Let's face it

True communism never worked because capitalists like the US always stepped in and destroyed it. In true communism, eventually, the government disolves and ALL THE POWER belongs to the PEOPLE. Why would you be against this?

Other urls found in this thread:

twitter.com/Sargon_of_Akkad/status/837843492076470272
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zapatista_Army_of_National_Liberation
laraj.ca/AGwiki/uploads/Fascism/Germany/Otto Strasser - Germany Tomorrow (Part 2).pdf
twitter.com/NSFWRedditGif

because someone would get their buddies together and start ruling the place

>power belongs to the people
>communism only works with a big government that controls the lives of every person
'no'

Surely the west merely sped up the dissolution of the communist government. Where was the resulting "true" communism?

Why are you suck a faggot, OP?

>Why would you be against this?
because it doesn't work and you have to destroy God and Country to get there

and then the people would fight against those "buddies" and destroy him and live happily

Then whoever won the fight will start ruling it to "make sure it doesn't happen again"

twitter.com/Sargon_of_Akkad/status/837843492076470272

This clip kills commies.

err no it doesn't

He's speaking about Stalin, which yes, he failed to establish communism.

Because if you want power to the people, the first thing you'd do is give them freedom of speech, give them the freedom to open their own business, the freedom to decline service to whoever they want. To not have government intervene in our private affairs, or subsidise a failing business.

Oh wait I described Capitalism.

All communists are capitalists when the government isn't looking.

Communism doesn't work.

If the capitalists are able to step in and disrupt it that easily, does it deserve to exist?

Yawn shareblackandblue still at it and failing even with the 40 gorrillion

Josh Dolin

Adrienne Watson

Amanda Karpay

Elizabeth Shapell

Matt McClure

Rebecca Charen

Benjamin Fischbein

Burns Strider

Ellie Cohen

Elizabeth Price

Johan Newman

Benjamin Williams

Caryn Lenhoff

Daniel Wessel

Karla Towle

Kathleen Kennedy

...

Because we will eventually encounter intergalactic civilizations and will need a state for diplomatic reasons.

Rusfag here.

Although true Communism would be glorious, it's quite literally impossible.
We can incorporate ASPECTS of Communism, yet we can never achieve the actual system in perfection.

People are just too greedy, too selfish.

True Communism would only be possible with a completely emotionless and intelligent population.

Fully-Automated Communism, which is essentially the take-over of machines, will result.

However, at the moment, the best we can do is wait.

It is inevitable, and it WILL happen.
It's a shame the USSR fell apart.

>Western cancer enters USSR.
>Crime rates spike.
>Narcotics usage spike.
>Assaults, violence spikes.

>MURICA.

I also hate Lefties appropriating it and making "Cultural Marxism".

This is NOT the original intent of it.

It is NOT diversity.
It is NOT equality.

Communism is about JUSTFULNESS.

I'm communist but that is ridiculous. True communism is an idealistic bullshit. Practical communism worked, although not without mistakes and occasional failures, all in all, achieving great things and accomplishments.

>with capitalism we won't have a state because we'd all die in the war launched by the US government to control population and speed up the economy, yet running out of control and destroying the human race.

which means its ineffective because it can't keep itself alive and keep up with modern society.

This.

Communist PRINCIPLES work at TIMES and only when applied MODERATELY.

It is impossible to get TRUE Communism, although it would be a utopia if we did.

We can add aspects, which is, essentially, Socialism.

Much like 1970s USSR, but even better.

There already is seperation of church and state in the us christcuck

SLIDE THREAD, HELP US PIN DOWN OBONGO, WE'RE SO FUCKING CLOSE!

for true communism to be implemented, socialism must come first.

You can never give the government all the power and then expect them to just give it up.

Why are commies so fucking deluded?

...

It can't keep up because of human nature.

People are selfish, greedy, and evil.

If EVERY person would be willing to sacrifice his life for others, and every person would commit to do this, this would achieve a perfect society.

However, it's plain impossible, just like this fellow says

We didn't say it's going to be implemented instantly, you fucking tard.

It's not like the world governments just shut down, and fucking say "OH HEY GUYS YOU'RE NOW IN COMMUNISM".

It can only work with indoctrination, and a VERY slow approach, and even THEN it's impossible.

However, Socialism is VERY, VERY possible.

The USSR from 1967-1977 was a truly Socialist state. Before it was a dictatorship, after it was a criminal shithole.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA, faggot.

...

Your post is so abhorrent, and your country so degenerate, that your opinion was automatically discarded and burned.

The Communists NOR the Nazis like you, Argentina.

Please go.

