Automation/Robots

How will capitalism survive when more and more things become automated?

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By building and servicing robots. Duh!

Ethno-nationalism + one child policy.

You kidding me? Producing more things faster and cheaper while saving thousands on labour costs? How will they survive?

Worker hours will go down, you'll see more and more 'gig' roles and companies will run leaner and leaner in terms of actual permanent employees. Automation will partially offset the drop in income by being able to reduce the cost of goods, the actual standard of living will go down, but not fast enough to trigger mass social unrest. After a generation or so, education will have adapted to the point where people are adequately trained for jobs within the new economy and the decline will level off.

There's still plenty of useful gigs that robots won't be able to do economically for a few more decades. It's a bad time to have kids though for sure.

How will we survive without automation.

It won't. All signs point to capitalism ending and something closer to socialism taking over.

All the major innovations in society have moved us closer to that point. Society is a collective, once there is no advantage to not supporting everyone we will.

It's going to be gradual though, not over night.

That's another angle to look at it from. We either go forward or we regress.

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Once we get robuts that can build our own houses and cook and clean for us we won't need most of anything.

>h-how will capitalism survive the industrial revolution
>h-how will capitalism survive the technological revolution
>h-how will capitalism survive the robotic revolution

Gee I dunno, maybe the same way it survived all the other "revolutions"? There will be jobs building, programming, and maintaining the automatons that perform manual labor. Plus there are still tons of jobs that cannot easily be automated.

We hit the point when a standard income has to be provided that allows the populace to live a comfortable life. Otherwise the many will rise up and destroy the few, and the cycle will start anew.

In a way it's a singularity of sorts; eventually it will happen, the best we can do is delay it.

Wrong leaf.

Fucking commie faggit. Your socialist ideals do not apply once the labor is provided by the ai and robots. It's capitalism with higher living standards to the point where you won't be requiried to work in a lot of shit fields. Nobody is seizing the means of production here closet Marxist commie asshole. Day of the rake is coming for you

Don't say that goy! We need universal basic income. UBI is the only way to completely automate everything and still turn a profit uhh err I mean UBI will save the poor people. You don't hate poor people do you goy?

>Your socialist ideals do not apply once the labor is provided by the ai and robots. It's capitalism with higher living standards to the point where you won't be requiried to work in a lot of shit fields.

How do you get "higher living standards" if the jobs are taken by robots you dumbass?

it wont.
youtube.com/watch?v=7Pq-S557XQU

Those who rule will own the machines will go to the next stage and it will be over for everyone else. You have 30 years to graduate, if you are lucky you will survive :D

Don't know, man. Those bloody blooms will surely bring socialism to power.

They pay you so you don't kill everyone because every job has been taken by AI.

We go to SPACE!

You're aware that all those jobs are specialised and need both education and a human IQ ?
You're also aware we're importing by the truckloads lazy one digit IQ subhumans ?
What then, kikeslave ?

Personally i don't care, there'll always be a stockmarket so i'm set for life. But you, wageslave, what will you do ?

redpilled comic about this.

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We revert back to exploiting minorities like we used to do?

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True capitalists will find a way to flourish like they always have and physical labor bottom feeders will starve in the streets as is proper.

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But we'll also have robots to do that

give robots minimum wage
have robots pay taxes
new slave class

Why ?
What for ?
Why not slaughter them all ?
What do subhumans bring to the table ?
What have they done for the world ?
Are you a nigger yourself ?
Maybe just a neurotic kikes that can't take care of itself, which is why you keeps blabbering about muh slaves ?
Why do you need slaves, why can't you take care of yourself, why can't you work like a human ?

Are you a woman ?

For fuck sake

>Whoops! I've gone past my stop! i forgot this car is moving 300 miles an hour!

Fucking died. take that, hyperloop!

or they can just tell the robots to kill you

It won't. We have two options:

1) The government invests in automated labor, and the public then gets a share of the profit generated by that labor.

2) The population declines dramatically.

The comic isn't about real life
It's about video games
>press x to do some cool shit and win the game
>all the player has to do is sit back and watch the white girl kiss the buck nigger in the finale

If they've advanced to the point of not needing 90% of the human population then they aren't far from the AI realizing it doesn't need the remaining 10%.

no economic model will be able to work when everything gets taken over by robots
communism doesn't work when there's no labor to be rewarded

but there are only two options when it comes to robot labor
1. because robots do everything cost of labor is no longer an issue and everything is made/collected with very little cost aside from robot maintenance, assuming all the robots have unlimited energy or very advanced solar tech
because robots mine all the metals we need and drill all the oil to make plastic and cut all the wood and farm all the plants everything will eventually become free for everyone and no one has to work anymore as robots do everything for us
everyone becomes rich and lives a great quality of life
(of course this model won't work if the human population isn't drastically reduced)

2. robot labor displaces the majority of humanity and only the very few rich (0.0001%) benefit from robot labor while human workers do only the jobs too dangerous to risk damaging expensive robots
the rich not wanting to allow robots to work for everyone took control of all the world's robots and made them work only for them
most people are left to fend for themselves in communities with little to no means to acquire any resources that isn't collected by the robots and live in squalor
while the rich live in shining bright cities and ignore all the rest of us

It will be no issue as long as we expand to Moon and Mars and around the immediate space.

