>'No!' says the man in Washington, 'It belongs to the poor.'
>'No!' says the man in the Vatican, 'It belongs to God.'
>'No!' says the man in Moscow, 'It belongs to everyone.'
So Andrew Ryan went and created Rapture, what Ayn Rand might call a "gulch". The original goal of Rapture was to create a capitalist society free of religious and government interference...but it still all went to shit anyway
what exactly was the message of Bioshock?
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all systems are flawed and will fall, just live life
wrong flag?
What did his ID mean by this?
Drug abuse is cool.
interesting post, would hope to see more replies on this. Personally havent played the game myself, only heard about it.
>what exactly was the message of Bioshock?
Fucking with injecting yourself with some kind of physically altering DNA is gonna end with a bad time. How it got to that level in that society where everyone did it and didnt stop at the first loony tune is never explained and pretty shitty story telling.
Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
The message, as far as I could tell, was if you allow completely anarchic capitalism someone will inevitably monopolize society.
I never read atlas shrugged, which the game is supposed to be based on so I'm not certain that's the actual message.
Much better propaganda in 3
>National socialism is flawed because kikes don't like it
Oy vey
I haven't played it in forever but IIRC the main issue was the unskilled labor they brought down there to support the population. I'm pretty sure most things were fine until the workers went full retard and rioted.
The augments didn't help either but I can't remember how large a problem they were before the riots.
>what exactly was the message of bioshock?
libertarian society will fail because people will inevitably use their magic to kill each other with bees.
>I'm pretty sure most things were fine until the workers went full retard and rioted.
where the fug did that come from?
Andrew Ryan was a libertarian autist, and when his free market society produced a lot of people who had nothing he told them to fuck off. Fontaine cared for those people and created an army to take over Ryan's city
and McDonald's McChild ArmiesTM
Yep or throwing lightning at each other
>implying (((they))) didn't get on the Rapture train too
Oy vey lets not shoah the 6 million
there were also some minor themes, like Andrew Ryan shitting on his ideals whenever it suited his business interests, like when he cracked down on smugglers (couldn't compete with the surface world). Or about how everyone coming to Rapture thought they would be super-successful without "parasites" holding them back, without realizing that someone has to scrub the toilets even in Rapture. Or about how this free market utopia was every bit as corrupt as the surface world that they shat on
Also the player character was Andrew Ryan's son in case someone missed that
The message of bioshock was tht the developers were commies that hated individualism and objectivism so they infused reality with "magic" (read:plasmids) so their boogeymen apocalypse made sense.
Any free society whose citizens are not self-governing moral Christians is doomed to tear itself apart or turn into a police state.
It is fairly flawed when it comes to dealing with the out-of-group population. Too many different thoughts in regards to this and no real consensus.
>all systems are flawed
Not national socialism.
Bioshock used a sort of para-Objectivism a thematic (perhaps mostly aestheitc) element for its story. It doesn't really work well if you're looking for arguments against Rand's ideas because the game didn't incorporate her ideas themselves, but just used her writing as inspiration for style (and particularly for characters).
The game was really all over the place in thematic terms. It presents itself as being about the collapse of an "Objectivist" dystopia, but that's really just a setting. It throws in all sorts of questions about the nature of free will and the idea of brainwashing. It has weirdly conflicting themes about supposed, but cleary unrealistic, dangers of genetic engineering. It tells you that using plasmids is bad and will make you insane, but also that you should collect as many plasmid powers as you can and use them all the time with no negative effects (side effects mostly seem scripted to happen no matter what you do, and don't interfere with play). I'm not sure the game was intended as a serious deconstruction of Rand's ideas. If so, they did a poor job of it.
Also, at the end of the game they thell you the real moral of the story is some kind of revelation about the importance of "family". This seemed jarring. The game presented some of clearly dysfunctional familial relationships, but mostly used them as plot devices and didn't really mention any possibility of better familial relationships.
it went to shit because of made up sci fi garbage to make a game
There was no Bioshock 3. Infinishit is not a Bioshock game.
Anarcho capitalism is just a cult of degeneracy
It all fucked up because some little cunt wasnt happy with what he had, cried alot, rioted and people listened and fucked shit up
>message of Bioshock
Dudes read Ayn Rand's book and came up with some kool looking shit.
Other then a few lines that are mostly ripped out of Ayn Rand's philosophy this game doesn't have much to offer in wisdom.
It's just a cool looking video game.
Don't look too deeply in shallow waters
Damn, that shit was 10 years ago, I get old. It feels like I'm in a time warp
>Socialism isn't flawed.
Nazi Germany was more socialist than Sweden.
I know what you mean.
I feel like I'm 10 years behind whenever I visit Turkey.
