Do you believe that socialized medicine could be successful in America? Is it a sustainable notion to begin with...

Do you believe that socialized medicine could be successful in America? Is it a sustainable notion to begin with? Do you believe there are any potential moral or legal issues that are created by socializing medicine?

Other urls found in this thread:

who.int/bulletin/volumes/82/2/PHCBP.pdf
pnhp.org/blog/2016/03/16/kenneth-arrow-says-single-payer-is-better-than-any-other-system/
krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/07/25/why-markets-cant-cure-healthcare/?_r=0
who.int/whr/2000/media_centre/press_release/en/
youtu.be/vAtQ4BeL2z0
twitter.com/NSFWRedditVideo

idk, if iwere an american citizen, and be forced to fund treatment for fatties with my tax dollars id be pretty upset

Yeah, it's worked in pretty much every other country it's been tried in, we could still keep private alternatives too. Economist Kenneth Arrow has done some interesting work on how it's likely the most efficient healthcare model given information asymmetry in the marketplace.

who.int/bulletin/volumes/82/2/PHCBP.pdf
pnhp.org/blog/2016/03/16/kenneth-arrow-says-single-payer-is-better-than-any-other-system/
krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/07/25/why-markets-cant-cure-healthcare/?_r=0

No. It only works in those countries because they don't spend money on military. The US does all the world policing, so other countries can afford national heath. When we stop projecting strength around the world, their national health care will stop.
Also sage

Thanks for the links user. The second one was interesting. Towards the end of the article, they point out the contradiction of his claim that a Canadian system would be better than a British one. I may have read that incorrectly, though.

> No. It only works in those countries because they don't spend money on military
They literally spend less money per capita than the US does on healthcare and yet we still pay for healthcare, we would actually save money.

Socialized medicine is fucking retarded.

Saged.

The biggest problem with healthcare in the US, is that a broken ankle costs $80k

I know your insurance covers most of it, but if insurances have to cover costs that insane and still turn a profit, there's only one person paying for it, and that's the consumer. $450/month for health insurance is not a normal situation.

If they regulated prices of health care and medicine, it would already be a great improvement.

>Do you believe that socialized medicine could be successful in America?

nope. only free market healthcare can work, because only the free market is productive and innovative enough to grow to meet demand. We need more free market, not less.

Why can't we have warehouse style budget hospitals? It could work.

>$450/month for health insurance is not a normal situation.
I pay more than that in Switzerland. Healthcare is a fucking scam in every country in every system. Period. Its incredibly expensive to keep people past their sell-by-date alive. It's worth it because old people are incredibly valuable founts of knowledge but we need to work out deporting all the niggers from Europe first

Fantastic argumentation. Thank you for the enlightening post, user.

>Why can't we have warehouse style budget hospitals? It could work.
A retarded idea. The solution is to have more pressure put on people to care for their own health via preventive medicine by punishing fat pieces of shit.

Also deporting niggers

if you socialize the medicine in us, all progress in medical sciences will die out within 20-30 years

it doesn't cost anywhere near 80k in reality
the government guarantees payments through the ACA. why charge 5-10k for a broken ankle and get that much when you can charge 80k and have the patient's insurance cover most of it?
the same thing happened to education, and the same thing happens any time artificial price controls and market constraints are put in place.

You're wrong though, other countries still do medical research, etc. even with heavily socialized systems and still do fine with high quality care and have much cheaper costs than America. According to the WHO:

"The U.S. health system spends a higher portion of its gross domestic product than any other country but ranks 37 out of 191 countries according to its performance, the report finds. The United Kingdom, which spends just six percent of GDP on health services, ranks 18th. Several small countries – San Marino, Andorra, Malta and Singapore are rated close behind second- placed Italy."

who.int/whr/2000/media_centre/press_release/en/

Ding ding ding
Idk why people think it's a good idea to give government complete reign over something under the banner of fixing it(where they claim the market failed) when it was entirely government which broke the system in the first place

Depending on the coverage, around €100 is a normal price here. Of course healthcare is a scam, but my government recently started taking steps against pharmaceutical companies charging insane amounts of money, for example by getting hospitals to develop their own medicine. Not only does it save insane amounts of money, but hospitals can even turn a small profit, reducing health care costs for both the state and the consumer.

It's a scam, but it doesn't have to be.

This exactly. A consumer won't walk away because 1. He has a broken ankle, and 2. The insurance covers it anyway. And why would the government fix it, i'm pretty sure a large portion of politicians benefit financially from this.

my god WHAT is that one in the middle

>Do you believe that socialized medicine could be successful in America?
no

>Is it a sustainable notion to begin with?
no

>Do you believe there are any potential moral or legal issues that are created by socializing medicine?
The fact that everything will be extremely expensive is a big issue

I was actually curious about that myself! What an odd piece of gear. Looks kind of neat though, I suppose.

youtu.be/vAtQ4BeL2z0

>it's most likely the most efficient

LIE

Here in the Netherlands we have a "chaos model" based on privatized healthcare
It's also the best healthcare system in the fucking world

You can fuck off with your commie propaganda

Besides any issues with expenses, do you think it infringes upon any rights held by an individual in any fashion?

It inherently does

I might be misusing these terms in this context, but do you believe that health care could be considered a positive or negative right?

