Korean War II: The Empire Strikes Back

So, we all know how Korean War I went, with Norks rushing defenseless South Korea with tanks and quickly taking Seoul then getting reamed by the ((UN)) (USA and a bunch of small token forces) and they almost lost Pyonyang until China intervened by sending a fuckton of soldiers and the war resulted in a stalemate that saw up to 3 million Norks die and all their cities destroyed from firebombing. My question is this, how would an all-out war now go? Would it be similar? Would the US win easily? Discuss intelligently please, lets avoid silly responses like "Based Kim slaughters the Imperialist Pigs" or "Commies all die". I want intelligent military discussion

Other urls found in this thread:

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ROKS_Cheonan_sinking
rt.com/politics/387256-declaration-of-war-senator-blasts/
youtube.com/watch?v=khchqRIPN4U
twitter.com/NSFWRedditGif

Hard to tell.

Morale is pretty low among South Korean young people. I personally would worry about desertions.

Still the US and South Korea have a lot of firepower so I don't think the North Koreans want a war.

What the communists will try is ideological subversion. That's ultimately how they won in Vietnam, not by fighting South Koreans which would be very unpopular but rather by convincing them that the US and not the communists are their enemy, that the US are bloodsucking imperialists blah blah blah.

The current election in South Korea will help bring that about. Moon will total the US-Korea alliance and abolish the national security law that makes being a commie at least theoretically an offense that gets you gaoled.

With Moon in power the North Koreans will get money from aid and the Kaesong Industrial Project. They will demand and receive cooperation from South Korea when it comes to shutting up refugees and North Korea human rights activists. Through the teachers union they will foment agitation against both US soliders and other foreigners here like English teachers poisoning the alliance at a grass roots level.

Because South Korea is so reliant on the US this is traditionally a weak point the North uses to attack the state as a puppet, anti-Korean etc etc. I'm actually quite worried.

So would you say the average South Korean citizen wants unification with the North?

Things have changed. We don't have a faggot in the white house willing to fight a politically correct war. Trump will NOT hesitate to fucking carpet bomb entire cites and respond to nuclear threat with the complete glassing of NK

First Korean saw NK glassed. US dropped nearly as much tons of bombs on NK as they did in the WHOLE PACIFIC campaign during WWII, and USA had Truman and Eisenhower as presidents during the War, you cant be implying that Trump is tougher than those two. glassing NK doesnt ensure victory.

First Korean War*

>insert no troops
>glass best Korea
>...
>wait for counterattack
>glass them again
>...
>profit?

And then what? you really think NK leadership would ever surrender from aerial bombardment? Boots on ground will be needed to force them out of power

Who says we need to force them out of power?
Just turn all their troops into hamburger every time they try to advance.

Fuck off Kike

I can imagine morale being too low to take the North, but definitly not too low to defend the South.

Aussie shitposter on holiday, btw don't let the flag trick uou knto thimking I have any idea

Its not like their gonna line up in formation and march slowly to gattle. They have tunnels ans underground bunkers for troop movements and artillery and missiles hidden in mountains and underground. Im sorry your analysis makes it sound like its a video game

Why does everyone always say the South has low Morale? They have the USA on their side, a stronger economy and at least on paper a stronger military than the North If anything they should be high morale

Fuck off English teacher. Morale might be mediocre if South Korea went on an offensive but if North Korea invades South Koreans will defend the country with their life. This isn't any war; if North Korea wins, their entire livelihood is gone. Nobody in my entire extended family, or any other South Koreans that I've met in my entire life, said that they would not defend their country to death if North Korea attacks.

And South Korea's military can beat North Korea alone in a conventional war without US help. Many people tend to forget how large and advanced SK military is.

I am just responding to the first poster.

I dont think the South wants to stump up for North in reunification thouhg

Young people are a bunch of hioster faggots here. They have alot to lose ( more than the oldies) but may be comparitvly soft. National service would hooefully countersct the hipstrr faggotism.

Yeah Kpop fashion kinda made men dress and look like faggots, but most young men and women are nationalistic and xenophobic as fuck.

Bring up Japan, North Korea and to a lesser extent China to Koreans, and see how long it takes before the hornet's nest explodes. Everything is extreme. Korea's Sup Forums equivalent Ilbe is insane and Korea's tumblr "Megalia" are literal men-hating terrorists.

Looks can deceive. Remember when Europeans made fun of Japs by their looks until they picked up weapons?

