Daily Japanese Thread DJT #1600

Cornucopia of Resources / Guide
Read the guide before asking questions.
docs.google.com/document/d/1pKgBm8Aa58mjB1hYhbK-VOPZsRBTXBuPBzw8Xikm2ss/pub?embedded=true

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jisho.org/search/上げる
twitter.com/SFWRedditImages

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I meant 2000

ぞいぞいぞ
いぞいぞい
ぞいぞいぞ
いぞいぞい

Just ignore them and learn them when you encounter them through reading later down the line

>上げる
>to raise
How's that not related to up?

Post the hardest thing you've ever read in Japanese.

Pic related for me.

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>上げる
jisho.org/search/上げる

I'm still not seeing where it doesn't relate to up

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Would you help me second-guess a translation, /djt/? Source is LoGH 1, context is the way in which Yang's CO looks down on him.
Original moon:
>若いながら歴戦の勇士であるはずなのだが、そういう印象をパエッタはまるで受けないのである。後方勤務本部で兵士の給料の計算でもしているほうが似つかわしく思えてならない。
Authorized translation:
>Though he was young, he was the hero of a historic battle, and yet Vice Admiral Paetta didn't get that impression from him at all. Still, when the officers' salaries were calculated in the rear service at headquarters, it was clear that he was being well paid in accordance with his record.

Shouldn't the second sentence be more on the lines of:
>He (Paetta) couldn't help thinking he (Yang) would be a better match for the rear service headquarters, calculating soldiers' pay.
or am I missing some grammar point here?

So let me get this straight.
A verb in plain form is always the end of a sentence.
If it's within a bigger sentence it is a clause that modifies the noun after it?

what raws groups do you guys use

image
>A verb in plain form is always the end of a sentence.
no
>If it's within a bigger sentence it is a clause that modifies the noun after it?
yes

That one looks like a guesslation to me.
If you can handle reading LoGH you probably should stop checking with the translations, it's a waste of time.

No?
Isn't Japanese SOV?

Yes, but verbs are not obligatory. Adjectives, copular words (だ・です), and bare nouns aren't considered verbs.

Tbh one of the problems with tae kim, another one is misexplainig が.

So TK says verbs are the only thing required by a sentence, but that isn't actually the case?

Thanks.
Still if it's a verb in plain form within the sentence it's the end of a relative which modifies the noun that follows it?

Pretty much. Japanese doesn't treat "this is a grammatically complete sentence" the same way that english speakers do.
Usually. Sometimes it's part of a fixed adverbial phrase, or similar. Use the rikai.

ねったいやちょくげきで

しんやにおきちゃった

Just starting out, was wondering if it's a good idea/worth it to learn kanji and vocab at the same time with 2 anki decks? (All in one Kanji and Core2k)
Also, for a beginner, is imabi better than Tae Kim?

>Just starting out, was wondering if it's a good idea/worth it to learn kanji and vocab at the same time with 2 anki decks? (All in one Kanji and Core2k)
It's a better idea than doing kanji first.
>Also, for a beginner, is imabi better than Tae Kim?
For a beginner? No.

Avoid Imabi unless you're some kind of linguistics genius

As for kanji/vocab, I'd say just focus on vocab for now, and if you find yourself having trouble remembering kanji and kanji readings a couple months down the line then you can think about doing kanji study, I'd recommend KD over RTK if you ever do do it

Thanks
By the way, how many words do you really need to learn from core2k to be able to read simple things like yotsuba (assuming you know the grammar) without looking up every 30 seconds? I really want to hone my grammar skills on examples because that's how it worked in other languages for me.

>>By the way, how many words do you really need to learn from core2k to be able to read simple things like yotsuba (assuming you know the grammar) without looking up every 30 seconds? I really want to hone my grammar skills on examples because that's how it worked in other languages for me.
I'm like 1200 cards into user core 5k and I can read things with some difficulty. I look up multiple words every single sentence but it's enough ground to be able to progress from sentence to sentence without constructing an interpretation for each one.

Also, image
I might say children's manga are on the same tier level as "internet forums" but with less jargon and more cozy common words.

You could do the Yotsuba Reading Pack deck or (my preference) just use its HTML file in a window next to the manga, it makes looking up words trivial.

Thanks.
I usually use a text hooker, but I guess it's the same.
Relative clauses are my biggest problem.

Rikai is better than parsers because you manually set where the word you're trying to read starts. Parsers are bad at drawing boundaries between words at the right places, and that's also one of the skills you have to get best at. So it's both messing up words boundaries and making it harder for you to get good at it. There's a reason the firefox text grabbing guide is so frequently recommended.

This is that time when you realize that even official translators make mistakes (or don't know what they are supposed to know) and stop relying on translations.

これわペンです

オマエ頭いいな

Thanks again.

I don't get this image, I need 150k words to read a newspaper?

Assumed known words is shit like names and places.

What's meant with hesitations?

Uh...

there are so many errors in RTK

Doing RTK is the error

I like the concept of breaking down kanji radicals and remembering everything easier.

So do I, it's just KanjiDamage does it so much better than RTK does

But hey it all leads to the same thing, it's just the journey there is slightly more painful with RTK

too far in to change now

has anyone done kanji-first without mnemonics or radicals, just meaning/keyword?

what does 一日 mean?

You put the long vowel mark before a consonant and it elongates it, it's often used to add emphasis

"I'll try hard tttttttoday too!"

First of the month obviously

What would be the fucking point?
If you're not retarded and don't need someone else breaking kanji down and and making up mnemonics for you then you can remember them in vocab right away.

there are only 2-3k useful kanji and many times that useful words. I guess that if it would make learning new vocabulary easier it would be worth it.

