Why are vikings revered as fearsome and ruthless warriors?
>no Major battles involving over 100k men >No marvelous architecture or structures >basic farming and agriculture >Killed and raped unarmed peasants or women/children >Robbed and stole and left like niggers >Never created anything noteworthy
If they were so fierce why did they always flee when a retinue was dispatched ?
Why were there very few sieges and high-stakes battles?
Honestly, the vikings are a meme They run to their ships anytime a real force showed up. >Charlemagne
>meanwhile romans fought pitched battles involving hundreds of thousands of men, elephants and seiged the mightiest walls with feats of engineering mastery.
>Varangian Guard >Best seafarers of their time >Harald Hardrada >The Great Heathen Army >Dane Law
Vikings were cool m8
Jaxson Reed
>battles faggotry >artsy builds faggotry >basic farming and agriculture if it's so basic, tell me what your home set-up looks like. self sufficiency is something most kids today wouldn't know where to even start at. >murder and crime yawn. some things don't change. >nothing noteworthy It's like you've never seen a swedish breast.
Jason Morris
Whats more, they were too retarded to keep historical documents so any of the few battles we knew existed, are vastly gross overestimates of what were small skirmishes bewteen 2 warring chieftains.
I challenge you, find me a viking battle with over 100k men. Find me A "guagulmela", A Alesia, A "Zama", find me a famous noteworthy battle
>protip: you wont
Elijah Cooper
>muh nordics >muh superior whiteys
Vikings were as degenerate as the rest of the world in 800-1000. The western Romans were long dead by then (though the Eastern Romans turned Byzantine Empire was still around).
Carson Jackson
>he doesnt know about the varangian guard
You see, vikings didnt need armies of 100k to be fearsome, unlike other "men"
Andrew Cook
>my subjective opinion is more relevant than historical facts.
heres your (you)
John Garcia
Because there was no discpline in their ranks. They couldnt even field an army of 50k
Their logitstics and supply should have been above par be that they are sea-farring people.
But nope. Which leads me to my next reason why they could hardly ever win a seige. They lacked supply if they strayed too far from their boats
Evan Rogers
Didnt know abos knew how to use a computer.
Benjamin Cook
Vikings turned into Normans though. Praise Christ.
Ryder Nguyen
Heres an example of a REAL battle.
Please, I wait your retort. Where are your so famous battles that we always here about, preaching viking courage and strength?
>Varangian Guard Elite group of Byzantine mercenaries, all Vikings looking for money Feared and murderous, they were involved in famous conquests and battles >Best Seafarers of their Time They were, no doubt The longship design was the best for that period, fast and nimble it could ride rivers and the high seas They were masters at figuring out exactly where they were even with dark overcasts >Harald Hardrada Just search him up man >Great Heathen Army A viking army that SHATTERED the Anglo-Saxons of Britain Except Wessex cause they were cool >Danelaw What is Viking control over a third of Britain?
Ryan Bell
They can't. I have a smartphone dum dum
Brayden Russell
>running from armies, raping, pillaging Because they were raiders and bandits. They didn't come to conquer, they came to take from the weak and sate the human need to kill. They had a better understanding of human nature.
>The only good battle is a big one
I bet you make the "You mad whiteboi" threads, too.
Oliver Hall
This really means alot to you doesn't it? You're right, the vikings wasn't THE deathmachine supersquad, do you feel gratified now?
Henry Brooks
>Battle of Fulford Not a BIG battle, because armies of that time in Europe were small. But a battle nonetheless >Battle of Beroia Varangians beat the Pechenegs so hard they were never a major player in Europe again. >All of the Heathen Armies' invasion of the Anglo-Saxon Kingdoms
Brandon Bell
>conquest I dont think you understand what that word means.
The varangian guard were mercenaries, sell swords and thus do not count, they are not a standing army but swords for hire.
>The battle of stamford bridge is the only battle you can name and they got fucking rekt and died in the battle.
Joshua Collins
>conquest I dont think you understand what that word means.
The varangian guard were mercenaries, sell swords and thus do not count, they are not a standing army but swords for hire.
>The battle of stamford bridge is the only battle you can name and they got fucking rekt and died in the battle.
