Do psychedelic drugs give you any valid spiritual insight, or do they just make you go crazy? Is there even a difference in our 21st century burgerscape?
When people take a psychedelic and become psychotic, are they operating on a higher or lower level of reality?
Can their continued prohibition be justified?
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>Do psychedelic drugs give you any valid spiritual insight, or do they just make you go crazy?
Yes and no to both, assuming by spirituality you mean just brain chemistry and no supernatural shit
>When people take a psychedelic and become psychotic, are they operating on a higher or lower level of reality?
No such things, their brains are just operating differently
I do psychedelics a few times a year just to flex my brains a bit, feels great to break bad thinking habits and let your brain just do it's thing without your conscious limitations. But thinking it's anything more than brain chemistry is just silly. Yes you might've seen God or you might feel really connected to everything after tripping but that's drugs for you, they make you see and feel things that aren't real
Drugs are for degenerates. No exceptions.
This, it's more like an experience to have, but you need to fully know that verything you see/feel/hear is just your brain influenced by chemicals
It's like watching a movie, it's important to believe it's real while you're in it, because otherwise it's pointless, but you obviously know that it's fiction
This.
>Do psychedelic drugs give you any valid spiritual insight
The world is bigger than we know. I ate 5/8 oz one night solo. Had friends enjoy the same amounts. OOBE etc. I quit smoking and drinking because of that night.
Taking psychedelics makes your mind see outside the box. The best way to describe it is Imagine looking through life at a TV screen. Acid or any other drug takes you from that TV watching perspective and puts you in the position of the person watching TV show being recorded. You have insights both good and bad that you would not have previously had without experiencing it firsthand
They disrupt the info processing networks you have formed in your brain over years of conditioning.
This can either be freeing and elevate you to higher perspectives - realising how there are alternatives to what you thought were constants/the only options - giving freedom of choice in how to think, act and live. This is bad for the established order that relies on obedient sheeple - There is no place for an individuated human soul.
Or they can be destructive and ruin your methods of living in the world, without exposing alternatives. This is a psychotic break - you can't go back to the old illusions, but you didn't gain enough insight to move forward/up, resulting in a collapse of your models of how to exist well in reality. This is bad for the established order because it ruins useful idiots and maybe even precious property.
They are great fun too. Do recommend. They make music EVEN BETTER!
No.
Your brain freaked out because of all the weird chemicals that was inside it, you didn't meet god or saw the universe, you just tripped
>It's like watching a movie
That works too, I think of it more as a brain vacation, just getting away from your routines and familiar surroundings for a while to experience something completely different. Has honestly improved my mental health massively
Psychedelic experiences can unlock inner collectivist desires in hardcore individualists.
(((They))) can't just have people dropping out of the system.
>Your brain freaked out because of all the weird chemicals that was inside it, you didn't meet god or saw the universe, you just tripped
Not wierd chemicals. psilocin etc breaking down in my brain. Not wierd at all. You go ahead and eat 5/8th an oz and tell me how boring your evening was lol.
I saw myself across the room.
What would valid spiritual insight even be?
Drugs just put your brain into a slightly different mode by doping it. Sensory enhancements/distortion and general euphoria are typically the strongest effects of popular drugs. Nothing wrong with it but there is nothing supernatural or spiritual about it.
Search deep into the topic oh PHARMAKEIA and you will understand.
All drugs, be it medical , spiritual or recreational, are a form of spiritual mind control.
>>This morning I had the experience of eating breakfast.
>NO. Breakfast is a cultural CONCEPT and you can't EAT a concept
I'm not saying you didn't experience something, I'm just saying it didn't have a higher meaning than just your brain being influenced by drug
They make your brain work different, not just wrong but also different.
So may truly think different and get prospectives, opinions and views you wouldnt normally get.
are you mentally challenged?
I've taken LSD a couple of times before, in small/medium doses only.
>Do psychedelic drugs give you any valid spiritual insight, or do they just make you go crazy?
