Electric cars

Whats your stance on electric cars Sup Forums? Government wants to increase electric cars share. Are they a meme or do you think they'll gain significant market share in coming years? And how will this affect oil economy

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useless for going out of town unless they suddenly start propping up recharging stations

We need battery technology for that. Current li-po batteries used in electric vehicles have shit energy density and are heavy.

I gladly welcome electric vehicles. Electric motors have superior power output and especially torque output to ices.

Plus it slays the oil industry jew, so it's 100% okay in my book

>Plus it slays the oil industry jew, so it's 100% okay in my book
Thats main reason why I want them to get mainstream. It will be pretty interesting how much it will affect oil industry. Tesla has made lot of progress in the battery tech I think? I hope it improves soon

Depends on the cost of gas vs reliability,upkeep cost and accessibility to electric stations.

For example.You buy one of these vs a used car that runs on gas.The used car (older) can most likely be fixed by any competent mech for a decent price or maybe cheaper.One of the new electric cars I would imagine you take to a dealer. Which most diagnostics,at least in my exp,run about 100 bucks right off the bat.

>Tesla has made lot of progress in the battery tech I think?
Tesla relies on government gibs. Everyone else waits for them to use public money to "figure shit out" so the rest can copy and make big buck from it. With this attitude it will take a while.

Electric cars are unfortunately in this mad circle where noone buys them because there aren't many convenient recharging stations and noone builds convenient recharging stations because noone buys electric cars.
Investing in public transport is considerably safer when it comes to financing it.

Electric cars have a place in market. The bad part is more electric cars = cheaper gas, which = fewer electric car sales.

All it will take is a government policy change. They can tax petrol cars heavily making them much expensier and cut tax on electric cars. It won't take long before you have the infrastructure needed for recharging. Main reason I think its not happening as of now is because US government probably doesn't see it as beneficial. They have significant oil reserves and the oil economy makes their military industrial complex much worthwhile, and also giving them "edge" or upper hand while dealing with oil rich countries.

Tesla is a fucking bubble. Get out of it!
Tesla stocks is worth more than GM Motors today, but they only sold 76.000 cars in 2016. On the other hand GM Motors sold 10 million cars last year.
Tesla is a bubble waiting to burst.

Tesla buys their batteries from LG, Sony, and IIRC Tenergy. The "tesla battery tech" thing is mostly a meme although they are trying hard to build their own cell production facilities. It's still just 20+ year old tech though.

Too early I think.
It will make sense once we have a surplus of electricity from renewable energies, but right now it's
>burn fossil fuels to produce electricity
>use electricity to drive car

Great, you added a fucking extra step and thus a loss of efficiency.

Electric cars are the only way to move a country off being reliant on coal generated electricity because during times of low power generation your car can sell electricity from its batteries back to the grid.


with enough electric car density we could have a grid that could run the night on electric cars alone.

I just got drivers lisence and with my budjet there's no chance i can ever afford a ecar. Fml if government starts taxing petrol cars heavily

They are fine for old women who drive to the supermarket and that's about it

t. hybrid owner

But they are our best bet at electric cars though. And they have significant government support, which means if anyone can succeeds in the industry its them. Also aren't they planning an affordable electric car? One that will be made for the masses?

Its not about environment its about getting off the oil. Coal will and is being replace with renevable energies. but that shouldn't mean electric cars shouldn't be build.

They'll make electric cars cheaper at that time. Currently tech is not ready for the push but once USA gets off oil addiction it will get significant boost.

>single speed tranny
>electronic speed limiters
>no turbo blowoff
>no dorito spinner
>nanny features everywhere
>remote kill switches/ecu access
>must have a PhD to wrench
If they come out with a bare-bones model with a minimalistic closed-shell ecu in a Faraday cage and no lsd/traction control, I'll consider having one in addition to my twin-turbo RX-7 FD3S and silvertop-powered Trueno GT-Apex.

Electric/gasoline cars using the same tech as the Mclarin P1 are the future. Electric motors and batteries assisting a gas engine to make it more efficient and powerful are appealing and a delightful evolution. The straight electric car has a very long way to go to become consumer friendly.

I hope I do not live to see the day the last gas station closes shop.

this. new cars are all gay, i don't care what it is or how much it costs. even motorcycles are getting cucked.

They're nice for short range commuter driving, but not good for much else at the moment. We need better battery tech or for the motors that drive them to somehow become incredibly more efficient.