>he failed to establish communism

Imagine a guy who comes up with this idea called "feather flight" where you glue feathers to your arms, jump off a cliff, and then fly in the air because of the feathers. You tell him that other people have tried that before, and it never works, because they all just fell off of the cliff and crashed into the ground. His response is "Well, that couldn't have been real feather flight, because in real feather flight, you fly in the air instead of falling to the ground."

That's what arguing with a communist is like.

I fucking hate when normies bring up the entire "OH WEW THEY KILLED 100,000,000 PEOPLE WEW".

Also, by the "I wouldn't work in a field".

Right now, I'm working as a full-time electrician's apprentice.

Please fuck off with your porky propaganda.

We're not going back to eating babies. Stop trying.

...

>protip : if they believe establishing a 100% true communist society is possible, they're not a fucking communist, instead an edgy 16 year old western child that wants to be a hipster.

A real Communist realizes that it's impossible, yet they strive to incorporate aspects of it, to believe a society as just as possible.

>In true communism, eventually, the government disolves and ALL THE POWER belongs to the PEOPLE

Are people really this fucking stupid to believe this? ...No, seriously?

>I fucking hate when normies bring up the entire "OH WEW THEY KILLED 100,000,000 PEOPLE WEW".
But they did kill that many people though
Stay bluepilled, you useful idiot.

Any commie itt is free to move to North Korea or Venezuela.

T. Fabian

>be me
>communist
>voted for trump because he is closer with the working man then hillary ever was and ever will be.


Not every Communist is a fucking anti-fa member.

NEXT.

sorry you got emotional

And yeah thats what I wrote. Socialism first then lead into communism.

However unfortunately, and this is where the delusion is, a truly socialist state=communism

>I don't know what Communism is

In political and social sciences, communism (from Latin communis, "common, universal") is the philosophical, social, political, and economic ideology and movement whose ultimate goal is the establishment of the communist society, which is a socioeconomic order structured upon the common ownership of the means of production and the absence of social classes, money, and the state.

Not even half of all commies and socialists believe in this anarchist utopia bullshit.

The division of labor is clearly a useful idea.

You're a leaf, you voted for nobody.

>True communism never worked because capitalists like the US always stepped in and destroyed it.
nah it doesnt work because rewarding everyone the same no matter what they do is fucking retarded.

Communists had total control over 2/3rds of asia

Was that not enough landmass to make communism work?

...

What's the average age of a modern day communist living in a first world country?

They did kill 100 million.

I said I hate when they bring that up, because it's literally the only argument in their bloody arsenal.
You know how many people capitalists killed over 20 million since WWII?
And in the past hundred years, Capitalists have done just as much killing and ravaging, right?

Holodomor was due to Capitalist States refusing to accept exports other then grain from the USSR, so we could not even obtain industrial machinery for food preparation.
Yes, some are, and they are called """"Communists"""".

Then there are others that REALIZE for Communism and Socialism, and other far-left authoritarian doctrines, you require a government to maintain production, progress, etc.

There are only two forms of government. A republic and a monarchy. Republics require constraining the power of government with some kind of constitution. Most of the ism's like Fascism and Communism fall into the latter category, of Monarchy.

>True communism never worked because capitalists like the US always stepped in and destroyed it. In true communism, eventually, the government disolves and ALL THE POWER belongs to the PEOPLE. Why would you be against this?


So communists dislike private property and especially private enterprise.
For whatever reasons, but 99% of the time because they make "profit" and since they think wealth is a zero sum game they also believe that profit comes off the expense of workers or customers or from somewhere, it doesnt matter... you believe someone is making a profit and therefor someone else is losing out.

That's all wrong, but going into that now and trying to explain it to you would be a waste of time.

I would rather ask you:
When voluntary organisations, like companies, never give up their "privileges" and make everybody equal just like that, what makes you think a government, something that holds WAY more power than any corporation ever could, would do that?

governments constist of people, just like companies do.
they just have evem more power, they are able to use force and they either have to violantly take hold of power or deceive their way into said power.

so what makes you think that a authoritarian, power grabbing, corrupt government is going to relinquish their power to create stateless communism yet a libertarian or even ancap society would be the biggest evil ever and could never reach your beloved utopia?

>libertarian socialism

As I was saying, Communism is bloody impossible.

Complete Socialism is not Communism either.

Whenever you attempt to get a political system, you always get a weaker strand of it.

Example:
>Go for Communism, get Socialism.
>Go for Fascism, get Imperialism.
>Go for Monarchy, get Constitutional Monarchy.

See where I'm goign with this?