Why Aoba's picture is often on DJT cover?

It wouldn't.

how do i index cards in my mining deck?

Because がんばらなきゃぞい

Except it would, you autistic vocab drone

It's not a competition you know, people can do whatever methods they want, they both have advantages and disadvantages depending on the person doing them

pic related

just started reading yesterday and i had to stop after 5 mins because i had to look up 90% of the words

What's the advantage to rote learning only keywords of kanji before doing vocab, then?

Mnemonics have the advantage of being easier for mentally challenged or teaching you to write shit, but without them it's pointless.

Gambattene

たしかに doing kanji study without mnemonics is pretty retarded, wasn't really trying to defend doing that, but I'm sure it would still have its benefits, for example it would still make learning vocab somewhat easier just from the exposure of all the kanji, whether or not it would be worth the time investment is another story, you'd have an easier time telling apart similar kanji too even without having to use mnemonics

random word taken from my twitter feed I'm using to start reading with short sentences: 認証

it becomes "acknowledge evidence" as keywords, and every time I'll see the word (once I have learned those keywords, which will take me a month) I'll at least remember the keywords.

I'm really wondering how well/bad it'll work. I'll report back in a few months.

皆がぞい子を強姦したいんだから

Hey guys
Does "あんなことが人間に出来るの?" mean
"Is that humanly possible?"
I've tried several translators and none of them is clear but this seem to be the gist of it.

It's literally "Are humans capable of such a thing," but "humanly possible" works too.

>スパッキーちゃんはちょうど今吠えながら、
>裏庭にある孔の突き抜けたホースから吹き出している水で遊んでいて、
>ずぶ濡れになってしまいました。

>Just a minute ago, Sparky was playing with the water spouting from the backyard's punctured hose while barking, and got dripping wet.

I wonder if this is a preferable translation/ interpretation. Are there any faults you mind pointing out?

いいえぜんぜんぞくないよ

This sounds completely retarded and backwards. Good luck with your endeavors, I guess.

I don't really get that image but 30k words seem a bit much.

My estimated English vocabulary is 15k and I only have to look up a word once in blue moon and even then I knew what it means before looking it up via context alone.

Your estimated english vocabulary is significantly lower than your vocabulary actually is. Vocabulary estimation tools basically make everything up.

>Tbh one of the problems with tae kim, another one is misexplainig が
What's wrong with が?

He explains が as if the 好き in 君が好き is a verb meaning "to like".

I have 11k+ words just in my mined deck, on top of the 2-3k+ I knew from core and random shit before, and still am not even close to できるing in any way

好き is the 連用形 of 好く.

I think Tae Kim explain が quite well.

なんかなにもしたくなくなってきた

>綱
>網

>好き is the 連用形 of 好く.
So? That doesn't suddenly make the nominative stop being the nominative.

>tfw my whole life revolves about learning japanese
I feel like I can't afford wasting time on anything else if I want to make progress.

If you love learning it that much then move there.

Except it functions as a 形容動詞 in that form, you can't just append a new clause directly after it without anything in between, like a normal verb in the 連用形.

I don't see what 好き's part of speech has to do with how が works, though.

I am fully aware of this feel

Pretty damn easy to come up with mnemonics for mountain + rope and net + death

Thanks user.

I assume you were the one who said that he incorrectly explained 好き being a verb meaning to like, which it is a stem of.

Also, Tae Kim is pretty unconventional and tries to reinvent a bit it feels like, so there might be confusion.

Unfortunately you have to be fucking rich to move there to learn, otherwise you have to learn the language before you can move.

>death
What

Has anyone here used the "Japanese for dummies" book? Is it any good??

Any input on this?

I feel like 孔の突き抜けた is an odd expression for "punctured" perhaps...

Hey people, I don't usually participate in this chat but can you guys help me in how you say this phrase?

Do you have any sexually transmitted diseases?
And also
Are you clean?

It's perfect for an idiot like you

Rude

>I assume you were the one who said that he incorrectly explained 好き being a verb meaning to like, which it is a stem of.

Navigation is not a verb. It's a noun.

好き is not a verb. It's a na-adjective.

Tae kim says 好き is a verb and that が is marking the object. This is wrong and confusing on so many levels that it's just plain not acceptable.

>Also, Tae Kim is pretty unconventional and tries to reinvent a bit it feels like, so there might be confusion.

There's unconventional and there's wrong. If you want to use grammatical terminology, you have to use it correctly. You can't repurpose "object" to mean something it doesn't mean. This isn't a technical thing. People literally get confused by this.

He could say [people use patterns like Xが to talk about things that are out of X's control, like Xが好き "I like you"], but when he outright breaks japanese's morphosyntactic alignment in order to gloss over wording differences, that's not okay.

>網
>糸 + 冂 + 亡 + 丷

>亡

Does いる give a connotation of the actor being in control of whatever's happening?

>i had to stop after 5 mins because i had to look up 90% of the words
This happened even to the best of us, おきばりやす

聞き取りの練習をしたいけどすごくめんどーい

宀

Is there a more damning (common) radical

I considered going to a language school in japan for a year.
I would lose my job that pays damn well though.
The problem is I'm not qualified for that job and only got it because I worked my way up so not sure if I ever get a job as good again.

What's damning about that

Tae Kim "reinvents" and reformulates a lot. Some people have problems with it, others go with it through the guide then adapt to other source material.

Don't worry, Japan will probably still be around when you retire.

>There's unconventional and there's wrong. If you want to use grammatical terminology, you have to use it correctly. You can't repurpose "object" to mean something it doesn't mean. This isn't a technical thing. People literally get confused by this.

It's probably common because it's easier to draw kanji in a box shape when that radical is at the top