Italians and Warfare

Italians have a pretty amazing history but why were they so bad at warfare compared to other European civilizations?

Italy was never truly united

do we?

The Papacy has cucked Italy since the end of the Roman Empire

> the sum total of his "knowledge" on warfare is ww2 as taught by pol

Italy denies Warfare. It's in our costitution.
"l'Italia ripudia la guerra"
War is for dumbs.

all the good men died in battle during the roman empire

Rome? Didn't they invent the idea of a professional army, more or less?

Or do you mean post-empire Italy? 'cos that's probably the reason, right there. When your national infrastructure is ruined by savages for a few centuries, you're lucky to claw back agriculture, let alone martial prowess.

Italian Frogmen were the best world war two special forces no one else could compete except maybe the Italian Fulgore division or a select few Italian mountain divisions.

The.
End.

because they don't wash their hands after bathroom or before preparing food

ok, that's not why they can't into war. but it's true they have the lowest rate of handwashing in the western world.

that's all i can think about when i think of italians actually. dirty hands and hairy women.

anyways good luck italy, wish you the best you hairy disgusting fucks

Italian hands can't hold swords, fhey are better for noodles.

If they created an whip-weilding infantry we would be speaking pasta talk right now.

This.

Also you guys mostly were/are just corrupt merchants.

Pretty sure that it's the netherlands

Roman superiority came with technological and strategic superiority. We are a young nation, still catching up on that.

Not as white as their neighbours

unlike Britain and France, they spent all their points on food

Not all. Merchant republics were Genoa, Venice, Pisa, Amalfi. All the rest were normal kingdoms/republics.

>lol we have are now under occupation by a foreign force but at least we aren't dumb dumbs for fighting them. Check mate invaders.

I thought the English and the Redcoats made the first professional standing army?

>Merchant republics were Genoa, Venice, Pisa, Amalfi.
>when you play too much ck2 and know this
are you memeing?

Nice try, but having a more or less tanned skin does not really change anything in the battle.

So does Japan, but neither of us included it because we had a choice.

Rome had a professional army, the whole feudsl levy system came later.

What? It's history. We are taught this in school.

Who needs to win wars when you can side with the winner?

>Italy denies war as instrument of offence
That twat forgot the rest of that article. Also, it's a fresh constitution, written in 1946, Italians fought a shitload during the 18th and 19th century to shoo away spaniards and austria

What the fuck happened there

we conquered them like bitches

...

BATTLE ROYALE

But didn't garibaldi overthrow the bourbon rule with like 1000 men?

Romans were kickass in their time

It actually makes complete sense once you hear the details, but I can't remember them.... something to do with a three way land dispute and treaties between any two of the three forming/breaking as land was won and other nations joined the fight

Romans weren't modern Italians, they were genetically much closer to modern day Germanics and continental celts, modern Italian are moorish hybrids. Italian haven't been good at warfare in recent history because they lack the long term planning like the romans and modern north and west Europeans, and instead just spent all their time and money on food, wine and women.

WE WUZ ROMANS AND SHIIIEEETTTT....
If anything they were more Greek.

I totally understand the reason you hide your flag, i too would be ashamed of my country if it had this bad of an education

If you're referring to WWII which I assume you are, Italy wasn't ready for war but Mussolini's arrogance and jealousy of Hitler caused him to declare war on the Allies. The did poorly on the Alpine Front because the French had well manned defences and there wasn't a way of getting around those defenses like Germany had. They invaded to get some concessions when France capitulated. They did poorly in Libya because they were ill-equipt, Erwin Rommel remarked the Italians fought well with German weaponry, and with his help advanced as war as El Alamein. They did poorly in Greece because they attacked a nation which had been rejuvenated under the leadership of Metaxas, while letting troops return home to harvest, but not before the Greeks advanced into Northern Epirus (Greek majority) in Italian-Albania. All things considered the Italians did well in East Africa but lacked resources and a link to Europe. They occupied British Somaliland and key ares in British Sudan and Kenya.

>mussolini's arrogance
He clearly said that they were not ready, but hitler was like lol let's start another world war and since italy was his ally...
>jealousy of hitler
Hitler actually inspired to fascism to create nazism.
The rest is good.

>we wuz romans and shieet
The hypocrisy of some members of Sup Forums never fails to amaze me. Germanics arrived after the Romans you retard. Romans were one of the native Italian populations, and modern Italians descend from them. Sure, we were invaded by germanics, but we still have the roman blood in us. More than anyone else for sure.

