Does not realize taxation is literally theft

>does not realize taxation is literally theft

What the FUCK?

MUH

ROADS

Taxation = rent.
If you don't want to pay your rent, fuck off the state's property, asshole. There's plenty of unclaimed land in Antarctica. You don't have to pay taxes to anyone there. Get going.

>theft
>after which you receive material benefits

it's not theft, it's racketeering.

So we live in a feudalist society? No one actually owns any property?

Or a payment to a service (army, police, infrastructure).

>Inb4 how do you use the gadsden flag statist

If you're anarcho- anything, you're an idealist LARPer

It's more like extortion, since there is a threat of force if you do not comply.

I hate my commie government so much. Taxes are insanely high in Germany.

Took this today. At least let us decide what our tax is spent on.

Taxationis the price of civilized life, if you want to live in a tax free shithole go to Africa.

Yes

No we don't, you fuck wit. We live in a modern society, and we comply to its modern rules and laws. It might not be what you had imagined the society to be or what it should be, but it's not feudal in any sense of the word. You own property based on your state's definition of owning. If you don't want to abide by these rules, then do fuck off to Antarctica.

only some kinds of taxes are theft

A tax based on rental value or land value is not theft

A tax on wages or interest implies that the income one receives in return for the exertion of one's labor, or for the use of one's capital goods, belongs (at least in part) to others. This conflicts with the basic libertarian principle that you have an exclusive right to the fruits of your labor.

A tax on rent implies that the income one receives for the value of the land one holds belongs to others. Since land itself (1) is not the fruit of anyone's labor, and (2) is that to which all have an equal right of access; and since the rent of land (1) is not a return to labor, and (2) reflects the extent to which Locke's proviso has been violated, a "tax" on rent does not conflict with the principle that you have an exclusive right to the fruits of your labor, but is in fact a just and necessary means of upholding it.

Thus, the part of one's income that is taken via taxation of wages and interest constitutes the enforcement of a wrongful debt, whereas the part of one's income that is taken via taxation of rent constitutes the enforcement of a rightful debt.

i hope this meme dies soon.

Taxes will be spent on removing that

Only after a certain point. Something like 10%, 20% max (including direct and indirect taxes).

It won't. People love feeling like they're being oppressed. They love it more than anything. They would choose that feeling over the reparations they claim they should have and the changes they say should be implemented.

Private firms build roads.
Government just makes money calling them by overcharging since they seem to have unlimited budget.

I want my money to go towards infrastructure, public facilities like parks and libraries. But not fucking socialist programs that infringe on the rights of others.

how are you feeling about the latest captcha?

>fuck off the state's property
so all property is "the states"

Assuming I owned property and I don't agree with the direction the country's going in and I don't agree with the amount the Prime minister or MPs are giving themselves, What do I do? Fuck off to where? Antarctica - you need to be a scientist and have permits and such. Its like the most protected place you can go.

>Not having a Sup Forums Pass
lol, poorfags.

Applying laws without providing opportunity of representation and vote, is colonialism.

>Taxation = rent

if only. Our current system taxes everything but rents. What we need is a land value tax or something that can capture community site rental values and return them to their rightful owners in the form of a citizens dividend

Why the fuck should you have any say in how the state runs itself? It's just a large company on whose ground you happened to be born. Be glad the company seems to have some sort of democracy at all.

When the mob does it, it's extortion.

I don't have a problem with tax but I have the problem with how much
>Sales tax
>Green taxes
>Income taxes
>Sin taxes
>Property taxes

I sat down and did the math and about 60% of my income is taxed at the end of the day. That's absurd. And for what? Seriously, how in the ever loving fcluck is that possible and to run billions and billions in deficits year after year.

You vote or you start killing politicians. Can you stop being anclap now?

I can never believe how many people on Sup Forums defend the state - like it needs defending. Theres more bluepilled brainwashed brainlets on here than there are redpilled "woke" folk. Its embarrassing.

If you like paying an arbitrary price for any service rendered or not, I can send you a bill for this post, right? and charge you "whateer" for reading it, right? I mean according to statists.......

Yes, yes, you work for the government, not the other way around. Very, very good goy

no taxes should be levied on activities consumptive productive or recreational

tax land not man

I break into your house
>Steal thousands of dollars from you
>Come back with $300 worth of groceries and the rest I take as a cut for myself and my colleagues

Is this a LARP?

