Who was in the right here?

Who was in the right here?

I thought Creationism was batshit insane before this but Ken actually made some good points although I still belive in Evolution.

Can you still be a Christian if you don't belive in Creation?

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Evolution isn't Abiogenesis.

Evolution has no impact on where life came from only how it developed.

yes, but you would have to believe that all life developed in 6,000 years

>Actually got swayed by Ken Hamsandwich

Did your entire understanding of evolution come from playing Pokemon games before this debate?

Nye was right, but he's an entertainer now (mostly) and never was a biologist by training. I've got enough degrees in the shit to answer any questions if you actually were shaken a bit.

>ken ham
>good points

Nye: "Where do you find evidence for your theory?"
Ham: "Well there is a book..."
Nye: "How, how can you support that claim?"
Ham: "Bible"
Nye: "But where how is this super unrealistic, unnatural thing real in the past, but not today?"
Ham: "Again, there's a book.."

Man, the fact that he has a silly accent doesn't mean he has any credibility in the world of science.
Sure, some of the people that he quoted are credible scientists and inventors that are coincidentally creationists, but they didn't give any evidence or even a theory supporting their faith. They argued who is right, not what is right.

Young Earth creationism is silly and based on dumb conjecture using random-ads genealogy tables.

I said I still believe in Evolution, can't you read?

>filename

>Sure, some of the people that he quoted are credible scientists and inventors that are coincidentally creationists

yeah, that made me think, I mean these are very smart people and they believe in Creation, I give them more credibility than the reddit fags on the comments

Nye got absolutely annihilated in that debate, even if I'm not sure I share Ken Ham's view of creation. Evolution is just plain retarded the more you think about it

Also you can't be Christian if you don't even believe the first sentence in the bible

I think believing Jesus is the son of God is enough

Only if you believe church dogma.

There is no place in the bible which states the Earth is 6000 years old. It was random addition by an old archbishop using an incomplete family tree from a 3000 year old book. His status being such where no one wanted to say "Sir, that's stupid".

>You MUST believe these cobbled together theories by people who came almost a thousand years after the birth of Christ in order to be a Christian.

That's excellent, circular logic you have. You should start a church.

Yeah OP. I too believe that Satan puts dino bones into the ground.

>believing the bible is literal truth

Its the written account of humanities collective metaphorical truths. You need to sort yourself out.

>Can you still be a Christian if you don't belive in Creation?
Well, yeah. There are a lot of ways to reconcile evolution with the idea of humans being created "from the dust" as in Genesis. Depending on how literally (or not literally) you interpret scripture, there is a lot of room for a creator.

In fact, there are things in the bible which seem to point, in an uncanny way, to our current understanding of the universe. After the universe was created, God "stretched out" the universe. Interesting huh?

Also, look into pic related

Technically, the geneology only necessitates that man has existed for 6,000 years, which is entirely believable.

>nothing for 10 gorillion years
>suddenly: pyramid-tier civililzation

yea right

>But kent actually made some good points
WEW

>Can you still be a Christian if you don't belive in Creation?

No, but keep in mind that "Creation" properly understood has a far wider meaning that your average Protestant would make you believe.

This is false
This is true

On top of that, Christianity encourages questioning ones faith and testing ones assumptions.

But the fact that Damanian guy invented the MRI wasn't influenced by his belief. He's a dumbfuck with a clever idea. Probably only good at one thing in life.

Did you not hear Nye's comments? Did he not shine pure fucking knowledge through your existence?

It was like five popes and nearly a hundred years ago the Catholic Church officially stated they believe Evolution is legit and the 6000 year old thing is looney BS. Literally no Christian denominations in the world outside of hardline conservative American Protestantism believe in that.

I never said you didn't. Can you?

I said swayed. You said you though he made good points (he didn't) and that "before" you thought it was batshit insane (implying after you didn't... it still is).

I didn't say he fully convinced you. He just swayed you a bit. Influenced.

Genesis 2:7
Colossians 1:16

not the Christian God if he didn't create and doesn't preserve creation, fine with me but it's not the God of the bible

>Can you still be a Christian if you don't belive in Creation?

I think that all the major christian confessions accept evolution and don't take genesis literally

>which is entirely believable

The guy is a television host, why should I give a fuck about him?

