On a scale of 1 to 10, how fucked is ISIS?

On a scale of 1 to 10, how fucked is ISIS?

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If trump and putin actually work together to fight ISIS, all of the isis controlled territory will look like baghdad by mid summer.

Fuck man. How has it been 15 years already since this happened?

It's very complicated though, because Syria must be dealt with first. And it seems like whatever the outcome in Syria, we lose.

you can't fight an ideological war with mental retardation + the track record of the US would suggest, you're only gonna make things worse

Anywhere between 3 and 9, depending on Trump's competence and ability to listen to intel and make tough decisions

ISIS will fold in 5 seconds if you can cut their funding from Saudi Arabia/the US/Israel

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i'm literally shaking

Only faggots are anti Assad

what isis controlled territory? They're getting their ass kicked by girls.

No idea man, feels like i was watching this shit yesterday
youtube.com/watch?v=R30cbnkMG3s

We're gonna have a replay of what the Mongols did to it, but in every city

They were maximally fucked as soon as Hillary lost.

Shouldn't you be cleaning someone's teeth right now?

they'd be a lot more fucked if we'd quit funding them

This.

I'm not informed enough to be on any side (I think in a lot of ways we benefited from the war being dragged on and both sides killing each other), but the US committed quite a bit in terms of resources to the opposition to Assad, even going as far as saying "Assad must go". We will look like assholes if there's a peace agreement where Assad's regime is maintained, especially considering the humanitarian toll his regime has had. Then there's the fact that Iran is allied with Assad's Syria, and Russia has influence via Assad as well.

She unintentionally brings up a good point.

Why bother allowing women in the military if you're holding them to lesser standards?

bombing the shit out of them literally gives them more reason to fight, and spreads more hate to fuel them

like, if you bombed my senpai, I'll fuck you up, on a regional scale

0 cause the U.S and Isreal run ISIS

We obliterated Japan and Germany with bombs. They gave up.

ISIS is the best thing to happen.
>all the dangerous muslim terrorists leave my city and go to syria
>they come back in body bags

>ISIS gets defeated
>'Syrian refugees' stop
>yfw the world suddenly stops becoming right-wing
>SJWs become less of a threat now
>now literally nobody cares and life goes back to being a normal liberal shithole

It's absolutely Vital that ISIS still poses a massive threat, really.
The reason Europe is becoming more nationalist and right-wing was because
rapefugees were fucking things up, and ppl were starting to see

Tis' also the reason trump won.

was that emo kid from your city?

...

Those stealth bombers will be great for blowing up sand farmers armed with knives and 60 year old AKs!

its funny, because the CIA is currently backing ISIS in Syria.

...

No, we fought them on the ground, on the oceans and in the air, and that was during a world war against an alliance of nations. For Germany, this meant millions of dead fighting on the eastern front. For Japan, we ushered in the atomic age and people thought we could glass the entire island at the time. False equivalency.

>but the US committed quite a bit in terms of resources to the opposition to Assad, even going as far as saying "Assad must go"
And those people lost the election. The new administration has the opportunity to cut our losses and move on, but I doubt Trump administration will effectively fight ISIS as it requires giving aid to groups aligned with Iran and actual socialists (Kurds).

Also, ISIS is good for right wing regimes like Trump and Israel as it gives them a cartoonishly evil threat to play off of. Many Israeli think tanks have mentioned that ISIS is a huge boon to Israel because it draws potential fighters away from Palestine and also keeps Israeli citizens in fear so they support more authoritarian policies.

>We will look like assholes

I don't care if Obama looks like an asshole, since he already is one.


>considering the humanitarian toll his regime has had

That's retarded. Assad has been fighting for secularism against Saudi Jihadism and terrorism. This whole mess happened because of the Iraq War followed by the gulf states (and Obama/Hillary)funding terrorists not because of Assad.

And no one who has ever sided with Saudi Arabia gets to talk about anything related to humanity.

>Assad's Syria, and Russia has influence via Assad as well.

And? I don't give a fuck. Taking out secular leaders in the Middle East has proven to be so disastrous that we're at the point it should be illegal to even suggest it.

No American set foot on the main Japanese islands. They were completely brought to heel with superior airpower (nukes, firebombs, etc.).