What happened to all that?

Why can't we just move more towards a Technocracy and just start using common sense? Please, get rid of this fucking cancerous religion AND liberalism/extreme conservatism. Extreme consumption is a bad thing. Climate change is real. We need to move towards a more sustainable/clean energy source. We need to put limitations on births majorly world wide. The world needs to be converting to a single language gradually. We need to take off limitations on genome research and make major medical breakthroughs that will end birth defects. etc.

Please, let's just start doing the reasonable thing. No, God doesn't exist and no, there aren't any more than two fucking genders. All of you extremists on both sides of the political spectrum need to relax and start thinking rationally.

Millions will lose jobs. Middle class will be destroyed. The manufacturers and multi-million corporations will completely hold monopoly of the market.

Robots will kill capitalism.

So socialism finally works when you take humans out of the equation.

And how will we get there ?
With the nigerian space program ?

Nah, the US and the EU leaves all the poor countries to fight over ruined Earth.

Socialism was never meant for humans.

Capitalism only prevails when there are competitions. You can't put a human in a race with a car.

Then we tap argent energy and get ass fucked by demons.

Nah, an ubermensch will arise and slaughter all the subhuman demons, it is foretold.

Energy costs go up as a result of peak oil extraction.
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Robots stay uneconomical since they have a ludicrously high embedded energy.
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Nuclear war.
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10,000 years of agrarian life, at least.

We can prevent this, but our narratives have gotten too out of control for people to see that it's even a problem. "technology will solve it! it always does!"

You have to take into account that your average worker is 100 IQ. Which is too stupid to work as an engineer. And manufacturing robots and repairing them? That's the job of robots. Not even the engineering jobs are safe. One day, sooner than anyone would expect it, AI+robots can do the designing better, faster, cheaper, nonstop. Companies will consist of only the owner/CEO and the robots.

I wonder why this topic gets so little attention. There will not be ''new jobs'', this is not the industrial revolution where human muscles got replaced with machines, leaving us to do the fine motor skill tasks and thinking tasks. The automatisation revolution will replace both fine motor tasks and thinking/creative tasks with AI and robots. And believe me, they will. Not a single job is complex enough that a sufficiently advanced robot wouldn't be able to do it. Not-a-single-job.

What do you have to offer to employers, when everything you can do can be done better by robots? Start thinking realistic instead of optimistic.

It's going to be existential crisis at the very least when sheeps don't have their daily work routines anymore. I wouldn't trust on the good-will of rich people for a fair basic income.

So "Paco and Ahmed's adventure - IN SPACE" ?
Seems realistic :DDDDD

>God doesn't exist

This is a positive statement, and hence requires evidence.

Frankly, i hope there's a nuclear war around 2040.
At the rate it's going, i will never get it before the others.
Even if they also put contingencies in place, i'll be better placed to get back on my feet first.

youtube.com/watch?v=sjAZGUcjrP8

Fucking amazing. God bless Capitalism. This video should bring a joyful tear to any mans eye.

Because technology follows a sigmoid curve.

We are here. Note the flattening out. That is diminishing returns. That is why your car does not get 200mpg, that is why we still use steam power, that is why the concorde is a relic, that is why we don't live in space, etc etc.

Exponential technology is just nonsensical. The are only four fundamental forces and a very limited amount of phenomena born of them. We didn't invent fire, electromagnetism did.

Likewise we are fundamentally bound by what limited phenomena exist, and moreso by what phenomena can exist at the extremely low energy levels called "room temperature".

We're just egotistical because electromagnetism has a shitload of uses. Relatively speaking we barley even use the other three forces. They're total shit.

Don't let yourself be fooled into accepting a revised god of the gaps argument.

>why the concorde is a relic,
PAIN

>the concorde is a relic
Rude, i didn't insult your whore of a mother.

Neither capitalism or socialism will be around when everyone is looked after by robots.

Social issues will be the main thing.