>they came to take from the weak Does that make them strong?
>the only good battle is a big one Nice strawman, Large battles usually meant the stakes were high, and it was life or death not only for the soldiers but the country they were fighting for. learn2history faggot
Logan Thompson
Why the fixation in Battles over 100 000 men?
Are Spartan hoplites Shit tier soldiers because There were never a 100 000 of Them at a battle?
Luke Rivera
>no Major battles involving over 100k men
Entire Scandinavian population at the time was at most 500k, also most of the numbers of men in ancient armies are exaggerated
>No marvelous architecture or structures
Small population for great buildings also the longships make up for that
>basic farming and agriculture
Eveyone was a farmer then
>Killed and raped unarmed peasants or women/children
Almost every power that could did that at the time
>Robbed and stole and left like niggers
Anyone who could did that at the time
>Never created anything noteworthy
Again the longships and their travels and adventures were unseen for their time
Matthew Flores
Im just saying they are overrated because of popculture.
>armies of that time in europe were small
Yet Darius was able to field an army of over Hundred thousand men in the desert...nearly 1 millennium before the vikings prominence.
Christian Kelly
Funny story about Stamford Bridge,
"The Anglo-Saxon Chronicle has it that a giant Norse axeman (possibly armed with a Dane Axe) blocked the narrow crossing and single-handedly held up the entire English army. The story is that this axeman cut down up to 40 Englishmen and was defeated only when an English soldier floated under the bridge in a half-barrel and thrust his spear through the planks in the bridge, mortally wounding the axeman." Wikipedia, sourcing page 198 of the Anglo Saxon Chronicles
Aaron Walker
>Thermopylae Easily over 100k combatants
500k where are you getting that number? their population all together would be well over 1 million from 700+ A.D
>basic farming and agriculture Yeah maby 1000 fucking years ago I think your confusing BCE with AD lmao
>muh longships You do realize they had no offensive capabilities and were laughable when you look at eastern ships built around or even earlier than that time.
Robert Fisher
>be level 20 barbarian >completely BTFO of Saxon shits >prepared to die in glorious battle so my bros can escape >some clever Anglo cunt hops in a barrel and floats under the bridge >stabs me in the ballsack
Tyler Ward
Why do you care if they're overrated in pop-culture? Are you autistic, user? Niggermusic is also overrated, start a thread talking shit about rap when this one dies. The thing is, Vikings had a badass warrior culture, and were aesthetic as fuck, ofcourse people look back at them and not some scrawny Roman legionere trapped in a bearucratic hell. >but muh battles
Nathaniel Brooks
>Varangian Guard So, did they even fight in a real battle? >Best seafarers of their time Arguable, I wonder if they could have sailed from the middle east to China to trade, and I know for sure they couldn't beat the byzantines who had greek fire and most likely a much larger navy. >Harald Hardrada Best known for being defeated by the English. >Dane Law What about it?
Sebastian Cox
>500k where are you getting that number? their population all together would be well over 1 million from 700+ A.D Sorry, only population of Denmark had around 500k, all Scandinavia must have been more than a million, still very small considering their exploits
Bentley Reed
>no offensive capabilities
Who cares about offensive capabilities?
They were special for their sleek, fast design that was incredibly durable. No other ship of that time in Europe could go as fast. No other ship could so easily from river to sea And no other ship had crews as experienced and talented
Andrew Johnson
>scrawny roman legionaries Thats a funny joke. You Nord cucks have no discipline. the vikings would shit themselves if they had to actually fight a legitimate battle on even ground.
Ethan Mitchell
>Yes >Yeah you're right, but their ships and navigational skills were A1 shit >But he did a lot before that, and it was rad >I meant Danelaw sorry
Charles Smith
>no discipline
Yeah mate you're right about that As much as I am a viking fan I'd still suck Rome's dick any day
Christopher Price
>Harald Hardrada
This dude gives me feels of masculine inadequacy.
Nathaniel James
Varangian Guards were very loyal outsiders (backstabbing in the bizantine empire was pretty common). And they were magnificent individuals of about 1.80, like fierce niggers. You have the idea.
The Nordics must be protected until their numbers stabilize, but they are certainly not known for their special abilities outside of their physical attributes (like beauty). Nor do they have supernatural powers.