>comparing 2017 South Korean weebs to the generation of pre-WWII and WWII battle-hardened suicidal fanatical warriors that fought for Japan

No you fuck off kimchisekki

This is a legitimate worry, all these young idiots voting for Moon because muh hell chosun which will give the left the opportunity to give North Korea all the money and shit they want, ending the National Security Law defanging the NIS and destroy the alliance also ruining the economy with gibs bullshit

Sorry Kim but your people are really screwing the pooch on this one

You just don't understand...

Young people voted for Park not too long ago. The shift to Moon was only due to the scandals.

In addition, the younger folks believe that there will be a peaceful solution to solving North Korea. That is delusional, okay, but you forget that if North Korea actually invades, all young South Koreans, with the exception of literal communists, will unify to fight them off.

Also read what I fuckin wrote mr esl. The North Koreans won't try win by fighting. They will instead try to totally subvert society through demoralization and agitation

Yes, because "Hell Chosun" and "do you know Kimchi" memes will cause South Koreans to drop their guns and run away and let North Korea take over because everyone clearly wants that. Fucking idiot.

no, please explain to me, how are South Koreans compared to Jap WWII army? If anything, I would consider North Korean military the modern equivalent of that army, Are SK as indocrinated and brainwashed?

Oh, North Korea will try to win without fighting? Then cross out the "drop their guns and run away" part and my statement is still correct.

my biggest fear is that the chicoms will secretly arm the norks with weapons and materiel. they might even send a few million soldiers into NK dressed in nork uniforms to fight the us/sk/japs.

they could lose millions of men and not bat an eye with their 1.3 billion population.
it would also give them experience and educate them on u.s. tactics and weaponry capabilities if we go to war over the south china sea.

pic unrelated

The North Koreans will work with China to undermine the US-Korea alliance and make South Korea increasingly dependent on China.

China has a vested interest in making South Korea economically weaker as long as it is a US ally, and even if the alliance is broken they have every incentive to try and destroy whatever independence it had (because a South Korea not attached at the hip to China is always a threat capable of becoming attached to a regional enemy or rival of China).

You will never be an independent country. If the US ever loses the will to maintain the (illusory) appearance of it for you by dominating your country, all that will happen is that you will be seized by a rougher master in the form of Japan, China, or Russia.

it's been many decades sicne then and the Norks have been training non-stop, plus they have access to modern military tech

if a bunch of goatfuckers in the middle of the desert can put up a fight against the US military then these guys can definitely defend their homeland for long enough to force a stalemate or a ceasefire

i wouldnt be surprised in the least if China backstabs us, even though Kim supposedly executed all the Chinese puppets in his regime when he came to power, I dont believe for a moment China trusts us or wants us to have a sizable military presence on their border. they like to use NK as a buffer state

Its going to be a cake walk. The North can't defeat 2 modern armies and the world's biggest over budgeted Air Force. The memelords that tell you North Korea could simply flood ROK with infantry play too many RTS games and forget how quickly the US defeated the Iraqi Army in both Gulf wars. The Iraqi military was once one of the top 10 biggest militaries.

They're nuclear. Also have innumerable artillery pieces within range of soul
Seoul. If war breaks out, everybody dies.

DPRK midgets couldn't pour piss out of a bucket. It's literally nothing.

Honestly it depends on where the lines fall.

Will Russia and China use their alliance to back North Korea? Or will the (((imf))) run Chinese psuedo-communists betray their comrades and ruin one of the few free nations left in the world?

I mean sure,the fat kid can say he's gonna nuke us from his base on Mars. I can say I'm the Queen of Sweden.

Same difference.

1. Seoul isn't the only city in ROK

2. Destroying Seoul does not cause the US and ROK military to shut down like the borg from star trek.

3. The Artillery would not be allowed to operate unmolested. They would quickly be destroyed under an hour or greatly crippled in a decapitation strike.

4. The state of North Korean Artillery is considered to not be at a 100% state of readiness. A lot of his has decayed along with munitions having a high dud rate. See: Bombardment of Yeonpyeong

5. ROK can select a new capital such as Busan or Daejeon.

The real question one has to ask is: how many people do the North Koreans have to kill to be retaliated against? We know this number is North of 50 already.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ROKS_Cheonan_sinking

How much higher? 100? 1000? 10,000? 100,000?

And I suspend that in the event of a crippled or ended US-Korea alliance that number would be higher than most of us would suspect.

Could NK be a diversion?

rt.com/politics/387256-declaration-of-war-senator-blasts/

> American bill allowing the US Navy to enforce international sanctions on North Korea through the control of Russian ports is a violation of international law, and is equal to a declaration of war.

