I seriously do not understand Sup Forums's opposition to an EU army

The idea of an EU army is as follows:

A. each member state selects one or more battalions (1500 to 2500 men) and makes them "EU battlegroups"

B. these EU battlegroups have certain standards and must be deployable abroad within a few days

C. in case of a military invention abroad that the EU countries get involved with, the EU member states which want to take part, can then offer their EU battlegroups for deployment

D. the coordination between the EU member states on procurement of military equipment, while on deployment and in training exercises are done by an EU military headquarter where military generals from all EU member states can meet.

How is any of this bad? It is absolutely sensible stuff.

Germans will be made to repress Italy, Italians will be made to repress France, French will be made to repress Germany. An EU army kills nationalism.

same reason as anything else when it comes to consolidating stuff: the lessening of a country's sovereignty, individual choice & varieties. This dream is sold as being all about "diversity" when the reality is mass consolidation is the ultimate antithesis of diversity. And the endgame, ultimately, of course = one world government/NWO. No thanks.

>an army ran by appointed functionaries who have already set out to replace the native populations of Europe with actual garbage
what could possibly go wrong?

And all of them are commanded by unelected officials who are ex-rothschild bankers.

On paper
>Everyone contributes to the greater good for Europe
In practice
>France, we need you to send your people to die in Syria for us.
>France, we need you to put down the Croatian revolt
>France, we think you should keep your soldiers stationed on the border with Russia
>France, we think you should get rid of your nukes before your ingrate people elect the wrong candidate and ruins things for Ger-All of us.
>France, we're putting soldiers in Paris.

Why would italians repress french tough? other than the ''muh soldiers only follow orders without thinking''

you krauts only want to create "EU" army so you can use it against us because we don't want to take your retarded refugees

Pretty much this

1. That already happens
2. We don't accept Merkel or Germanistanis as leaders of the EU.
3. Fuck off cuck

> German

Every fucking time, do you cunts never give it a rest?

Stop trying to make us pay for your army.

You lost son? We're anti-federation, pro-democracy. Why would we want to give more power to the "one solution fits all" failure that is the EU?

Saupreiss
kys
please

Isn't that what the FFL is for

tfw most people don't realise if it wasn't for the massive financial might of Germany half of the countries in the EU would be poor and shitty as fuck. Also I aprrove what was earlier said, France is too solicited in military stuff, but nuke codes are nuukes codes... you dipshits think the president only has to push a big red button on his desk?

If it weren´t for the EU, Czechia would be the richest slavic country

>How is any of this bad? It is absolutely sensible stuff.
So was the initial idea of the EU and we know how that fucking end up. Why the fuck would any self respecting country hand over the lives of their soldiers to fucking ghost bureaucrats who are giving commands from a fucking non country that has issues of ghettos filled to the brim with goat fucking terrorists.

Why does the EU need a fucking military in the first place? That should've been the first fucking question and not "what's a big deal"

Pay NATO debts

richest slavic country, I think there isn't much concurrence in that domain no?

Fuck off you German cunt.

Well, kinda, but without Russia´s gas, we would be all fucked during the winters

Because shitty countries will steal the french army and we can enter into war we don't have any interest to do it. Secondly now he have another cuck in office, we need to keep our army the last patriotic institution we have.

You left out the part where everyone is beaten back and they beg for US intervention.

everyone in eastern europe relies on ruski gas, it isn't that much of a shame man

Black people aren't even human

US intervention, like there is no oil in the EU, why would you start an "intervention"

There is no geopolitical reason for it
It's a step towards federalization, which no one wants
can you imagine the astronomical costs of maintaining further, useless bureucracies

Well Churchill and France begger the US to join their war in WW2 and the US formed NATO knowing Europeans couldn't handle an actual Soviet invasion soooo... not to mention that whole last-minute pointless WW1 join in... and that wasting time fighting the Domino Effect when the French left Vietnam. Do you really think Iraq posessed a lot of oil? Out of every middle eastern nation that produces oil?

This.

Everytime its a kraut flag.

Fucking dying for kike loving un-elected pieces of shit, like Guy Verfhosfdat. Id rather die for dog shit than any EU-loving piece of shit.

Where are you getting this from jerry? I've only ever seen people talking about an EU army, never actually outlining how it would work.

Are you going to force all the current defense freeloaders to actually contribute a proper share? Are you going to force the current military powers to give up control of parts of the military they have maintained? How will units from many different nations coordinate effectively with each other? What language will be used? Can you even convince enough people to potentially lay down their lives for the rather than their own country? Will the people of europe be happy with an eu army running around doing whatever the fuck the commission wants with zero accountability?