What an utterly boring shitshow these kinds of debates are.
It makes me feel like they are designed specifically to make Christians look less credible and atheists, and by extension liberals, appear on le right side of science.
They're a case of kikes playing both sides of a useless question to direct the answer to their favour.
Most Christians I know recognise evolution and most atheists I know refuse to believe evolution applies to humans (hurr all races are equal even those separated geographically for long periods of time).

Common mistake, thinking smart people are universally smart.

The guy who invented PCR is convinced that HIV doesn't exist.

Isaac Newton spent a shit ton of time trying to decode the bible to predict the end of the world.

Einstein couldn't handle a lot of the theorems that were coming out with quantum mechanics.

Everyone is stupid/uneducated/unaware about at least a few things. Scientists are no different.

Creationism is a purely american and modern invention and is literally un-christian.

I took off work to watch that debate. The whole thing was embarrasing. Bill Nye the Electrical Enginerr Guy used a power point that must have been made on the Uber over, and Ken Ham did nothing but shove the bible down people's throats. Embarrasing debate.

>the Bible is the literal word of God
>look at the cover of a bible
>King James' Version

Every Finn is retarded, every single fucking Finnish person is a fucking retard. A unique one, but an utter retard.

>Can you still be a Christian if you don't belive in Creation?

Yes, Theistic Evolution has been around since evolution itself has

Asa Gray - Botanist and Friend of Darwin who argued for theistic evolution
archive.is/NrxR0

Summary of Asa Gray
archive.is/WFely

Darwinia - His book on Theistic Evolution
archive.is/Fnb1K

>Website that elaborates on the christian view
biologos.org

who ever said it was literal word of God? You probably have never even heard of the term divinely inspired or understand the preservation of scripture through thousands of years. Why do you even attempt to debate something you have zero knowledge of?

> Ken argues that the rules behind observational science changed exactly 6,0000 years ago
> Not 10, 50, or 500 years ago
> Exactly 6,0000 because MUH BIBLE

W E W

not an argument

He's an actual scientist, you nimrod.
A mechanical engineer.

Einstein said that who ever can't explain something, he/she doesn't understand it him/herself.

Nye pretty much fucking explains everything I'm wondering about

Pretty sure that even the birds around the studio where it was filmed got the general idea of why evolution is credible. Fucking hell, man, it took nature BILLIONS OF YEARS to become what it is today. You think you can learn it from Sup Forums or a four-hour debate?
Go to a library and start, come back after you've read enough. You'll know you read enough, you'll just start realizing how Everything in nature has a logical explanation due to laws on nature.

Now gtfo, you lazy polluter of the genepool.

Didn't Ken Ham explicitly state during this debate that no prospective evidence, no matter how convincing, could ever change his mind because his beliefs were based on faith?

Made it something of a pointless exercise desu

I only said Bill Nye isn't a real scientist which is true, so if I wanted to learn about Evolution, I certainly wouldn't watch that debate. as for the rest of your autistic rant, like I said in the OP, I do believe in Evolution but I decided to give Ken Ham a chance

>Atheist
>Protestant

They're both wrong desu

God save the Queen

Creationists BTFO

youtube.com/watch?v=s-AIQk4KZ6U

...

>Nye pretty much fucking explains everything I'm wondering about
Its no ones fault but your own that you are a stupid nigger bro. Just because some fake scientist on TV is smarter than your stupid nigger ass it doesn't make him a cappable scientist. Holy fuck I hope you are trolling.

>god was too stupid to create and let them evolve

If Ken Ham swayed you at all you need to brush up on your science. Or you're just an idiot and can't be remedied.

>autistic rant
>don't believe in evolution

It's not about believing, it's about knowing enough. It's easier to read one book than a thousand.

I mean it, you are so incomprehensibly ignorant of the real world that you are giving someone who believes the Earth is six fucking thousand years old a chance.

Go away.

That and their perception of time at the time was certainly different than ours. To them 6000 yrs may as well have been 4 billion.

Bill Nye the Actor Guy

Aha, like what? You think Nye thought me about evolution, nigger? I read stacks of books from all points of view on the subject, watched tonnes of documentaries, travelled through over 25 countries and on top of all that, I am on a Master in Anthropology.