I fucking hate you leafs with such a passion. Why has no-one nuked your country yet? Even your Nazis are faggots.

It's common sense. I hate you ancaps with a passion as well. I can only take so much stupidity in a day, and I've met my fill today tenfold. Let me spell out why you're a retard: THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A STATE AND A LARGE CORPORATION INSIDE AN ANCAP 'SOCIETY'

ALL the options for voting are the same option, what to do now?

>How to have a totalitarian shithole 101

>waaaaah government waaaaaah aggression

It's not about that you fucking mongoloids. Do you think that snekmen are the only one's on Sup Forums that have figured out that the government sometimes doesn't act in the interest of the nation?

Saying "taxation is theft" means nothing, it's just like.. your opinion man. What you think doesn't matter in the context.

That's irrelevant to the current conversation. We will always have s state, an authoritarian or not.

To add to this I renovated my house and now have to pay more tax because my property value increased due to work I did on it by myself.

You can't even take care of your property without being forced to pay more taxes. It's absurd. How can anyone justify this?

The difference is consent.......

Taxation is the repayment of debt incurred by the government providing infrastructure to raise you and facilitate your birth.

Your parents consented for you by means of having you as a child, and you consent by continuing to live on government owned land.

If you don't want to pay taxes, go to an unclaimed island and establish your own country.

I already said.

since none of you faggots want to talk about how the land value tax and the Georgist paradigm is the best possible tax and only morally just position im going to go ahead and shit post a bunch of benefits of the LVT. Try and refute them

>pro tip
you cant

>Georgeism reconciles common land rights with private tenure, free markets and modern capitalism.

>Those who got the upper hand by securing land tenures would support public services, so wages and commerce and capital formation could go untaxed.

> To pay the taxes, landowners would have to use the land by hiring workers (or selling to owner-operators and owner-residents). This would raise demand for labor; labor, through consumption, would raise demand for final products.

>To pay the workers, landowners would have to produce and sell goods, hereby raising supply and precluding inflation. Needed capital would
come to their aid by virtue of its being untaxed. Thus, George would cut the Gordian knot of modern dilemma-bound economics by raising demand, raising supply, raising incentives, improving equity, freeing up the market, supporting government, fostering capital formation, and paying public debts, all in one simple stroke.

>George's proposal enables us to lower taxes on labor without raising taxes on capital. Indeed, it lets us lower taxes on both labor and capital at once, and without reducing public revenues.

You're a certified retard. Tell me, what consent do you have in an ancap society once all the land there is has been claimed by someone. Where can you go to live by your own rules?

>George's proposal enables us to lower taxes on labor without raising taxes on capital. Indeed, it lets us lower taxes on both labor and capital at once, and without reducing public revenues.

> Georgist tax policy reconciles equity and efficiency. Taxing land is progressive because the ownership of land is so highly concentrated among the most wealthy,'8 and because the tax may not be shifted. It is efficient because it is neutral among rival land-use options: the tax is fixed, regardless of land use. This is one favourable point on which many modern economists actually agree, although they keep struggling against it

>George showed that a tax can be progressive and pro-incentive at the same time. Think of it! An army o fneo-classicalists preach dourly that we must sacrifice equity and social justice on the altar of "efficiency". They need that thought to stifle the demand for social justice that runs like a thread through The Bible, The Koran and other great religious works.

>The only shifting of a land tax is negative. By negative shifting I mean that the supply-side effects of taxing the rent of land will raise supplies of goods and services, and raise the demand for labor, thus raising the bargaining power of median people in the marketplace, both as consumers and workers. This effect makes the tax doubly progressive: it undercuts the holdout power and bargaining power of landowners vis-a-vis workers, and also vis-a-vis new investors in real capital. This effect also makes the landrent tax doubly efficient.

Taxation is not theft

Taxation is the reason why i can literally get free education, health care and no fucking worries abt my life.

However in your (((Welfare State))) they probably choose to spend the money somewhat differently

Taxation is not a theft its the people spending the money that are thieves. fight it for real if you aren't happy with it.

Assuming you dont live in a turd shit country you have the power to go into politics and first of all learn that some of the stuff politicians spend money on is necessary and change those things that aren't

It is though. Why tax men who are simply doing business between two consenting parties and exchanging business. The only tax that should be levied is tax is land which the government "rules" over considering it is on their land. Otherwise you are unjustly taxing production.

