Why Don't you Support Socialism?

Assuming you aren't one of the one percent why don't you support socialism. I know that it won't make your life any richer but it will make the rich poorer through higher taxes so there's less inequality.

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I supported Trump for this reason. I know him and Clinton were both pro-rich but the next closest thing to the elites are University students which I like Trump since he triggered them.

>taking wealth
>all the workers get paid
lol?

Because I'm not a bitch and I don't want to watch poor minorities take things because "muh feelings"

Because you can't fix niggers. And I hate Jews.

...

Yeah, and who owns the buildings and skyscrapers those wrokers create? Who gets the tanks the worker makes, who gets the expensive clothing the worker makes, oh right the corporaiton

So why do you support capitalism, aka the welfare state that allows so many minorities to live for free?

So you want the government to own it instead of the corporation? What's the difference?

>Why don't you support socialism it's gonna be great this time guys you'll see

Pic = line to buy food in Venezuela. I think I'm cool with my Wal-Marts.

Because i personally don;t want to be poor as fuck, and I don;t want everyone in my country to be poor as fuck.

I'm also not retarded.

Who paid for them to have a job in the first place?

You know that the money given to those people had to earned through work, right? Even if their parents or grandparents were the ones who had to work for it. Rich families don't just pop out of nowhere you fucking retard.

nobody 'took' the money those kids are spending

it was given to them

No one will get rich off it if the government owns it, it can also be put in the public treasury which benefits me as a citizen

>venezeela
Awww yes the capitalist country that crashed that somehow proves socialism is a failure.

>i don't want to be poor as fuck
So why do you like capitalism?

The corporation

>No one will get rich off it if the government owns it, it can also be put in the public treasury which benefits me as a citizen

>work for it
You mean open a business and force others to work for you?

It was given to them by their parents which took it. And even if that was the case they still shouldn't have it.

Russia is crony-capitalist. I'm talking about a Scandinavian socialist type society where it all gets put in the public treasury

Bringing other people down because you cant bring yourself up. Get a job, fag.

>No way it wasn't REAL socialism just because the government nationalized all the businesses, but THIS time it'll be real socialism you guys

A hospital in Cuba with all the free health care

>aka the welfare state that allows so many minorities to live for free

so you don't like capitalism i assume.

...

I have a job idiot

>bringing other people down because you can't bring yourself up
Yeah that's literaly what socialism is about, and it's basic human nature. Even Peterson admits that

Ahhh yes the CIA is totally a socialist organization

No i hate capitalism.

So a doctor should make as much as a fucking janitor. Yea that sounds great.

This 100%. Capitalism forces people into eating rat shit

Well, you lazy fuck, it relies on millions of people working hard day in an day out, with no additional reward for doing so.

These millions people are almost all even more lazy and indifferent than you.

Yeah sure a doctor should totally be paid more than a janitor, sure.

I actually find it ironic that you used that example because I dispise and hate doctors.

>So why do you like capitalism?
Because people aren't as poor as they are with socialism.

Oh you mean that part of the world where their politicians used the money to stage an Islamic invasion and lots of rape to tank the economy?

Well Scandinavian Socialism was great while it lasted, was based on oil production, etc. But somehow I think it only works under certain circumstances. And I think those circumstances did include corporations and use of finance capital. What do you think Norway does with all that oil money?

>i get called lazy by someone with no job who defends capitalism
KEK

True, but there are a select few that get VERY rich.

...

You know Sweden isn't all of Scandinavia right? Norway is also Scandinavian and very white.

>And I think those circumstances did include corporations and use of finance capital. What do you think Norway does with all that oil money?
Pay off their debt, fund the military, roads, schools, all that

Funny because that's a strawman.

I lived in a socialism regime and it removes all the incentive in people. You have no reason to better yourself, because there's nowhere better to get. Everything is controlled.
You end up being a lazy scum that would sell all his friends just for a little taste of something new

>No one will get rich off it if the government owns it
The government will.
captcha: extra salt mine

>
>No one will get rich off it if the government owns it

You are daft if you think no one will get rich. How do you suppose our legislators go into congress upper middle class and come out millionaires?

Please don't vote anymore until you grasp basic econ.

>Thread

So you want everyone brought down to the status of poor, instead of the majority being middle class and a few super rich

Utopian retard.

>Cuba is the CIA it's not real socialism REAL socialism is some Scandinavian country or some shit

No way dude Sweden is the CIA, it's owned by the U.S. government which means it's not socialist which means your argument is wrong dude. Also all your criticisms of capitalism are bullshit, I'm talking about meta-pre-post-neo-colonialist capitalism not whatever capitalism you're saying doesn't work, that's a different capitalism.

