Croatia

This country makes no sense, geographically. What happened there?

Other urls found in this thread:

homepage.univie.ac.at/ilja.steffelbauer/DAI.pdf
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Croatia
twitter.com/AnonBabble

a very many great number of slavs happened. also some italians and THOSE FUCKING turks. and russia. and everyone hated those fucking JEW- i mean SERBS.

they all hated each other for a very long time and had to keep cutting up borders for different wars and treaties and local ruling kings and what not. its all very confusing.

nothing. just stay away.

Arbitrarily drawn up borders thanks to the commies.

That's basically Dalmatia with a bit of Illyria, isn't it?

>What happened there?

It's a shithole just like suburbia, pls stay away.

Basically alot of wars throught the years and various other conflicts.
Atleast we cucked the others from having a coast

Half asset attempt to divide a nation into religious and ethnic groups. Obviously those poor oppressed Bosnian Muslims got first choice. Croatian is catholic so they got last choice. Alpha serbian just get fucking bullshit clay for trying to stop muslim genocide of Christians in Kosova.

>What happened

We lost the war.

I noticed that, you did well.

Ottoman salient in the "stomach". Ethnically, and consequently geographically it looked more coherent several hundred years ago. Ottomans hauled over peoples from other parts of the empire loyal to them (mostly Orthodox Vlachs, who will become Serbs later) and converted and a bunch (Orthodox as well as Catholics/Croats) into kebabs. Now we have this, but there's going to be a war soon and Bosnia and Herzegovina will be divided.

It is the sickle, I will use to reap the turks once and for all!

Were the Mujahideen already in Yugoslavia when it still existed? Sorry, thought you miggt know.

N-nothing

the republicans gerrymandered it?

But why couldnt turks conquer dalmatia, for example?

Dalmatia was for a large part of it conquered.

...

Then why is it back with Croatia? That contradicts your original explanation.

Forts and they tried to get to Vienna ,most of the time.

This is pure bullshit.
This is modern Croatian historiography narrative, which has no basis in reality or any primary historical source.

>Vienna, Buda and Pressburg was much more important
>Shitty terrain
>Since it was the Southern border of the Kingdom of Hungary, it was heavily fortified

Croats didnt flee from there like they did from Bosnia. Also the occupation lasted for a very short time.

Kek..."no primary historical sources"

Why wouldn't it be with Croatia? The population is consistently Croatian since ancient times.
Ok.

Try with reading Byzantine and Frankish sources, from 7th to 9th century.
Then go for Kulin, Matej Ninoslav, Tvrtko Stefan, Dubrovnik archives.
If you ask retarded New Croats, none of this has anything to do with Serbs, they will even claim "Croatian cyrllic script" and call a praying
book from Dubrovnik from 1512 THAT HAS EXACT QUOTE TO BE WRITTEN IN SERB LANGUAGE as "Croatian". They will call a book commisioned by a brother of Stefan Nemanja, Miroslav, as Croat Cyrillic book.
I can go on and on, but it will get us nowhere.
Noone here has ever read through primary historical sources, Ottoman defters etc

Oh I see now. You have to go back.

No it wasn't.
In fact, everything south of Cetina was called Serb and unbaptised Serb. Sources from 12th century to 1897 speak of Serb language spoken there.
Dubrovnik was first included in Croatia in 1939 and 1945.

It's C for Croatia.

Did you know that "Serb" means "person who wears shitty shoes"?

Read "De Administrando Imperio" and don't even think about writing here before you haven't read it.
>12th century
Kek.
Croatian history starts 5 centuries earlier.

what has no source? Bosnia was part of croatian kingdom and it looked more coherent at one point. its borders were determined by mountains and rivers like most countries.
you mean the vlachs part?
there was a document by Ban at the time where he allowed Serbs and Vlachs to settle in Croatia, and he clearly differentiates the two.

Read the first couple of paragraphs of this and shut up.

Croatfags, what do you do when you want to travel from Vukovar to Dubrovnik?

>serbs in the TONGUE OF ROMANS..

