A question. On this map of ukranian clay claims is a sizeable part of Poland they have once claimed. This green area. What is the story behind this?
Anons with Polish/Hohol history knowledge
Angel King
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Anthony Evans
>What is the story behind this?
Tyler Taylor
>t. Butthurt League
>Members: Pawel "Kurwa" Lechzyzyzyzyz and Ivan Moskalov.
Justin Myers
It was part of Rus' and Halych-Volhynia Principality in Middle Ages.
But it was pretty much polonized for many centuries already.
I don't know why the autists claim it.
Luke Lewis
>Ukraina: U+kraina - U kresu krainy - U krańcu krainy Korony Królestwa Polskiego, Rzeczypospolitej Obojga Narodów.
>Ukraine: At+borderland - At the borderland of the Crown of the Kingdom of Poland, Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth.
Luis Ross
...
Mason Rodriguez
Ukrainian memes, you dont have to worry about this, they'll stop existing soon.
t bh they have no right to that land.
Kayden Gonzalez
Western western Ukraine was Polish for a loooong time
Jackson Sanders
Nobility and cities were Polish but the majority of peasantry was Ukrainian. Stalin deported Poles and Ukrainians from both sides so both areas are ethnically pure now. Thanks, Joseph.
Austin Harris
I see. Well, you and Belarus can still demand some land from Poland.
Charles Fisher
UPA attempted to genocide Poles and got BTFO by Soviet Army
David Young
>I don't know why the autists claim it.
Because Poland rightfully inherited Galicia-Volhynia in 1340.
Xavier Baker
This is en.wikipedia.org
During WW1 Ukies set up 2 countries
en.wikipedia.org
en.wikipedia.org
They say those are ethnic ukrainian lands so because of that they should belong to Ukraine. Ukrainian chauvinists even have a saying "Pamiętaj Lasze, po San nasze"
Shortly after the war that territory was cleansed of Ukies en.wikipedia.org
Polish historian of civilizations claims though, that those western territories became ethnically mixed only after the Mongol invasions when Ruthenians simply fled to the west
Zachary Flores
That's not how it works.
You can't just ask for some land, only because you think it's yours. You have to fight for it, conquer it.
And Ukraine right now has to worry about completely different problems.
Jeremiah Sullivan
>poor country fucked over by civil wars
>hur dur give us more land look how well we're doing
Wyatt Ramirez
>after the Mongol invasions when Ruthenians simply fled to the west
Same thing happened with Bukovina and Maramures (Transcarpatia/Rutenia)
>some ukrainian faggot going "WE WUZ HERE FOREVER"
>slav(e)s refugees during 7th century and mongol/turkic/tatar invasions
Motherfucking russians, we give you refugee and then you attack, kick us out and claim our house for your self?
Literally arab tier in Sweden.
Adrian Ortiz
Once upon a time there was Rus.
And it has split into many feudal countries. One of them was Galicia-Vohlynia that joined with Poland at some point of time.
Around the same time, pagan, Baltic Lithuanians conquered what is now Belarus and Ukraine(+ little bit of extra). Then Lithuania(baptised) and Poland(baptised long time before) formed personal union which after years turned into very weird country - typically called Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth in English, whatever.
The rest of Russia was eventually united by one of the old princedoms, Muscovy.
So #1 - the difference between Russia and Ukraine/Belarus - one was part of Muscovy the other two were parts of PLC, with different government, culture etc.
The difference between Ukraine and Belarus lies in Ukraine being governed by the crown and Belarus - by Lithuania.
After WW1 the old, heavily Polonised parts of Galicia-Vohlynia had enormous population of ethnic Poles and then after Polish counter-offensive against Bolsheviks in 1921, the interwar eastern border(containing all that yellow part). In 1939 R-M pact assigned it to the Soviets. Later on when Germans started occupying it, Ukrop went full retard on ethnic Poles living in the region, only to get fucked in the ass by returning soviets. The R-M border remained post-war with massive population movements being made to:
1) Depolonise Belarus/Lithuania/Ukraine(all SSR's back then)
2) Deukranise and Degermanise Poland.
Done.
Gavin Jenkins
exactly
Zachary Ward
Come home Ruthenian man
Kayden Walker
Look at those german tumors all around Jesus fuck. No wonder this country was a mess.
Asher Cruz
>ukranian clay
No such thing.
William Martin
>Literal prison of nations composed of serfdom, forced colonization, racemixing and retrograde imperialism applied by an inbred Hasburgshit
I'm happy whenver I hear some austri*n suffers because of t*rks, g*psies, n*ggers or mudslim*s.