>True, but there are a select few that get VERY rich.
Why should that bother me? You'd rather make yourself poorer so you didn't have to know there were people richer than you?

Yeah but who owns the government? The PEOPLE.

Better than capitalism, where you work hard and are still poor

They make money from campaign finance, please don't vote until you understand basic economics, but if people understood basic economics they wouldn't be capitalists

Strawman

Well not poor as in poverty, but everyone live like a 1950s factory worker which today would be like $19, 000 a year

Capitalism needs to die now that romantic bullshit they once spouted about becoming wealthy through hard work and innovation doesn't hold true anymore we are not small fish anymore we plankton and they are blue whales

Plus all the degeneracy and liberal politics you see now is due to capitalism dont complain about immigration and gender benders and then whole heartedly support capitalism conservatives need to realise that it is a falacy to be economically liberal and politically conservative economics drives social policy

If you want true social conservatism then you need constraints on economic freedoms and more control and direction by the state to say no to businesses that pander to degenerates no to corporate media propaganda and no to big business and their lobbying

The free market needs to be controlled and if it is controlled how free can it cruelly be?

Why should i want the rich to get poorer? Why should i carr about inequality? Why are deadbeats and losers more deserving of the money that the rest of us make than we are? Get fucked cuck

Shut up stupid. You anti-Utopian

America, Britain, Hong Kong, all the rich countries, not true capitalism because i said so

Yes because it raises you in the social domminacne hariarchy. We could all live like millionaires but it's the social dominance heirarchy that matters.

No one's forcing them to work you retard.

Look here, boy.
I lived in a socialist country. I'll give you 3 guesses what happened.

>Yeah but who owns the government? The PEOPLE
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
*inhales*
BAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

>Why should i want the rich to get poorer? Why should i carr about inequality?
Because it makes you lower in the social heirarchy

>Why are deadbeats and losers more deserving of the money that the rest of us make than we are? Get fucked cuck
Because YOU don't make money, you implied you weren't rich just a second ago.

>Utopia
>Reality
Pick one.

You can support a redistributive taxation system and robust social safety net without being a God damn commie who wants state owned industry

If your labor is too cheap raise the prize of it. If you can't, maybe it's not worth as much as you'd like.

>You know Sweden isn't all of Scandinavia right?
You know I was referring specifically about Norway when I was talking about the oil?

>Pay off their debt
You would need to understand the Federal Reserve and the Jews and Jewish Banking and Jewish Communism and Jewish Capitalism and Jewish Socialism in order to understand what's really the problem here.

>social dominance hierarchy is all that matters
>we'll eliminate money as a source of status and then status won't exist
>oops we're monkeys and we'll just make up some other bullshit reason to put some people at the top and other people at the bottom
>too bad we now we don't have any food at the grocery store

>We could all live like millionaires but it's the social dominance heirarchy that matters.
How do you figure that? I'd rather be a middle class person in a capitalist society than the richest person in a socialist hell hole like Venezuela.

Why would I feel better about being poor so long as everyone else was as poor as me? I'd rather be well off and be the poorest person in the country.

>Because it makes you lower in the social hierarchy
What social hierarchy?

You have to work to earn money to pay rent idiot

I know you're trolling, but if you said that shit in a real socialist country you'd be arrested

And i never once said a utopia was possible

I don't even want a social saftey net. I'm not a fucking commie scum. I'm a socialist who supports state run industry but those who are old and unemployed don't deserve anything

Yeah that's true, so what? I still want stuff.

the biggest issue with socialism is it rewards bad behavior. Without the state taking care of your basic needs you at least had to be a decent person, in order for people to help you out. With government subsidies you can be the biggest piece of shit and, the government makes sure your taken care of.

Here's one argument no one has countered yet.

Socialists and other economic leftists believe in collective ownership of the means of production. One of their core concepts is that the working class should seize the means of production and start a fair redistribution of wealth thereafter.

This is nothing but wishful thinking. It implies that the working class is so naturally talented and adept at management that as soon as it gets access to the means of production, everything will work smoothly. If the proletariat is really good, why doesn't it start small right away? You can easily amass the initial capital by fundraising. No seizure is needed. The workers and left-wing enthusiasts just have to chip in, it works. Then you launch your collectively owned enterprise and share profit among each other however you like. Over time, it might grow bigger, more people might join and start doing the same - voila, your dream comes true. But it doesn't happen because the working class is dumb, and the leftist ideologues are incompetent.

I am not saying that collective ownership is not possible at all. With the right organizational culture, it well might be. But in that case it will work perfectly well in a market economy. Which means, the market is the only way. You either play it and try to implement your gimmicks on market terms, or you're a delusional fool betrayed by history itself.

