The Wall

I want to know this boards general thoughts on the wall being built on private land. Most of you seem to hate when the Federal government comes after your rights as a citizen so why is it okay for them to do it this time? Do you honestly believe eminent domain is the way to go about this wall?
No meme answers, I want this to be a civil discussion.

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en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fifth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution#Takings_clause
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I'd be more than happy to give up some of my land if it meant keeping illegals out

You would be happy to give up your land, and I see no problem with that, however, lets say your neighbor refused to give up his land, would you support the federal government infringing on his rights as a citizen?

Eminent domain is a common law doctrine as old as private property. The fifth amendment requires people to be fairly compensated if the government does something like build a border wall in their land. If it was my land I'd charge them a backstage pass to a trump rally.

Just build the wall around his land, then. Make it so that he has to pass through a checkpoint every time he wants visit civilization

something tells me those ranchers would be more than happy not having wet backs crossing their property

I suppose yeah some would be, however, I still haven't received a clear answer, do you or do you not believe that if a land owner refuses to sell his private property that the federal government be allowed to take it by force?

how is this not solved with eminent domain? People lose their houses to make way for a fucking road, and if we really wanted to do all we have to do is make wall = national security, and the that land is the government's again right?

Look guys I don't support nor hate the wall I just want to know why Sup Forums is okay with the federal government having power over privately owned land

I wouldn't know. I'm not qualified to make that kind of decision, nor do I know enough about our current state and federal ordinances pertaining to land seizure

Fair enough

eminent domain, come on now you all cant be this stupid

FDR had no problem stealing peoples gold to then steal from us for generations

Fuck it "steal" the land for the nations well being

Eminent domain is established common law, centuries old. The land owner must be fairly compensated for the loss of land. My parents lost a chunk of their land for I-49 a few years ago. There's no problem with it. Only issue is the cases where the gov't takes it and gives it to somebody politically connected, which is a real abuse of the power and not a legitimate exercise of it. That's not the case with the wall.

IANAL, but along us borders, like a utility company, the federal gvt already has legal access. The gvt routinely patrols the border, and has access to private land and Indian Reservation's. Building a wall on the border is nothing, legally speaking its equivalent of the power co. having to replace an underground live in your property, by default the federal government has right to access. BUT, this needs verificiaction with Bureau of Indian Affairs as dealing with Indian tribes is by treaty, and gets complicated (which makes it in favor of fed gvt by default)

Yes you are right that eminent domain is centuries old, but if a property owner refuses all payments, then in a court of law the federal government can take private property by force if it believe that the land will be put to good use. So lets say you refuse to sell, they even ask you to make the offers to sell, and you still refuse to negotiate, then the most likely scenario that would happen is that the federal government decides they need it anyways and you go through what is known as condemnation proceedings and basically they can take your land by force if you lose your case as to why you don't want to sell.

libertarians can fuck off. This is a fascist board

Wow great argument

The border has already been done lads.
The vehicle barrier infrastructure has been instituted by the Warrior President Bush.
All the leylines, environmental impact statements, archaeological surveys, biological impact statements, property agreements with municipal governments, private property owners, national park lands, Native American tribal lands( re: Tohono O'odham, yuma, basically the ONLY tribes with land that has land intersected with the ACTUAL INTERNATIONAL BORDER, meaning U.S./mexico border (the large section in red)), ...... It's been done!!
Its been DID!!! Already!
Trump can wall off the cities all he likes.
We need more BP in the wide open deserts, more cameras, more ENFORCEMENT, more deportation, the death of sanctuary cities,
The end of the democrat cuckfest.
MAGA

Yes I know this, however, do you believe that the federal government should have the type of overreach to do so, should a private property owner be forced to have the federal government develop on his land even though he refuses?

Nice thread, I'm learning a lot.

We'll just strong arm and coerce the little whiny cocksmoker until he complies. How much land does a fucking wall take up, not much. YOu gotta be patriotic or GTFO.

>tfw no border ranch to kill illegals with impunity

So we dont fucking get genocided by spics, idiot.

>you gotta be patriotic or gtfo

So then you must side with your fellow American right? Would you support the federal government strong arming and coercing you?

what we need is summary execution for illegals

wew lad nice argument

Didn't you see the ranchers and Farmers and folks who lived on the border complaints about how droves of 100s of illegals at a time would march through their property and how unsafe they felt.

10 /10 would let Donald build the wall

There's no private land on the border. Every nation in the world maintains direct control over its borders.

I can't imagine any private ranchers near the border who wouldn't want a border wall. Do you know how much crap those guys put up with on a night-by-night basis from illegals coming through their property?

this

The Tohono will not accept the wall

sacrifices must be made

>>infringing upon his rights

Imminent domain isn't infringement, it's a rational social policy which fairly allows the government to negotiate at market value for land, as opposed to simply stealing it. This isn't Russia you massive faggot

>There's no private land on the border.
This is wrong though, there is private land on the border. And I never asked on the opinions of the private ranchers, I quite explicit asked a general question of whether or not the federal government should be allowed to seize private property even if so the owner of said property refuses to sell.

As Tribal Native people, the mexican has been our stalwart enemies since 1492.
We would like nothing better.
Destroy mexico, take all their scalps for my lodge pole.

There is a federal easement along the border. They dont own the actual land up to the border

I'm pretty sure the US has laws taking away people's land (with "due compensation") for some public works, like every country in the world, and those always include infrastructure project

Hated. We fashy goys now.

yep, and in the constitution

>No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

Wikipedia expands:
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fifth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution#Takings_clause

Eminent Domain?

Imminent domain.
Tough shit.

>but if a property owner refuses all payments, then in a court of law the federal government can take private property by force if it believe that the land will be put to good use.
That's literally what eminent domain is. I don't see where you're getting the "but"

When the government comes for your land you are better be supple and bend to their request. They won't hesitate to fuck you over.

Yes I am aware of the laws in place, but what my purpose with this thread was to find out whether the laws are just to the citizens of the united states and so far I've gotten some bullshit dodgy replies

Again, if you refuse to negotiate the federal government can take your land, and yes you will be compensated but say bye bye to your land whether you like it or not

Hey guy.
Im tohono, from the rez, its 70 miles of rough desert back country.
We made the anti-vehicle bollard fence over most of it.
Large sections are not done.
Parts of the border are inaccessible in season, with only wetbacks and drug mules moving through it.
We would LOVE it if trump made more improvements and sunk tons more $$$ into more surveillance, more agents, more ARRESTS, more DEPORTATION!!
Get all the mexican wetbacks and drug cartel off our reservation! Scalping time buddy

the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few as long as people are compensated fairly for their land. Mexicans were bragging for months up to the election that they were taking back america we need this wall to stop them.

kek, shit like this can only happen in fucking China or some SE asian shithole.

I agree. That's what eminent domain is.

This.

They'll use imminent domain, and hopefully ethically so. That is, i hope the gov't pays a small premium for every piece of private property required

Exactly. Unlike building a school or a fucking highway (or the retarded cities who used eminent domain to build fucking shopping centers for increased tax revenue) this is for national security. Pretty much the intent behind having the doctrine of eminent domain in the first place.