>Holodomor was due to Capitalist States refusing to accept exports other then grain from the USSR, so we could not even obtain industrial machinery for food preparation.
lol, you had the means of production though right? You could've made those machines :^)

If you really think the government can dissolve into "True Communism" you might as well take up the Jedi Religion and wave around a light sword. It's pure fiction but hey, it's fun to LARP.
Put up a speed limit and people will speed, tell people not to steal and people will still steal, tell people to share things evenly, and it ain't gonna happen. Not without law enforcers, and even then not everyone is going to want to go along with it. And the structure always has to stay in place to have control over those law enforcers. You can't get rid of the structure no matter what the book says. Go read Harry Potter it's just as realistic.

Have fun working two jobs to pay for those immigrants.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zapatista_Army_of_National_Liberation

Very low, because 99% of these cunts aren't Communist, and instead indoctrinate their Liberal-Capitalist cancer as "MUH CULTURAL MARXISM", which is a fucking abomination and falsification of the true Communist doctrine.

They simply do it to be "edgy" and to be "hip" and "unlike the others".

15

Im sure the net time they'll get it right comrade

>voted for trump
>a leaf

...

Pretty sure it couldn't be over 20. Only those cooped up in their "school bubble", who never get out into the field and actually work, tend to believe in that shtik.

Immigrants and refugees are not supported by Communist doctrine.

Neither is forced interbreeding.

It's a Western Judeo-Capitalist lie invented to feed the masses and dumb them down.


If you don't work, you're shot.
If you're a waste of resources, shot.
If you don't bring any benefit, shot.

Refugees are not in-sync with Communist doctrine.

They are a waste of resources, they slow down production, and they don't work.

They're a perfect example of an enemy of Communism.

I'm not a Communist. I'm not even a socialist

>Never heard of a VPN.

user, I unironically believe you may align more with national socialism than with communism.

>twitter.com/Sargon_of_Akkad/status/837843492076470272
all those emotional arguments.
I thought Peterson was a better public speaker seeing as he gets shilled on here constantly, dissapointing desu.

>guys, I promise it'll work once it's implemented everywhere
>only having a third of the world as communism wasn't enough for it to work

Just jump out of the helicopter on your own next time instead of waiting for us to do it for you.

Go to Walmart. Look around. Do you really want those people deciding important matters? The Founding Fathers set up an oligarchy for a reason. The intelligent, well-educated, successful people flourish in an oligarchy and are motivated by self-interest to see to the true common good, which is often to the detriment of the uneducated who contribute nothing to the common good. In a communist democracy, the masses vote for their own short-sighted waste those resources that should be dedicated to building the future. Hence Venezuela's failure to allocate resources wisely and embrace of the giveaways that leave the people starving but equipped with free washing machines that they can't afford to use. Hence the Obamaphone given to those who refuse to work for their daily bread. Power belongs to the few wise enough to weild it for the common good.

Muh some piggies are just more equal

I think you're full of shit

>the us is the reason stalin killed people
Well kinda

It is wrong. It is incorrect.

The truth is capitalism is just as immoral as socialism simply because it's not Anarcho-Primitivism.

>I don't know what reality is
You can write shit in a book all day but the real world has proved your ideology is a fairy tale

So you're an authoritarian commie? Well good luck with attempt number 52, I'm sure it'll work this time.

problem is, after going nuclear, the soviet union could have just gave up on all other military expenditure.

and all of those socialist asian lands that are poor and malnourished.
>but muh china
chinks threw away maotism in the bin since deng xiaoping, and replaced it with state capitalism, since then famine stopped.

Because your premise ignores reality. Stop with the baby's first no true Scotsman arguement when it comes to communism. That arguement is invalid and could equally be applied to any number of failed political systems. Drop the bong, get a job, hit the gym and learn to live the god emperor.

I'm not for true communism because I BLOODY WELL KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS!

Haven't seen the clip, but emotional arguments are the ONLY way to communicate to a liberal

Just like how Comrade Stalin put an ice pick in the head of that traitorous Trotsky.

that is literally sex to my eyes

>Why would you be against this?
Because it never will work. Not because of US or anyone else stepping in but because it's naive crock of shit ignoring basic drives of a human being and basic human tendencies. Ambition, need to provide and prioritize their own over others, want to ensure better living, success as seen through material possessions and money, tendency to create cliques and prioritize friends over strangers.

While many of those traits can be redirected and/or managed, they're integral part of human nature. Humanity would have to willingly undergo radical changes in the very mentality, often denying impulses stemming from their biology for such shit to work. Otherwise either all humans, or just the ruling class will still be corrupted rather than serving for the good of the community.