>He enjoys being cucked

So you are just going to stand back and let the state do what they want ?

>Taxation without representation is theft

I wish it was mandatory that you graduate high school before you are allowed to post here

>A state, provincial or local government can finance generous public services without driving away business or population. The formulais simple: tax the rent of land, which cannot migrate, instead of the incomes of capital and people, which can. By eliminating the destructive "Wedge Effect", the land tax lets us support schools and parks and libraries and water purification and police and fire protection, etc., as generously as you please, without suppressing or distorting useful work, and without taxing investors in real capital.

> Georgist tax policy contains urban sprawl, and its heavy associated costs, without overriding market decisions or consumer preferences, simply by making the market work better. land values are the product of demand for location; they are marked by continuity in space. That shows quite simply that people demand compact settlement and centrality. A well-oiled land market will give it to them.

> Georgist tax policy creates jobs without inflation, and without deficits. "Fiscal stimulus," in the shallow modern usage, is a euphemism for running deficits, often with funny money. George's proposed land tax might be called, rather, "true fiscal stimulus". It stimulates demand for labor by promoting employment; it precludes inflation as the labor produces goods to match the new demand. It precludes deficits because it raises revenue. That is its peculiar reconciliatory genius: it stimulates private work and investment in the very process of raising revenue. It is the only tax of any serious revenue potential that does not bear down on and suppress production and exchange. As I have noted, George's fiscal policy takes two problems and composes them into one solution.

I don't give a fuck about what kind of a state your hypothetical state is going to be. This thread is about ancaps coming out of the woodwork to demonstrate their retardation for all the world to see.

>free
It costs taxes which cost money. These go into and insanely inefficient and corrupt system because it can, because their is no motive to improve.

This, for most of human history governments have funded themselves through property tax alone

>Pay taxes to cover cost of university
>Literally free

Yea that education is really doing wonders for you

>Get job to not be poor
>Work to get taxed
>Taxes feed those who don't work
>Get pushed in front of train by poor shitskin while on way to work to be taxed to give to poor
>Die

Ayyyyyy.

It never ends with you guys..

If you started questioning the notion of property, would you die? You're a big guy, maybe you could understand what I mean if I said that property is first & foremost a legal concept enforced by the state.

HG gave us the solution the problems of modern society more than 100 years ago.

(((neoliberal economics))) was invented by the elites to stifle george because they knew how powerful the idea is

> George's land tax lets a polity attract people and capital en masse, without diluting its resource base. This is by virtue of synergy, the ultimate rationale for Chamber-of-Commerce boosterism. Urban economists like William Alonso have illustrated the power of such synergy by showing that bigger cities have more land value per head than smaller ones. (Land value is the resource base of a city.) Urbanists like Jane Jacobs and Holly Whyte have written on the intimate details of how this works on the streets. Julian Simon (The Ultimate Resource) philosophizes on the power of creative thought generated when people associate freely and closely in large numbers. Henry George made the same points in 1879

>Georgist policies encourage the conservation of ecology and environment while also making jobs, by abating sprawl. It is a matter of focusing human activity on the good lands, thus meeting demands there and relieving the pressure to invade lands that are now wild and marginal for human needs. Sprawl in the urban environment is the kind most publicized, but there is analogous sprawl in agriculture, forestry, mining, recreation and other land uses and industries.
>Georgist policies strengthen public revenues while in the same process promoting economy in government. Anti-governmentalists often identify any tax policy with public extravagance. Georgist tax policy, on the contrary, saves public funds in many ways. By facilitating the creation of jobs it lowers welfare costs, unemployment compensation, doles, aid to families with dependent children and all that. It lowers jail and police costs, and all the enormous private expenditures, precautions, and deprivations now taken to guard against theft and other crime. Idle hands are not just wasted, they steal and destroy

If the monies are used to kill leftist liberals, niggers and muslims I'm happy to pay my share. Problem is they are not. State is necessary but current ones are not doing good things.

Nothing is hypothetical about it. I was asking would you let an entity you did not choose to exist forcefully take away freedom from you ?
Would you accept that ?

So, you owe me £50-grand for reading my post. You can PayPal me. If you dont pay, a team will come round, kick in your front door and start removing goods to the amount of £50-grand.

