the fuck doesn't have a driveway?

they are god tier, /o/ hates them because muh transmission

What do you have against ultracapacitors and supercapacitors?

-----
A supercapacitor (SC) (sometimes ultracapacitor, formerly electric double-layer capacitor (EDLC)) is a high-capacity electrochemical capacitor with capacitance values much higher than other capacitors (but lower voltage limits) that bridge the gap between electrolytic capacitors and rechargeable batteries. They typically store 10 to 100 times more energy per unit volume or mass than electrolytic capacitors, can accept and deliver charge much faster than batteries, and tolerate many more charge and discharge cycles than rechargeable batteries.

These are the people arguing against electric cars

I have a 2015 Chevy Volt.

Bought it used in cash at 26,000 miles for $15,500.

I have charging stations at work and frequently bum off of municipal charging stations. I haven paid a dime for gas the entire time I've owned the vehicle. I still have the dealer's tank.


Overall all the all electric mode is great, but most Americans live in Suburban areas, so until the bump the range up on these plug in hybrids and all electric vehicles, they're not practical for most people.

>What do you have against ultracapacitors and supercapacitors?
They don't work

You know what'll happen to those nuke plants? They'll be forced to stay running longer than designed, maybe pop a new reactor into an old infrastructure that wasnt really made for it. Then if/when it has a problem, the right wing will get the blame.

When really, it was leftists fault for not approving totally brand new plants.

I don't know, maybe people who live in an apartment? and not all houses are made equal.

I live in a 3 townhouse unit. they each have a driveway in front, but they are shittily made so that no normal car can actually go up without scraping the underside, so nobody uses them.

>I'd buy one today especially a Tesla.
Buying a cheap plastic marketing meme car. Why?

>Drive to them every week

No, I fill up twice a week because I don't drive very often and getting gas is incredibly short and simple so I usually fill up when I'm already on my way somewhere or going to work instead of going out of my way some day to fill up. No car skyjacking my electric bill necessary

Should go solar. Got a long way to go before several ton trucks are running off the sun, but it's a start. Batteries can be recycled.

You'll never blackout entierly due to not having enough energy.Canada signed a deal that makes it so we'll export you energy from Quebec if that ever happens, at our own cost.

Expensive, short life time, leakage of energy is pretty large.

Big batteries destroy the environment.

>They don't work
So why are they in use in lots of applications?
---
A supercapacitor (SC) (sometimes ultracapacitor, formerly electric double-layer capacitor (EDLC)) is a high-capacity electrochemical capacitor with capacitance values much higher than other capacitors (but lower voltage limits) that bridge the gap between electrolytic capacitors and rechargeable batteries. They typically store 10 to 100 times more energy per unit volume or mass than electrolytic capacitors, can accept and deliver charge much faster than batteries, and tolerate many more charge and discharge cycles than rechargeable batteries.
Supercapacitors are used in applications requiring many rapid charge/discharge cycles rather than long term compact energy storage: within cars, buses, trains, cranes and elevators, where they are used for regenerative braking, short-term energy storage or burst-mode power delivery. Smaller units are used as memory backup for static random-access memory (SRAM).

The scale of that is smaller than people think.
Let's start a global boycott on Arab oil!

Hydrogen cars are realistically the way forward. Elon Musk is literally Steve Jobs 2.0. Probably receiving money from fossil fuel sponsors to keep pushing electricity as the future.

>No, I fill up twice a week
that's still every week. holy shit, america is fucking doomed.

That article is retarded because one of the things that causes ICE vehicles to pollute is their irregular power output.

An electric engine always runs at maximum efficiency, so even though it's not perfect, it's still an improvement.

Meant to say I get gas once every two weeks

Also leftists here wont approve of Yucca mountain then bitch and moan when we have to put it in places less safe than yucca mountain. Fucking idiots I swear.

> (You)
>Expensive, short life time, leakage of energy is pretty large.
No ugly lithium required.

As to expensive, that is where new research gets in. As to short life time, not any more. As to leakage of energy, yes, but they are working on it - batteries lose charge as well over time. Capacitors just lose the charge a faster, but that can be remedied through a cycling process.

I know, my mum test drove a leaf for about 45 minutes from full charge and got a low battery warning

>So why are they in use in lots of applications?
they can be used where not much power is needed, but they don't beat batteries for energy density and good discharge rates.

Holy shit you're a moron

this guy gets it. Best way is to reduce consumtion

>applications requiring many rapid charge/discharge cycles rather than long term compact energy storage: within cars, buses, trains, cranes and elevators, where they are used for regenerative braking, short-term energy storage or burst-mode power delivery. Smaller units are used as memory backup for static random-access memory
Basically, they are not made to be a car battery.

90% of all people you fucking dick

I live in a nice 4 bedroom townhouse with a large garden but I still don't have a drive

>they can be used where not much power is needed, but they don't beat batteries for energy density and good discharge rates.
BS.

lmao the mick musk fanboy rears his retarded head again

>how so?
they cost substantially more than analogous models of gasoline cars for considerably less functionality and convenience

>UK
you barely have space to park a woobley-wobbley

pretty much everyone with a house here has a driveway