Where did you get this shit, you imbecile?

It is not "tongue", it is "language"
It is not "language of Romans", it would be Latin.
Except for a very small detail that in that period the Romaioi were speaking and writing Greek, like the author of DAI did.

I swear, every single retard thinks he is a genius and a knowledgeable person. Thanks for nothing, Google.

>In fact, everything south of Cetina was called Serb and unbaptised Serb
what the fuck are you on

Why are you trying to change the subject, you sandnigger?

WWIII Swiss babies get chainsaw raped. No catholic anything to protect you sandniggers anymore.

FFS, Serbs came during Emperor Heraclius.
You have never read DAI, otherwise you would know this

>implying denizens of Vukovar have money for that

>Where did you get this shit, you imbecile?
Source is in the filename. De Administrando Imperio, written by Emperor Constantine Porphyrogenetos in mid 10th century, based on older scripts.

Serb means "a person who wears shitty shoes", "opančar" quite literally.

You do know of Kulin and Matej Ninoslav, their documents?
Have you ever investigated Crkva Bosanska and Djed names?
Do you know what "Kralj Srbljem Bosne i Primorja" means?

>ITT Croats trying to disprove they are not Serbs

lmao

It's just where half the ethnic Croats live, the other half live in Austria and Switzerland.

>Where did you get this shit, you imbecile?
Kek. Doesn't know "De Administrando Imperio".
How new are you?
This is exactly the reason why Serbs are nationalists. If they made it mandatory to read this book inb Serbia no Serb would ever get the idea that "CROATIA IS MUH RIGHTFUL CLAY".

Would you be so kind and screenshot the original paragraph in Greek?
That translation is atrocius.

Why do intersex people let themselves be mashed with those sickos?

Read this:

Who cares, they make a better polymer framed gun than Austria.

>ITT: Serbs proving their WE WUZ origin

Porco Rosso happened there

It states in DAI that Zahumlje, Paganija, Travunja, Duklja are Serb lands.

just a bunch of catholic serbs that don't want to live with muslim serbs or actual serbs.

How about I invent a time machine and ask Porphyrogenetos himself? I gave you the source, have fun.

homepage.univie.ac.at/ilja.steffelbauer/DAI.pdf
pp.153.

If you can't see what they were going for you must be blind.

"... ad Sorabos, quae natia magnam Dalmatie partem obtinere dicit..."

Royal Frankish Anals. early 9th century.

The Franks have to know, they were fighting in that region against Byzanines,
ending with Aachen peace of 814.

It also states that Serb means "a person who wears shitty shoes", and that Illyricum (Bosnia) was possessed by Croats. But that's trivial since borders changed and keep changing non-stop. For example, you no longer have Kosovo.

The only reason I know about and respect Croatia is because of pic related.

/thread ,so much this

pretty much on point. a shame the serbs were stopped of purging the turk rape babies.

Ancient Dalmatia was a much broader term than Dalmatia today. Modern Dalmatia are Zadar, Šibenik-Knin and Split-Dalmatia counties in Croatia. Ancient Dalmatia encompassed almost entire western Balkans, from modern Slovenia on the west, Hungary on the north, Bulgaria on the east and parts of modern Albania.

The next chapter deals with Serbs.
It says that Serbs inhabit Travunja, Zahumlje, Pagania and Duklja.
Literally.
That is the reason I am making fun of you Internet experts.
You are not even aware that the original was not preserved, what was preserved are various later period copies with numerous additions and modifications.

Fortunately for those interested in history, like me, we have Dubrovnik, Venice, JAZU Zagreb archives and their treasures.
Even better, we have documents of Kulin, Matej Ninoslav, Nemanjić etc. detailing the language and demographics.

Everyting west of Vrbas has always been Croatia, that is not Bosna and is not part of discussion.

Borders were created that way to cut off russia from ever building a warm water port in adratic sea

Only Miyazaki movie i didnt watch. Now i will.

>German education
Noch nie was von De Administrando IMperio gehört, aber trotzdem überall seinen Senf dazugeben.