This argument has been done already. I'm just going to refer you to Rand Paul

thanks burger, also shadilay

best battle rifle ever made. i love mine.

I'm a moron and accidentally commented on my own comment. ^^; Sorry everyone. I meant to post it as a general comment directed towards everyone in the thread.

Not having access to good health care when you can't afford is a worse infringement of rights, if you ask me.

It atracts illegal immigrants.

A good example of socialized medicine in the US is the VA hospitals and services.

The VA doesn't work correctly. It takes to long to be treated, patients have to get approval from the feds, travel hundreds of miles to a center that can provide that specific treatment etc.

So no, it can not and does not work well.

Maybe if insurance companies didn't have everyone by the balls with barbed wire.

>friesland flag
>socialist ideas

fucking faggot kill yourself

>Duckposter detected

idk how burgers even put up with this shit system they have

india has better healthcare than the US , and most likely even better doctors


that's how sad this whole affair is

Read the actual links, Kenneth Arrow is a Nobel Prize winning economist and is no slouch and makes great arguments, you can still have a private model operating within it which can work very well.

I don't care who Kenneth Arrow is
We have factually the best system, this has been the case for years now
And it's a privatized model

>getting hospitals to develop their own medecin

wat

that shit costs billions

Make it easier for drugs to get through the FDA, make health insurance cross state. Get the government out of the equation as much as possible.

Poof, all problems solved.

Insurance isn't a fucking right.

There are probably more factors at work than "muh private healthcare" making it "the best" in the world. There is more nuance in the world, billy.

Well it helps that they aren't a bunch of mongrelized fucking fatasses like Americans.

You shoulden't, it's shit

dont talk shit. our healthcare system is shit as well mate

>Do you believe that socialized medicine could be successful in America?
Why the fuck do you have to call it socialized medicine? It's universal healthcare

Is it a sustainable notion to begin with?
It is not, like the justice department or the fire department, but you need it.

Do you believe there are any potential moral or legal issues that are created by socializing medicine?
If you don't have universal healthcare then your disease becomes a business and doctors never let you go because they want to milk you all your money. It is one of the very few things where the State has to protect it's citizens from greedy motherfuckers.

>literally spend less money per capita
True. It's called price fixing. Even with government holding prices down, their health systems will be unsustainable if they had to pay for defense or fight a war.

>shit system they have
We have the best heath care in the world, but you wouldn't know this.
Pay cash you faggots

You might want to see which countries males live in the longest on planet earth

It's not feasible, and in Europe "it works" because it's like 30% of your income. Yeah man free healthcare at 15.000€ per year!

Ever see those ridiculous 50.000$ surgery stories? Well if you take care of your health you pay around €5000 per 15 min doctor visit. If you don't need intensive healthcare until you are 60 years old that's give or take €500.000 you spent on healthcare of others and salaries of people who didn't need to help you.

>around €100 is a normal price here
user the bulk of the money comes from your income tax

Socialized healthcare will never work in America because you have niggers.

You might want to remove nigger / taco nigger gun deaths from any stats you use.

you're like 100 place behind us bro. no amount of statistical manipulation will let you stand toe to toe with us. deal with it fatty

There are so few murders statistically speaking proportionally to the total population that it doesn't hugely affect the numbers.

>Why the fuck do you have to call it socialized medicine?

That's what it is you fucking retard. You can call it Universal to hide the fact it's socialist if you want.

Ha. I wouldn't trade my health care for yours any day. I'm giving you new info here: our facilities and doctors are vastly superior. You wouldn't know this because you can't afford it. What little you do have will be lost when any invading army decides to dissolve national health.

Good point.

we have the best heart and brain surgeon on planet earth working at the hospital near my house. feel free to live in your delusions though. im not one to waste breath educating americans

I don't really see the point of calling it that, nobody calls infrastructure, police, firefighters, etc. socialist. Socialist would also imply they remove options for private alternatives which isn't the case in most countries.

>You wouldn't know this because you can't afford it.

>we have the best
You wouldn't know because you can't get a visa to see for comparison, akmed.

Almost 50% of Americans dont pay taxes and many are unhealthy as fuck (gee I wonder which two ethnicities)

lmao i'm embarrassed for your country right now

That's a perfect example of what socialized healthcare looks like in America. Our federal government is too inefficient to run a large program like that. Pic related.

>india has better healthcare than the US
>You might want to see which countries males live in the longest on planet earth
>India 67, USA 77
you are an idiot

>i'm embarrassed
Because you're a virtue signaling faggot. You and your family probably wanted Hilary to win.

What? I was saying we out live these amerilards by vast amounts. Don't be retarded.
>you're a virtue signaling faggot.
What virtue am I signaling? I'm literally calling you a fat pathetic uneducated peasant. Stop throwing around words you don't understand you subhuman

>India 67
The fuck does this have to do with anything being discussed. Are you honestly mentally retarded you albian trash bag? Fuck off back to your third world shit hole.

I was referring to learn to read Arbër

Socialized medicine has been working in Australia for decades.

The only time it gets fucked up is when right wingers come in, defend the place then try to sell it because the underfunded services are not operating properly.

>quotes the wrong person
>gets triggered when called retarded for it
k

Thanks everyone for contributing! Hopefully you all have a good day wherever you're from. I'm off for now. Peace.

One word. Massachusetts.