>Humanitarian toll his regime has had
Oh, right barrel bombs and all that jazz... Way to buy the Western narrative to smear him. The guy may not be a saint but war is hell and he's fighting terrorists. Meanwhile, our rogue intelligence agencies are arming/funding said terrorists along with our great Gulf 'allies'

jake bilardi?
i went to his school, i knew his older brother and saw his dad at woolies recently.

gold

t. retard

Trump's already all but said the war is fucking over and he's ending all support of the terrorist rebels, a policy that Obama implemented, bts, not that you care because you are a huge faggot.

Assad wins and you lose

go back to Israel, Shlomo

I agree, if we wanna stay on the road we're currently one.

We HAVE to keep ISIS as a thing, not because we support it, but because it's the source of the West (And to an extent, the East) becoming more red-pilled

Good, Geese are total assholes

fucking kek

on*

So we genocide them.

Obama helped fund ISIS and is, by Islamic law a Muslim (his father was a Muslim)

This

Are you retarded? Did you actually read my post?

There is no need for us to fight

the war is all but over and Assad is winning

we should be supporting the Syrians and Iranians instead of the fucking Saudis and gulf states

Yeah I did

Your leftist wish fulfillment is that Trump is going to be pro ISIS like Obama was, but guess what? It's not happening.

More bombs were dropped on Vietnam than all the bombs dropped during WWII. Did the Vietnamese ever give up? Is Vietnam currently a stable western style democracy or a Communist shithole?

Which is actually sad. Years before we used to look at US and think how cool that would be to be like them, all western and shit, no middle eastern heresy and shit.

You don't understand. They have no nation. They are an idea. You can't kill an idea. I don't know how you can stop them but it's not through war.

Most those bombs were in empty jungle areas

During Vietnam they weren't allowed to carpet bomb civilian areas because "muh human rights" and fear that China would retaliate with nukes.

If they had the war would have been over in a few days

>Your leftist wish fulfillment is that Trump is going to be pro ISIS like Obama was, but guess what? It's not happening.
Nowhere did I say that you fucking mongoloid, I said that Trump won't do the things that will actually stop ISIS which goes beyond just cutting aid to militants in Syria (who I think we should stop funding as they are jihadist scum).

ISIS exists in places where they are unopposed, the Shiites in Baghdad (plus the Iraqi army) and the Kurds in Syria and Iraq routinely fuck ISIS' shit up but we won;t help those groups because they are Iranian/Socialists.

ISIS is losing irreversably right now

It's comparable to Nazi Germany around late 1944-45. They're past their prime and being pushed back in Mosul and their capital, Raqqa. Meanwhile Assad has to just take Idlib and the rebellion is quashed. Assad just has to give some concessions to the Kurds, and then he can focus on driving ISIS out of his country.

of all sad words of tongue or pen, the saddest are these: george takei was right again.

internment camps when?

We lost Vietnam due to lack of will. Do you really think rice farmers could stare down the most powerful military that ever existed?

The fact that they have no nation does complicate the matter. There's no simple solution, but it seems like the first thing we do is bomb the shit out of their de facto caliphate. They control quite a bit of territory as it stands. We also need good intelligence

easy access to mobile pussy.

>stop ISIS which goes beyond just cutting aid to militants in Syria

It doesn't

The rebellion in Syria lives and dies off of free shit the Gulf monarchies and the Saudis give them

when that dries up they are dead

But once ISIS dies it won't matter, the Saudis will just spend billions on other Jihadists somewhere else to achieve their eventual global caliphate

at least until the oil runs out and they're all back to riding camels.

It almost feels like we're on think-tank levels here, looking moves ahead. ISIS is a shitty regime. if ISIS must be removed, their regional control must be glassed into oblivion. Otherwise, their ability to exert any influence (particularly through communication/the internet, as Trump indicated in the campaign), must be strangled and extinguished, while we can exploit them during their waning existence.

Their influence only exists because of the gulf states and us

The US was a nice place until all the jews came here

>We lost Vietnam due to lack of will. Do you really think rice farmers could stare down the most powerful military that ever existed?
How young are you? You can't win people who can eat their own shit and fight till their last breath. It's the same shit happening in Afghanistan. First of all, there is no point in conquering it... And second of all it's their land, they can't just walk away and give up.

