OPINION THREAD

What is your opinion on universal basic income

A meme that needs to die already.

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bump

It's probably too expensive to maintain.

I disagree vehemently with the universal aspect of it and I would only agree to a conditional BI in states with a number of other requirements, i.e. low population, low immigration, extremely strict selective citizenship.

That it's a system designed to create perpetual lazy failures, OP.

See what welfare has done to niggers over the last 65 years?

Guess what it'll do to whites as well. This is simple stuff here.

Who administers it? Who controls the ledger?

It should become a thing. But, there should be background checks etc. And NOT EVERYONE should be able to qualify for it. I don't want criminals getting free money.

Only the good people should deserve it.

>entitled to resources despite not contributing anything

How could this ever go wrong?

Communism 1.1
The alternative is much more friendly to the working people, it's called labour market regulationss, 30 hour working week, minimal wages. etc.

i can't wait for trump to stop all these free medicaid handouts. UBI is terrible too. Too many lazy fucks out there

What a moron. I don't really support ubi but blacks are the way they are because of their genes. By blaming welfare for black rapes and murders you're literally blaming white people for what blacks do

I blame every retard in a block around when bad shit happens.

>How could this ever go wrong?

Exactly. I mean, what bad could possibly come by squeezing business and the wealthy harder so that others who don't want to contribute can stay at home and play video games all day without having to worry about how they will survive?

The fact that anyone backs UBI as any viable alternative to being a contributing member of society is beyond me, but we've got a lot of 16 year olds here these days, don't we?

If people want to exist without paying for their shit, they need to squat in abandoned buildings and go dumpster diving for whatever they can get. At least those folks aren't draining the system with their lazy "the world owes me a living" nonsense.

Essentially a politician bribing the masses for votes.

Massively unethical.

Slow down there, Bong, you're missing the point.

Nigs, yes, are violent and shitty creatures who naturally have a high propensity for violence, rape, robbery, etc. That's not being disputed. HOWEVER....

You fail to realize that prior to the welfare state, here in the USA, there were MANY areas where blacks were actually thriving in their own self-sufficient communities because they HAD to work. In my area (Milwaukee, WI), this was the Bronzeville area of town - black-occupied, black-owned businesses, and actual black SUCCESS STORIES that came from it from those who weren't too retarded to just go the full on criminal route that they all take now.

What happened? Well, once welfare came into full force, the community fell apart (the black leaders blame a proposed freeway bypass that never actually happened for why so many abandoned their businesses, but the facts show otherwise), once these niggers had a chance to make a dime doing nothing instead of a dollar working, they took the easy route and formerly-working individuals all gave up and took the dole monies.

Basically, a massive portion of the population of all races can be swayed to give up on life for a few dollars of free gibs. Whites would do the same in massive numbers if they could get, say, $2-3k/month in cash without having to work for it. People will gladly lower their standard of living and future opportunities to not have to do anything they don't want to do, this is proven time and time again.

So, cool your jets, buddy, I'm not blaming whites, but I'm saying that we've seen that anyone who is looking for a reason to give up being productive WILL DO SO for meager incentives to do this.

If it's instituted before automation demands it through attrition, it will destroy an economy. It should be funded through taxing business to the amount of a wage per person they remove for automation.

1 x person costing 60k a year works 7 hours per day.

Tax them 60k

Robot works 24/7.. industry thrives. Basic income is paid for.

Additionally I believe people who received redundancy through automation should receive free education if they train in sectors that require workers.. not gender studies or whatever.

Makes much more sense. You would think discussions about lowering work hours would take place before discussions about working no hours. There will always be enough jobs to give everybody at least some hours. Just lowering the average a few hours a week would be great for unemployment

>What is your opinion on universal basic income

I'm coming around to the opinion that it will be necessary quite soon due to tech and automation. Would probably help small business formation rates. Immigration also needs to be capped/limited to under 500k/yr.

Current system is incentivizing and rewarding sociopathic behavior.

Yeah but that doesn't happen when communists want to work no hours and without reducing consumption.

plebit tier shit
gtfo back to plebit faget

It's not something I would really want, but due to the increase in automation recently, I feel that we would be left with the choice of either universal income, or machines wiping the vast majority of humanity, because there simply won't be any purpose for us anymore.

>Universal Basic Income?
Not until we deport all non-whites and end brown immigration.

Not sustainable

Problem is this -

People cost only the time spent hiring them and whatever equipment you give them that they need to perform their job, and that's it.

Automating a human position can cost hundreds or thousands of times that investment to replace humans, and may take years to recoup those high costs.

What happens if you start massively taxing companies immediately once they begin automating? They become fiscally insolvent, and either start making massive cuts in other areas (reducing cash flow and ability to pay those new taxes), go out of business, or start yelling BIG GUBERMINT PLS HELP WITH GIBS AND MORE TAX BREAKS UNTIL WE OKAY AGAIN AND CAN SURVIVE.

When people stop looking at the issue exclusively through the eyes of the worker and begin to see the big picture, it's clear why UBI is pretty much shit-tier ideology and will only hasten collapse.

Communism under a different name.

A polished turd is still a turd.

I should have included "also cost the money paid to them" since inevitably, someone will think that was the loophole in my statement. Let's just say that spending $250k to automate the $8.25/hour part-time positions is a massive gap in spending difference.

Since the government fucking HATES allowing businesses to hold capital in reserve to be able to pay for major changes like this, it means that these businesses often have to take out more loans in order to finance automation. That's not making this any better with more usury now, is it?

It's just too complicated for most people to think through, too many just say "WOW IT'LL BE SO GREAT WHEN I CAN PLAY GUITAR ALL DAY AND STILL GET PAID!!!" without having the slightest clue about how business operates and how these changes come to be.

In short, it intrinsically constrains individual productivity. But so does the current welfare state in the United States (the "poverty trap"). A more generous negative income tax would be better than both systems, definitely cheaper than UBI, and probably cheaper than the current welfare state.

t. work for center-right public policy think-tank.

Naturally this system is not optimal within the society that we live in today. Mostly, exactly due your government point.
However there are plenty of jobs today in which a human has little say. Lots of car manufacturers use automatic equipment, there is a beer company in my town that is literally a thousand machines all being operated by a single PLC unit that has less memory than your computers single ram stick.
And this is physical work. Mental work thats devoid of humanity ( emotion, perspective and so on ) is 10 times easier to replace and in reality is incredibly cheap to make. You get that cute program and pay for it with alot of money, but it saves you all the money you spent incredibly quickly.

The government question is also a big question for AI as an example. AI thats working properly is an instant victory to the government that has it. Much like nuclear bombs. The reason any other country has them is because at first scientists that made the bomb gave russia the plans on how to do it. They were wiser than the politicians. But now we are in the problem where if a country announces ai its getting nuked.
Every economical system is shit. Due to its properties or properties of humans. Best you can do is polish shit.

When it comes to universal income id say sure thing, however on top of that people operating the machinery should be paid extra for working on them.