Teach me about Orthodoxy Sup Forums

I have a serbian orthodox church local and I'm gonna go to this weekend. Was taken to a roman catholic in my youth but haven't been in a long time, what's the difference?

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oca.org/orthodoxy/prayers/symbol-of-faith
youtube.com/watch?v=jDbOCKdSIR8
youtube.com/watch?v=dKXMcfazByQ
youtube.com/watch?v=T-n75RDC49g
ccel.org/ccel/damascus/icons.i.iv.html
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don't know much about catholic churches

you're likely to not understand what is being said in the orthodox one, as i think they generally speak their local language

light a candle or two, listen to the priests, maybe buy a book or (sanctified?) cross or smth.

unless it's some occasion/holiday (easter, baptism, etc) very few people go (here), mostly old women

don't know what you're expecting

It is amazing. Coming from a protestant background into the Orthodox church was mind blowing, almost like a mystical experience. In fact they take mysticism more serious than the other Christian denominations. I have been studying the Philokalia and the lessons of the monks on Athos. In protestant america it is all about "let me tell you about Jesus", in Orthodoxy it is about "let me show you the way to get closer to God through Jesus, the Theotokos, and the saints." Orthodoxy is royal road of Christian enlightenment.

If the choir is decent its amazing, otherwise meh.

The difference is the leadership is democratic, no Pope, the Holy Spirit is one with the Father and Son, and no jewery (no paying to make up for sins).

The nearest orthodox church that sings around here is in london, and thats miles. I'd love to go to one for the same reasons as but i'd try this one first.

It's tiny so I've got a bad feeling they'll start talking to me tho.

>The difference is the leadership is democratic
Kinda, its based on discussions between hierarches
>no Pope
This is the main thing really
>the Holy Spirit is one with the Father and Son
Dont know what youre saying here
>no jewery (no paying to make up for sins).
Yep

...

From what we were taught, the Catholic church put the Holy Spirit on a lower level than the Father and Son, changing the Symbol of the Faith to reflect this.

oca.org/orthodoxy/prayers/symbol-of-faith

English source for the Orthodox Symbol.

Introduce yourself to some books and youtube vids by Metropolitan Kallistos Ware, as he is located in London I believe. Reading his stuff is really what made me take the leap, especially his discussion on the Jesus Prayer.

youtube.com/watch?v=jDbOCKdSIR8

watch this before. all your questions will be answered about christianity.

>3 hours

least gimmea hint


danke listening now

Even tiny churches should have at least 2-3 people, the priest and his assistants, and they all "sing" here.

youtube.com/watch?v=dKXMcfazByQ

youtube.com/watch?v=T-n75RDC49g

This is approx the sound they should have.

it's a much more meditative experience and looking at Christianity and the Bible in a more mystical way.

for example I've never met an Orthodox Christian who believes in Hell as a literal lake of fire. I've heard them describe the afterlife that everyone will be in the presence of God and Heaven and Hell will be the state of being as you're experiencing your creator firsthand. (for the saved person, being in God's presence will be a warm, blissful experience while for the unsaved, it will be like fiery torment upon one's skin as you're filled with your own shame)

Wait, Americans believe in a literal Hell with molten lava and shit?

Another Orthodox Englishman Robin Amis wrote a great book A Different Christianity. It deals with his unraveling of the esoteric influences upon patristic spirituality in his experiences with the monks on Mount Athos. Sadly he passed away a couple of years ago and the few vids of him have all but vanished.

There's no "tolerance" for degenerate shit like homosexuality, kiddy diddling or muslims, that's a given.

If the priest demands money for services, don't give it to him. It's traditional to give them money, but it's not needed and it's usually some small amount unless you personally think he deserves more. In Australia they're really cocky about this and some outright demand it. And by services I don't mean talking/asking questions. I mean having him participate in baptism, having him sanctify your home etc

This happens because they're somewhat autonomous from the patriarchy and rule their church however they want. If that's the case don't bother going to that church.

most christians do

>he doesnt want to invest 3 hours of his live to get live of eternity.

