The amount retards here "DUHH DESTINY GUT REKT"
Destiny has logically dismantled jon tron, naked ape, sargon and Jim and BTFO'd them completely
The amount retards here "DUHH DESTINY GUT REKT"
Destiny has logically dismantled jon tron, naked ape, sargon and Jim and BTFO'd them completely
Destiny's argument style goes something like this:This is the Destiny technique.
Bring up Source.
It can either be true or false, if true then I get a point in.
If the Source is challenged by someone and he doesn't have the credentials (appeal to Authority) then he's nuts and I immediately discount his opinion even if he may or may not have a point.
If the person challenging the Source is actually well educated in the subject then I will back off and claim ignorance on a subject.
Steven is so strongly opinionated on subjects that he claims to know nothing about, it's strange and comes off as idealogical as fuck.
Under no condition is the Source ever able to be considered false.
Someone who makes arguments that are unfalsifiable aren't making scientific arguments.
Hence, his arguments shouldn't be taken seriously.
>moron makes a moronic assertion
>Destiny directly attacks absurd assertion
>moron waffles and shifts goal post
>Destiny continues attacking morons assertion
>moron continues getting BTFO
>Destiny gets tired of moron like any sane person and ends it
please kill yourself you retards
You've failed to address my point on Destiny's argumentation style. Look at his debate with Ryan.
Who, who, who, who and who? I don't watch reality tv man, sorry.
damage control from leftypol
destimeme lasted /oneday/
All you've said is that if he's arguing against an expert he's more careful
It doesn't really matter because the people he's arguing against are complete knuckle heads that keep fucking waffling when he actually points out the flaw in what their logic
>logically dismantled Jim
Ummm, no he didn't.
Jim got Destiny to say that we should carpet-bomb Mexico to make it better.
He also said that "women should be equilaterally put into every male dominated position".
That's not logical.
No, what I'm saying is that Destiny has nested himself in such a way that is unfalsifiable due to his own intellectual dishonesty. He will never be willing to concede a point because he will retreat. This makes Destiny's "debates" very predictable.
I've noticed something funny about your post as well: You've conceded that Destiny has argued with experts yet you claim they are complete knuckle heads. Which one is it?
Also, you dodged his chat with Ryan Dawson as well.
k.. keep me posted
HOLY SHIT THE RETARDS KEEP COMING
he said any money spent towards Mexico would be better aiding anti-cartel actions and that helping a safer, stronger and more stable Mexico would be more beneficial than just shutting them off
Of course your pea sized brain reduces that to something simple as "WE SHUD BOMB DEM"
>No, what I'm saying is that Destiny has nested himself in such a way that is unfalsifiable due to his own intellectual dishonesty.
What, if he's making claims that are wrong then they can call him out, if it's unfalsifiable then that simply means he's being careful enough not to make unsubstantiated claims, which is a GOOD thing.
>You've conceded that Destiny has argued with experts yet you claim they are complete knuckle heads. Which one is it?
I never conceded that, I was expanding on your point, then (as implied) rejected it
>If he's making claims that are wrong then they can call him out,
If someone does this as a layman and points out something wrong with his interpretation of the study then he dismisses them as a layman.
> if it's unfalsifiable then that simply means he's being careful enough not to make unsubstantiated claims, which is a GOOD thing.
There is a big difference between being unfalsifiable and being careful enough to not make unsubstantiated claims.
Imagine trying to convince Destiny of a truth value with the way he argues.
Destiny: This study says 2+3 = 4
You: 2+2=4
Destiny: Wait are you a mathematician or something wtf.
You: Yes.
Destiny: Okay well I'm not a mathematician so idk not enough information lol.
In one breath he proclaims something to be true, in the next he abandons it as if it were never so.
This is not the kind of argumentation one should trust.
the worst are the NakedApe shills the kid is a fucking retard
Destiny also only professes to be an expert in two things: music and games.
One would have a very very hard time convincing him on a subject that he already believes in.
These are the hallmark traits of an idealogue.
Also, Ryan Dawson.