Socialists believe it isn't work to come up with a product to sell, built a factory to make it, hire employees to manufacture it, buy materials needed to assemble it, sign agreements with distributors and retailers to purchase it, and advertise it so people want to by your product.

No, none of that is work. The only work that matters is done by the high school dropout that tightens a couple of bolts. That is where the real wealth is created.

He's talking about primate status hierarchies. All primates form them. Some monkeys are high status, some low status, and the high status ones shit on the low status ones. Which is ingrained genetic behavior and which will always happen regardless of how you try to organize your social system. So until he can figure out how to snip this behavior out of our DNA his dumb utopian idea is just a dumb (pointless) utopian idea.

So the lazy fucks like you aren't rewarded.

>real socialist country
Good thing that they never existed, according to people like you.

I hope you die of cancer and see your whole family eaten by dogs. Stupid spoiled brat having no idea about socialism.

Socialism is based on the misconception that everyone has the same needs and abilities.

THat's why you have a nationalized central bank, read up on Rothschilds and how they own the FED

You're stupid, there will always be a social heirarchy, and you can't eliminate money

Because the part of your brain that determines your accomplishments and sucessfullness as a human is directly connected to the part of your brain that monitors your social status. Jordan Peterson talks a lot about this. Chieften in the middle ages who had almost no material wealth were happier and more satisfied than a worker in 2016 America who makes $25K a year and has internet, remote control cars, a car, shower, food whenever he wants, a computer, phone etc.

I'm poor and I'd be a lot happier if the douchebags that made fun of me in highschool were poor too, instead I have to find out they are making good money now.

People should realise that a man himself is worth nothing his labour is worth nothing his ideas are only valuable if it concerns satisfying the pointless vapid wants of others

> if you said that shit in a real socialist country you'd be arrested
>workers paradise, people own the government
>don't down talk government or we'll throw you (the people who own the government) in jail
>gee, why don't people want to join my worker's paradise.

What would incentivize a person to spend years becoming a brain or heart surgeon if they aren't compensated for their times and skills? With socialist logic, they can be dragged out of bed in the middle of the night to operate of some random person for free under the threat of imprisonment.

>Hat's why you have a nationalized central bank
Now we're getting somewhere! Come back and make a thread about how the central banks are LITERALLY the capitalists and how we need to fix the banks.

Otherwise you're arguing about isms and workers of the world uniting and a whole lot of claptrap nobody will understand or relate to.

>I want to raise myself in the social status hierarchy by making everyone make $19,000 a year, that's the whole reason to do socialism
>Admits there will always be a social hierarchy

Who's the stupid one? Your dumb idea will not raise your status. It would just be like the Soviet Union where friendships with party bosses determined your status instead of money because everyone made shitty salaries. You'd still be a loser, and will always be a loser, and there is no way to change that because you have a loser mindset.

>I'm a low status loser
>The solution to this is to radically reorganize the world economic system so I'm no longer a low status loser
>Go make some more money or start a business? Fuck that it's easier to change the entire world economy so everyone else is a loser too

Capitalism encourages laziness since you get free money from the gubbiment if you too lazy to work

Because it's hard to compete against megacorps

I'm not saying the first one isn't work, but hiring people and managing people pays for itself via making you feel good. I felt really good when I was promoted to temproary manager since i got to boss people around even though it was more work but now im back to where i am as a retail worker and feel bad

No idiot, the social hierarchy will ALWAYS exist

You're a lazy fuck, no wonder you love capitalism you want to live off handouts

You're a stupid spoiled brat who knows nothing of socialism

No it doesn't retard, it says the OPPOSITE, some people are smarter so we have to take more from them since they will produce more. If everyone was the same we wouldn't need socialism

>Me: The social hierarchy will always exist because of our genes
>You: No idiot, the social hierarchy will ALWAYS exist

Uh, okay?

Solid trolling, op. 10/10

I agree with that, i see the FED as just another corporation

How can i just start a business if i have no money, and how can a business compete in this world of multinationals? You're stupid bro

They will get paid more, but not much more. I love how you mentioned that because the kid who bullied me in highschool is now a doctor. And everytime I learn more about his life now the more i want absolute socialism where doctors make the same as me. He has a nice wife a nice car he's got a good house (with debt though) and has a great social life. I always thought "well i'll be better than you in real life" but nope.