They aren't. Your argument for this is WWII. Italians have a long history of being a warfaring people, inventing new weapons and tactics up through the modern era and exporting their fighters as mercenaries.

Their DNA is identical to modern Italians. Muh noble aryans could never carry out the anti-semitic brutality the Romans did.

Rome became a super power after defeating and annexing Greece, guess where Mussolini failed.

Italians themselves are good and brave fighters, the problem was that most of our military leaders were trained by the incompetent Savoy military tradition

No wonder the house of Savoy had to beg help from French and Garibaldi mercenaries to conquer the peninsula, all the worst commanders in Italian history (Cadorna, Badoglio etc.) were trained by them

>muh wwii
Mfw theres a while chapter in The Prince discussing why italians are trash at warfare

kek. underrated comment

Oh my fucking god not this larping bullshit again. I don't hate northern euros, but this is nigger tier we wuzzing. Look up portraits of Romans: they look not so different from what we do now

What are you talking about? Italians are always on the winning side.

Stupidest fucking thread I've seen in awhile
Rome literally recreated warfare and were virtually unstoppable on the battlefield when it's military was at its height
Hannibal raped them at Cannae
Germanicus skull fucked them in Teutoburg Forest
But they always bounced back and kept conquering

kys you fucking kike

nice weather, pretty girls, and more than enough pasta and wine to go around. what's there to fight about?

That would contradict Italian history

Germanicus was the Roman general who skullfucked Arminius and destroyed his tribe.

Great argument, you've defintely convinced me
AYO WE WUZ ROME N SHEEIT (nevermind the fact that Germanics came to Italy later on in history, so if anything Italians have more germanic phenotypes and overall DNA today than 2000 years ago)

Italy has sucked at war for much longer than since ww2. Ever since guns became the main weapon on the battle field, Italy has been a 2nd rate military power. Kinda like Austria-Hungary empire and the ottomans.

>Germanicus
Caligula is Germanicus
You're thinking of Arminius (Herman)

>Austria-Hungary
>2nd rate military power
Why are people on Sup Forums so ignorant about history? For most of its existance AH empire was the dominant force in continental Europe along with France. Do you base your historical knowledge on "muh Prussia stronk" memeballs?

all the good Americans died in ww2

And many of the best families an heroe'd after devastating civil wars in the first century BC.

I don't need to convince you. You blatantly lied. You already know the truth and obviously don't want a debate so what's fucking the point in wasting my time seriously debating you. I'd rather just name you. Go and jew elsewhere.

Italy changed warfare forever.
They beat celts and others when they were heavily outnumbered.
The whole world copied the shield wall and discipline model after them.

this

People who say this are idiots who think history began in 1900.

>tell you to look up roman portraits made at the time of the romans, such as the ones in Pompei, which clearly shows that the inhabitants at the time were not nordics
>HUUUUUR LYING JEW!!111!1!
All my ancestros are Italians for at least 4 generations btw. So no, I'm not ethnically or culturally or religiously jewish.

This. Too many people on Sup Forums get their history from memes and don't do the research themselves.

even before
during the civil war

Nice IMCF pic. England got fucked this year.

we're not even serious about wars.

whenever we've been, we just literally FUCKED around and impregnated the local women.

that's our idea of colonization, spreading our seed and building restaurants.

not bad

i'm suprised a kiwi knows about this. respect.

very true my man

>3322000
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

AHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAH
Fucking kraut

Yeah Caligula is Germanicus's son Idk how I fucked that up, Arminius was a the leader of the Auxiliary Cavalry and lured Varian into the forest.

I'll take the bait alright

We have one of the biggest military spending in the world (dwarfed by USA's as everybody else's but still good). We have one of the most powerful navies in the world, and we do well with the air force and the army too. We're as good as any other modern country today, if not better than many. In the past we made the terrible unforgivable mistake to eat more than we could chew. We had an almost unexistant military industry in WW2 compared to France or UK, and a smaller GDP. We had no tanks and no ways to fight enemy tanks to be mass produced (our anti tank guns were decent, but not many). A mistake? Sure. We just had not the means to win the war we joined, but still hundreds of thousands of italians more or less willingly gave their lives for our country, no matter how much do you shitpost about the same 3 battles here.
In World War 1 we had a force to be reckoned with in terms of quality and quantity. We went full italian, though, and like the russians gave important places in the highest parts of military hierarchy because of heritage and not of actual leading quality
Before then we were a third world country and still many of our people fought side by side with americans during the ACW, and Lincoln asked for Garibaldi to become one of his generals

Any other italian that doesn't say this is a PD voter who can't just wait to have his wife fucked by a Mbeke.