Neither. They provide a feeling of euphoria and glee. Your brain starts working at a really fast pace, and forms neural connections that weren't there before. Synesthesia is a common aspect of acid induced hallucinations.
>When people take a psychedelic and become psychotic, are they operating on a higher or lower level of reality?
Do you know the meaning of psychotic? Why are you taking drugs and "levels of reality" on the same plate? I think you should go to /x/ because it's hard to give you a serious answer when your questions are completely misinformed. Hallucinogens and psychedelics aren't "spiritual experiences", they are what you make them to be, and it might feel spiritual while you're intoxicated but once it wears off, you realize it was only a ride, and reality will still be what it always has been. Unless you're some degenerate and loose control, in which case, good luck being lost in eternal nothingness.
There is two things about psychedelics that scares decision makers. They seem to be very much regular addictive drugs and they distort reality.
People fear those two things. Its shame because they generally are not physically addictive and they can be really eye opening.
The brain does a lot of things to keep our focus on what is relevant to human survival. Psychedelics allow a person to see things that are very beutiful that our brains are primed to ignore. It wouldnt be very practicle to be admiring a tiger for its stripes and its musculature when its running at you, would it?
Tree bark is very colourful. I was shocked by how much the colour varies.
It's time to take a break from drugs if you have trouble differentiating hallucinations from reality. Tripping is great but everything in moderation my friends
Ever drink coffee?
Drugs are mainly illegal because they empower crime syndicates
>That works too, I think of it more as a brain vacation, just getting away from your routines and familiar surroundings for a while to experience something completely different. Has honestly improved my mental health massively
This is a good description
>drinking the caffeinated Jew
user said he had an out of body >>experience
Are you saying the purpose of making them illegal was to empower crime syndicates?
Drugs do allow your brain to function out of bounds.
If you listened to Dr. Peterson he talks how your level of perception narrows so your thoughts get specialized in a narrow field.
Drugs disrupt that and allow you to get some insightful ideas and new legitimate points of view.
Its like 90% delusion and idiocy, 5% weird shit and 5% insight.
Ever eat sugar?
Crime syndicates are empowered by them being illegal.
The demand is ever present and will remain so.
ie
Frenchie was being mildly autistic and then you went full american mong on him. Both of you stop now.
Psychedelics wont give you legitimate spiritual knowledge.
Simple test:
Look at the people who claim that they possess spiritual knowledge after taking psychedelics. Hippies, looks retarded, talk about bullshit, act like Jim Carrey lately.
Now compare them with monks and how they talk and behave. Exactly.
There's a difference between experiencing something and the reality of something. You can't eat a burger from a billboard, but the experience of seeing a burger on a billboard is still pretty appealing.
What I meant was that you can't shit on someone's claim of having had an EXPERIENCE because you mistake it for their assertion of reality. They still had the experience, regardless of wether or not it reflected reality.
Except the permanent mind-altering side-effects, of course.
I didn't implied he didn't, he started his post with "the world is bigger than we think"
as if his experience had taught him something real about the world that he couldn't find out otherwise, a trip is just a trip, it doesn't connect you to god or to the universe, it's fun, it can make you think, but it's not magic
They allow you to see the world in a more artistic way. They dont make you smarter and they dont reveal god to you.
Lots of medical studies indicate they reduce depression.
>It's time to take a break from drugs if you have trouble differentiating hallucinations from reality. Tripping is great but everything in moderation my friends
Thanks for your consideration Abdul. I have been clean for many many years.
Sorry you miss out on all the good stuff in the world like mushrooms and bacon.
>I'm just saying it didn't have a higher meaning
Excellent. Go to the jungles of south america, and tell that to our tourists who spend time with the tribes in the jungles. If you have never eaten a totally natural substance like fresh cube mushrooms, you have no right to pretend to understand.
>Drugs do allow your brain to function out of bounds.