>create army
>draft in poor leeches from the shittiest cities
>soldiers with no national loyalty
>soldiers loyal only to who pays them
>the bankers and EU oligarchs use this army to crush the ones who resist.
>deploy plebs from the east to crush civil unrest in the west
>deploy your plebs from the west to crush rebellions in the east
>replenish your ranks by importing more 3rd world shitkins to fuck the locals and create a mixed race with no notions of national pride or heritage

Fucking sinister

>I seriously do not understand Sup Forums's opposition to an EU army
>The idea of an EU army is as follows:

>A. each member state selects one or more
>battalions (1500 to 2500 men) and makes them "EU battlegroups"
Why should Dutch soldiers fight for a nationless government
>B. these EU battlegroups have certain standards and must be deployable abroad within a few days
How is that different from present militaries
>C. in case of a military invention abroad that the EU countries get involved with, the EU member states which want to take part, can then offer their EU battlegroups for deployment
Why is that even needed
>D. the coordination between the EU member states on procurement of military equipment, while on deployment and in training exercises are done by an EU military headquarter where military generals from all EU member states can meet.
Again why
>How is any of this bad? It is absolutely sensible stuff.
Because nothing is stopping us from doing all that without EU regulation

You can work together effectively without this, this Will end up in these battlegroups answering to Brussels before the Nations that appointed them, how is that desirable

That makes me sick to read

because the EU is run by crazy fucks that want to replace you with an 80 IQ worker race

how fucking retarded are you Germany

>Because nothing is stopping us from doing all that without EU regulation
Prisoner's dilemma is stopping us. Most countries in Europe give a fuck about military readiness. Everyone tries to rely on others. And then every single member states is trying to duplicate ALL functions of defense. That is why Europe is so weak militarily.

With the EU battlegroups, each member state would be required to have one or several EU battelgroups ready to go. Some would be mountain forces, some infantery, some tank units, some airforce, some navy, some marines etc. But currently, most countries just try all of these at once, resulting in no capabilities at all for the most part.

P.S. this has nothing to do with EU regulation and is just member state coordination

1: It strips power away from the individual member nations of the EU and prevents them from effectively projecting force or acting in their own interests or defense
2: It forces the nation to be subservient to a higher power for the purposes of self defense
3: It both removes their military power from their own control and threatens the consequence of a much greater foe if they attempt to leave unilaterally, since the entirety of European military might is now united under one cohesive directive
4: It enables the EU to create a USSR style system where troops can be garrisoned in foreign lands: the French in Germany, the Germans in Italy, the Italians in Poland, the Belgians in Greece, etc. By this method they fill their member states with foreign soldiers that hold no love for the country they're in, thus lessening the possibility of defection and unified resistance--if Poland attempts to leave, the German troops stationed there can swiftly take control of the country or at least contest it, while the Polish troops are stuck in, say, France, and thus utterly surrounded in the event of conflict. In this manner it becomes not a defensive alliance but an occupying force.
5: It forces soldiers from many different nations, with differing equipment, training, languages, and cultures, to attempt to work in concert as a cohesive unit. Without standardization of language and equipment, this makes an EU army sluggish, incoherent, and saps both effectiveness and morale due to lack of cohesion or common bond. The reason the United States military doesn't suffer from this is because the United States army shares a common language, culture, and equipment standard. To attempt this with the culturally distinct members of the EU would either lead to homogenization and subjugation of the member states or abject failure.

Tl;dr, it sounds nice on paper and gives you nice fuzzy wuzzy feelings of mutual defense and common brotherhood but what it's likely to actually amount to is a boot on the throat of each member state, threatening war with a monolith of a military with their own out of position should they attempt to disobey the central authority, and a requisite erosion of culture, individual identity, sovereignty, and individual military might to go with it. It's a gilded cage. However small it may start, it sets a dangerous precedent and will inevitably slide toward further EU control of each nation's military, and thus their destiny. It will not stay small. It will grow until everything is consumed and each member state cucked in turn. Then there will only be the will of the EU. The nations inside it will be nations no more.

...

>pictured

> It's a german eu thread

>join army to defend your country
>fight alongside bretheren for a cause ou believe is righteous
>fuckhead academy officer selects you to be transferred to EU battlegroup
>get sent to country that is not threatening your homeland or you value system in any way
>die while being castrated alive by shitskin farmer in Bumfukistan
>family receives letter signed by merkel

no.

Eu is compromized by das jüden ins Brüssel, how hard is it to understand fucking kraut. There is no way back if we allow EU with a independent (((agenda))) militarize no matter how sensible the intent its gonna get abused and muh world politzei aus Brüssel mit diversity. No new brexit will be able to happen, no alternative fuck no

thats the idea! :D

The only purpose of an EU army is to make each country less self-sufficient and more reliant upon the EU, making it more difficult to leave.