>more marketing bullshit
if anyone here isn't an idiot, here's a redpill: the people pushing the "automation" line are primarily marketing experts at companies like tesla. they're using "automation" as a buzzword.

really tesla is the primary group pushing this. they can't secure enough debt to expand, so they need to attain funding through their investors. they can't get enough funding through them (which is a big statement considering fucking google is funding tesla), so they need to raise money by selling stock.
this requires very high stock prices, so musk has built a cult of personality to drive tesla's stock price through the roof. his main selling point for tesla is "it's the car of the future!", and his stated game plan for making tesla into a large company is "we'll use vertical integration and automation to make lots of cars!", which is a completely meaningless statement. every large company uses automation (have you ever seen an assembly line? when was the last time you saw a conveyor belt powered by a bunch of people pushing around a big cog? have you considered that even the conveyor belt itself is automation, even if it's manually powered?), and vertical integration is just making a bunch of stuff in house, which itself has a bunch of problems (which tesla will start to see soon, their bullshit about doubling the world battery production for the model 3 will fall apart when every other battery producer runs circles around them and they're stuck with aging factories and a decade long agreement with panasonic to not change anything).

if you want to do something fun, go to the futurology subreddit whenever you see threads like these. 95% of the time the OP has ripped the article directly from reddit, and will use arguments devised by redditors whenever you get into arguments with them.

>that is why the concorde is a relic

there's nothing wrong with the concorde, it's just that nobody wants to use it because of the PR disaster when it inevitably explodes and kills people. do you know that the 747 has it's odd shape because they intended to convert all 747s into freighters once the concorde and other supersonic passenger aircraft took over the passenger market?

You've no idea the depths of my sorrow for the future that will never be.

Well shit i just noticed i forgot the image.

I didn't say anything about exponential technology. We don't need that for 95% of workforce soon becoming obsolete. They don't even need to automatize 100% of all jobs before a massive social crisis will emerge.

Some warehouses are already being automatized where I'm living. Self-driving trucks are already a reality. It's coming, just wait for it. Expecting all people to work is a thing of the past.

What odd shape? It's extremely well designed to be efficient.

>s to use it because of the PR disaster when it inevitably explodes and kills people.
That's not really it.
The reality was the ticket was too expensive.

Let's say I'm x years 100% of the jobs are taken by robots. They program, farm and mine goods, ship goods, and build other robots. Even governments and the justice system is completely run by AI. There is no need for any humans to do any work.

At this border case, humans need only to survive and enjoy themselves. Food, housing, and entertainment are freely provided to humans. Socialism exists because humans cannot demonstrate themselves as useful to society (or more useful than a robot running on 90% efficiency and 100x the speed) than other humans. Any humans who do work will get more free shit than those who don't.

You wanna make a guess at the cumulative total amount of energy that humans themselves use to keep the lights on every day?

7.1 billion people now. Most are children or too old. 3 billion at least in jobs from what i can find.

How much energy does an average person output on a 3000 cal diet in a day? About 3.5 kilowatt hours.

Sum it up. You're looking at adding 10.5 billion kilowatt hours to the global demand to power the robots. That's greater than all of our nuclear capacity.

We've enough energy problems, thanks.

You didn't go into the part where the 0.1% owns 99% of everything, and suddenly it becomes a socialist heaven where everyone gets what they want. For arguments sake, why would the owners want to keep around 8 billion people, just wasting resources with their useless life? A manufactured pandemia or nanobots or whatever could be done to wipe out world population to

That's not true either. What killed it was that, despite making a profit, you could sell those same people first class tickets in a slower plane for a greater profit margin in more long but skinny routes. Aka, why earn 4% return when you can earn 15% even if you travelled half as fast.

It won't.

post scarcity is literally communism

It's a good thing the singularity is bullshit, or we'd end up with immortal cyborg superfuckingrich nobles hunting normal humans for sport.

No amount of automation can solve the price allocation problem, user. It's known to be an unsolvable problem.

And why do we need so much people around?

When robots are more cost-efficient than humans for a job, that's enough reasons to replace humans with robots. Energy probably won't become a problem, even if no huge advances will be made in that (fusion etc.).

blame the mexicans

By your logic, we wouldn't have arrived at 7 billion people because our economic systems have no use for them. The simple fact is that the large numbers of consumers is what drives demand, and that makes the economy move. Automation hasn't change the rules of economy before and it won't do it now.

>by signing treaties that put our citizens on the wrong side of a border and then we tell them "oh well live somewhere else lol"

I got your bettering right here.

>When robots are more cost-efficient than humans for a job

That will never happen. Biological machines are too efficient.

Because you can't convince people to stop breeding without force, and that's the sort of thing that's likely to get the world blown up.

Uh oh this one again.