/thread
Socialism isn't flawed when it still preaches identity, shuns multiculturalism and happens in a country that's at least 95% white. Flag related.
They intended for it to be anti-Objectivist yet if anything it just reinforced Rand's views. Rapture was a paradise when Andrew Ryan was still true to his beliefs, it only went to shit once he abandoned his Objectivist principles.
Libertarianism wouldnt even work in a fictional magic underwater art deco city not to mention the real world.
Also, why were there no roads in Rapture?
The message is that normies ruin everything.
...
>what exactly was the message of Bioshock?
love authority
I wonder how George Washington would feel about Christ-like imagery like this surrounding him.
Bioshock is a strawman argument against Ayn Rand's political and philosophical arguments.
That's really it. The game dev Kevin Levine was interviewed back when the game was first released about the story and he basically said that he was a lolbertarian and that while he was fascinated by Ayn Rand's ideas in Atlas Shrugged, he wanted to write something that would represent how such a situation would go down in reality (something to that effect).
It's literally a strawman against Atlas Shrugged. Similar to how Bioshock in the sky was a strawman against white conservative Christian values. I think at the end of that one however, he tried to give some kind of cheesy meaning with the multiverse stuff, despite everything else being an attack on western culture and American values.
Basically, this is why you don't trust lolbertarians. They're a right wing nihilistic movement and Ayn Rand knew this, which is why she hated them, saying "libertarians plagiarize my ideas and rip the teeth out of them".
that jews ruin everything and we're all slaves to the jews. If you read that novel that was written about rapture before it was built Frank Fontaine didn't even belong there and was a subversive fuck who stole identities working his way up to infiltrating rapture. he's also the reason why it went to shit
That libertarianism and "true" capitalism, can't exist, because of nature of the man. Like communism. It will eventually boil down to authoritarianism.
The whole commentary is superficial because if you read into the development history of Bioshock you'll know that the first idea they had was the little sister/bid daddy dynamic and its creepy imagery and then reverse engineered a scenario as for why they were doing anything at all. The critique relies on a deus ex plot device (adam slugs) to justify how a free market society would end in anyway like that at all. The whole thing is superficial and anyone impressed by this game's commentary are morons who don't read books. Fun interactive entertainment at least.
Libertarian societies can advance technologies at a rate 100x that of modern society. Just look at all the cool shit like plasmids they had in the 50's because they were allowed to chase technological innovations without regulation.
>what exactly was the message of Bioshock
Dude weed lmao is a slippery slope to, dude just drink the blood of the sea slug inside that little girl Lmao
Why were there no fat people in rapture?
I'd say that they did a pretty good job all in all.
Ken Levine is a member of the tribe and a smarmy jew
Because they didn't develop any fat character models.
The city was an autocracy with private police. There was a civil war that began with zero charity or opportunity for some people. There was also the widespread drug/superpower problem.
Rand would have objected to Ryan's governance, probably predicting doom just based on that. She also praised reason which drug addiction destroys, and superpowers changed the metaphysics of the in-game universe which also would have necessitated reconsidering some things.
The issue that needs the most attention was the civil war. Ryan brought in a lot of people who were avowedly elitist and uncharitable. Most people who bitch about objectivism suppose that the philosophy would make everybody this way, leaving unfortunates to die. Rand felt more positively about people as a whole (not a group handpicked for their almost-tangible douchiness), and believed enough charity would be available when truly needed, but that less would be needed in the first place.
So I guess the lesson is that a philosophy will fail when you deliberately create the conditions under which the author of that philosophy predicts it will fail.
All systems based on external identity fail? Didn't bioshock take place in a technologic dystopia which people "found" themselves in tech?
>Why were there no fat people in rapture?
There was a food shortage caused by the lack of roads.
Hierarchy shuffle is not a civil war, dumb leaf
Niggers fuck socialism up. It only works if their just white people. Asians suck at it too.
System shock, system shock2 > bioshock
Random bullshit between a shoot and another.
Pretentious plot.
Good music.
If you want real messages read a book.
It shows the fall of man due to his own hubris.
That's p. fuckin' nasty, bro
civil war is civil war though
Nah uh
The Message: AnCap societies always become drug-ridden shitholes, just like Freeside in Fallout NV
Horsey quality comic.
Absolute trash.
Sure, they use the plasmid shit as an excuse to explain why everyone went crazy and why the player character has to kill so many people. But if you follow the commentary (diaries and stuff) you'd know that the decline started way before that. Even before the plasmids made everyone insane, the libertarian paradise was suffering from corruption (Andrew Ryan abusing his power) and unemployment. The society produced a lot of people who had nothing and who were shit out of luck. Frank Fontaine started building homeless shelters for these people and in return they regarded him as a hero. Eventually, Fontaine and Ryan started duking it out, and Fontaine turned his admirers into an army. In this plasmid arms race they all got super hopped up on plasmids and a lot of people became completely insane
in case anyone wasn't aware, this is real anarchist/communist propaganda tacked onto a Randian commentary
>t. Fontaine
It is technically civil, it is technically war. But it isn't civil war, since no civil change is made. Switching one leader for another, even through war, is not a civil war,
yeah all those cartels were just banter lmao
Huh. I watched that video introduction 15 minutes ago.