Go fucking shove an artichoke up your ass, you lobotomized buffoon. You went through the stupid fucking American educational system. I had A's in fucking Singapore where I was obliged to be in school from 8am till 6pm every fucking damn day includig Saturdays.

I developed third-degree insomnia from the schizophrenic studying required to do well in that moist hellhole and you think I'm basing my knowledge on a single person, you shallow, narrow-minded fucking imbecile.

>Ken made some good points

Nye is a liberal cuck, but he's more then educated enough to btfo a creationist retard like Ken Hamm. If you ever want to laugh go to his museum.

I believe in micro-evolution and creationism. I'm personally a fan of the clockmaker theory.

You gave him a chance too you cretin, didn't you watch the debate?
Plus, people much smarter than you believe in Creation, you're just a guy who posts on a japanese image board on a Saturday night

>Only if you believe church dogma.
It isn't, the Catholic Church only says that you have to believe in Adam and Even and the Garden of Eve, if you want to believe evolution is true you can do it. Biblical literalism is a protestant invention from the 19th century and not what the Church teaches

Absolute utter nonsense. Classic example of a theist making up drivel

>Both can't comprehend old earth/old universe creationism

False dichotomy 101

>Implying you need a "real scientist" with heavy credentials to explain evolution

It's remarkably simple, and the central, connecting dogma of all of biology.

I didn't get Steven Hawking to explain high school physics to me. While even I personally am more qualified than Nye to explain evolution, that doesn't mean he is unqualified... it's literally grade school science.

Realistically the only thing the bible got correct was catastrophic events. The people of the time wouldnt have known how to interpret it. Abrahamic religions are flawed, as evidence is not coming out that civilizations existed well before, and possibly advanced civilizations.

>Every answer to a question was "It's in the Bible"
>Ken made good points
pick one and only one idyat

you okay?

>old universe creationism
ken ham doesn't believe in the change in species over time that leads to new species
it doesn't matter how old the earth is

"macro" is just micro over a longer timescale. I suggest you look up gene duplication, whole genome duplication, neofunctionalisation and subfunctionalisation for explanation of the mechanisms behind how radically new features could have arisen over evolutionary history

*Adam and Eve and the Garden of Eden
sorry I am tired and going to sleep

>Can you still be a Christian if you don't belive in Creation?
Yes, if you don't believe the Bible is literally true. Fundamentalism is retarded, and it always has been.

On the other hand, rejecting a religion outright because its holy book contains allegorical fairy tales is pretty gay too.

This. Lets see Jared Taylor debate Bill Nye the meme science guy.

more accurate depiction

Adam and Eve is clearly a metaphor, otherwise God is a dick. Catholic Church largely accepts the bible to be metaphorical.

Oh, I suffer and die because of something my distant ancestors did? Pretty Old School God.

Nye: "What would it take for you to accept you are wrong?"
Ham: "There is nothing that could prove me wrong."

this was the final nail in his coffin

>Can you still be a Christian if you don't belive in Creation?

We're talking about the God that confused languages to prevent humans from getting too advanced. Why would his book tell people true science? I'm not saying it's lies but I just assume everything before Abraham is an approximate history based on ancient lore.

I didn't give him a chance, I wanted to know their point of view because then I can comprehensively argue back when I meet one.

>Plus, people much smarter than you

Did I ever claim I am smart? No, but there are most certainly NOT any moronic creationists who are smarter than I am. Maybe in one field, but generally - fuck no.
I live life being aware of how fucking stupid I am, and yet I can claim with certainty that I am smarter than 99% of the people I have met. I can fucking claim that I travelled half this bleeding world. I cannot find people who can challenge me in capabilities. When I do, I don't let go. Only people like that help you improve.

Fuck you, faggot. Arguing with you is like playing chess with a pigeon: no matter what I say, you just knock everything down and shit on the board.

Stay a stupid, uninformed meme of a person and eat a bag of shit, you're worthless.

Saged and out

That's fine, but I believe that no matter how much time you're given, something with gills and scales and fins is never going to turn into something with lungs and hair and hands. I know that things can get faster, or see better through natural selection (ie, those who aren't faster or stronger just die and thus don't pass on their slower/weaker genes) but I see no basis for why an organism would radically change its nature.