>“What immediately draws attention is the list of nations where US congressmen want to have special control over sea ports,” he said. “These are Russia, China, Iran and Syria."

That was during the Barrack Obama I care more about nigger gang bangers in Florida days. President Donald Trump would relish in the idea of going to war with cause.

You'd get a flood of starving people to the south

The Korean War isn't even technically over. War between South and North is just in an armistice, meaning that it's reached peace but not actually out of war.

that's exactly my thinking.
i've been running thought experiments, and i can't think of a single reason why china would actually ally with us against best korea when they could simply pay lip service and secretly undermine our objectives.
even if they get caught doing it there won't be any repercussions; too many of our politicians are bought and paid for by chinks and no one wants to risk a war against them.

North Korea will find it hard to demoralise the South when there is us$10000 per capita difference in earnings and literally nothing attractive about NK life. This difference did not exist during the Vietnam war.

You seem to be unaware that the peak of pro-Chinese sentiment was last summer when Park attended China's military parade.

That all crumbled down when Park was crushed and America and the South Korean military agreed to deploy THAAD. During Park the mainstream media was so afraid of saying anything bad about China that they blamed fish-grilling restaurants for air pollution (when everyone knows that most comes from China) which caused huge outrage.

After THAAD and China's autistic sperging in LOTTE marts, every channel on television now shits on China everyday. Just watched the evening news and they were tallking about how Chinese tourists were so fucking dirty and loud and "we didn't like them anyways." This is the large channel news by the way.

Basically, Korea will not willingly be friends with China. That option was gone long ago. And because Korea is surrounded by large giants, yeah I agree that we're fucked. Park Chun Hee (the dictator) wanted to create a nuclear program of his own to make Korea "truly independent" from every foreign nation (he's giving hints to America) but he was promptly assassinated. Not surprised.

The Japanese are the Aryans of Asia, Koreans and such aren't the same.

There's a difference between being all talk and legitimately being able to fight.

I am nobody. North Korea couldn't carry my balls in a wheelbarrow.

Enough said.

America has the final call on war. America doesn't want a war with China so they tell everyone in Korea sit shut up and sit tight.

>Qt3.14 Korean GF. Spend a lot of time in Second-Best Korea.

The South Korean populace does not support any armed conflict with NK. They want a peaceful resolution to the conflict. They want to talk it out. I estimate this is the common sentiment for those under 35 as a result of social engineering.

They will see America as starting an unwanted war. As trampling on their birthright. Most SK do no 'even think of NK.' Think about it. Every week that goes by, NK threatens something major to the world. This has been going on for years now. The SK are largely immune to it at this point. The populace of Seoul is not worried about NK. Even in southern SK, the populace is not concerned.

As for the last few weeks developments, I do not believe sentiments will have changed. A noticable undercurrent has arrisen to protest the American Military's deployment. It can be expected the proportion of the population that opposes the war will be higher than the population that will support the war. Estimated that around 60-75% of the population is ambivalent, but will, of course, fight when called. The struggles the mountain people have endured in their history gives them a lot of firewood to burn for these sorts of things. Most of emotionally relevent Korean history has been in defence of the homeland against the Japanese. They will not surrender the land like newer, rootless cultures would.

China couldn't carry our balls in a wheelbarrow.

It's not that Koreans love China or anything, it's that they're demoralized and cowed and will be increasingly so in future especially when they realize what they've gotten themselves into. Think about the attitude Hong Kong people have towards China. Angry yes, but impotently and powerlessly so. That's likely the future.

The constant low level resentment towards the US here actually reflects South Korean bitterness about their own weakness.

How do you suppose the US is going to react when Moon starts up all the KDJ and Roh era failed policies again? What do you think will happen when South Korea starts basically interfering in US efforts to actually stop North Korea building ICBMs that can hit the US? And I'm sure we're going to see all that great stuff we knew and loved like the mad cow craziness and base prostests all over again.

Unfortunately for South Koreans America is no longer the 착한 호구 나라 it once was. Many South Koreans used to look on approvingly at how much they could insult and abuse the US and its citizens here and at the end of the day for strategic reasons the US would stay. This may no longer be the case.

And terrifyingly enough the country's leaders now may not actually want the US to stay.

i don't care how it goes
i just want to fight commies when i get there

If by nuclear you mean they'd probably try to fly a plane ww2 jap mircrowaving style over to Seoul and be hit by an a-10 becoming the worlds biggest firecracker then I guess you're right.