Baader-Meinhof effect up ins
Fontaine was not a good guy, he only did those things to gather his own army in an attempt to take over rapture. he faked his own violent death to then outrage people that andrew ryan would do that while he used adam to change his appearance to that of Atlas to come take charge of that army he created that was now enraged.
>Andrew Ryan literally did nothing wrong
The true philosophical message of bioshock was don't let potatoniggers (eg fontaine) into paradise
bioshock.wikia.com
It's referred to as a civil war so that's what I'm calling it. Take the pedantic shit up with someone who cares. I answered OP's question
Yeah,went so too when man decided there is no God, therefore man is god
We all know how that thinking process ends up producing
I never said that Fontaine was a good guy, only that he pretended to be. As for Andrew Ryan, the reason he got into some shit with Fontaine in the first place was because Fontaine was smuggling stuff from the surface world, which severely hurt Ryan's business interests (no free market for you).
>They can't even into roads in fantasy.
Explains why his games are strawman bullshit, typical of all Az Jews.
>right-wing being reffered to as nazis so that's what i'm calling them
That libertarians are even more arrogant regarding human behaviour than commies/socialists.
This is why the game is a strawman argument against atlas shrugged.
>if you have nothing beyond yourself to rely on then you have nothing at all
You were controlled the whole game. >capitalism is failing
>communism has failed
>national socialism was smashed
>Feudal monarchism has been tried and never failed nor defeat from the outside
Really boggles the goggles
you cant create a society free of mans problems when including mankind in that society
Ryan was a retard. That someone would weaponize the poor was a matter of time, especially in such a claustric environment. Charity would guarantee his safety.
Yes, Andrew Ryan didn't live up to his ideals. But even if he had, the free market would still have produced a lot of people who are shit out of luck. That would be very fertile grounds for political agitators even if Fontaine had never existed
>Feudalism never failed.
Pffffahahahaha!
the true redpill is knowing that nothing can ever succeed because people are fucking stupid and that's that
...
>freeside
LOL no, you have the two sides, the poor in Freeside and the rich in The Strip. That's what happens in an AnCap society.
Objectivism is not libertarian. Rand Hated libertarians.
>Because libertarians are a monstrous, disgusting bunch of people: they plagiarize my ideas when that fits their purpose, and denounce me in a more vicious manner than any communist publication when that fits their purpose. They’re lower than any pragmatists, and what they hold against Objectivism is morality. They want an amoral political program.
Libertarianism is right-wing nihilistic politics.
Just because there wasn't a civil change, doesn't mean there wasn't a civil war. This is like saying just because there was no victory there was no war.
Bioshock were lackluster games but the stories were always cool. The message i got is that any ideology on steroids will lead to failure. In the second game the main villain was a commie and her daughter even says
>she would rather us all be equally miserable than achieve happiness on our own
Since I can't think of an equally bad comparison of the top of my head I'll just say that if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck it's probably a duck or at least very close, but it's almost certainly not an alligator.
Being right wing myself I'm a little more invested in that kind of pedantic shit since it's pretty easy to demonstrate that I don't have enough in common with nazis to be one.
Oh that makes sense.
Anyways on the issue of roads, they did use trains as well as mini submarines to travel between different parts of the city.
Why build roads when you can just travel through the water I suppose.
Ex. This would be like saying if the U.S. and U.S.S.R. had gotten into a nuclear war. Because they were both dead by the end, there was no war.
I dunno, but I think every civilization will go to shit eventually.
>mfw OP doesn't ask "Would you kindly tell me the message of Bioshock?"
My disappointment is immeasurable, user.
Civil and social shift presides civil war.
If not happening, then it is not civil war. It is coupe or hierarchy struggle.
Doesn't matter. The game was a strawman and using a strawman as an argument that something will or will not work is a logical fallacy.
You're literally the person this game was made for, to arm you with shallow arguments and steel your mind against arguments to the contrary.
That you use this game in anyway to make a point shows how manipulated you are.
make way for the better game
>No!' says the man in the Synagogue, 'It belongs to Goldman Sachs and Israel
Literally electra complex: the game
>Civil and social shift presides civil war.
True. But what your saying is because this fighting didn't result in anything, it doesn't count as a civil war. Which it pretty much is implied if not out right stated to be.
Eehhhhhhh debatable.