And, if the EU does not collapse, then in a hundred years you'll have this happening. The EU is an aspiring communist superstate, nothing it desires can be good.

the EU already has an army

muslim immigrants

this german EU shilling has reached insane levels in the past 2-3 months.
i honestly wouldn't be surprised if they're paid to shill on Sup Forums.
wouldn't be the first time it has happened after all

Army to quash nations who don't follow the orders from eurocrats.

also
What do you need an army for, when you've already sold all your clay to foreign powers.
to suppress the native population when they eventually rise up?

Denmark are not part of any EU battle group so it only happens for some of the members.

kys Tysker

>Needing the EU to do that
How about your fucking governments man the fuck up.

Germs are the leafs of EU

>How about your fucking governments man the fuck up.
What in 27 parallel structures duplicating everything is a problem don't you understand?

One corollary I want to follow up on: standardization of equipment.
This will happen one of two ways. The first (much less likely) option is that the existing designs from each country will be examined, tested alongside each other, and the most effective among them will be slated for production and distribution amongst the entire EU. Research, in this model, continues much the same--collaborating or competing design teams from different member nations attempting to create the best possible equipment for the EU overall. This has the potential for infighting, corruption, and playing favorites by nation--but is still the better choice all things considered.
The other option is that one country--in this case we'll take Germany--demands that all other member nations conform to their standards of military equipment and doctrine. Not only will this breed resentment, but unless production of the standardized equipment is decentralized and spread among the member nations, it means that one country will:
1: Have complete control of the production and distribution of armament, ammunition, and materiel,
2: Become a money sink for other nations who are forced to purchase and adopt this equipment at whatever price the producing company or EU demands,
3: And make them completely reliant on that member country for the supply of their vehicles, armament, and other equipment--thus making it impossible for them to effectively wage a sustained war against it in the case of secession.
This is undeniably the worst option.

I do not want an oppressor army

Yup

EU is dead, keep your cuckiam and refugees to yourself.

glad you mentioned that.

the EU army will function as the FFL.

You can form multinational battalions without EU, like we did with the baltic battalion

>You can form multinational battalions without EU, like we did with the baltic battalion

That is not the point. Multinational battalions are incredibly shitty. What you want is state battalions solely made up of one state's soldiers. BUT, coordination among states, so that each state doesn't have to duplicae each and every function by itself.

THE. EU. IS. NOT. A. LEGITIMATE. GOVERNING. INSTITUTION.

IT'S NOT EVEN A LEGITIMATE STATE AND AS SUCH HAS NO RIGHT TO A ARMED FORCE FOR ANY REASON. EVEN AN ARMED POLICE FORCE WOULD BE OUT OF THE QUESTION, LET ALONE A FUCKING ARMY. WHAT ABOUT THIS DO YOU EU KEKS NOT UNDERSTAND?!

I am so mad about this, I could burst. How the fuck are Europeanists unable to grasp this simple concept? Sure, a unified economic management overhead might be a good idea, but that is literally ALL the EU has the right to FUCKING BE. Everything thing else it is, EVERYTHING ELSE it claims to be, it is ONLY by the permission, recgonition and MERCY of its member states. MEMBER. FUCKING STATES. They're not even constituents, because nothing in the EU's "governance" system is absolutely binding to the states it is composed of because it is in no way connected directly to the CITIZENS of said states that give the government of these states its political legitimacy WHICH THE EUGH YOO DOESN NOT FUCKING HAVE.

SHIT!

The EU isn't even a legitimate "governing institution", that it is trying so hard to pretend to be, IN THE PRE-WESTPHALIAN sense, because it didnn't even: 1.conquer its "acquired territories" through war, 2. Depose the current leader AS EU, 3. Form anti-government cells within each member state to wrest governance from the previous government through a) violent or b)peaceful means. It did none of this! For the last time, the EU is not a system of governance, but a set of AGREEMENTS! To claim to be one would be sinister, political machination at best and a TREASONOUS POLITICAL CONSPIRACY AT WORST.

tldr: IT IS NOT A STATE. IT DOES NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO COMMAND, LET ALONE IMPOSE ARMED FORCE, CIVIL OR MILITARY.

You could just spend more on defense.

Because it's sole purpose would be monitoring face book for "hate" content.

^__^

you can have your Army after you pay America

Thats the way baltic battalion functions, each country gives a company (and us more because Lats and Lits arent even trying)

That is the case at the moment, but the EU is intended to eventually become one country, with the previous nations remaining in name only.

Is this image based on an actual thing or what?

>You could just spend more on defense.
How can a country such as Denmark or Ireland or Austria or Latvia or freaking Luxembourg spend enough to have a military with any strike force.