Yes because a culture that literally borrowed everything from China/Korea is superior. What wars did they win? They beat Chinese only because Japan modernized several decades earlier. Japan beat Russia because Russians were severely overextended, in a bad shape to begin with and their navy was absolute meme-tier (read articles on it and you will laugh).

South Koreans were the most brutal and efficient fighters in Vietnam. It's basically an East Asian thing.

No need to defend and white knight for a culture that doesn't accept you. Now piss off weeb.

Fuck off esl teacher. Most Koreans are indifferent to the North. However they know how shitty life is in North Korea and don't want to live their or bring that into South Korea.

If China had a choice between having their vassall state on the Korean peninusla run by the South vs their vassall state in the Korean oeninsuka run by the Kim dynasty, they woukd prefer the South. Omly problemmis South is America's vassal.

America out of Korea would be a diswster for the North, funnily enough

I agree. It's not anger inducing anymore, it's just sad. It's just the way things are.

It's not as hopeless as Hong Kong, which China already grabbed by its pussy, but it's dire.

Chinq does not ewual North Korea. America out= Sk deferring foreign and trade polivy to China, not NK ruling Seoul

Continuing, the theater projection is as follows.

America finds an excuse to initiate the conflict. Be it 'one test too far' or false flag that it is most legendary for at this point. Perhaps even a ship will be sacrificed. It is unlikely that a west coast city will be allowed to be damaged unless WW3 is certain and an enormous amount of social/emotional capital needs to be generated for support of the war with the US populace.

The initial fight will be between NK and US. As before, China will get involved and hold the northern territories.

First, they must do so because allowing the west to gain a second colony in the area would be disastrous to China. And open back door to both China and Russia, the pass no longer held back by the mountain, is unacceptable.

Second, NK has perhaps the worlds most abundant non-claimed heavy metal stockpiles. In the defence, some of these resources will be ceeded to China. Allowing the US to gain additional resources for actualy 'hot' WW3 would be unacceptable. And thus they will be defended.

Estimated 15% chance of Russia getting involved, but by that point far greater concerns have entered the world stage.

Estimated wartime duration is between 8 months and at most 3 years. Engagement lasting more than 2 years can be expected to escalate into larger combat.

Both China and the US already have trillions and trillions of dollars in assets prepped for the war inside the NE Asian theater. The participation in this exchange by both powers, down to the full social and logistics levels, indicates a level of reality of the proposition of combat.

NK is a hyper valuable asset for WW3 in both the geographic, political, and resource measurements. It is in the United State's best interest to start major conflict as soon as possible because the dominance of the East in the above areas continues to expand year by year.

If not now, when? And given the necessity of the US to do this to survive, why not now?

What it does mean is decades of watching helplessly as your industrial base is hollowed out while China bulls up North Korea and later forces both states to join together as at best a semi-democratic puppet state (a real one, the kind without the freedom to elect politicians hostile to its ally unlike modern South Korea).

You will end up like a cross between Hong Kong and Cambodia or something. You won't be North Korea or South Korea, you'll be something in the middle. You and I don't know what that will be exactly but we can speculate.

아니 당신 꺼져 이 새꺄

Older folks grew up in one of the poorest countries in the world. North Korea was a huge threat which South Korea could not compete militarily or economically. There was a low-lying sense of fatalism in 1950's-late70's South Korea so people generally had a militant "come over and we'll fuck each other up we don't care anymore" attitude. They had nothing to lose.

Younger folks grew up in a hyper-modernized and much wealthier (compared to NK) country and they think they have everything to lose. Especially because of nuclear weapons, people think they have even more to lose if there is a war. Basically they are hoping that there will be a peaceful solution based on "cmon we're both Koreans" sentiments. Unfortunately, I don't think there will be a peaceful reunification.

But who knows? Nobody expected a peaceful unification of Germany during the height of the Cold War.

builds up* North Korea

Kek I wasn't going for a cuck analogy there, Freudian phoneposting slip

Basically, I don't think wanting to avoid an unwinnable nuclear war = low morale.

It's something else. Would you call America a pussy because it tried its best to avoid a war with the USSR? Maybe some far right extreme Hawks would, but in historical hindsight, most people unanimously believe that avoiding war was a good idea.

Nevertheless, South Korea's leftists are being fucking retarded and they're being too friendly with North Korea.

> Token forces

Tell that to all the men who died on Gloucester hill.