>there are people who want to support the oil jew

Keep buying gas goyim

Resource hungry prestige project for wealthy cityfaga. You still need to waste energy on the production, energy to move a heavy vehicle around. You need rare earth metals for the battery, and for the production of battery if you're using solar.

Electric cars like the picture related are not sustainable and they cannot be a solution for everyone.

Aw hell, guess we'll have to put the trolleys back in and people in the US might actually have to TALK to one another. The end is nigh!

Electric cars are socialist, so they must not be tolerated.

It will never happen, it will be the same as with horses

In fact it will be probably the best time to earn a gasoline car in history. Gasoline will be dirt cheap, all those minor roads outside of cities will be not connected to the grid and so, empty, only occasional hobbyist taking a ride

electric powered vehicles? even more of an issue considering these things chew threw the bills, give it 20 years, by then these cars will have a place in civilisation.

these things move slow, unless California has closed all their petrol stations you don't need to worry

reminder that car companies lobbied their asses off to get public transit gutted in the early to mid 1900s so people would need to buy the jewwagons

Too much time to charge and not much autonomy, 250 km and 30 min to recharge 80%, when yo can charge that for a week or charge that in 5 min or less will worth

it's can run on methane

>buy electric car 4 times the cost
>change battery for a price of a normal car every 3 year
sounds like fun to me

yeah they're not ready to replace cars. Li-Ion is awesome for cell phones, torches and it may also find its way into forklifts. And that's about it at the moment.

Maybe the fuel cell will be used to supply electrical vehicles - the plus is you can store a chemical in a tank rather than needing more microtexture and batterymass for every unit of charge. Of course they also have their problems.

If you take care of your internal-combustion engine like you should, with all the oil changes, transmission fluid changes, brake jobs, timing set, etc., you will be paying just as much if not more. It's a very popular conservative argumentation tactic to pretend that the status quo is free, but it's not.
Electric motors last nearly forever. Electric car batteries also use only the middle third of their charge range to minimize battery stress. I think hybrids are a better idea, or throw a Honda generator in the truck bed and rock on.
Heh, fuel cells... apparently the powers that be want a hydrogen economy. Needs more microstructure

>it's can run on methane

Hmm...

There are other possibilities, for example graphene batteries, or straight out designing a car where you can replace batteries in 10-15 min.

You would just drive to a charing station, and instead of charging your car you would replace empty batteries with full ones. This however would require infrastructure that makes current gasoline station chains look like childsplay

Thats not true and you know it.I didnt payed 1/6 of the cost of my car so far and its 14 years old this year.Its not about the motors - that dont last forever,you know - its about the battery costing more than the whole car, and you HAVE to change them every 3 year or so if you want more than 30% of the original range.

the physical changing of the battery is a workaround, doesn't mean it couldn't go mainstream, but it's not the ideal solution

and yeah if there are better solutions it's always good. The industry is pretty much waiting it out for the time being. They've developed the fuel cell sufficiently to make it possible to revert back to it if you quickly need to and that's about it.

I want to know why is it better to make heavy car with unreliable battery when you can have hydrogen powered cars without drastic changes in the engine or the filling infrastructure.

pointless to power a vehicle from your house when your house power comes from fossil fuels as well.
Until the grid is supplied by clean energy only wind/water/sun
(fuck Nuclear it's not clean if it produces toxic waste that we just hide inside of mountains)
(fuck natural gas, fracking produces toxic waste water which is worse probably than buried nuke juice)

Lol no. They are a minnow, boutique auto manufacturer.

GM tried, nobody wanted the volt
Nissan tried, nobody wanted the Fucking Leaf.
Mitsu tried, nobody wants a Mitsu.

Also, some user did the numbers for Aus and we would have to increase electricity production 6 fold if everyone in Aus had electric cars.

Petrol is cheaper now than when i started driving 12 years ago indo scum.

>fuck Nuclear
>Eternal Pom trying to Jew us out of using the largest uranium deposit known to man
Sounds about right.

Pretty much this, no jeep wrangler electric. Also the good ones or maybe just the meme ones are expensive.

I know it's a workaround, but that's the thing. It's a working solution for NOW, even if expensive to introduce.

No idea man. At this point is probably only a cost thing. Hydrogen cells are fucking expensive to produce.
Toyota Mirai sells in nippon just under 70k american, and experts calculated that Toyota loses almost 100k on every car sold.

But if a company can make electric battery cars cheaper and more efficient, they can make hydrogen cells more efficient and cheaper too.

It's probably a fashion thing. Electric cars have Tesla, and Tesla is a new apple for rich normies.