Aiden Cooper
Not trying to shit on them, Im just saying they are to a certain degree over-rated.
Isaiah Cooper
Will the eternal Anglo ever be stopped?
Andrew White
East Rome(the Byzantine Empire) would not have hired them as bodyguards of Emperors if they did that
Cameron Reyes
Well everything is overrated in someway
Connor Bennett
Ancient Trireme max speed: 7.37 knots
Longboat: 10 knots give or take
Considering the size and displacement difference of the two, and the time frame (first known triremes built around 250 BCE)
I'd say the longboats were inferior design. They Were fast, yes, and sleak perfect for raiding but...thats about it...and thats why the design was tossed away in favor of larger, and more powerful ships only 200 some years later with the brig and Cog.
Landon Taylor
>They run to their ships anytime a real force showed up. >Charlemagne then why did they recruit and give land to them aka normans normandy.
Nolan Perry
Just one reason really. Rape. No one even knows what "pillage" was.
Jordan Morgan
Longboats were perfect for their time, and were amazing crafts with amazing crews
That's why they could sail to Iceland, Greenland, and Vinland (Most likely)
That's all I'm saying
Gavin Ortiz
>Robbed and stole and left like niggers I wish niggers would leave desu
William Brooks
critical hit
Connor Flores
If anything that was due to Norse seamen ship which was far superior to anything the world had seen, the same way the mongols were the most skilled horsemen, the norse were the most skilled in Seamanship
To replenish their forces.,...same reason any army recruited from the local population if disease or famine struck the ranks. Even the Wehrmacht and SS did.
Matthew Richardson
this isn't the first anti viking thread I'm seeing here seems like a way for (((them))) to keep pushing the anti Russian narrative
Nolan Bennett
> >>Thermopylae >Easily over 100k combatants
If you believe herodots numbers, which many historians do not.
Even then, no 100 000 spartan hoplites There, so does this make them shit Warriors?
Hunter Harris
>no architecture Yeah the Normans really built nothing impressive. What were they thinking when they constructed this?
Henry Anderson
>what are myths
Grayson Rivera
>Sup Forums thread >All about arguing
Seems good so far
>Arguing about whether vikings are overrated or not
What the fuck even This is the most invested I've ever been in a Sup Forums thread
Justin Peterson
Propaganda. Not even kidding.
Kayden Morales
>Actually calling the norse for "vikings" Historial illiterate detected The vikings fought like the Anglo-Saxons and every other northern European fighting force. The reason they never had battles above 100k men is because Scandinavia was barely populated.
The level of influence they achieved for such a small people was pretty amazing desu. But yes if you compare them to the modern portrayal they dont live up to the hype. But if you understand the context, the "vikings" where pretty awesome.
Xavier Powell
I agree vikings are overrated. Scandinavia have had much better times.
Jaxon Cruz
Dorians>Vikings
Justin Harris
I think a lot of the fascination for them, aside from their aesthetic, is that we as Western men long to be strong, proud and feared again. Everything is so picked apart, ironic and post-modern that we long for something exotic and fierce but still "us". The European "noble savage" as it were.
I do agree that people do a lot of Varg tier larping and it's not always a good thing. I would much prefer fellow fashy huwites embrace traditional concepts like Mos Memoriam for honor instead of Jack Donovan's ideas on "strength" and simplistic values. In most cases it would have been better that many anons had never abandoned their Christian roots on their self improvement journey, but instead taken inspiration and tried to de-cuck their churches and communities from within. People need to actively work on things that bring value to western nationalism, and meet objective material and political ends. So apart from their inspiring ferocity and masculine qualities, I don't think the Vikings have much to offer, especially for non-Nordics (because it's Nordic culture, and theirs to do with as they please).
Jason Wood
That information comes from a primary source >I can quote it for you if you want
"Then was there one of the Norwegians who withstood the English folk--That they may not pass over the bridge nor obtain the victory. Then an Englishman shot with an arrow, but it availed naught; and then came another under the bridge and pierced him through in under the bryny." -Anglo-Saxon Chronicles
Adam Rivera
The goths = ancestors of vikings were the ones who conquered Rome.