You are wrong, but I won't let bitterness consume me.
i actually agree with this
we should vassalize mexico and carpet bomb all cartels
Wrong. And he has twig arms. Put me in a room with him and we'll see how much longer he runs with mouth.
debates are stupid and Destiny is a faggot
IF you actually waste the time to listen to Destiny argue with internet celebs you are a fucking retard.
pls stop spamming this vidja gaymur child all over the board
I'm pretty sure he said that Mexico would be better if we did to it what we did in Iraq. If you can find the section where he says what you said, then sure.
Destiny literally only debates so retards like you can be astonished by words he doesn't even understand. Obviously it works because you and other shills are making shit posts like this to bolster his fame and feed his shitty self esteem and false sense of superiority.
Congrats faggot.
His arguments are more like:
"C'mon dog"
"I literally can't even"
"I feel like"
"How can you even say that?!"
Exasperated "Ugh" while flailing his arms or dropping his head.
All of these statements are made while the other person is trying to respond to his point/question (which he makes while quickly rambling off supposed studies or statistics), in order to disrupt their response and talk over the other person.
He effectively runs roughshod over people because most people don't call him out on his interruption tactics. That's his only effective weapon in his debate arsenal which allows him to control the direction of the conversation. The one guy I watched that called him out on this (nakedape) and asked that they not talk over each other was cut off and then Destiny rage quit the debate.
Jim held his own with facts, (same with Jontron) but he didn't call him out on his bullshit. NakedApe actually wrecked Destiny, because Destiny does not debate, he aggrandizes and talks faster and talks over his guests so when one person actually manages to corrall him into terms for an actual debate, he fucking rage quits with an "I can't even".
This is such retarded gamer arguments.
Please fuck off with this shit. "Should USA invade canada hurrr"
...
Never heard of this faggot, just watched excerpts of his debates with Jim and naked. I have a genuine headache from how retarded this kid is. I had to quit because I can't stand discussions where one person keeps interrupting the other...
Do you have the link to NakedApe destroying Destiny? I rewatched Jim push his shit in, but would like to see the other.
The whole point of a debate is to have a moderator and experts.
These amateur online gamer debates are basically just argument contests and not informative. It's pointless. The "destiny" argument I watched was with shkreli and it was basically Destiny making shit up and them going through 20 different topics.
The whole point of a real debate is you pick one question or topic and both sides are experts with great evidence.
The actual Clinton/Trump political debates are shams.
I agree with this sentiment.
Especially the Presidential debates, these aren't really "debates." They're utter trash, it's really Clinton + Trump lightly brushing up against each other and reiterating their stances to convince ultra left/rightist that they're good enough for them.
I think the amateur online debates are alright, it's a lot like amateur fighting. It's messy, it's shit, it's like watching retards play chess. Shouldn't be taken seriously, but I'm glad the fighters are getting practice at least.
twitch tv /videos/ 128503581
add in the . convo doesn't start until about 10m in.
Yeah, it's really more of a sophist "I'm convincing the crowd I'm right" technique than having a good point technique which is one of the aspects I hate about debates. It's probably something Destiny pulls out of his hat as a gamer, the man isn't an intellectual personality so don't even try to make him out as one. This will only end in disaster for the left.
>WHAT'S YOUR BACKGROUND IN ECONOMICS
whats his? The redistribution of minerals and vespene gas?
youtube.com
>communism is just an economic thing
Thanks user.
Fucking kek.
reminder these arguments are pointless are stupid. Destiny is good at low IQ debates by how he argues. Which is basically shit, aka talking fast and switching arguments while using whatever definition he wants.
Debates are timed with each side given a time to give all arguments.
>Saying helping the Mexican government take care of the cartels to stabilize the country and make it better so they'll stop coming to the US
>You somehow take this as "HAHA CARPET BOMB THEM XD"
all communist and socialist regimes have been purely economic things
Reminder that JonTron got fucking destroyed.
Jon BTFO!
Jon lost. Destiny won.