>actually made some good points
You must be an idiot

it never "radically" does
its the tiny changes you described over enough time that lead to radically different changes from organisms thousands of generations before it

who's Jared Taylor and what does he believe in?

Sup Forums.org/rules#global7
>Replying to a thread stating that you've reported or "saged" it, or another post, is also not allowed.

My point was that ACTUAL Christian theologians (i.e. Catholic, Anglican, and Eastern Orthodox) who study the bible thoroughly with different perspectives on it believe that the old testament is an allegory of faith and the human relationship to god, not a historical document. So old universe creationism that lines up with modern scientific knowledge is a viable point of view. Ken ham is the product of degenerate half ass protestantism

youtube.com/watch?v=v2Xsp4FRgas

scborromeo.org/ccc/p123a9p3.htm
>The Church's relationship with the Muslims. "The plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Muslims; these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind's judge on the last day."

>Adam and Eve is clearly a metaphor, otherwise God is a dick
Wrong. I am going to sleep so I'll have to pass on the discussion but God simply let us make our choices, and when we choose wrong it's our own fault. Giving someone independence and therefore responsibility for their actions is also an act of love
> Catholic Church largely accepts the bible to be metaphorical.
No that's not true. Don't go from one heresy to the other. Prottie literalism is different from just believing things in the Bible are true, in the same fashion events in the Bible are not merely metaphorical although they are narrated in a way that is deeper than a simple historical account and therefore shouldn't be treated as such.
>Oh, I suffer and die because of something my distant ancestors did? Pretty Old School God.
You are given the Way, the Truth and the Life so that you may never perish. You are like someone saying "oh radiation from Chernonyl gave me cancer? Wtf I hate nature now". Actions have consequence, God gave us a way to fix ourselves while respecting and preserving our freedom and independence. And the way he did it is nothing short of infinitely good and merciful. So yeah, God is a pretty cool guy in my book.

Goodnight

Biblical literalism is heresy, so not only can you be a Christian if you don't believe in the "Creation" peddled by Ken, you're a better Christian for not believing it.

They are the same guy on different days. Bill Nye grew a beard.

He's a racial realist. That's all you really need to know.

>I can claim with certainty that I am smarter than 99% of the people I have met.

Could you be anymore Reddit, Jesus Christ, get the fuck out of my thread you insufferable faggot

oh, the muslims. The ones we kicked out of Europe at the same time the protestants focused on waging war on us on the other side of Europe.

Ham absolutely annihilated the intellectual lightweight Bill Nye

>mental gymnastics

Do you think my life will change even if ai get banned?
Why do you care?
Does it fucking matter?
I am so baffled now, why, what, how can you American be this fucking stupid? Did you suffer physical trauma to your head?
What the fuck is going on

Damn that trap-tech has gotten good. Had me fooled

Sorry I don't understand your accent please learn to speak English

of those two faces
which do you think has breathed on a dick?

I am just telling you the truth, you are free to name-call the simple truth however you want. Goodnight

>Can you still be a Christian if you don't belive in Creation?

No, and the creation in scriptures is not "God created the world in 6 days." If you actually read it, the 6 days were when he planned it out. Chapter 2 in Genesis covers the actual building and populating of the world.

and what would he debate with Bill Nye? that black people didn't evolve?

yeah that would make sense for it not to be literal
I believe there are 2 different accounts in the old testament of the order of creation, in addition to light being created before the sun

protestantism was the beginning of the end of the western world

>biology degree

how many genders exist faggot

I believe in micro evolution.. Macro evolution or species evolution AKA dog turning into elephant makes no fucking sense to me... If it was the case animals would have evolved to survive humans and kill us but they haven't and they wont

The mechanisms are there, and so are the transitional forms. Fossils like Tiktaalik, Eusthenopteron, Acanthostega all show "transitional" limbs which are somewhere between fins and legs.

Natural selection isn't the only driving force behind evolution. The most current understanding of evolution invludes random forces such as genetic drift, which are "more powerful" drivers of evolution in small populations and can lead to big changes and increases in complexity over a relatively short amount of time.

The problem is that this sort of information isn't that accessible to laypeople

>Can you still be a Christian if you don't belive in Creation?

god could have created evolution, right?

Evolution and creation can be the same thing.