I'm happy you will become a minority in your own country.
Thats exactly what you did to ethnic romanians, slovaks, croats, slovenians, serbians.
Enjoy them yugoslav and t*rk men colonzing your daughter's womb.
Hudson Howard
>Ukrop went full retard on ethnic Poles living in the region
I'm not from Western Ukraine and it's honestly embarrassing how people here deny this.
I know one woman, she lived there before WW2 and fled to East during war. But she witnessed this massacre. What's shocking is literally neighbors killing neighbors even married Ukrainians and Poles. Kids, women, old people...
Also pretty hypocritical when you constantly scream about Holodomor.
Aaron Butler
Ukraine is a mess. Always was, always will be.
Based advice, don't try to understand its clay.
Ayden Rivera
You did the same towards romanians and jews.
Parker Perez
The Austrians literally pushed the "Ukrainian" identity on most of the indifferent peasant population which was ethnically Ruthenian-Polish mixed for centuries going back as far to the 1300's. Intermarrying was very common for centuries in these lands.
Camden Edwards
>The Austrians literally pushed the "Ukrainian" identity
And bolsheviks continued it. Korenization and shit.
Jace Sanchez
...
Jonathan Martin
This guy knows what's up.
Ukraine is just a name for a region that nobody quite knows where it starts and where it ends, that's why Putin is still trying to remodel the borders.
Evan Williams
The austrians literally pushed for settling and racemixing with gypsies, changed their name to "new peasant" or "new hungarian" and forbid gypsy-gypsy marriages.
Banned their language too.
mfa.gov.hu
"rutenians" are nothing but russian population pushed into romanian mountains by turkic/tatar invasions
We took them in and fought together, then they backstabbed us and ethnically cleansed romanians from those parts.
Thats that we got from saving christian slavic refugees.We lost Transcarpatia and Bucovina.
Leo Lewis
Jayden Campbell
The Germans did before that, and after that in their Nazi form.
Eli Ross
All is rightful Lithuanian clay.
Nolan Gray
>We lost Transcarpatia and Bucovina.
William Brooks
You look like a sane Ukrainian. I demand one answear.
Why do people who consider themselves a real nation feast on false hate towards another nation without even thinking that this nation saved many of them from their greatest genocide in history. The hohlodomor.
Are they so stupid or should communism really by treated as a crime against humanity for brainwashing whole generations?
Carter Hill
Not after Lithuania refused our """"diplomatic"""" proposal of a union.
Curzon line B + current borders would have been almost perfect t bh
Nolan Thompson
>all these fucking euros with their boarder squabbles
I swear to fuck, I hope we pull out of NATO and let you stupid faggots kill them selves.
Jaxon Ross
>If some country annexes a land, it magically changes the ethnic-religious structure it has !
By your logic, poles were german and russian, since you stopped existing for... 200 years?
Jason Nguyen
Except for Wilno
Wilno nasze kurwa
Jordan Garcia
Shut up, Żmudź.
Jose Watson
>Given a golden opportunity to live long and prosper.
>Chimp out.
Fucking Lithuanians reeeee
Luis Flores
>Wilno nasze kurwa
>polish death camps
Benjamin Jones
>Why do people who consider themselves a real nation feast on false hate towards another nation without even thinking that this nation saved many of them from their greatest genocide in history. The hohlodomor.
>NO BUT THE SECOND POLISH REPUBLIC WAS BAAAD VERY BAD, EVIL, IMPRISON FEW HUNDRED OF OUR TERRORISTS
While in fact the Second Polish Republic shielded and saved many Ukrainians from the Holdomor! OUN and Bandera were terrorists supported and funded by the Nazi Abwher in the interwar period in Poland. They killed prominent Ukrainians like professors who worked with Polish authorities to improve Polish-Ukrainian relations, but also assassinated Polish statesmen. Now some stupid banderites have grudges towards Poland for sending ONLY FEW HUNDREDS of Ukrainian terrorists who planted bombs in public spaces and assassinated Poles and Ukrainians to the Bereza Kartuska prison camp... Fun fact, Polish communists (mostly) and other criminals were imprisoned too.
youtube.com
en.wikipedia.org
Aaron Davis
>yellow
Polish bastards giving khohols theland i was born on. You cant comprehend how hard life is being a ukrainian.
This bannanarepublic needs a takeover.
Anthony Green
mfw when my roomie from Lviv says the same. One based guy. Never knew someone could hate the Russians so much.
Brody Scott
>it magically changes the ethnic-religious structure it has !
Joseph Green
...
