SHIT

...Does God really exist? I can't refute this argument. Should I become a Catholic?

youtube.com/watch?v=s2ULF5WixMM

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The video is meh but God does exist and you should become Catholic once you understand what that even means.

Is Catholicism the right one to pick?

Correct.

>Does God really exist?
yes
>Should I become a Catholic?
no

>yes

Gonna need ya know, some evidence there, bud.

It seems like I would have to pick one that doesn't hold to biblical inerrancy. Either that or they don't hold to biblical literalism.

The bible is still full of BS.

>The bible is still full of BS.
such as?

Biblical Literalism is a foolish concept altogether and isn't sound, nor is it literal. When you examine texts and what they are about it is important to grasp the context and the genre of the texts given to you rather than assume it all. Biblical Literalism and the people using the "literal/metaphorical" dichotomy for a text just assume the genre out of hand and fail any serious understanding of the text.

wtf I believe in god now

You also need evidence that he doesn't mate

>text
"texts", I should say. The Bible is a collection of books rather than just a book.

burden of proof is on you bud

Not really. There's no reason to state something isn't true when you first have no given reason to grasp how something is true.

So it doesn't make sense that the universe could come from "nothing" but it does make sense that god could? Muh "he always was" argument is invalid and retarded.

>Muh "he always was" argument is invalid and retarded.
how is it invalid?

don't expect most atheists to understand even the first premise.

but I believe that the universe, MUST have a creator
scientists say that the universe has a starting point
that means that at one point it didn't exist and then at another point it did exist
they try to say that before the Big Bang the universe was contained in the Singularity
but that's just moving the goalpoast they still acknowledge that at one point the universe didn't exist either before the Singularity or before the Big Bang

either way no matter which version of universal creation you subscribe to the Universe starting at the Big Bang or the universe starting at the Singularity
the fact that it CAME into existence means that something must have created it
the universe cannot have created itself because it is constrained by the laws of nature

God (or a similar supernatural being) is REQUIRED in science's current understanding of the universe for it to have come into existence at one point
it requires something outside itself to start the process that created the Singularity or the reaction in the Singularity that sparked the Big Bang.

tl;dr the Big Bang points to the existence of God
the Big Bang is a result of God's will.
there's no other way to accept that the Universe has a starting point

What is the genre of Genesis?

>Catholic
Don't.

Can you verify a thing that can not be verified?

>scientists say that the universe has a starting point
False.
Stop posting, retard.

Hey look, Christians agree with science when it supports their ideas.

Great post 10/10

oh really faggot.

i guess you don't have any knowledge of modern astrophysics

how about you kill yourself

If everything in the Bible literally is true God is a huge douchebag. Poor Job. Remember that one time he killed those kids for calling a guy bald?

13.7 billion years ago

No, you stupid faggot.

Name a single scientist who claims there was nothing and then big bang happened, and universe was created.

Name one, you stupid faggot.

The catholicucks are bible-denying pagans and they are all going to hell. You're in the USA, you must have some bible believing fundamentalist baptist church near you.

science is the method in which we discover the truth of our reality

the truth is that God created the universe and the more we find out the more science will point to this

Your understanding of science at the most fundamental level is extremely flawed. I'll leave it at that though because based on your insane comment no amount of evidence or logical thought processes would be able to change your mind.

READ MORE FAGGOT

I could apply what you said about the universe to God.

I believe in God for the same reasons as Schrodinger and von Neumann, but your argument and the OP video are retarded as shit

>literally doesn't understand the singularity
>believes the universe is eternal
infinite regress is not possible in science moron.

God might be a "douchebag" according to your morals. Why would that make it incorrect? Just because you don't personally like God?

>Does God really exist?
Can't prove it.
>I can't refute this argument.
Then shut up.
>Should I become a Catholic?
Only if you want to fuck qt Catholic chicks.

You shouldn't be even using words like ''not possible''. You're the one who is saying that a magic sentient being created the universe. All based on a strawman of what scientists think.

If the universe must have been created by a powerful being, how would a powerful being just pop into existence out of nothing? Wouldn't a being as complex as "god" have to have a creator? Do you know about the nature of complex systems and the requirements to create systems? It's turtles all the way down. The argument that "god always was" is just beyond idiotic.

The argument fails at the first premise.

There are countless things that exist without explanation of its existence, or at least without us understanding enough about them to explain them. Also, the argument does not apply itself to itself, ie. who made the creator, then?

Don't fall for (((their))) tricks.

I accept that on atheism moral values and duties don't exist.

I'm saying god is violating his own all loving nature by creating a world in which unnecessary suffering exists.

>the laws of science says nothing can create itself or exist eternally
>so I'm gonna apply these same rules to God
the point is that God by definition is supernatural
supernatural as in not constrained by the laws of nature

the fact that the universe cannot create itself yes has a starting point REQUIRES that something that doesn't follow the laws of nature to have created it
the universe as we understand it requries a supernatural outside entity to have created it.

Video games

personally i think its a possibility that this life is a way for people to prepare for the concept of eternal life

God exists.

Don't become a Catholic (stuck-up Zionist cucks).