And let me tell you, because of that naivety, communism is one of the most vulnerable to corruption systems, where certain ruling class has a right to manage all aspects of life of average citizen.

In true communism, the government dissolves but it's not needed, because the government is all good and pure and fairies make people happy. And everyone has a qt waifu and lives happily ever after.

Won't happen. It's not the human way. And communism is incompatible with humans as they are in real world. What people are against isn't the ideas behind communism but the actual application which is far worse.

I've got a 'lil something for the Capitalists here.


Communism fell, because as an economy, it's impossible, and only works when PARTS of it are implemented.

Pure Democratic Capitalism doesn't work either.

While the Soviet Union realized it couldn't handle itself, it fell apart quickly and at least attempted to preserve the remains, yet it kind of failed.

America is on the other hand, slowly failing, burying itself in debt, and only trying to slow down the inevitable.

Let me give an example.

>Bob has Cancer.
>Vlad has Cancer.

>Vlad realizes his cancer is incurable, and kills himself.
>Bob realizes his cancer is also incurable, but instead of taking his life, he decides to financially put his family and himself into a fucking drain by getting a shitty treatment, only to die, and destroy the lives of 5 other people on the way.

Check dis out.

Karl Marx himself said all of these things.

The pursuit of communism trades the capitalist class with the bureaucratic class.

Strasserism actually deals with this problem by abandoning anarchy.

laraj.ca/AGwiki/uploads/Fascism/Germany/Otto Strasser - Germany Tomorrow (Part 2).pdf

>problem is, after going nuclear, the soviet union could have just gave up on all other military expenditure.

Go to bed, serbia. You are drunk;
Nukes only help against external enemies. As soon as you have any terrorists or separatist elements in your country - or the enemy manages to get in - you are fucked, even with nukes. (Unless you want to nuke your own country. Good luck with that move. Do that once, and even tanks won't help you against the rebellion that is coming.)

>bob and his family use their own wealth
>vlad still did the right thing

>Bob realizes his cancer is also incurable, but instead of taking his life, he decides to financially put his family and himself into a fucking drain by getting a shitty treatment, only to die, and destroy the lives of 5 other people on the way.
Bullshit. If each person in your example is one country, then they're similarly intertwined with others and their downfall will affect those others. Additionally, fall of communism in eastern Europe wasn't because soviets decide to just partition themselves. It was because the shit was so bad they simply broke apart.

US may or may not be going to shit as far as economics etc go. But it proves it is better - Bob will live for a bit longer and spend some time with family, Vlad's cancer was so horrible though that it ate him in a blink of an eye.

Yes, perhaps it will.
Reason the Union fell apart was the introduction of Capitalist ways of life, and Western influence over it that resulted in it buckling and falling.

I DO admit America was stronger, and I do not deny that.

However, the main reason it fell was due to Western Influence, severe corruption and greed (another Capitalist aspect), etc.


No.
Bob takes on massive bank loans, takes his parents,' sibling's, and government money, only to slow down the inevitable by five months, and brings a shitload of hassle to everyone.
They replaced it with Communist-Capitalism.

A blend of both works, because a pure system is destruction on the government.

A blend of systems always works.

Refer to this No hard feelings, mate, just political discussion.

>what is North Korea

This.

All systems of government have a lifespan, most of which is tied to economics. This is not news. No state can last forever.
Republics/democracies last around 300 years assuming a largely capitalist state.
Centralized economies can last longer assuming a strong hierarchy is maintained, typically monarchy. You get dynastic cycles but regimes rarely fall without provocation.

In capitalist democracies/republics, the lifespan is largely determined by the concentration of wealth. If the elite can buy the government and placate the masses, it's only a matter of time before they assume direct control of the state.

This is why revolution is so important. It's an economic refresh button. It prevents capitalism from becoming too top heavy or bottoming out.

And you somehow we spank your commie/socialist asses for decades. I wonder why.

>Bob takes on massive bank loans, takes his parents,' sibling's, and government money
They are all in agreement, no one is being coerced through violence.

He's talking about ANYONE who thinks they can establish communism better than Stalin did.

Communism requires everyone in charge of it to hold to altruistic designs. The more people you have running it, the faster it will fail. The less people you have running it, the more dictatorial it'll become. Communism cannot work. Anarchy cannot work. In the context of the full speech, he's actually referring to the broad stroke of communism and marxism as it's being applied today. It's in reference to the people saying that we should still try it, because it's 'never been implemented properly'. And yet, countless people have died because of people trying. It's a fool's mission.

An emotional argument is different from an appeal to emotion. He's got conviction behind what he's saying here, but it's not an appeal to emotion, it's citation of history in context of arguments today.