There are multiple genders, gender is a social construction

Hear me out Sup Forums, I used to think it was just SJW bullshit but honestly they're not wrong. Plenty of longstanding cultures have had distinct third genders going back centuries (e.g. Samoa and the sub-continent cultures) and the roles of the two common genders vary between pretty much every culture on earth. How is it then contentious that gender is a social construct and that there are multiple genders?

It's still flat out retarded.

Men have dicks or atleast XY bodies and women have vaginas or atleast XX bodies.

I honestly wouldn't mind calling a man a woman if they were that way so inclined but don't expect me to suspend my internal beliefs of what you literally are.

There are cultures that had distinct third genders I know but they weren't the western culture of the 1st world and I imagine their 3rd gender probably made up a reasonable chunk of the population compared to how many people want to go by the name xir, che, xo, per, qer or what ever stupid shit you want to make up. It's no less silly than people who say call me an attack helicopter.

There's no basis for this new gender crap other than self exclusion and professional victimhood that is so popular with mindless leftists these days. These are the same faggots who join antifa to bash fascists when they are the biggest fascists in the modern day world.

It's not just wrong and retarded but it's an altogether toxic ideology that promotes division rather than unification.

What sound does a kangaroo make

>There are cultures that had distinct third genders I know but they weren't the western culture of the 1st world
But what does it then say about the nature of gender that there do exist +2 distinct genders in certain cultures? If you accept that multiple gender identities can indeed exist then obviously at some point you have to acknowledge someone just made that shit up and over time these became ingrained in the culture. Whats then to stop people making up their own genders today and then identifying with that?

>There's no basis for this new gender crap other than self exclusion and professional victimhood
Yeah there is, its a social construct

Kinda a hiss

you gotta be a shill, or an idiot.

you are either born with male genetalia or female, it's a biological construct, plain and simple.

of course, some are genetic defects and are born hermaphrodites, but let's not go there.

eunuchs are not even remotely similar to the 32 flavors of made up genders

Gender exists to allow the human race to breed. It's biology. You need a man, and a woman. That's it. There is no need for a 3rd gender, or more - that's made up nonsense by insane liberals intent on destroying western civilization as part of the Marxist global plan.

Male for sperm, female for eggs. That's it.

if you want to suck a dick as a man, go for it - but you still have male genitalia, and you are a male of the species. Nothing you say can change that.

What ever happen to people just being fucking weird? Why does every little mental disorder need its own title. LBGTQIOU and sometimes Y will fragment itself into oblivion

It's not a construct at all, it's basis of the human species and it's survival and evolution on this planet - male and female are the words we invented to describe it, but males and females would not cease to exist biologically if the words didn't exist.

>you are either born with male genetalia or female, it's a biological construct, plain and simple
Gender econmpasses more than just genitalia though. I doubt you'd disagree that males tend to be interested in sports so when gender is spoken of in academic circles it includes such dimensions of ones identity.

>of course, some are genetic defects and are born hermaphrodites
Or several ancient cultures with multiple genders

At some point these cultures just would've made up these genders wouldn't they?

Quotes the wiki entry, which has been a highly contested battleground between scientists and liberal nitwits.

Fucking auts. Is it something in the water in Australia?

>Hear me out Sup Forums, I used to think it was just SJW bullshit but honestly they're not wrong. Plenty of longstanding cultures have had distinct third genders going back centuries (e.g. Samoa and the sub-continent cultures) and the roles of the two common genders vary between pretty much every culture on earth. How is it then contentious that gender is a social construct and that there are multiple genders?

Give me the percentages of people that identify as a "third" gender (not male or female).

Something like 98% of the people identify themselves as the gender they were born as. Of the remaining 2% people the vast majority are unhappy with their gender, but they don't want a third option, they just want to be called the other one.

So how many people that would "identify" as the third gender are we actually talking about?

I'm talking about people that do feel discriminated when they're called any of the binary genders. I don't mean people like Miley Cyrus that simply want to use it as a fashion accessory to make themselves seem more unique.

I, unironically, agree with you that gender is a social construct. Its true thar certain cultures included more than 2 genders because it was a cultural/societal ideology.
But now we have science and technology, making gender/sex verifiable through chromosomes and other genetic correlations.

>Yeah there is, its a social construct

What use does a "gender" that you can pick yourself have?

It doesn't help you with medicine. It doesn't help you with anything practical I can think of. If you want to wear a dress as a dude then just wear a dress as a dude. You don't need to be a "third gender" to do so.

>Plenty of longstanding cultures have had distinct third genders going back centuries
Yeah, those ones are socially constructed.
Not the 2 that actually exist

>the roles of the two common genders vary between pretty much every culture on earth.
They really don't. They don't even vary between most animal species.
>inb4 point out to one animal species that strays from the rule
I said most.

cuttlefish have a subset of males that are specifically genetically breeding to be smaller and look like females. they maintain their population because the other males don't know they are male, and will let them roam free thru their territory.

cuttelfish are like 3 year old intelligence. i think humans can comprehend and realize a much broader 3rd gender than that.