>waste years on Sup Forums

human are wierd creatures.

>(for the saved person, being in God's presence will be a warm, blissful experience while for the unsaved, it will be like fiery torment upon one's skin as you're filled with your own shame)

interesting, this is exactlly what talmud says.

even your spirituallity is materialistic.

yeaah, also interested in how jewish it is.

What?

watch it juden

orthodoxy is the opposite of materialistic, though they only make up 33% of christians or so

I found an orthodox bible at a used book store and while I really hate the NKJV translation, the annotations and additional info in the book have been more enlightening than years of growing up as a catholic (not that I cared to learn much back then).

I've been wanting to go back to church recently, but haven't been yet. There is a Roman catholic church 2 minutes from my house, and an orthodox one 30 minutes away. One of these days I'll go

I think it was a news story about how the Church still hates gays, and how it was still barbaric.

Basically REEEEE from faggots.

Makes sense.

It's not Catholicism for one, huge bonus there.

Do orthodox hate anime?

Orthodox is fine, but why not try Catholicism too and then decide?

not a jew tho, just someone whos interested in religions.

orthodoxy is still idolworship because of icons
Exodus 20:4
"You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below."

>still does image

No, why would we?

The icons help to encapsulate you in a otherworldly place when you step inside for the Liturgy. When you partake in the Liturgy and look around the Saints are there partaking in the Liturgy with you. It creates a place where this realm is connected with Heaven and the heart with God.

same book (Exodus 25:18)

God commands Moses to build two statues to place in the temple where he prays:

18 And thou shalt make two cherubims of gold, of beaten work shalt thou make them, in the two ends of the mercy seat.

Even modern Judens have no idea what they're doing. Ancient Judaism was filled with sculptures and icons. Notice God only scolded them when they would make statues of Molech and Ba'al

shit thats one thing i do remember, it was false idols

>Exodus 25:18
hes also commadnts to kill his son, it is specific command for moses, are u moses ?

You sound Muslim? Very few Christians throughout history have ever taken up issue with icons or depictions in art of Jesus, Mary, and the Saints. However, there is one religious group that has a major hangup with icons and pictures and those are Muslims.

What does that have to do with anything? The whole point of that story was Yahweh mocking and show how evil the practice of sacrificing humans to deities was. The climax of the scene we have Yahweh replacing Isaac with a lamb to slaughter instead. Yahweh has never pushed a human to commit a sin (sacrificing your son would be murder).

Furthermore, a graven image is an idol or image used to worship. Both Catholics and Orthodox don't use them to worship. They're nothing more than decorations which help put one into a more meditative heavenly mindset.

Are the large icons of the Torah behind the pulpit of every synagogue I've been to also a "graven image"?

Exodus 20:4
"You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below."
or on the earth
or on the earth
or on the earth

i quoted from the bible

not muslims tho.

icon is an image to me

synagogues have symbols not images.

Shit we New Testament now bro! I think I will take my guidance from holy men then some user who is trying to say we are doing it all wrong.

a symbol is an image. that's literally the definition

Orthodoxy doesn't put as much emphasis on going to mass and such and keeps more of the old testament. The Orthodox concept of Christian salvation is basically self improvement

seems like u are ignorant of the new testament aswell.

Matthew 5:17-19English Standard Version (ESV)
Christ Came to Fulfill the Law

17 “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18 For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished. 19 Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

somewhat correct. Mass is as important as it is in Catholicism. But you're right about the main concept of salvation:

>Theosis or deification is a transformative process whose aim is likeness to or union with God

Sorry but greater minds than you have not felt necessary to get rid of icons regardless what interpretation you take.

ccel.org/ccel/damascus/icons.i.iv.html

are you sure you're not Muslim? Not hating, every point you've brought up though is what every Muslim I've come across brings up.