Xavier Cox
You are trying to compare a group of warring tribes to vast urbanized empires. The Norse should be compared to the Dorians or the Parni, uncivilized barbarians who laid the basis of later development. Saging this retarded thread
Adrian Jackson
simple google search of norse words in the english language sheds light on how influential they were. op hiding behind larping flag, probably a self hating swede or shitskin.
Charles James
I'm convinced the speed of technological progress of a civilisation is inversely proportional to the attractiveness of their woman.
Ethan Brooks
t. swede
Angel Butler
>muh romans >got destroyed by undisciplined pagans
Oh wow gee golickers, looks like discipline has fuck all to say 1on1 when ones a little Roman homosex and the other is a towering brute
Adam Robinson
That must be why the mighty nyugga and aboriginal qwangz conquered da hole werl
Colton Cook
Harold wartooth, Battle of Brávellir, Gunnhild, Mother of Kings.
Brody Peterson
"In any case, the 4th-century army was probably much more dependent on barbarian recruitment than its 1st/2nd-century predecessor." -Wikipedia with sources Lee (1997) 222–3, Zosimus books IV, V, Elton (1996) 144–5
>Maybe it was the barbarians in the armies that led to less discipline? Hmmm
Hudson Russell
You are forgetting the previous three battles where Roman armies of 20k, 50k, and 80k were completely wiped out by the same tribal group comprised mostly of women and children.
Sebastian Moore
It OK they only killed christcucks.
Zachary Carter
>towering brute lmao Strenght does not win battles. Discpline, and Honor wins battles.
If a roman retreated, every 10th man was bludgeoned to death by his comrades.
Keep thinking they were towering brutes, when in reality they were theives, rapist, and murderers, honestly they were the first pirates.
Normans may be Norse descended, but they aren't "Vikings"
Adrian Diaz
Desert? You clearly don't know what your even talking about.
Saged
Isaac Lopez
>Replying to people who speak ill of mother Rome
Owen Anderson
>some guy makes a big army and takes advantage of a collapsing Persian empire to just make the Greeco-Persian empire and then fail to conquer India and then pretend like your work is done and nothing of your empire survives your death
Christopher Perez
>honor wins battles
David Sanders
>women and children Oh I forgot women and children fought battle hardened legions that been fighting in hispania for years and lost. My bad
Yes I agree, But the problem is strenght leads to pride, and pride leads to violence. Christianity destroys your ego and rebuilds it, you fear god, you will always be below him, and That keeps your ego and decisions regulated and makes you second guess every action you make, Paganism is too primative.
>he looked at my wife >I must crack his skull or im weak.
Also forgiveness is antithetical to paganism imo
>t.rational Belgian /thread
Blake Bell
Even if we argue about whether vikings were overrated or not
We can all agree on one thing
>Rome was fucking 10/10
Benjamin Powell
God this fucking "muh personal guard" got old real quick, yes they hired them because they were skilled individual fighters, but you forget to mention they had to abandon their old habits and culture and be properly disciplined.
Evan Gomez
For a long time, yes.
Dominic Torres
Ikr
oh look a fucking retarded leaf >pic related
Cowardice tends to loose battles, would my logic not be sound and for it safe to say that Honor and Valor can do the opposite, and win battles?
Landon Adams
Well of course...it was the greatest empire to ever exist, any historian east, or west will agree.
This is not a Rome vs Norse or viking thread.
I been using examples of warriors from all creed.
Ethan Reyes
>Oh I forgot women and children fought battle hardened legions that been fighting in hispania for years and lost You cant even get your damn facts straight. Marius campaigned in Mauretania against the Numidian king Jugurtha, and was put in charge of the defense against the Cimbri after they had absolutely annihilated every single other consular army put into the field by Rome. The women and children were standing behind the men, and when the men were routed the women killed themselves and their children.
I forgot Romeaboos get their history from comic books and cartoons.
Austin Bennett
Normans were nords olny by blood (and even that barely) otherwise they were completely assimilated. Also this was constructed in the fucking high middle ages, long after the viking barbarians were gone.
James Thomas
Nah man I was just giving us all a sense of common ground
>And also to bait Anti-Rome people
Matthew Russell
The Normans were assimilated into Christianity the same way Turks were assimilated into Islam. They maintained their martial attitude and sense of elitism.