I believe it would be possible for a reunification in perhaps 40-60 years, but too many things stand to change that.

And yes, while the SK have much to lose, and thus fear, even with the modernization they will still fight to the end. SK still has a lot of virtue like that.

NK definitely has the most fight in the dog, though. They would stick around in the shit longer than SK would, some of that is due to the fact they are less advanced and thus are more used to the harshness of life and the realities of war.

I hope we won't be defending your sides again

Thks. Indifference to the fate of NK does not = indifference to the fate of SK

I didn't mention low morale, if you think I did.

In most measures of life, a peaceful outcome is the best ending this story has to offer. Its just unlikely NK won't be plundered long before that option will become available.

And no, theres nothing wrong with wanting to avoid the hell and hellfire of war.

I agree with you for the most part.

If they were nationalist they wouldn't have 1.2 birth rate. Asian countries like south korea must be saved.

yeah whatever, you were just doing your masters bidding go drink tea or get run over by a bus or raped by a paki or whatever it is you lads do these days
I was reading the Korean War history and was utterly SURPRISED that Turks actually fought bravely during the Korean War. Roaches arent useless after all
you should look into writing shorter posts
This.Let me let you in on a little secret: China has always been horrifically inept at war. Theyre literally Arab-Army Tier. There whole history has been a cycle of "China is the next world power omg there is so many of them they have huge army xD" followed by them being completely buttraped in war and their power annihilated and their people enslaved. They spent 2 centuries getting colonized and bullied by like 5 british gunboats on their coast and then were utterly destroyed by Japan in early 20th century. The only Asians who are good fighters are the Vietnamese and Japs up until 1945 before being brainwashed by ((them)) to be panty-sniffing freaks. USA in a one-on-one war would dominate China and win ever battle but end up fucking up politically and losing due to domestic politics

Sorry I mixed you up with the other guy talking about low morale

I figured, and nice digits.

NK loyalty will come jnto question if there is a mere crack in the Kim facade.

Thanks for the concern, brother nation, but South Korea could use a bit less people because there literally are no jobs there. It's a small country with no natural resources and 50% mountains.

After population stagnated for several decades, Japan is now starting to promote births at the government level. SK will do that in a decade or two as well. Koreans won't "die out."

There are a great deal of problems Kim has, personally. After a year or two of war, the cracks in Kim will become apparent. That level of stress brings out all the laundry to dry. If NK 'win's the war, it will not be because of NK.

You thank Turkey for doing less than us in the same sentence that you shit on one of the greatest last stands in military history.

The apple fell far from the tree. This is why I will never lift a finger to help the USA.

you are right sorry i didn't think that, it seems like a nice plan

100% Agree. Korea has almost certainly the most will to survive with the other 2 in the area.

>The apple fell far from the tree. This is why I will never lift a finger to help the USA.

Whatever, your country is literally our buttslave now, if you had any free will I would respect you and your military. If USA jumps, you just ask how high ok. Now, leave me alone with your decrepit irrelevant island that will be renamed New Islamabad in a few decades. We might still save you a THIRD time if push comes ro shove

>You thank Turkey for doing less than us in the same sentence that you shit on one of the greatest last stands in military history.

I didnt thank them. I was just voicing my awe that Turkish forces actually fought well and that for once they were a trustworthy ally. It seems totally random that theynwould commit so much to such a far-away operation.

youtube.com/watch?v=khchqRIPN4U
see you on the battlefield

The majority of the NK soldiers and civilians would be loyal to the end. The regime is doing plus 60 years of brainwashing of the population, they view the kims as gods, the army have a japan ww2 mentality fight to the end, i mean by 1945 it was clear that japan would lose and people would still volunteer to be kamikazes, if the north is good in anything probably would be in propaganda and control of the population. I imagine that north korean holdouts woul still cause trouble decades later of the conflict.

Basically, Koreans aren't having kids simply because they can't afford to have any, not because they don't like children. That's literally what every cousin of mine told me in the past (they all have 1 kids). Population stabilization is long overdue.

Well, I intend to go over there and put down a good couple myself. Lets get this started, folks.

But what's the use of propaganda to the average North Korean if they are starving and their homes are crumbling?

That's why thousands attempt to flee North Korea every year, oftentimes failing and being executed.

Honestly nobody knows the true morale of North Korea. It's unpredictable.

Yes, and to make it worse. Absolutly everything we know about Korea is filtered through the MSM's lens. Everything.

Well good talk with everyone here. I have to study for shit now

hmm my IP changed when I came back to my home. lol