Automation has always created more jobs than it's destroyed. It's impossible to predict how these jobs will be created because the technology hasn't come yet. This concern has been constant since the industrial revolution. But for instance, say a cashier is replaced by a robot. You now need a person to maintain the robot, you need someone to write the code. You need people to make the robots more efficient, more friendly, etc.

More white collar jobs will be created, which means a greater need for education, which means education must be more readily accessible.

Please do even a little bit of research before asking stupid questions. Take an economic class maybe?

The workforce will just shift into something else. I'm starting to look forward to it, because it'll mean less jobs for illegals and refugees.

no we dont 'need' that.
People want to do something, achieve something, make something, participate, build, innovate, etc.
UBI makes people lazy, dumb and mot important: it gives them a sense that their lives are worthless, that they cant take care of themselves and need the gov. to take care of them. (like a child).
It will just lead to suicide, poverty and depressian (just like in russia)

You will see a decrease in the demand for jobs requiring more manual work whereas demand will increase for jobs that require a higher education. It isn't that difficult.

Assuming these jobs provide higher wages, this will spur a demand for superior goods/services.

Chakotay

Automatisation has not happended yet, so I wonder how you try predicting the future by looking at the past which is different. Factories and jobs still need humans. But not in the future. It's not the same.

At working your typical jobs? A robot doesn't need to expend any energy on bodily functions, breaks, free time.

So your average 90 IQ female cashier will suddenly learn to write code? Not happening. Also writing code will be automatized to a degree as well. Automatisation creating jobs is just the first phase. Not so much when they get even a bit smarter, and automatisation gets cheaper.

Wars.
As it always did.

>You now need a person to maintain the robot, you need someone to write the code
For every 2 of those you replace 100s of cashiers. Also, in the first and second industrial revolution you got machines that had to be controlled. Now you get whole factories that need minimal supervision.

>More white collar jobs
Only in your dreams. Mundane office work like data management and input will be shrunk considerably. Even in bumfuck eastern europe where outsourcing rules, companies are starting to creep more automation. My office lost 1/3 of the workers in the last 5 years. Then truck drivers, the majority of factory workers, miners, warehouse workers, retail clerks, code monkies and suddenly you get 50% unemployable no-education people in their 30s and 40s that can't compete with the newer generation for jobs.

.>demand will increase for jobs that require a higher education
>this streamlining improvement to office systems destroyed tens of thousands of jobs worldwide but it's ok because we hired 20 more tekkies in Santa Clara. Automation btfo
,

>How much energy does an average person output on a 3000 cal diet in a day? About 3.5 kilowatt hours.

LOL DUDE 3000 calories isn't even a fraction of a persons daily requirement of +2000 KILOCALORIES.

Kilo means thousands

The workforce will adjust, assuming automation continues to impact developed countries, their populations will eventually shift to a more educated workforce. No, your cashier isn't going to become intelligent over night, although their children that are receiving an education will have probably attained a higher education attainment, which will allow for them to work a professional job.

I also doubt automation will affect the service industry. Emotion is usually preferred for hospitality, therapy, etc,

Automatization has already occurred/ is occurring in developed countries. Technology usually spurs the creation of new industries. You are basing your view on the production of goods, whilst not taking into consideration the demand for services.

>At working your typical jobs? A robot doesn't need to expend any energy on bodily functions, breaks, free time.
That's very low compared to the energy costs of doing its job. You can bet that you won't be powering a robot on just 3.4kwh a day. 3.4kwh an hour, maybe.

I had to state kcal? really? I'm trying to keep it legible to most folks.

Are you still cleaning your clothes in a river? Shaping lightbulbs with your breath? Distributing water by carrying it in gourds? Manually fanning your house?

Automation is all around you as we speak, and the fact you don't want to see it as such reveals much of how you arrived to the conclusion automation is some newfangled thing rather than a slow process of freeing people from doing certain jobs for others, all while improving everyone's life while at it.

A robot can do in 1 hour more work than a human in 8 with the same amount of energy, Robots are more efficent.

Many service jobs like ticket sellers have been automatized. Some people actually prefer robot therapists over humans. You're being hugely optimistic that humans prefer humans over robots. Humans prefer low cost first.

Just build more nuclear plants, energy won't be a problem.

Predicting the future by looking at the past again, when they are not the same. I can still compete with robots and offer something on the job markets, but against sufficiently advanced robots, I can't. Nobody can.

>For every 2 of those you replace 100s of cashiers.
>Now you get whole factories that need minimal supervision.
>Predicting the future by looking at the past again, when they are not the same.
both of you cunts obviously have never worked in IT. nothing ever works properly. ever.