Shit country with shit leaderships with shit people who only steal land and walets

It doesn't help your cause at all.
If we take your definition of Imperial Roman province of Dalmatia, how could Serbs hold the majority of it?
Even better, why would a chronicle of Franks, contemporary to wars in Byzantine theme of Dalmatia, refer to a province from centuries ago?

Your "argument" is typical Croatian Internet meme.
You ought to be more creative.
Think of the creativity people who call 1512 pray book from Dubrovnik "Croat cyrillic book", yet it has this phrase in it "
Stampadis in littera et idiomate seruiano"

According to DAI Belgrade was Croatian.

Croats are just Serbs who LARP as Italians and suck up to Germany. Prove me wrong.

>JAZU Zagreb
Communists dreaming about better times.

>Belgrade

You do know that Biograd and Beograd were written the same way in Old Church Slavonic and spoken the same in Old Slavic?

What are you trying to prove with this?

Serb sclavinias were centered on Epirus and Thessalonika initially, later ones were in Bosna, Diocleia and western present day Serbia, due to Bulgarian prevalence in the rest of Balkans,
while only the Nemanjić Dinasty centered it in present day Serbia, Kosovo, Montenegro, north Albania and Macedonia.

It says that Servians inhabit a part of Dalmatia, which could be anything, it's not specific at all (neither is DAI, Illyrium and Panonia could be entire Bosnia and Hungary). I'm not a historian by any means, I'm making fun of you.
It's modern Biograd, not to be confused with Beograd.

>communists
>JAZU

Pa ti si mrtvi idiot.
Tko i kada je osnovao JAZU maloumniče?

>Croats are Serbs
>Croats live on Serbian land
Don't you just love when serbs shape the discussion however it suits them at any given moment?

If we're serbs then we're already living on our land ;)
If we're living on your stolen land, then we're not serbs ;)

>this Serb again
Fuck off back to Belgrade if you don't like it here

you should i loved it especially if you live in croatia. you will love your country even more and want to remove kebab and make europe great again.
long live NIPPON thanks for loving europe even tho its becoming shittier by the day.

No it says they hold a GREAT (magnam) part of Dalmatia.
You don't know Latin, yet are "making fun of me", by continually being proven wrong and making a fool out of yourself?

No, Croats are not Catholic Serbs.
That is bullshit, pure and simple. I have never and would never claim so.
I am just making fun of historical revisionism and falsehoods fueled by newly awoken nationalism.
Science and historiography don't bow to emotions and politics. At least they shouldn't.

We lost our rightful clay

>broad, not specified term at all
It could mean borders of modern Servia as well. Word "Serb" on the other hand is very specified, it is a pejorative slang.

Nope, they showed up after Tito's death with other national - religioua groups. This is basicaly why I hate monoteistic religions.

Kek, didnt even think about this, serb perma kill
Will watch it soon, i didnt know why they meme about Miyazaki loving croatia in the shitty Miyazaki trivia, now it might make some sense.

First gotta get rid of Merkel, literally nothing can be done in any european country as long EU rules over everyone in it.

>falling for a bait this hard

Through Bosnia mate. Faster and cheaper.

nah we have the best shape geographically of any country besides italy

>someone from Vukovar having money to go anywhere
I swear to God, we'd have been better off if the Serbs flattened that shithole to the ground

It doesn't matter really, Stefan Nemanja controlled everything up to Pelješac, islands included, gifting monasteries there.
Dubrovnik funded a Serb Orthodox Church monastery of St. Sava in Holy land until XVIII century.
Patrician laws and proclamations were written in "Latin and Serb", they explicitly state so.
Natko Nodilo in 19th century confirms it, as does Rešetar later on.