I support this post.

All values = ISIS is fucked.

you think we cant kill every single person in that god forsaken shithole and repopulate it with actual humans?

Rebels != ISIS/ISIL

They are both Jihadist groups but ISIS/ISIL is present in Syria and Iraq you stupid fuck. The rebels are trying to install a pro-Arab Gulf state in Syria, ISIS/ISIL wants to dominate the entire Arab world and is opposed to the Saudi government (not all Saudis as they get funding from Gulf state Arabs privately) who they see as decadent.

The rebels are fucking crazy and we should stop funding them but that won't stop ISIS. To stop them you need people on the ground to root them out, people like Assad and the Kurds in Syria and the Iraqi army and Kurds in Iraq.

no b-52s or ac130's. 2/10 could defeat militarily

0

the euro-migrant crisis won't end with the syrian civil war.
we already know and understand that these are largely african economic migrants.
they're coming in any way they can, and like a leaky ship there's no way to plug the holes.
the crisis in europe continues unabated without serious political change. Frauke, Geert, Marine... there's still hope.

gop insider told us the plan was to build up the german army as the eu ground force. that'll be lots of jobs for those migrants, serving as continental EU's military.
'grats on that, europe.

what a time to be alive.

Read history. Guadalcanal, Okinawa, Indonesia, mainland China. The Japanese military was engaged in a lot of places not on their islands, but it is true that they were bombed there. Still, false equivalency. Then is not now, and Isis isn't Imperial Japan. You fuckwit.

Awesome way to start a new world war, and get an alliance of enemies aligned against us as the aggressor state.

Mess with the best, die like the rest.

>free
>syrian
>army

Not a false equivalency. The Japanese believed so strongly in their cause that they were flying their planes into US ships. There was just as much zeal for them as there is with terrorists strapping bombs to their chests. Japan wanted a pan-asian empire. ISIS wants a global islamic caliphate. There are clear parallels.

The only difference between ISIS and the other rebels are that ISIS has been more successful at unifying and imposing their will. They did this mainly by using the arms given to them by the US/gulf states, crossing the border into Iraq, taking over Iraqi territory, and then using that as a base to invade Eastern Syria.

For fuck's sake Al-Nusra and ISIS are both former Al-Qaeda affiliates in Syria that broke off because of various management disagreements.


youtube.com/watch?v=ccdeANvo2bg

The rebels were ALWAYS Jihadists

They were ALWAYS Al-Qaeda affiliates

If you think otherwise you're a damn fool

youtube.com/watch?v=INPW3QF3xn8

This. Islamists are virtually the same psychologically to the Japs. The only reason they haven't submitted is they have no centralized war machine to bomb, no common leadership to intimidate into submission, and we want minimal civilian casualties which allows them to get away easily

...

"If we could just commit war crimes on a massive scale it would have all been over in a few days."

Except the part where we get into a fucking nuclear war with Russia.

Fair point on that aspect - both entities have ideologies that inspire willingness to sacrifice life to destroy the enemy. Territorial expansion is a rather common facet of fascist, expansionist, bellicose regimes, so I don't see that as particularly compelling.

Let's look at the differences.

Imperial Japan was a nation state in the classical sense. It had a functional set of laws, internationally recognized territory (when we bombed Hiroshima, Nagasaki and Tokyo, we were bombing Japan - and as a fascist, totalitarian state an argument can be made that there were no real "civilians", as the entire society was in a way part of the war machine), treaties, and all the trappings of a legitimate government. They had a single figurehead (their emperor), who, once he surrendered, largely broke the will of the people, and like that the war was pretty much over.

Isis has... what? Transient territorial boundaries, stolen land, illegitimate, inconsistent rule of religious "law", and what else? Trump is right about one thing - It started after we pulled out of Iraq, where we had no business being in the first place, and where we could by no means stay forever in any case. Unlike Imperial Japan, there's no figurehead to secure capitulation from, no static population or economic centers, it's an insurgency/guerrilla movement masquerading as a nation-state.

I apologize for my personal insult previously - you do seem thoughtful and honestly willing to engage in intelligent discourse, and these are rare things these days. While I don't agree with you (I don't think, on this point, based on a very superficial conversation we've had so far), I want you to know I value that fact.