These are basic theology 101 problems that you could understand with a simple google search if you wanted to.

Jesus is fulfilling the prophecy here. He lived by the Law perfectly, he didn't commit a single sin or mistake, he revered the Law. He fulfilled it. Thus completing the prophecy and starting a new age.

Abolish used is Greek "kataluo" that means "to loosen down" and has been used in the Bible before talking about the destruction of the Jewish temple.

Pretty clear that Jesus said he hasn't come to do this to the Law because if he did, he would not be fulfilling the prophecy.

That sounds interesting. I have to ask though, what's with praying to "saints" and marry and all that? From what I can see, the Protestants have a really big problem with that and the Papacy.

Nice quads btw. There is no papacy though. The Saints in a nutshell are like role models. We do not pray "to" them. We ask that they intercede on our behalf at times. But mostly we look to them for inspiration in how to live our lives, because they were once like us.

papacy is roman catholicism

orthodoxy has patriarchs

The Saints and Mary issue brought up has been mistaken as Catholics and Orthodox worshiping them. What they're doing is asking them to pray for you. Partly tradition partly scriptural. We have evidence as early as the 2nd Century. But also there are clues in scripture such as the parable of Lazarus where Abraham is in Heaven and he can hear the rich man on Earth and in Hell.

It's the same concept as someone asking a friend or family member to pray for them. Except instead of a human, you're asking an even greater being to pray for you.

>starting a new age.
so you are new age guy `?
>he revered the Law. He fulfilled it
hmm
he says here
>until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished.
earth and heaven is still here.

not muslim, islam have also lots of mistakes. i would adress this if you wer muslim, but since you are christian i want to understand on how you came to such point in life to accept a fake religion

why does the russian patriarch have a 30 000$ watch ? and why did the church try to hide it ?

Oh noes you're going after the Patriarch!!!! We do not hold our leaders as infallible.

Jesus says in romans 1:16

"For I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is the power of God that brings salvation to everyone who believes: first to the Jew, then to the Gentile."

do most christians accept that second class status ?

>so you are new age guy `?

new age as in "new era". not hippie new age. It's a semantical issue that may be difficult if english isn't your first language.


>hmm
>he says here
>until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished.
>earth and heaven is still here.

He FULFILLED the Law, meaning he completed it. Think of it like this: A math test. Someone completes the math test. He has "fulfilled" it. Nobody else can take the test now because he has already done so. But that doesn't mean the questions and answers on the test are "abolished". It's still math, and it's still the truth.

I don't know how else to explain it man this is easy Christian doctrine

because he's man? Man is not the head of the Orthodox Church, Jesus is

Because it's factual? The Jews were the first ones to become Christian. Then they spread out and preached to the world

>Jesus says
>in Romans
You're retarded ahmed. Read the gospel of Matthew if you want Christ's opinion of the jews, specifically the parable of the field workers.

Matthew 19:24
"Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God."

nothing against patriarch or church. or any rich person. iam just interested on why do christians never listen to what jesus says to his followers ?

for me it seems like christians never practice what jesus says and go WOOOOOHAHA CHRISTIANITY IS COOL here check this icons out, get this cross, look this heretics! deus vult! seems like a fanboy who never played football and wants to be part of something to feel good without knowing the rules and hardship of the game.

>ahmed
not muslim, stop name calling.

stay on topic

>He FULFILLED the Law, meaning he completed it.
"until heaven and earth pass away"
earth is still here. wtf you talking about ? he said the law will stay untill earth and heaven will pass away.

that's a pretty retarded argument.

first, being rich isn't a sin or something weird like you're trying to imply. it is easier for a poor person to know god for a few reason. mostly because they are humbled by their poverty and seek other things besides earthly riches. Some of the most notable heroes in biblical doctrine are filthy rich kings.

you seem to understand very little about Christianity, and take everything you believe about Christianity from Sup Forums.

But also as the Bible says, the road is narrow. And not many will reach him. Humans are flawed, big surprise.