David Lee
>BUT WE WUZ COSSACKS N RUTHENIANS N SHIEEET
Urine is a failed state rapidly spiraling towards total collapse and I can't wait to see Jan and Ivan split it down the middle
Matthew Williams
Poles were cossacks too.
Charles Miller
Why is Wilno jewish?
Jews are literally everywhere and nobody knows where the fuck they came from.
Michael Gray
>The implication that Poland has a claim on a city where almost no Lithuanians lived before Stalin forcefully removed the Poles.
=
>The implication that Poland(Which didn't exist) Opened camps where they gassed themselves
Ian King
Russians unnaturally forced by Austria and Soviets to develop meme non-identity. Poles in west were genocided by fascist Banderisti and replaced with """Ukrainians""". same process is being repeated today in east.
fact of matter is that Ukraine is an entity completely made up by forces who wanted to mutilate Russia. it's not a real country.
Ryan Morris
>minority in their own capital
Julian Ross
If Crimea belongs to Russia than Russia belongs to Poland. Ukrainian is more linguistically closer to Polish than Russian.
Jacob Walker
>>The implication that Poland(Which didn't exist) Opened camps where they gassed themselves
?
timesofisrael.com
worldfuturefund.org
Poles hated jews.
I'm not saying Poles don't have a claim on Wilno.
Henry Bennett
>Ukrainian is more linguistically closer to Polish than Russian
How does that make sense when Polish is a West Slavic language and both Ukrainian and Russian are East Slavic languages?
Kevin Rogers
It is top bait my gypsy friend I admire your dedication.
Owen Kelly
Because of Russia after the partitions of Poland.
youtube.com
Brayden Smith
There was no antisemitism before the war, that's why there was a fuckton of jews here.
It's another story after the war though.
Evan Adams
Well, yeah, you basically made Jogailla king of Poland, and then when Jadwiga died you LITERALLY made him King of Poland. It's not like you were trying to *annex* Lithuania.
Nolan Sanchez
You would still be turkrapebabies without Russian liberating you from Ottomans.
Carson Scott
Ukrainian - West Ukrainian that is - is a mix of Russian and Polish.
youtube.com
Isaac Powell
Oчeнь хopoшo!
Yes, yes, my Western slaves, fight against each other! Yes, your neighbor is the enemy and you must hate him.
Yes, let me have Ukraine, trust me.
Justin Perez
>examines-poles-who-killed-jews-during-wwii
Yes, all two of them! And guess what, every single country that had nazis on their territory repressed jews to some degree, we barely did it but of course the blame's on us.
Austrians and French were the most effective in giving all their jews to extermination camps, but nobody speaks of it.
Perhaps you didn't hear about it, But there are stories about the Jews greeting the Nazi saviours with hailing and spitting on the polish survivors after the first days of september.
And in case you wondered, the Polish death camp propaganda is spilled by the jews as a revange on the Polish society for maintaining antisemitic views after witnessing their treachery
Levi Sanchez
Jaxon Nelson
There was a story about integrating Podlasie and Ukraine into crown lands from Lithuania which led to a continuation of the union that I heard but Im missing some details on it.
Owen Harris
>Polish society for maintaining antisemitic views after witnessing their treachery
This is the case here after the majority of jews collaborated with the Soviets and sold us out after we thought of the as integrated brothers of jewish religion.
Easton Watson
And Poland was wise enough not to fall for that bait.
Leo Martinez
>tfw our retarded government will never accept this
Kevin Wright
Easton Watson
I-I know. It was good bait tho like said.
youtube.com
Mason Wood
1 Treaties won't let you
2 EU won't let you
3 NATO won't let you.
4 Urine won't let you.
5 UNcucks won't let you.
>accepting "gifts" from Russia
>Russia wanting to do good for Poland
Are you ok?
We have the 3rd largest minority in Ukraine and they can't even study in their own language.
Nicholas Jones
That's what they do, and they do it once again with Poland.
We'll soon be forced to pay reparations for the stolen property that we didn't steal, and they will convince the world that we did.
The polish death camp propaganda is already pushed far, and soon the difference between the executioner and the victim will be non existant.
Alexander Moore
Wow, not a single link to demographics of relevant areas.
Not a single link to Habsburg or Imperial Russian census data, which exist.
My favourite is the part where people unironically use Rus/Rus', Ruthenia and Russia as if they are different terms, and not being a case of Greek and Latin exonyms for a Slavic word.
Pathetic. Historic ignorance makes excellent breeding ground for nationalromantic historiography bullshit.