>I don't even want a social saftey net. I'm not a fucking commie scum. I'm a socialist who supports state run industry but those who are old and unemployed don't deserve anything
So you want Socialism without any of the aspects that make it even possibly appealing. I can't believe I'm being forced to say "Not real Socialism", but you want the most retarded version of state capitalism possible

>>You're a stupid spoiled brat who knows nothing of socialism
>Romanian
>spoiled
HAHAHAHHAHAHAH
kys commie , you aren't even human LOL

youtube.com/watch?v=G0aTMgPALSA

>pereaches how this ideology is flawless and awesome, but the moment somebody who lived in it shows him proof why it won't work, he starts ignoring it.

Typical

What is your definition of wealthy more trivial things to spend our hard earned money on? What good comes from an entrepreneur when the end result of his work is to the detriment of humanity? We don't need more stupid shit to waste our time money and lives on technology is good when it concerns the progress of science and science alone technological progress for the purpose of entertainment is poison wasting finite resources entertaining the plebian masses with more wasteful toys gadgets accessories and fashion items is immoral

>They will get paid more, but not much more.
No they won't you moron, they will be taxed to hell because who else is going to pay for all the free health care?

The Federal Reserve Bank is literally another corporation. Most governments are also incorporated.

If you want to argue against the corporation as an organization structure, then do that. Don't say Jewish ism this and Jewish ism that. Pick one main point and make it clearly.

You need to lurk more.

Stop posting and fucking lurk more.

wat

>Me: Social hierarchy is real
>you: IDIOT IT WILL ALWAYS EXIST YOU CANT CHANGE THAT
Okay

Because i want a system that benefits ME. I don't care about old people, i don't care about sick people, i don't care about unemployed people. I am a young healthy white male with a low paying job. I want whats best for me. I hate rich people owning corporation since that benefits them not me, if the state redistributes it but gives it all to old people and hospitals that doesn't benefit me.

That's a fake quote. Can't find the source of it

Show me proof

There shouldn't be free healthcare. Only things that make profits should be nationalized like oil, manfucaturing banking etc. Things that are a drain are useless

I spend like 8 hours a day on Sup Forums and 12 hours a day when i don't have work. Don't tell me i need to lurk more

uh no, It's literally a socialist redistribution of taxes. The government which is elected by the people decides the budget. In an actual capitalist economy it would be up to the individual or the corporation who gets if any "benefits" we used to call it charity.

>shit I have a big bag of material and a machine I don't know how to operate, and both need moving
>hey, there's a guy who's qualified to operate the machine
>I'll negotiate a deal where I pay him X amount of money and he'll move it for me
Capitalism, the nutshell.

Also, socialism fails because all forms of it have been executed faithfully.

>I always thought "well i'll be better than you in real life" but nope.
But you're a whining faggot dude? Turning out better than some douche has nothing to do with social/economic standing. You're unironically a materialistic fool.

Retarded delusional cuckery the post

Dumbass welfare is not a capitalist idea. We are still a capitalist country but have a few bits of socalistic programs sprinkled in here and there

Coops alone are not socialism.

>What do you mean I'm such a loser that I'll always be at the bottom of the social hierarchy even under socialism?

Can't tell if mouth-breather or troll.

>Because it's hard to compete against megacorps
Compete against those who you can beat, then. Find your niche

The point is, if you cant implement your idea on a smaller scale, it won't work on a national level either

Not really, socialism is nationalizing the MEANS OF PRODUCTION, not things that drain the system

That's a very oversimplificied version. More like

>every machine on earth owned by one dude
>have to force it through his machine since he owns monopoly
>now a wage slave

You're a materialistic whining fool. All you want is money and consumerist items

>Better than capitalism, where you work hard and are still poor

Okay now I KNOW you are just baiting, captain Ahab.

You just got told by someone who lived under a socialist state that it sucks, and yet you deny it with some dumb assumption?
I have spent a great deal of time amongst the cheeki breekis, and it is no lie that socialist systems make you lazy.
Sure that may be an anecdote, but that's better than a baseless assumption.

>You're a materialistic whining fool.
Don't project onto me. Find your own words user.

WORKERS OF THE WORLD RISE UP AND SEIZE THE MEANS OF PRODUCTION

Hey dumbass, who installed welfare in our government? Hint, Eisenhower

I think you're a troll.

Bro, multinationals have a monopoly

I don't even care about money or materialism or any of that shit. So it's a strawman to call me that. I even admitted in my first post I want everyone even me to be poorer if that's what socialism requires

You're a terrible troll. Like 1/10

Socialism survivor here. You don't want socialism.

I only support national socialism and national Bolshevism all other forms of socialism are trash

>claims my version is oversimplified
>produces version that's even less coherent
Your logic doesn't follow. Anyone can buy a machine to handle the material, provided he has the money required.
Doesn't mean people who can't afford it are condemned to wage slavery, it means they're shit at making financial deals. Or to be fair, they don't know it's an option.