Don't join a church either, find a Bible translation that suits you and doesn't add in pagan doctrines like the Trinity, the Cross, and Hell (and even the lie that all go to Heaven instead of the 144,000). I can think of either King James or Byington.

Pray a lot.

Remember that there are many challenges along the path to salvation and that many will try to cause you to stray from it. Do not get involved in politics, nationalism, war, et cetera.

Don't give up.

Universe is supernatural, therefore doesn't need a god
Checkmate, atheist

Catholic - A charming combination of cannibalism, child abuse and seaside tat.
The vatican is a gold plated abomination.

At least give some of Calvin's writings a chance. If you aren't a cuck, TULIP probably would make sense for you, if you are willing to admit you don't have nearly as much free will as the average person thinks they have.

what part of the universe is constrained by the laws of physics do you not understand?

here let me try to make it easier for you
let's say the universe is a box
the laws of the box say the box can't have made itself

but we know that the box had a starting point
so therefore the only way the box makes sense is if something outside of the box made the box

something that isn't constrained to the same rules within the box

You know why there's no direct evidence for God

Because there's such a thing called faith

>i think god is mean therefore the bible is BS
come on, man

>how would a powerful being just pop into existence out of nothing?
He wouldn't, that's why 'he always was' was a good answer, no popping

>The argument that "god always was" is just beyond idiotic.
why is it idiotic?
you just pasted a bunch of random dawkinisms and made no effort to show that's the case

You're right.

They speculate something like 'phi' or a quantum vacuum must have existed.

Doesn't really change the nature of the argument, since none of what those scientists speculate on has causal agency. It's no less absurd than something from nothing.

>not an argument
and i guarantee you i understand physics and have a better grasp of logic than you do my neckbeard friend

No, only kek exists

No gods here, only the Bogs.

Thats the dumbest argument religitards make.

...

This man is right, his name is Ahura Mazda.

>but we know that the box had a starting point
This is where you're wrong, you stupid faggot.

No one claims that there is a starting point to the universe.
The universe shifting from one state into another is not the creation of the universe.
For all we know universe is eternal and simply exists. For all the know there never was a starting point.

Call it what you will, it's what keeps me going

Dialy reminder, burden of proof doesn't pertain to truth nor reason, it is merely a tool of questioning.
You're asking the wrong questions.
In a world where experience is subjective and nothing can be proven, whom are you to ask for evidence of anything?
t. Kant and Wittgenstein

God doesn't just love, God hates as well. Where did you get this concept that God loves everyone all the time? It's not in the bible. That's hindu hippie talk.

How was Jobs suffering unnecessary? It makes for a good story to teach people about faithfulness. Job is in heaven now, forever and ever, I don't think he cares much about that suffering now that he has his eternal reward.

Can I get a sanic speed rundown?

Utter nonsense sir. Your arguments are beyond shit.

Anyways, if a God really does exist it's very likely that no human knows anything about it or ever will. The Christian God is absurd for a huge plethora of reasons.

>pic kinda related

>>i think god is mean therefore the bible is BS
Nope

youtube.com/user/NonStampCollector

For all your biblical fun.

THERE

Absolute bullpucky.
Shoehorning the word "being" into poorly worded repetitive presumptions (solely for the purpose of heavily implying this being has sentience) achieves and proves nothing. Fucking disgusting theist fuckwits.

>youtube.com/watch?v=s2ULF5WixMM

Hey, not sure if youre joking or not. Whenever philopher's tried listing things out in order to logically get to answers it was just dead wrong lol. That form of argumentation is completely dead now and can lead to some silly ass conclusions. Unfortunately, I wish we could say there was any evidence for it, but it has proved quite elusive. It was science that killed that kind of thinking and once we understood things a little better all those ideas of trying to understand things died off... We forget what our vision of the world was back then.. I probably would have believed in god too.

the universe isn't supernatural

the universe obeys the laws of physics
things like time and energy and mass were created at the Big Bang
we also know that UNDER THE LAWS OF NATURE in the natural universe there cannot be an infininite regress

so if the universe can't have eternally existed and it can't have created itself
than something that does not follow the natural rules of the universe
(something supernatural) is required in the equation

>I believe in God for the same reasons as Schrodinger and von Neumann
what reasons are those?

sargon of cukkad pls go

i'm sorry but you're simply mistaken

the universe having a starting point is accepted by all astrophysicists

False premise. Discarded.

Still haven't named a single scientist who believes universe came from nothing.

He has it. Human words are useless.. You should know, too. It's a priori knowledge.

i don't feel like watching your youtube cartoons, post a really damning case of BS

Kek exists,whether you believe him or not

You must become a Hindu. All monotheistic religions are useless to human needs. If you want wealth, why pray to some general "God" when you can pray to Lakshmi, wife of Vishnu and goddess of wealth?

God supposedly being all knowing and all powerful would know the exact details of everything that would happen in every possible universe that could ever be created. Why would he create this particular universe and allow all the suffering and "evil". Just so that we'd have the experience? Just so we could worship him some (selfish asshole)?

Since god is all powerful and all knowing, he'd know the exact outcome of every action taken by anything and anyone since the creation of the universe and he CHOSE to create the universe in the exact way it way SO WE HAVE NO FREE WILL THEN.