Jackson Gutierrez
>acel sentiment cand nu o sa obtinem bucovina, sudul basarabiei si maramuresul de la cacanarii de rusi care se cred ucraineni si antici celto-ruteni
John Butler
>tfw my Family is from Galicia
My last surname is Kruczek and Poles always tell me that's a jew name
Josiah Parker
>for 1000 years when all Europe is killing jews Poland was save heaven for them
>Poland hated jews
Thomas Wilson
>Not a single link to Habsburg or Imperial Russian census data, which exist.
well? you can post, can't you?
Luis Perez
The feels...
Gabriel Murphy
People of Ukraine are Russified Poles and Polonized Russians.
Sebastian Long
>Rawa Ruska
>located on current Polish-"Ukrainian" border
>"Russyns" preserved in Hungarian and Pannonian lands, but their relatives and descendants in Habsburg controlled parts switched to "Ukrainian"
Zachary Wright
>When you find out western hungarians are blondes with blue eyes
>when you find out eastern austrians are brown/dark haired with brown eyes and look like north italians
Brayden Myers
I've always found curious that name. Galicia is also a spanish region (rightful portuguese clay, but whatever).
you can find Galicia references in 19th century literature, particularly in Austro-hungarian and russian authors.
Jacob Myers
en.wikipedia.org
Here have this my american friend. It's a story about Lithuania getting cucked out of half of their country.
Based Zygmunt
Jackson Cruz
What's the point? People here are moronic pawns most of the time, who even in case they are interested in history, 99% of the time come here for a dumbed down, biased summary, and not for primary historic sources and documents.
The other type, even when confronted with such data that brings down their narrative, simply dismiss it and go full "history is irrelevant, the present is important"
bookland.com
for example.
Retards will simply let out Ukrainization, Koryenizatsiya, Freie Ukraine, persecution of Russyns etc.
Carter Anderson
Go to /his/ if you want something more substantive than shitposting Mr. Toothpaste Plus
David Russell
See?
Moronic "Ukrainian" diaspora Internet warring from Winnipeg or some other distant-from-Ukraine-the-glorious-homeland paradise.
Christian Martinez
Ha Cтpaшнoмy Cyдi Бoжoмy, Cтeпaн Бaндepa i Poмaн Шyхeвич, викoнyють фyнкцiю пpиcяжних, cyдячи нaйбiльших кaтiв yкpaїнcькoї нaцiї, cepeд яких Чингiзхaн, Пьйoтp Пєpвий, Кaтєpiнa Bєлiкaя, Лєнiн, Cтaлiн, Бєpiя, Пiлcyдcький, i Гiтлep.
Dominic Martin
1
Ryan Harris
not sure what you're trying to say, but my idea is that most people here adhere to the narrative that Ukraine is an aberration. Difficult problem to solve but hardly an ethno-country in the european sense.
if you have contributions, post. some people are interested.
Noah Hughes
2
Kayden Cooper
3
Jace Adams
habsburgers tried to colonize them like the germans did with western polandia
Chase Scott
Imperial Russian census data 1897, overall and by regions slider select.
demoscope.ru
Galicia census data
czernowitz.blogspot.hr
There are also interesting census data for 1857 1910 and Carpathian Ruthenia (Hungary)
Not a lot of books and hard data is available online, though.
Xavier Diaz
Galicia in E. Europe is austrian meme created to justify their claims and depolonise people living there, it was something to do with Celts that lived there before ancient times (similiar meme was to try make White Croats" out of Poles around Cracow, some of them even saId it was thier nationality when they settled in USA).
Before partitions it was always Litte Poland and Red Ruthenia with "border" around San and Bug rivers.
Cameron Peterson
Independent Ukraine was a crime against Ruthenian nation.
Hudson Brown
Losing Kresy was very beneficial to Poland actually, it was a terribly backward area, and Ukrainian-Polish conflict dragged us down. Also it led to conflict with Russia.
Best scenario for Poland in 20th century would be Poland with Curzon line B in East, more territory in the West(also maybe East Prussia) in alliance/confederation with victorious White Russia after WW1.
Hunter Brooks
>losing clay
>beneficial
ok
>inb4 but you got german clay
you mean piles of bricks stomped by soviet army
meanwhile wilno was in good shape
Nicholas Ramirez
Wilno was a shithole. 60% of buildings there were out of wood.
Also the territories regained by Poland were originally Polish and full of industry and resources.
Kresy had nothing comparable, besides uneducated population, lack of infrastructure, swamps, angry Ukrainians and impoverished villages looking like Middle Ages never ended.
Henry Jackson
retard
we got poorest german region (prussia), and pile of bricks (silesia)
how is that a gain
at least wilno was in functional state