If you want to see the extreme ascetic side of Christianity like you seem to want everyone to follow, go watch a documentary on Mt. Athos or something.

Look to the Saints then if you want examples of Christians that listened to Jesus. I left my church for Orthodoxy because everyone just seemed to want a pat on back every Sunday and go back to their normal routine. They felt as long as you are "saved" their isn't much else to do. I want myself to draw closer to God, if some Christian is wearing a 30K watch, so what, as long as my heart has become receptive to the Lord that is all I care about.

Well in general, Orthodox:

- Accept the heritage of the church, accordng to Bible (unlike protestants).
- Do not accept the authority of pope and do not agree that the doctrine can be changed with time (unlike Cuckholicks)

>orthodoxy is still idolworship because of icons

Thats just stupid, Ahmed. No one worships icons. Icons help to concentrate / get in the right mood. Icons are a part of church heritage, not idols.

I already gave you an example. Meaning the truths of the laws remain until heaven passes away, i.e. never

Don't quote me on this but I believe that the Orthodox churches are close enough to the point where, for a Catholic, it would actually count as going to Sunday mass.
This is just what I heard from some priest along time ago, might of misheard it, idk.

Orthodox Mass is valid for Catholics, but Catholic Mass is not valid for Orthodox

so by the Catholic's own admission, the safer bet is to be Orthodox

The Root of Jesse
Isaiah11:6…5Also righteousness will be the belt about His loins, And faithfulness the belt about His waist. 6And the wolf will dwell with the lamb, And the leopard will lie down with the young goat, And the calf and the young lion and the fatling together; And a little boy will lead them. 7Also the cow and the bear will graze, Their young will lie down together, And the lion will eat straw like the ox.…

and then jesus says..

The Sword of the Gospel
33But whoever denies Me before men, I will also deny him before My Father in heaven. 34Do not assume that I have come to bring peace to the earth; I have not come to bring peace, but a sword. 35For I have come to turn ‘A man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law.…

why does jesus wants to make fight between family members ?

Isn't Catholicism like Christianity with Justin Trudeau as Prime Minister?

...

He's telling people that if they become Christian and follow him, they will cause strife in their family.

You better ask local hegumen, not a ironically hitler-worhsipping shitpost board.
That would be reasonable, right?

that's because the juden were buying, selling, making profit and interest in the sacred temple. what does that have to do with anything?

I thought germans were fucking smart, but you're fucking retarded bro. at least on theological matters

Is art bad?

>Icons help to concentrate / get in the right mood
that means you use icons to worship ?

if you dont have icons will you loose some % of your prayer ?

We don't even hate gays. Why hate on people, poisoned by atrazine?
If we would have more influence, we would ask our parish to research cure for this poison.

why close your eyes? why go somewhere quiet? why bow your head?

these things help get into a meditative stance

>buying, selling, making profit and interest in the sacred temple
hmmm

so buying icons, crosses and expensive watches near church is allowed but not jewish scrolls, religious ornaments and prayer boxes ?

I think Orthodoxy has a much fuller understanding of the Holy Trinity than the Catholic Church. Because of scholasticism, the persons of the Trinity come to be defined solely in their relations to each other without filling in the nature of each person in the Godhead. For example, the Holy Spirit feels like some kind of leftover in Catholic Cathechism and this is a consequence of Catholicism's defining the Holy Spirit as emanating from the love between the Father and the Son. But this doesn't convey the personhood of the Holy Spirit because in this case it is merely an emotion.