How do you lads feel about the glorious state of Pagania

Dobro došao u 21. stoljeću. Hrvatska je neovisna republika, i obuhvaća i Istru i Slavoniju, i Dalmaciju i Dubrovnik. Neka pati koga smeta.
Drugo, nije Slavorum meridionalium jednako SFRJ.
Ime akademije danas je HAZU iz točno tog razloga. Našu dobro namjerenu panslavenska ideju su na najružniji način iskoristili srpski nacionalisti i izjednačili južno slavenstvo i panslavizam sa totalitarnom yugoslavneskom ideologijom. Preimenovanje je znak protiv totalitarizma i šovinizma.
Ljudima koji ne poštuju institucije, povijest, kulturu i jezik draže u kojoj žive, u toj državi nije mjesto. U drugim riječima:
You have to go back!

It took this form because of the antemurale christianitatis and Venetian Republic

Here's a timeline of Croatia for the past 1000 years
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kingdom_of_Croatia
Then why is Dalmatia included in every version of Croatia?

>Dubrovnik was first included in Croatia in 1939 and 1945.
Why does this even matter when a Dubrovnik was a republic by itself for hundreds of years and they're catholic?

Come to think of it, what was your original argument even about?

>jugoslavenstvo
>srpski nacionalizam

Ti si moron. Srpski nacionalisti su bili protiv, svi odreda.
Nadalje, autor vaše omiljene "Srbe na vrbe" je u "velikosrpskoj Jugoslaviji" bio Ban Dravske banovine. A za Jugoslaviju su lobirali hrvatski političari i čak pravašiz
Potpisan je konkordat, Hrvatskoj su priključeni krajevi koje nikad nije imala. Ako misliš slučajno na SFRJ kao srpski nacionalizam još si pogubljeniji.

>Austrian flag
>You have to go back

You are doing great. Not moronic at all.

Šešelj get off Sup Forums.
Serbs didn't even have their own dictionaries until Karadzic.
Also
>Who is Ivan Gundulic

Claiming dubrovnik ever had anything to do with serbia is the most ridiculous shit. It was an independent republic for so long, one of the largest trading states in the 17th century, so rich in fact that it was unconquered by the italians or turks because we payed them off, napoleon was the first to conquer it from us.

Josip Broz Tito and commies.

My initial argument is that bullshit such as "no Serbs over Drina", "Ottomans imported Serbs", "Vlachs from medieval and Habsburg sources are not Serbs but Wallachians" are absurd nonsense that is easily disproven.
Dalmatia ends on Cetina, historically speaking, that is core land of Medieval Croatian Duchy and Kingdom.

HAHA.
>No, dear friends SFRJ had nothing to do with Serbian nationalism.
>Neither did the Kingdom of Yugoslavia.
>Friends, please, lets be civilized about this. The Radic brothers just had to go. You do understand that we couldn't possibly let those savages allow to block our glorious project.
>Also, everyone who speaks stokavian is a Serb, because Vuk Karadzic said so.
>Also SANU memorandum II now!

>I have never ever read anything related to actual history and primary sources, but my reading of national wikipedia and Internet forums makes me an undisputable authority: THE POST

>Vuk Karadzic
wew
>Serbs have no dictionaries or standardized language
>steal Croatian dictinoary
>change five words
>call it Serbian
>"Croats are Serbs, they speak our language!"
T O P
K
E
K

>yfw there are actual ethnic Croats who support the common language declaration or whatever the fuck its called
If only there was a way to exchange these fags for Asian immigrants, I'd do it in a heartbeat

Ljudevit Gaj explicitly said that he took Serb language as a template, basis for standard Croatian. I can find the exact quote for you. You are ridiculously uneducated and base your arguments on completely wrong premises.
Even better, I can find quotes from Croatian nobility and politicians of 19th century resisting this "foreign and artificial" language, or Starčević arguing in favour of kajkavska ekavica.

To no avail. You are an imbecile.

Radić was a piece of shit and a loser. He would have doomed Croatia had ti been according to his wishes. Italians would have easily claimed what they were promised, and Croatia didn't exist, it was just a region of the defeated Habsburg empire. He roamed from socialism, Comintern to republicanism, eternal opposition and malcontent.

There is no SANU II memorandum, and you have never read the first one.