It's not a question of intelligence and understanding. It's a question of what use does this have.

What social construct? Its just terminology its only used to communicate ideas not formulate them.

>Give me the percentages of people that identify as a "third" gender
1-5% of Samoans are their third gender

>But now we have science and technology, making gender/sex verifiable through chromosomes and other genetic correlations.
But I'm talking about gender as defined . I don't doubt that there are two biological sex's

>What use does a "gender" that you can pick yourself have?
I'm not too sure if one can pick their own gender I'm fairly sure you just identify with the one you feel like. Its useful just in the classification and identification of genders and gender roles within society

Gender is defined to be Gender roles have even changed in single societies over time wtf are you talking about. Are yo seriously going to tell me that the roles that women play in western socieites are similar to what they were 50 years ago or that the roles women play in saudi arabia are the same as they do in the west?

>Plenty of longstanding cultures have had distinct third genders going back centuries (e.g. Samoa and the sub-continent cultures)

Degenerate beliefs of shit-stained barbarians are irrelevant. Unless you're willing to claim that sorcery is real too, you have no leg to stand on here.

>and the roles of the two common genders vary between pretty much every culture on earth.

No, they don't. In language of each culture genders play much the same role.

And if you talk about sexes (do remember, outside of newspeak, "gender" applies to words, "sex" to people), their roles also are fundamentally the same in every culture on earth, moreso in every culture capable of progressing beyond stone age. Even the level of leniency extended to females follows the same progression - every culture starts off treating them like a mix between cocksleeve and workhorse, but gradually gets more chivalrous as prosperity and sophistication increase.

The moment the words sex and gender started to mean different things, of course gender became a social construct because the word covers the behaviours and what they mean and that is socially constructed.

We didn't have a word for the "whole set of behaviors that we associate with a pair of nether bits to signify to other people stuff about your bits". It's because we started to see biological sex as a different thing than the behaviors that you think so now. Of course behaviours are social constructs.

Imagine that I made two words for eating. One is "feeding" and now feeding means only the act of taking edible substances and taking nourishment from them. "Eating" means all the rituals and ways that people sit down, consume the substances etc. and now you can't eat-shame anymore. Every way a person decides to put stuff in their mouth is good and valuable, because our social constructs are oppressive.
Do you see how retarded this is?

It's a post-modernist game that makes you see everything as a construction, because you just add a separation somewhere between biology and behaviour and say that we can't have anything to say about the behaviour. It's easy to play, don't fall for it.

gender roles are a social construct, gender is a biological notion

A social construction is a social construction in itself.

>Are yo seriously going to tell me that the roles that women play in western socieites are similar to what they were 50 years ago or that the roles women play in saudi arabia are the same as they do in the west?
The changes in the West are a really recent development and not quite as widespread as you seem to think.
Women, in every culture in the history of mankind have always primarily been caretakers. They'd raise the kids and manage their home while men worked/went to war/whatever else, and that is also true with most other animals.
Feminism in the West has largely shaken that structure but there are still a lot of families that still adhere with these gender roles.

wtf I'm a crippled african american female attack helicopter now

I work in emergency medicine. If a dude identifies as a chick, that's fine, I'm still going to do my job. However, if they have abdominal pain, by protocol, I have to ask a woman if they could be pregnant, if they've ever been pregnant, and when they're last period was.

I can lose my job if I don't play pretend. Whether or not it's a social construct is irrelevant. It's a waste of my goddamn time, and adds an unnecessary layer of useless frivolity to time sensitive situation.

Sometimes they actually answer that they had their period last month, but not this month.

Don't you See? These people have something seriously wrong with their self perception to the point that they will lie to medical professionals and potentially ignore a life threatening problem just to pretend that they are a woman.

Don't act like these irrelevant "civilizations" should have any bearing on gender when I can guarantee their third gender has fuckall to do with the current deluge of insanity and delusion.

there may be many genders but only 2 sex

>1-5% of Samoans are their third gender

I'm not asking about the situation in a tiny third world country that's economically worse off than a country that had war only some years ago. I'm asking what it would be globally.

Their population is Its useful just in the classification and identification of genders and gender roles within society

What the fuck does this even mean? Give me practical examples of where it is useful that you're referred to as a third gender instead of one of the biological sexes.

So you're saying pretending to be another gender makes a smaller and weaker population?

Sentient human beings are exactly the same as cuttlefish. Science.

Without being a dick, you'd have an easier time using the mouse experiment as an example, as it is more representative of our current society of plenty.

>At some point these cultures just would've made up these genders wouldn't they?
they made them up for a reason related to the practical challenges they faced as a society, as a way to express facets of the human experience that weren't being clearly spoken for already, and did so over the course of generations with mass buy-in. That's how culture works.
transgenderism is being forced very quickly by a tiny majority for ideological reasons unrelated to anything pragmatically happening on the ground. That's cultural engineering, it's stupid, and it will be rejected strongly by most people. The definition of gender has nothing to do with those facts.