If anything, F1, and introduction of its technology into current gen hypercars showed that even using hybrid technology can make cars fater, better and more exciting. And fucking prius is still being produced. We live in the age of marvelous speed of technological progress, it probably just a question which direction to take.

Like VHS and Betamax, VHS won because it was more popular, even through it was inferior, it was "good enough" until the next big thing arrived. Or the whole BR vs HDDVD war, that was won beacuse of PS3.

Venezuela has a fuckton of oil to be burned pajeet. Help them and burn oil. You could also drive an electric fagmobile. It still burns oil.

Im not talking about hydrogen cells.Hydrogen burns like natural gas and there are currently vehicles powered by natural gas.

Fucking this applies to entire auto industry

>Great, you added a fucking extra step and thus a loss of efficiency.
Burning fossil fuels in stationary powerplant is more efficient than an engine.

yeah pretty funny really, they try to make the car an idiot proof appliance for kindergarden children. Not sure if I like this trend, after all it's still a car and you still have the responsibility over it.

the cost of batteries will come down as more lithium miners come on line

Once you can recharge the battery for 500 km in less than 30 minutes it will be usable

Currently just smug fathers who buy Tesla driving to work to show off

They're a step in the right direction, the further we move away from Wahabi oil the better.

if they take power away from muslim arabs (through oil money) i support them completely if they have good millage per recharge and arent shiny lemon shitboxes.

I feel like hydrogen cars, with the proper infrastructure, could have all of the benefits of electricity, without the downsides.

>Hydrogen can be produced with water and electricity. A green electricity source means green hydrogen production.
>Cars still use electric motors, which means no transmissions and easy AWD.
>Refuel time is 5 minutes, rather than the minimum 1 hour charge time that Tesla has managed to reach.
>Hydrogen can be produced at a hobbyist level similar to using consumer solar panels to charge an electric car.

The only real problem is that there needs to be refueling stations built for hydrogen, with storage tanks and the like, while electric power is already in place (for the most part). On the other hand, I'm curious if gas stations could just produce their own hydrogen, given utility electrical and water connections, and if it could be economical for such a system to exist.

...

Pretty common around here these days, but it only makes sense as a car number 2 imho.

There are a number of incentives in place like free parking, free on toll roads, charging for free and you can use the bus/taxi lanes.

Hydrogen cannot be contained.

You will still need to change the battery every 3 years or so and deal with the reducing range every day.Its a fucking retarded concept with the design to grab as many cash as possible with the batterys.

Why?There are numerous uses for contained hydrogen right now?Why is it impossible to contain it within a vehicle if there is at least 50 year old technology there to store natural gas?
I tell you whats wrong with hydrogen powerd cars: You can produce your own fuel.

something seems off living in 2017 but still using tech from ~1914

we can go to the moon but cant move a bunch of metal without complicated outdated engines and using fuckton of fuel

I know why is that but you would not b elieve it.

While there's is no tech with 100% efficiency, there will be a lot of loses to produce mechanical energy, convert it in electrical enegry, move electricity to fuel station, "fuel" electric car and convert electrical energy to mechanical.
So, if we imagine simple european country, which changed all it's ordinary cars to electrical analogues there will be huge electricity consumption, which green power sources couldn't handle, and government will need to make more power from common power sources as coal, oil.

let me guess

petrol companies?

>Why?There are numerous uses for contained hydrogen right now?Why is it impossible to contain it within a vehicle if there is at least 50 year old technology there to store natural gas?
Hydrogen is the smallest atom. It fucks right through atomic bonds, even 4 inch thick steel cylinders. That creates huge losses and destroys the benefits and makes the whole thing exceptionally flammable.

>You can produce your own fuel.
No, it's an energy transport mechanism, it's no different from a battery.

Oh,

HIC units have their problems too bro.
They do not produce CO2, and mostly produce chemically clean H2O, they also produce NOx

Storing hydrogen is also a problem. Natural gas canisters already need to be super thicccc and crash resistant because of preassure and danger all those are increased tenfold with liquid hydrogen.

pic very related, reason why BMW 7 HCE experimental did not get much traction

but it is indeed another possibility

No

>You will still need to change the battery every 3 years
The Nissan Leaf comes with 8 year/160k km battery warranty.

If their engines yield equal or more watts per dollar compared to gasoline, then I'm all for them...

Nuclear is the answer

>inb4 BUT MUH NUCLEAR

Impossible to finance. Both from the sheer cost and from "not in my backyard" politics.