I have never had a "bad trip" and I don't know anyone who has. Ever. I only did them a few times, but we mega dosed because I grew them, why not. half oz was typical dry weight. there really is a freedom of though in that state. Id never tell someone to make a habit out of it....hell, no more than a few special times in a life is all you need of that. It had me self reflect to the point that I didn't exist. Like I said, I quit smoking and drinking because of it.
>the world is bigger than we think
That comment is because I wonder how far away from nature we need to get. I don't mean preservation, but instinct. Animals can survive so much, but we as humans are weak. A power outtage for a few days will kill in cities...but the bird and its friends just go on their merry way. Humans lost instinct. The thing that makes us human is being replaced with smart phones. We use google instead of our memory. We are all part of the machine, not of nature. A school of fish never bump into each other, but humans can't walk down a street without bumping into a lamp post.
I don't know man, I'm convinced that the primary purpose of the brain is to filter out information irrelevant to survival. Like the one user said, admiring a tiger's stripes as it mauls you is retarded.
If that's the case, then using substances which modify or reduce the brains filtering mechanisms would necessarily expand your experience of reality, useful or not. But with such little risk of being mauled by tigers in the modern world, there are far fewer legitimate dangers to kicking back and admiring their stripes.
>I have never had a "bad trip" and I don't know anyone who has. Ever. I only did them a few times, but we mega dosed because I grew them, why not. half oz was typical dry weight. there really is a freedom of though in that state. Id never tell someone to make a habit out of it....hell, no more than a few special times in a life is all you need of that. It had me self reflect to the point that I didn't exist. Like I said, I quit smoking and drinking because of it.
I know plenty of people who have had bad trips.
drugs are for degenerates and criminal niggers
m.youtube.com
Okay, last time.
my boy terence
personally, I believe psychedelics have spiritual properties. Even in a most literal sense, it's true, so long as you understand that the "spiritual" applies to the subjective nature of our experience in the physical, "real" world.
The problem is that they lead to introspection. Whether by directly exploring one's mind, or exploring it through your interactions with your interpretation of reality. You can learn a lot about yourself. It's no coincidence that a lot of people say marijuana "shows you yourself" or that it amplifies your current state of mind.
People who look inwardly will begin to solidify in themselves. They'll have a deeper respect for the unknowns around them. But that just makes them better at picking up on bullshit. A lot of people depend on bullshitting to make a living, so you become the enemy of anyone who wants to peddle bullshit.
People who study their own minds are harder to control. Simple as that. You don't need to take these drugs to do that, but they offer the opportunity to experiment and experience new unknowns of your own psyche (that you usually ignore).
They also could actually help people with addiction, depression, anxiety, ptsd, and other mental disorders. They perform better than pharma, they're cheaper, and they're safer (at least, some of them are). All because it encourages introspection and altering one's pov to get a new angle on something. People really underestimate how powerful a slight change can be to helping you understand the bigger picture. Think of a drawing of a cup from below, it's just a circle. But if you're given another angle, from the side, you understand.
Psyches will help people, but if they let people help themselves, people will destroy Their systems of control.
Roll the dice , odds are that you could do one of three things ,
1) you could have a WTF experience that you can not articulate.
2) You have a deep and profound experience that improves your life.
3) You fuck your mind up and have a mental illness for the rest of your life.
No. I don't drink alcohol or coffee. I don't smoke or consume drugs, and I don't watch pornography.
Yes and that is somewhat my point, those experiences aren't real and you shouldn't be claiming "the world is bigger than we know" because of things you experienced on drugs.
I might be overly aggressive on this because I've seen people go too far to the rabbit hole and become stinky hippies who do nothing but babble about their enlightened experiences so my apologies, I think we just had a bit of a language barrier problem here
>permanent
That'd be nice, sadly the positive mind-altering effects slowly fade away and your brain eventually gets driven back to narrow thought patterns causing all sorts of stress, anxiety, depression and shit
>I know plenty of people who have had bad trips.