>Unless you're willing to claim that sorcery is real too, you have no leg to stand on here
Sorcery is veritably false but taking gender as its academic definition of genders the third genders of samoa and the sub-continent fit into different category than male and female

>In language of each culture genders play much the same role
Women in the west don't even play the same role today that they did 50 years ago, different cultures can have radically different gender roles but you already knew that:
>every culture starts off treating them like a mix between cocksleeve and workhorse, but gradually gets more chivalrous as prosperity and sophistication increase.

Why do some cultures have multiple genders then

>Feminism in the West has largely shaken that structure but there are still a lot of families that still adhere with these gender roles
Theres been a pretty severe drop in marriage rates, close to half the amount of women getting married. I think its pretty bold to say that this isn't at least in part due to the changing gender identity of women due to feminism

fuck thats funny

Well they're just being retarded if their not going to answer questions pertaining to their biological sex. That's not what gender's about it couldn't be more clear. I agree its delusional to somehow think your not your biological sex however its not delusional to not identify with the gender matching your biological sex

Other genders have sex

Close to no population

>Give me practical examples of where it is useful that you're referred to as a third gender instead of one of the biological sexes
If you felt uncomfortable being referred to as your assigned gender. If you were a sociologist examining further genders

>Theres been a pretty severe drop in marriage rates, close to half the amount of women getting married. I think its pretty bold to say that this isn't at least in part due to the changing gender identity of women due to feminism
>movinggoalposts.png
It is still a very recent development and almost only in the West. Doesn't change that "traditional" gender roles have been pretty much the same for all of history and the entire animal kingdom.

>If you felt uncomfortable being referred to as your assigned gender.

In almost all the cases wouldn't you just be happy with being referred to as the other one?

>If you were a sociologist examining further genders

How is this of practical value to essentially anybody? You're saying that the practical value of having additional genders is the ability to be able to study having additional genders.

>Why do some cultures have multiple genders then
Because those cultures are wrong.

Outliers. The vast majority of life on planet earth is binary.

Show me where a so-called third sex fits into the breeding cycle.

You can't.

>people used to think the earth was flat and the sun revolved around the earth.

Until science proved them wrong.

Reminder that something being a social construct does not mean it isn't real. In fact it being a social construct means it is real. It just means it is defined by society.

Also reminder that gender and sex don't mean the same thing.

Also reminder that society doesn't define an attack helicopter as something a human can be, at least until 2077.

>he thinks social sciences are capable of proving anything

>Doesn't change that "traditional" gender roles have been pretty much the same for all of history and the entire animal kingdom
Sure 'traditional' gender roles are immutable. The gender roles and identities within a society are always changing and even though they in large part may often reflect the traditional gender roles and identity.

>In almost all the cases wouldn't you just be happy with being referred to as the other one?
As in the other gender? Idk maybe it'd probably depend on the person.

>How is this of practical value to essentially anybody?
lmfao thats the case for 90% of 'pure' social studies. It's only useful to people wanting to learn about gender theory or conduct research in the field.

How can a culture be wrong in itself? That's like saying Indians aren't polytheists and they don't worship cows.

There are objectively two genders.

XY, and XX.

There are also mutations that cause stuff like XXY -- these people are aberrations.

You seem to be confusing gender with sex, and if your English is that terrible you should probably work on that shit before you move on to science.

You're all retarded, just use the word sex instead of gender so you won't be bogged in a retarded nothing conversation. Sex is determined by genitalia and YES there are rare occasions (like op) that are XXY.

The semantics to this constant argument are fucking dumb, gender is just a bastardized term now because it now comes with 5thousand myspace tier names after it. It isn't cute funny or anything, its just annoying self centered and a waste of everyone's fucking time.

>The gender roles and identities within a society are always changing
But that's my point, they're not. They changed once, in the Western world, in the past century. That's it. And even then they didn't change dramatically, they progressively transitioned.

>they progressively transitioned.
Much like a transsexual

eh

I can actually agree there are different expressions of gender as sexuality or societal role. I'd say Chad Thundercock has a different gender role than let's say a beta cuck who provides for a roastie with kids. That said genders as such would be made up of
a)persons biological sex
b)persons background
c)persons social context
d)persons life choices
e)persons genetic predisposition

I think while a) is crucial and whoever denies it needs shot, other four will make enormous difference through man's lifetime.
I also believe there is a higher variation in men due to our biological status.

No, it's like saying cows aren't actually gods and you shouldn't shit in the street.
There aren't three genders even if some people pretend there is.

What should term should we then use to refer to the characteristics of each sex?

You don't think there hasn't also been a change in western male identity alongside this? Haven't gays altered male and female identities and their perception with their increased acceptance? Don't gender roles differ between western, asian and arabic socieities?

What would constitute a third gender in you eyes?

>there is no biological difference between the genders
>men shouldn't hit women, they're biologically weaker!
SJWs/feminists/anyone who believes in 3+ genders should kill themselves immediately

>plenty of long standing cultures

and not single of them relevant, sage

Why is social construction considered a bad thing, or somehow illegitimate?

Arguably, anything that isn't running around naked pissing and shitting everywhere, cannabalizing one another is a "Social Construct."