Sky Williams posted a DM convo with Jon and then deleted it. Anyone have it?
twitter.com
It's pointless. You don't get it.
You can say communism is just an economic theory. If you can pick and choose based on theoretical rather than practical implementations in history than when I say national socialism it doesn't include genocides or nazi germany.
The point is that Destiny's arguments are completely low IQ and the way these debates are structured is pointless without a good moderator.
Any good debate, aka professional ones, are usually a team of experts on each side, long time limits, and a very good expert moderator, and ONE subject that both teams research.
Having zany arguments across topics without a good moderator and being able to throw logic out the window is pointless. Destiny is basically doing cheap circus tricks. I would love to converse with him on one of these but calling it a debate is pointless. It's one retarded gamer talking to other e-celebs about random topics and arguing over "gotchas"
It is intellectually bankrupt.
>116555969
I think my ideal debate would be a long form conversation over months.
It would start at a foundation level beliefs and gradually work its way up to bigger ideas like taxes and equality.
There isn't enough time to properly articulate a belief, and it's like asking someone to explain Chinese history in a completely true way in 10 minutes!
here's your (You)
Destiny is the future. Smart, sexy, liberal.
Jon is a fucking loser.
Jon is NOT the future of politics.
Meant for Although, I realize most people wouldn't be interested in ultra long winded conversations at a foundational level, haha.
Basically Destiny constructed a circle jerk. It's his stream and he gets to basically end the "show" at will. Then can talk uninterrupted to his fanbase aterwards.
Let's say theoretically someone "bested" him in these pointless arguments he could just spend the next hour coming up with small counterarguments to every point of the other person afterwards and feel like he still "won".
The fact they verge into abstract territory like should we bomb Mexico or whatever shows how fucking stupid this shit is.
(You)
PUNCH.
EVERY.
NAZI.
IN.
THE.
FUCKIN'.
FACE.
All he does is try to sound smart and talk about details very vaguely in hopes on not getting called out on details. Which backfires routinly
Jon lost
No you don't get it. It's not even that. Arguments as structured in what these debates supposedly are is just a case of who is better at arguing over inane things and "gotchaing" the other person.
It's very low level discussion, aka ant shit relatively speaking. Destiny seems focused on gotchas and playing games with the conversation. It's essentially pointless.
At the end of these it becomes "X was bad at arguing" or "Y was better at arguing" and has no substantive point. Destiny fans who agree with him will still agree with him and actual understanding of issues is not gained on either end.
I would rate Destiny above random internet celebs at arguing but the basis of his arguments are childish.
The fact these are considered "debates" just shows how stupid most people are and uneducated.
youtube.com
Here's Mister Metokur making Destiny almost start crying in a debate.
youtube.com
Here's Ryan Dawson BTFOing Destiny on every single point for two hours.
youtube.com
Here's Martin Shkreli humiliating Destiny 5 minutes in and the faggot spends the next hour sucking him off because he lost so badly.
Naked Ape also cut his fucking head off on livestream. Everyone saw it bro. Steve ragequit because he had literally no argument and had begun to cite Friedman-esque anti-labor bullshit to defend immigration when he's a fucking liberal leftist.
I've only bothered with two debates. The Shkreli one, and the Dawson one. Both of the debates were more of a free lesson for Destiny. He offered little to nothing throughout both of these debates. Because of his poor performance in the two instances where he debated individuals with merit, I find it hard to believe anyone who has a genuine interest in politics would spend their time listening to bottom shelf debate.
Liberalism has already become pure cringe. It's on its way out.
for people new to shit, aka plebes
Study after study shows arguments like in destiny's case fail to sway any opinions. Even if Destiny "won" the argument it won't sway anyone. These types of gotcha arguments actually reinforce polarization. Because people watching are more upset over how good the people are at arguing than anything else.
It's why good surrogates on TV usually use canned responses or talking points. Not because it is the best argument or best point but rather because everyone using the same messaging will propagate the messaging to normies who will use it.