This is not an opinion, it's history.

This.
Also, so many people underestimate role of natural resources and industry in 20th century.
Italy in ww2: No home oil, iron ore or coal, yet they get laughed at their tanks. Meanwhile, France with access to everything capitulate in one month, even with British help. But I digress.
Also, try to hold your state together, when half of it is mafia ridden shithole.
I dislike (not hate) italians to some extent, but you have to understand them. North is Bavaria tier region, in mentality and industry. Imagine, that your country gets Romanian level of gypsies, and try to have normal country.

Why didn't didn't you finish off the Jews when you had the chance, Roman? That might've been our only shot...

>modern Italian are moorish hybrids
>seriously, do you even think before writing? are you aware that your country is one of the most cucked in europe? with a humongous number of mixed couples? (shitskin men and german women)?
lol enjoy demographic crisis, in about 50 years secular germans will be extinct

Very high proportion of Italian men were/are faggots and completely incapable of caring for themselves without their mother. Unfortunately because Mario had to leave her at home to go to the war, his ability to provide any kind of organisational structure fell to bits and he was unable to feed himself.

Italians used to be the innovators in terms of warfare, most renaissance age armies had italian 'advisors' and mercs. However, with unification, the business of those condottieris ran dry, leading to leaders like cadorna in ww1 and similar excuses.

If you read about the history of jews in italy, you'll be surprised at how much we hate them

To be honest Italians have been great at warfare until the 20th century, although not as famous or as good as the French.
Certainly far better and more effective than their fragmented political structure would have suggested.

Excluding roman times, and starting only from the the middle ages onwards, we have had plenty of excellent generals and commanders (Gian Galeazzo Visconti, Raimondo Montecuccoli, Emanuele Filiberto di Savoia, Eugenio di Savoia, Andrea Doria, Francesco Morosini, Marcantonio Colonna, Giuseppe Garibaldi, Enrico Caviglia, etc...).
Even in later time up to ww2, there's been plenty of militarily excellent people, from theorists like Giulio Douhet, to commanders like Amedeo Guillet and field heroes like Durand De La Penne.

The problem is, from unification onward, the state itself has been extremely incompetent and careless both in the waste of men and manpower, as well in handling leadership and grand strategy.
Thus we ended up with certified morons at the high command, like Cadorna or Badoglio, may their name forever be cursed.

cuck

>Italians can't fight for shit
>still won both world wars
You're thinking of Germany there m8.

Do not be surprised, NZ troops fought in the campaign for Italy, up to the hills of Florence.

clash royale XD

>tfw you will never be an Italian neet that lives with their mother until they are 40

Look the secondhand-Italian is posting

Justinian destroyed almost all of Italy when he tried to re-unite East and west. After that the country was always divided and ruled by merchant republicans who could give a fuck less whether they use Italian soldiers or mercenaries.

...

...

I just wanted to make a joke
Sorry if it was shit

Italy = best blokes ever to war against

it's ok

These games are based on history, and whatever the developer's name is of the EU, CK, HOI, they do good research.

>what is the roman empire

>He clearly said that they were not ready
Yeah he did. After that he attacked Greece like a complete fucking retard. Explain.

/thread
Small city states couldnt compete with France or Austria.

HEMA (historical european martial arts) is having an incredible surge of participants and fans in Italy, we're literally getting ready for another crusade.

Italians hate Jews?

It s just a meme.
We lost 400,000 people in ww2 how many lives took to kick us from Africa balcans Russia and last from our own peninsula

It seems weird to say and some of our areas are of ashkenazi admixture (slight), but they always lived in ghettos. They were always kicked from Sicily, papal states, naples... they weren't exactly liked

Paradox Interactive.

They're also good at giving fans what they want. Zoroastrianism was put into the game solely because of fans desire to remove kebab and WE WUZ SHAHS.

Hahaha "we went full italian" sums you up right there. Stick to making good food, war is for the big boys.

Yes because the Italians were the original merchants.

The Bardis and Peruzzis were the Rothschilds of their day. Then they got bankrupted.

Now the Peruzzis own car dealerships where I live, kek.

Strategy games are not with the whole PC bullshit because you need to have an IQ of at least 95 to be able to play it.