Is anime poison?

umm if people were buying / selling farm animals on top of the pulpit where the eucharist takes place, no that sure as hell would not be allowed

you dondt understand me here, iam not agains icons or arts, or muslim prayer rugs, iam just asked why christians do opposite on what jesus or bible says....very confusing to me. i never get answer only insults and namecalling ahmed etc.

anime is the cure

if you can do all this, whats the point of icons and crosses ? just close your eyes and talk to him.

why waste so much time on things you dont need to pray ? or do you need them ? if you do, it means you cant pray thus you use it as medium and thats idolworship, if you dont need them, why use them then ?

because we've explained it to you already

what's more, there are theologians with PhDs who have written essays, books, and articles that you can read for free online that will give you a more concise in depth answer, but you just wanna bait non-religious poltards

That means people are retarded and thus they need to at least worship wooden board with sacred image, if they cant understand God as it`s described in "New Testament" (aka first testament).

Rejecting people for being blind is a sin.

The bible did commission the construction of images in the temple and on the ark itself. Context for the prohibition of images is due to the belief that the deity is somehow present in the image and is the image in some sense

>why waste so much time on things you dont need to pray ?

why do anything? why close your eyes when you pray? after all that's just one unnecessary step. why go somewhere quiet to pray? after all that's another unnecessary step.

or do you need them ?
they're not needed or required. they're simply there as a reminder. do you need pictures of your family around your house or else you forget about them? No, they're just decoration.

Nice

Some of it sure is.

Is Kpop sin?

i was saying why christians have such fleshy and rich rituals with golden suits where jesus said to be poor. Matthew 5:40 "And if anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well."

then after i posted picture whhere jesus kicked out sellers he agrees that it was good that he kicked them out. and then all of the sudden he agrees that selling religious ´stuff is good as long as it is icons and crosses BUT not close to the church OH NO it would same like selling meat close to a funeral! but they can be sold in supermarket where no one is botherd and everything is so holy in a supermarket!

Nothing in the teaching says about meditation. Of course you can go that way, because you have to search for the righteous path. But as I see it, meditation (emptying your mind and doing nothing) is just a form of vanity.

>why close your eyes when you pray?
not to worship stuff "..which is on earth or heaven above or in waters...."

well emptying your mind of thoughts is Buddhist meditation. One can meditate upon God and various mysteries.

you don't worship things by looking at them, that's retarded

and buddhist temples are adorned with gold and rare materials. yet they're still ascetics who shun wealth

your whole argument proves nothing though other than the fact that there are degenerates in the world. which we would agree with because we're on Sup Forums

I've read that quietism is looked down upon by orthodox

> i`m so smart
to whom much is given, much will be required

> well emptying your mind of thoughts is Buddhist meditation
And other things are not meditation.
Just as capitalism outside of marxist definition of it is not a capitalism.

Of course energizing your almonds about things is pretty important to a Christian.

>Of course you can go that way

isnt meditation a way to raise your "serpent" power trough the spine to communicate with demonic spirits ?

i thought prayer is just talking to the Eternal One requestion something.

This fucking russkie has never heard of hesychasm

well...

Search Results
med·i·tate
ˈmedəˌtāt/
verb
verb: meditate; 3rd person present: meditates; past tense: meditated; past participle: meditated; gerund or present participle: meditating

think deeply or focus one's mind for a period of time, in silence or with the aid of chanting, for religious or spiritual purposes or as a method of relaxation.
think deeply or carefully about (something).

activating those almonds is essential

>and buddhist temples are adorned with gold and rare materials. yet they're still ascetics who shun wealth
maby they pretend to be poor so people will give them so they dont need to work and just chill all day read books and stuff.

like parasites

> isnt meditation a way to raise your "serpent" power trough the spine to communicate with demonic spirits ?
How should I know?

I would not explain it to you, so you wont turn on me, step on my pearls with your hooves and rip me apart.

I'm not really much of anything but I have heard that jesus said, "Let he who is without sin cast hte first stone." Now his dress is much more practical than the cardinals and the pope in Rome, at least it appears that way to me. The only thing about his appearance that would suggest wealth is his watch, and for all we know maybe his mother gave him that watch? Maybe that watch was his fathers? it doesn't seem very fair to try and rip this guy apart as some kind of priest king because he happens to wear a nice watch.