The car does. You sure it covers replacing the battery as well?

yes.
but you will also be saving from the engine consumable cost. no more oil changes. no more timing belt changes.
even if i only get 70% range i can still live with it. I cannot remember the last time i used a whole tank of petrol in one trip

>160k km warranty
160k km is nothing if you use the car besides going to shop in the city.
I dont drive much but i get 100-130k a year just running around between forests.

Aw shit ten seconds too slow for this fuck.

Come back with a cost projection, ya mutt.

also there is the fact that used lithium batteries are basically gonna turn into a toxic waste bomb because recycling lithium is 5 times as costly as creating new batteries, so as long at lithium can be mined noone is gonna bother recycling

waste-management-world.com/a/1-the-lithium-battery-recycling-challenge

A FUCKING LEAF

n tesla was proof that beady brit greed does not allow progress. this is all jokes. enjoy your new iphone.

>no more oil changes. no more timing belt changes.

I can do those myself, or if i'm too drunk 100% of mechanics can do it.

Gotta go to a specialist with your juicer.

You just want to believe there will be no maintenance costs to the engine.If it has moving parts,it needs maintenance.Guess how much will the maintenance cost when you are only allowed to open the hood when you have 4 PHDs from the manufacturers school.

and that gasoline is still 13,000 times more energy dense than the best lithium batteries.

I know thats why i think its a retarded cash grab nothing more

you do 130 000 kms a year?
you are in the minority

Yup.

out of sight, out of mind

savetibet.org/temporary-halt-to-mining-after-protest-in-eastern-tibet-the-rush-to-invest-in-tibets-lithium/

>something seems off living in 2017 but still using tech from ~1914

>we can go to the moon but cant move a bunch of metal without complicated outdated engines and using fuckton of fuel

thats false equivalency my brother.
Going by your train of though, we went to the moon using XIII century technology, because thats when first rockets appeared.

Even modern Rocketry started in 1926 with Goddard

We are drowning in electric cars. They are generally a bad investment, as you will have problems selling it later. What you gain in fuel money, you loose in repair costs and parts. You can't really do anything yourself either. They are not efficient enough yet, to be worth it. Takes hours to recharge, and you are fucked if you are going far, and there are no charging in proximity. Also, fucking expensive!

i like the idea but the faggots who buy one are unbearable

i mean look at your picture zero emissions

BULLSHIT.

Their was some powerplant some where that made the energy that your car runs on. Be it coal, gas, nuclear, etc.

If they wanted to use actual science and say a conventional car gets 25 miles to a gallon but an electric car can get charged and run for 200 miles requiring no gas that would get attention but it would not be the attention of the liberals who want to be religious zealots and smugly superior about what car they own. They want to drive around and talk down to everyone because they dont drive an electric car.

FUCK SMUG LIBERALS.

Are you for real? 100k-130k is not even close to being normal. That's what taxi's drive in a year.

Well,if you live all your life in a 20km are in the city,130k seems like much,but in rural areas thats literally nothing, under 400km per day.

>Hydrogen is the smallest atom. It fucks right through atomic bonds, even 4 inch thick steel cylinders. That creates huge losses and destroys the benefits and makes the whole thing exceptionally flammable.
Wikipedia doesn't seem to list leakage as an issue in their hydrogen storage page. If you have a source, I'd legitimately like to learn about this issue. Is it specifically liquid hydrogen that leaks, or gas as well?

>No, it's an energy transport mechanism, it's no different from a battery.
Sure, but anyone with electricity, access to water, access to google, and a bit of time can produce hydrogen. You're still spending energy up front, but you're not paying for fuel from a company.

I dont drive in the city.

>400 km per day

What did he mean by this

>Even modern Rocketry started in 1926 with Goddard

and by 1960 humans went into space

now there are space stations

but cars are basically the same since first ford model

just upgrades here and there but the construction is the same, still burning fuel, still using 100 parts, the only major upgrade was automatic gearbox

You drive for 5 hours a day?

?????????

>400km per day
You drive Budapest-Debrecen and back every day? And you think that's normal?

Sometimes i drive from 6 am to 6 pm,3 hours on the highway 9 hours in the forest

and in 20 years time you'll be stripping down an induction motor.

Tesla Model S accelerates pretty quickly because of instant max torque at 0 rpm and also drives fine. That's about it for electric cars.

Your country is way too much spread out horizzontally.

Here in a 400km radius you can go anywhere.

>under 400km per day.

with average 60km/h thats over 6,5h driving daily

unless you are a professional driver, thats kind much

W-what do you do in the forest?