Why does America not have 50 different armies?

We do fuckstick. It's called the National Guard.

We should honestly just end the EU and divide Germany into a French, Polish and Swiss protectorate. The moment they get any tiny amount of power they instantly have to take it to the biggest extreme and ruin things for everyone else.

>We do fuckstick. It's called the National Guard.

I am not arguing against EU states' having a National Guard. I am even saying 75% of all soldiers int he EU should just be National Guard. I am saying that 25% should be EU army.

We have 54 national guard organizations Ahmed.

>Germany calling the shots
What could go wrong?

You can start by using european soldiers in your pic and not American soldiers.

>I seriously do not understand Sup Forums's opposition to an (((EU army)))
>The idea of an EU army is as follows:
>DO NOT OPPOSE (((US)))

Or you can just not fuck with any loss of sovereignty and cut bureaucracy by having each nation have their own militaries and sign treaties and pacts. But it's not about collective dsfense for the EU. It's about control

>54
where do the additional 4 belong? one is probably DC.

Nobody's going to go and get shot at in the name of a dysfunctional political union with no common culture.

third world war time?

Just buy off some blue hats and African Union troops. Give them some farmland and have them train anti-piracy and border control on it. Call that the EU rapid urban enrichment deployment force or whatever and when you get sick of them ship them off to the Korengal Valley or whatever.

I mean how expensive could it be?

Okay, fine, but give yourself some legitimacy first. To put this more harshly, cede the right to elect their representatives to the individual citizens you want to govern over.

But the EU has not fucking done this, nor is there any sign that they plan on doing this any time soon. There could have been some whispers about this when people worried about granting Eastern European states membership status. There could have been discussions about this when Greece was having debt troubles. There could have been splinter groups in the EU parliament there seriously considered this when it became apparent that migrants were the source of many social problems that are doing the citizens of its member states direct harm. THERE COULD HAVE BEEN A REAL PUSH FOR THIS WHEN BRITAIN SECEDED ALTOGETHER.

Intead, what do we get? Not a single fucking peep. I am so done with giving EU the benefit of the doubt. I have been following the news all these years, with the express purpose of spotting even a single real instance of them wising the fuck up and understanding that their real problem, ONLY real problem is one of legitimacy, but I saw no indication that they have, or ever will. This is coming from someone who even now think the EU has probably done Europe more good than harm, but the scale is already starting to tip to the other side and will continue to do so inevitably unless EU wake the fuck up and DEMOCRATIZE THE FUCK UP. Fuck the EU. If this continue, the EU WILL break, unless they change before it is too late.

Wake up you dumbasses, it's just a money laundering scheme to get more funding into military equipment. It's all about money, it's not ideological, at least not entirely.

>t. uncle is a brigadier working for Nato.

When there's a reason for you all to work together you've not had problems making coalitions. ISAF worked out just fine. NATO is working just fine.

Territories.

One for each state plus US territories. They can be Federalized by the president which is how you see them in Iraq or Afghanistan. However in conflicts like Vietnam and I believe WWI they stayed home.

Hmm. An armed forces controlled by an unelected group of elites.
I can't see the problem either

I think it's like Guam, DC, Puerto Rico and Virgin Islands. Half my basic training unit was dudes from Guam. They sent over 2 full companies in the same cycle. Fuckin weird.

the problem is that it wont be a army to defend or attack someone else, it will be a police to make sure there are no anti-eu revolts

...

it's not because France has nukes that it's a powerful country faggot

...

...

The EU in it's current state absolutely cannot be allowed to have a military, or the cement will dry, so to speak. The EU will be around forever in that situation.

But in a hypothetical scenario wherein the EU undergoes serious reform and reconstruction, it would be a wonderful idea and a great way to take some of the burden off of NATO (and by that, I mean the US).

...

>The EU in it's current state absolutely cannot be allowed to have a military, or the cement will dry, so to speak. The EU will be around forever in that situation.

A military won't save the EU from the next Eurozone crisis, and it sure as fuck won't stop Greece pulling out when it finally defaults.

Yes it is. It's one of two European countries (unless you count Russia) with nukes.

Well it's certainly not because of your conventional arms.

Because we're getting pretty fucking sick of footing a large part of the bill every time you schnitzel munchers try to put the entirety of Europe under the control of a single military.

>USA and England mostly concerned about a potential EU army
>not even members of the EU
>wtf I love the EU army now

is each battalion under the command of a centralized general, or a general comes with every battalion which would result in a cluster fuck?

Its not going to work

German soldiers are drawing swastikas on French barracks and shit

Europe can't get along and should be nuked.

>Giving control of an army to a pseudo-government that cant even be voted out of office if they start acting up
No thanks