>war
>crimes

kek

the only crime is losing

Civilian casualties on a massive scale gave rise, in some capacity, to Islamism in its current form as a backlash against foreign interventionism and militarism. Accepting massive civilian casualties (Like, bombing 100 civvies to get one asshole, or going after their families, or whatever else) will only embolden these fuckheads and further empower their ideology and hatred, while fueling their propaganda (recruitment) machine.

The Nuremberg trials, and the ICC disagree.

The end game is this.

Topple the kings of Saudi Arabia.

We can no longer stomach 10,000 monarchs as a dominate force in the middle east.

We can no longer have 10,000 Princes and Kings, royals, to control the heart of Islam.

We are destabilizing the entire fucking region and building a massive Islamic army to invade and wipe out Mecca.

It was never about Israel.
It was never about Iran.
It was never about oil, nukes or WMD's.
It was never about Kurdish Genocide
It was never about slant drilling
It was never about shipping lanes
It was never about anything except a gigantic royal family having direct control over the Islamic religious pipeline of faith for the Haaj at the Kaaba built by Abraham at the supposed birth place of Muhammad and the place where Muhammad received his first revelations in a cave.

1 billion+ Muslims are ruled and lorded over by the Saudi Royal family.

That dynasty ends.

And with it Islam can be destroyed.

I'm not saying Imperial Japan and ISIS are perfectly equivalent, but I'm comparing them to provide evidence that an "idea" can be destroyed by military means. ISIS is not a nation state (luckily they fell short of occupying Baghdad), but they did conquer Mosul, they did not steal it. They are a territorial entity. I think that if the United States and other countries were to invade ISIS occupied territory from the ground, they'd fold up quickly and we'd have another insurgency like Iraq 2.0.

I don't know what the solution is to destroying ISIS. But their leadership and many of their men can be annihilated with airpower and good intelligence that can be used to guide it. Beyond that, we would have to prop somebody up to fill the power vacuum that ISIS currently occupies.

Well ya, when you bomb a hospital from a drone and are just like
>whoopsies, there was a terrorist inside so it's fine xD
you're going to get more terrorists

But rolling into their cities and roughing up the populations, not giving a fuck about confirming if the guy you're going after is civilian or not until after, is effective. The secular dictators keep order this way. Russia keeps Chechnya in check this way. China keeps their western provinces in check this way

my point went over your head

Just check my numbers and youll see

I don't disagree that you can drone the shit out of men, leadership and materiel, but I don't see how that's substantially different from what we've been doing. I mean, we have bombed the shit out of a lot of 'em, and these days they're sitting in civilian centers.

You know who did a great job keeping their shit in line? Fuckin' Saddam. Unfortunately, trying to prop up a new guy now just becomes another proxy conflict, US vs Iran/Russia, etc.

And I don't agree you can destroy an idea with military means. The nazi's lost the war, their leaders got tried and executed for their crimes, and it's pretty clear that National Socialism isn't fuckin' dead.

Russia and Chechnya, China and its provinces are not equivalent to US and the middle east. US occupying the middle east would be the equivalent of China occupying California. The natives would see it as an invasion, and respond in kind, as they have done, and continue to do in Iraq/Afghanistan.

No, I get it, but without at least the facade of the rule of law, another world war is inevitable - empires competing for dominance. The species might not survive World War III.

Or the equivalent of China occupying Oklahoma.

1. ISIS fighters are not afraid to die. I believe Donald Trump is too afraid to have any of our soldiers die due to backlash. ISIS exploits that and regrows its' population in Syria. Trump doesn't' care as long as they don't attack. 10 years later and another 9/11 will surely happen.

I too went to his school and saw his willy wollies.

1776
>Implying we need their help at all
We could level the entire region in 4 days, don't need their help at all
Only reason we will even be going into the region is to stop Vladdy from trying to turn it into their new Afghanistan

america doesn't have woolies?
so you have to shop at coles or IGA every time?

Fixed

> merkel was playing 12D chess all along

Considering that ISIS gotten the US President they wanted, I'm thinking "not very fucked".

As fucked as the vietnamese rice farmers ?