Parker Ortiz
Fucking what? They spoke latin and french and fought in the style of franks, almost nothing remained of their original culture.
Henry Gomez
Rome was absolute shit. Couldn't establish a decent line of succession, profligate hedonists, could never figure out how to plan long term. Never figured out how to manage their borders, defense in depth, or divide and conquer. Every was given to them, literally in the case of the Kingdom of Pergamon.
Adrian Davis
Read my post again.
Austin Green
>vikings >literally snow niggers >the only memory they left behind was how primitive they were
Nicholas Ward
Two pics on the bottom right aren't even in the Roman (aka Greek) architectural style. The August statute was a copy+pasted counterfeit of an earlier greek statue.
Ayden Sullivan
>>And also to bait Anti-Rome people
Rome was, and is, the most influential empire to ever exist on the face of the Earth.
How do I know?
>We're speaking with Latin letters >The world uses a Latin calendar >Western culture is based on Rome >And we all know how the West did >Monuments of Roman design still stand >Romans were the fucking MASTERS of architecture >Look at the Pantheon, Colosseum, Theodosian Walls, etc.
Thomas Wood
An empire that lasted over 1 and half millennium is not long term
okay kiddo
Benjamin Turner
...
Hudson Sanders
>I like Old English >Viking Language >REEEEEEEEEEE
I'll have you know English is in no way "Viking" or Norse It is a shoot off of Germanic way before Norse formed The first "English" was Anglo-Saxon >Eala! hu gæþ hit þe? Some Norse words were stolen by English But English is NOT Norse
Josiah Brooks
That is really bad art
Jayden Ortiz
My paternal ancestry is Norman and from what I've read, they did quite a bit of assimilation. This was common wherever the Nordics went, they adopted local customs and did their best to conform. But with all the Nordics, especially the Normans, their concepts about elitism and honor were so culturally ingrained that it took quite a long time for those trends to dissipate. It's my opinion that the religious views of their ancestors played a huge role in this, and oral tradition likely played a part, even after they adopted Christianity. I can see aesthetic patterns that are similar to their Nordic ancestors in things like pic related, this was centuries after the assimilation period I believe.
I don't know about martial attitude or anything like that. It sounds interesting, likely interwoven in their concepts of hierarchy and natural order., though this became progressively Christianized and faded. I wish it hadn't.
Joseph Wilson
And you read mine ffs, they did not raid, pillage and steal, they fought organised like the frankish armies with heavy cavlary and all. The invasion of the British isles was not due to some sense of superiority it was a quest to destroy the pagan heathens.
Aaron Torres
Both norse and old english are shot offs of germanic...
Jaxson Collins
Question for myself and everyone else >How is this Politically Incorrect?
Oh well, I'm still having fun
Joseph Howard
>We're speaking with Latin letters Latin letters were spread by the Christian Church, not Rome, and it was derived from the Cumae alphabet, a Greek alphabet which was in turn derived from Phoenician. >The world uses a Latin calendar The world uses the Gregorian calendar, invented in 1582, not the Julian (Roman) calendar. >Western culture is based on Rome Occidental culture is based on Greece, not Rome. Roman philosophy does not hold a fucking candle to Greek philosophy. >And we all know how the West did Ah yes those Germanic barbarian kingdoms who conquered the world. >Romans were the fucking MASTERS of architecture >What are latifundia Everything that was shite has collapsed already, so you dont get to see it. The pic you posted is actually in the form of a MOSQUE, not a Greek temple, signifying the inward orientalization that was well underway in Rome at the turn of the millennium. >Look at the Pantheon temple style stolen from the Persians >Colosseum a fucking sportsbowl >Theodosian Walls Built by Greco Thracians.
Tyler Wilson
Rome was able to succeed catastrophic defeats that would had destroyed other nations ipso facto. His strength, organization, and "vir", (virtue virile), is legendary. The sense of civic duty among Romans has not been surpassed in the whole history.
Vikangz mentality quickly warms up, but it's incapable of maintaining a lasting sense of cohesion. Much less to create something so enduring.
Mason Hernandez
Swedish vikings besieged constantinople multiple times