>God supposedly being all knowing and all powerful would know the exact details of everything that would happen in every possible universe that could ever be created. Why would he create this particular universe and allow all the suffering and "evil". Just so that we'd have the experience? Just so we could worship him some (selfish asshole)?

>Since god is all powerful and all knowing, he'd know the exact outcome of every action taken by anything and anyone since the creation of the universe and he CHOSE to create the universe in the exact way it way SO WE HAVE NO FREE WILL THEN.

>Buildings used to look like that

if we work under the assumption that a supernatural intelligent entitiy created the universe

than it isn't illlogical to accept that this entitiy might desire to make itself known to its intelligent creation
if we accept the premise that it WOULD have in fact wanted to make itself known than the next most logical conclusion is that ONE religion is correct about this entitiy and the rest are false.

ofc there's no evidence I can point to prove that this supernatural intelligent entity is the Judeo-Christian deity.
but Christianity is the most logical and scientifically compatible religion today
at least when compared to other easily disproved religions

because you are an idolator praying to a statue. read the bible you heathen

This is close to my view.

>Determinism is completely unavoidable.
>"Free will" exists only in the sense that we still choose our actions, but "we" are nothing but the sum of causal chains out of our control caused by god

...

>False premise.
How come?

Only if you want your boss to suck on black toes.

how about you name a single scientist that says that infinite regresses are possible and that the universe is actually eternal and has always existed for trillions of trillions of years before the big bang

oh wait there aren't any and you're an autistic fedora drawing completely irrelevant conclusions from scientific theories that say something completely different from what you think they say

what's outside of the universe lads?

That video was so full of ridiculous assumptions. I'm still very much agnostic.
This is just some pseudo-intellectual retards pretending they know what they're talking about. Weak sauce OP, try using your brain next time

>implying that idols aren't the only way to contact supernatural powers through the metaphysical world

If that's the case then why is India so fucking poor and smelly?

Reddit cancer.
Atheism is goy version of Judaism.

NIGGERS!

We wuz Gawds n sheeeit

Satan did all that, God just allowed it to happen because he wanted to prove to Satan that Job would not give up his faith in Him.

>goy version of Judaism
That's literally Christianity.

Orthodox Church is the only true Church, as handed down from the Disciples when they went forth to preach.

PROOF GOD IS A SINNER FOLLOWS FROM AQUINAS

1. God exists, he is the uncaused cause
2. As the tail of the causal chain, God "caused" everything
3. Sinning exists in the causal chain
4. God is the causing of sinning

GOD IS THE ULTIMATE SINNER, EVERY SIN IS HIS SIN

I can refute this easily. It says the universe has an explanation for being the universe.

But in ""nature""things tend to ""just are"" the universe has no purpose or reason, it is just here.

The only reason religion exists is to present a way of life to certain people. For those people it also explains what life is and how it should be lived. It's all made up bullshit but it served a good purpose. It kept people in line and prospering towards a lifestyle thats good and in harmony with the enviroment.

Your life doesn't need an explanation or ""end-goal"", life is just life and you either go through it sane, or you willfully become mentally handicapped and throw yourself onto some kind of meaningless religion.

Picking a religion is like going to the library, picking one book you like and then shout for the entire store
>" THIS BOOK HOLDS THE ONLY TRUTH THIS WORLD WILL EVER KNOW, ALL OTHER BOOKS ARE 1000% BULLSHIT "

Bow out.

literally checkmate for some versions of Christianity

The only option is to accept God is responsible for the existence of evil.

False. Judaism is the antithesis of Christianity. It is condensed rebellion against God.

easy.

God gave his creations free will
sin is simply choosing to do evil instead of good
or choosing hatred instead of love
the ability to choose to hate or love or do good or evil is free will.

God gave us free will and He Himself has free will
but his creations chose evil and hatred and were the first sinners
God has never sinned

next

>God ultimately causes everything that happens
you should look into calvinism, it'd mesh well with your views.

By saying humans aren't capable of actually understand the universe. It's a decent retort, the whole premise of the argument is that what we see has causality and we know it exist in a instance. We may have limits, people shouldn't be so arrogant of our intellectual capacity. An alien race out in space is far more sophisticated and intelligent than us statistically. They would have all the answers we need.

Same issue I have for people that think we live in a simulation. Some people like to use the proposition that we live in a simulation because our universe has observable limits. They say we have limits because whatever computer or I guess entity has limits, in that case the entity is in a simulation as well. But then they can say well then it's just a God like being that gave us the limits of the universe.

We get to the same issue of a God, creator or deity. What's more likely a God created us or that we as humans lack the knowledge/capabilities to properly understand our universe.

Not sure if that meant anything to you but maybe it will make you less freaked out by the prospects of a God.

No, he's right. Its fucking atheism and their degenerate behavior. Not the you just don't believe in God atheism but the "look at me guys I don't believe in sky daddys hurrr durr so smart am i rite?? bible so hateful dood richard dawkins god delusion read nietzsche open boarders support lgbt women's rights peace and love man" type of atheism.