For instance if you go on CNN, you might be very smart and able to argue a great point. You actually would be a very bad surrogate for your party or politician if you did that good argument. instead you repeat a easy canned talking point because normies can use it. If normies are exposed to complex arguments they can't repeat them and scientifically it has found good arguments don't sway opinion anyway.
Basically. Everything destiny is doing with these debates is what people who think they are smart do. It's similar to the annoying atheist at school who argues with religious nuts about god not existing. The truth is that type of argument is proven to actually reinforce the other person's views.
>retards thinking either of them were good
It was painful to watch all around.
Shills are out on full force tonight, btw your Id shows your bs post...kill yourself leaf.
>posting giant hour long streams with this faggot
Going to need some time stamps, I can't stand listening to this whiny self-important idiot sling his two-bit rhetoric out from under his underbite for more than four seconds at a time unless I know the pain is about to come his way, user.
He said get rid of borders, pay Mexico billions, send in the military and bomb them. He also spent 30 minutes using a whiteboard to draw diagrams of privilege after the debate. He had a fucking meltdown lol
Huh? What are you going on about...? But I did get it? I've already posted that sentiment you've just expressed already.
This is a big problem even in formal debate settings, when/what is the last debate you found yourself actually changing your mind in?
Changing someone's mind is extremely tricky business, logic, facts, reason and argumentation is only one side of the coin when it comes to being convincing. (Unfortunately.)
And of course Destiny would play games, he's a gamer after all.
Here is a popular debate youtube
Keep in mind even it is shit because they use mainstream pundits when it comes to politics but their science debates and on foreign topics are kind of good.
A good debate should provide a huge amount of information to people who watch it.
Hillary vs Trump or political """debates""" are more about mastery of social tricks and persuasion.
Changing minds is pretty easy actually.
Sup Forums actually is pretty amazing at it as are some other places. There are quite a few groups that know the tricks including some people in media although not that often.
Like how these kids can't take a proper stance on nation building.... are you serious and I agree they aren't debates, screaming meme knowledge at each other. I'm the same way I would love to "debate" these low tier intellectuals without the slightest clue of history.
>Actually being this retarded
Is this some counter bait?
Hm? Whatcha referring to?
Neurolinguistics?
The breakdown in arguments:
A) This technology will save $300 billion and 2,000 lives. Support it because of logic and rational benefit.
vs
B) This technology would make it so Emily can stop crying all night. So that Emily's poor mother can get a good nights sleep instead of being up all night trying to comfort her suffering child. Support it so Emily can stop suffering.
The argument B, aka an individualized case that appeals to empathy is the better one in all tested and scientific cases.
If you give someone a personal connection it always beats the argument containing better statistics or facts. Humans are fucking stupid and it's why debates don't actually work. Everyone in media knows this. It's why everything is so dumbed down and talking points.
Read the first post on Sup Forums
>Fallacy Fallacy: Presuming that because a claim has been poorly argued, or a fallacy has been made, is wrong.
Jon is not a debater at all and was clearly unprepared. Any match between someone who knows how to debate vs someone who doesn't know how to debate will always end in the debater winning, even if the debater is argueing how eating actual cow shit is healthy.
No, just effective persuasion techniques. Sup Forums is full of great propagandists. It's why Trump won is because the propaganda was so absolutely dreadful from hillary.
This
You would need a control. For instance have Destiny argue an insane point like how the earth is flat with the other person. I'd bet the times he "wins" is the same as if he was arguing issues. It's purely argument skill.
I agree, basically all of Hillary's debating points boiled down to "I'm not the other guy!". Their has never been anyone in history that has won anything simply by saying that they are the physical alternative to the other party, at least not without hundreds of years of social conditioning
Stop adverspamming
Guys.... all our representatives and leaders get destroyed i cant handle this...
Maybe the leftists are right..?
Hans your cars are now getting out done by fucking Us of all people. You were never right to begin with, don't drag us down with you
Is good Jon got embarrased tho. It will just make him want to grow stronger in the red pill.
>our
Spotted the rebbit concern troll.
How is a random Youtuber who makes videos about games a "leader"?