I would ask, "are you ok with this" but that not how statism works is it?

sometimes, i love to be a NEET, i mean wageslaves pay for ahmed house.

love how the only two fagboys defending taxation are a pair of europeans. bet you also see the great virtue and necessity of a "unified europe" dontcha

suck my american cock

Remove the capital gains tax. While you're at it, dismantle social security and return the money to the people in the form of future tax breaks. If you want to talk about theft by the way, the government does it in a lot more sinister ways other than the taxes it tells you about. Try the interaction between the interest rate, government borrowing, and controlled inflation. The whole system at this point is so fucking broken it is staggering.

you voluntary engage in taxable transactions

VOLUNTARY = not theft

plebs btfo

and what right do I have to an unclaimed island over the land I was born in?

How did the state claim the land I live on in the first place?

Property is an idea which does not a require a state to exist. The state in minimally needed to make sure this is not taken from you in unjust manner. A small 5% tax in exchange for protection is all that is needed. Production should not be taxed only exchanges and minimally at that.

through right of conquest, read some fucking law/history

That's not a "benefit" because it's a net loss. Nice try leaf

But even then the state is not need as you could have a voluntary private company to do the same thing.

Ok - so how do I claim the land I was born in?

Imagine you have your great ancap society where everyone is happy. Imagine you have a nice house. Your whole family lives there. Your sister gives birth. 20 years later your nephew says "I WAS BORN ON THIS LAND, IT'S MINE"

What do?

Yeah you convinced me. Get the helicopters fucking commie ghosts of stalin whagt the fuck

>implying you get net gain with taxation

LOL

>arguing with an egoist

Maybe not in Europe

Ok - so i'll forever be a slave to the state because I can never aggress and win "war" against the state?

Tell me what would your anarcocapitalist world would look like and I will tell you why it wont work.

Shit that's not even taking into account the rigged as fuck U.S. markets (different markets for different people, politicians and their capacity to move the markets however they choose, etc.) and the social engineering campaign of pooling your money into mutual funds creating a highly inefficient but extremely controlled marketplace by limiting the amount of significant participants. None of this shit is by accident and the system we have right now is pretty much the mentally challenged physically defective rape-baby of Capitalism and Socialism.

>Ok - so how do I claim the land I was born in?
you don't all the land is already claimed ,

The land hes referring to is private and already owned by someone.

Through war. Just like it has always been done.

you let him keep the land but tax collect 100% of its site value this way he keeps "his" shit but the community gets compensated for the exclusion

ezpz everyone wins

>Pay taxes in exchange for upkeep up infrastructure and government services

>HUUR ITS THEFT!!!11!!

Listen here Clarence, just because you've been living off daddies trust fund doesnt mean you get to not pay taxes for shit you use literally every day.

maybe *you* can't because your a weak fuck with no leadership quality, but plenty of states have lost wars

DO U EVEN HISTORY BRO?

And how is a state any different? The king who founded the land owned all of it. Now his heirs do. You are trespassing.

see:

Please tell me this is fake.

I hate those type of walls.

Your household sounds oppressive as fuck, m8. You're going to have a war in your living room.

>Property is an idea which does not a require a state to exist. The state in minimally needed to make sure this is not taken from you in unjust manner.

This is accurate with the exception to the word 'minimally'. The state is needed exactly as much as it takes to dissuade violent takeover of property. Private property is not the only way of managing resources, you have to argue for the reason why we should rely only on private property.

Who is stealing it from me? I give them the money willingly

Good commie

>yes this 90% tax is justified bc the majority said so. Thank you mob for not killing me! This is so civilized!

Yes. Tough luck. Just like you wouldn't win against a mega corporation either. You could ally with like minded people and revolt, but doing so would turn your group into a state.

>government services
Not all of us are niggers on welfare Tyrese. Remind me why I should be paying for other people's upkeep. Go ahead, I'll wait.

I dont think "leadership qualities" can compete with aircraft carriers. I'll get to saving my fiat money for one tho.

DO U EVEN REALITY BRO?

The quintessential function of a state is to guarantee the security for its people from outside threats, like invading armies and raiding parties. You pay taxes for that. Anything else is suprefluous, and you should probably do something to change it. That would result in a minimalist state, but not anarchocapitalism.

because the king is just another human being like you or me. Theres no reason for one person to have ALL the land. The land traditionally belong to the people who work it and make it productive, right?

how else would they support all the fresh jobless rapefugees?