I have herd rumors. Mindset is clutch. If you have serenity going into it and the right intentions, you will never have a bad time. The people around you make a difference. I had a buddy one night look me right in the eyes, and ask "What is the meaning of life". I told him about the boulder and the hill. He then went and sat on the front porch for an hour staring at the stars. He was a total load before that night. I think something in him broke, because he has been a workaholic since that night.
>drugs are for degenerates and criminal niggers
And silicone micro chip engineers.
>my boy terence
I can't discount him, because Ill sound like some of these straight-laced people here. I have not and never will DMT. He seen shit too lol.
I can't argue with that either. I have had 1 & 2.
this , I was hated religion and had no respect for faith before shrooms. After eating them I come across a quote by goebbels and got my noggin joggin. They give you a different perspective
Learn what the definition of drug is befor you comment on the subject, pleb.
>operating on a higher or lower level of reality
Define wtf you mean by 'levels of reality' first. I've taken my fair share of psychedelics and I still don't know what people mean by this.
It depends on the person. Everyone has a different type of personality.
Ive seen LSD enlighten people, ive seen it make people crazy and stupid on it.
Their prohibition is unjustified because it doesn't work, LSD is more available than ever thanks to the internet. More research should be allowed as there is a use for psychedelics, particular in therapy.
I believe LSD helped me resolve my depression and dissolve my suicidal tenancies. Ive been drug and alcohol free for 4 years since my last trip.
>AnCap
The memes are real.
Last time I did mushrooms I approached that eternal nothingness. It chases me in my shadows and haunts my soul now. I had never had even the slightest bad experience w/ shrooms before then. Sucks pretty bad my man
Psychedelic drugs are illegal because dumbasses like to take them and trip balls and jump out of windows.
I have done psychedelics before (LSD, Mushrooms) and it does seem to open your mind but in my opinion you rather have an open mind or you don’t. So psychedelics just enhance that mindset.
>If you have never eaten a totally natural substance like fresh cube mushrooms, you have no right to pretend to understand.
>If you have never taken a product which is known to alter your perception, the way your brain processes information and cause hallucinations, then you can't pretend to understand why people believe they met god when they took it?
Never go full retard.
Humans love to believe there is a higher being, that there is something more to life, some people believe in ghosts because they heard weird sounds in their house and saw shadows move in the dark, this is just being human
Of course that if you take psychedelics, it's human to believe that what you see is coming from god, or from the universe speaking to you, the fact that some people visit Tribes in the jungle doesn't prove any kind of connection, it just proves they can't distinguish fiction from reality, and they lack the critical spirit that would have made them realise that all of this just comes from their brain, which itself is pretty amazing
> trip balls and jump out of windows.
Natural selection.
You don't eat sugar?
depends on the situation and the drug of choice
shrooms made me go crazy for a few hours
Are you happy?
>I might be overly aggressive on this because I've seen people go too far to the rabbit hole and become stinky hippies
You are talking about drug abusers and not someone who has used mushrooms 4 times in my entire life. I know people who have overdosed on heroine and died a few times in a week. I never have done that (never will). What is your point?
So you are discounting my personal experiences of megadoses by telling me about your personal observation of a dirty street urchin? Thats not an argument.
>Natural selection.
Hahahah, You have a better chance of getting hit by lightening a few times.
>Never go full retard.
Keep on drinking your fluoride water Rizwan.
Very happy. Thank you.
As little as possible. I don't drink soft drinks, and avoid as much processed food as I can. Most of my food is grown locally.
I guess you just disagree with the method and not the claim itself, which is fair if you've known people gone off the deep end.
Personally they've given me immeasurable insight into myself and my environment, but sometimes it seems like I used cheat codes or skipped ahead to the climax of a novel.
I think there certainly is some degree of danger in knowledge without experience, and I wonder how it would feel if I had learned these things after 8 decades of life experience, instead of during 8 hours of spiritual entertainment.
It'd be really hard to get addicted to psychedelics because of the fast tolerance buildup
for me now that i know my brain can create elaborate visions fueled by certain chemicals i realize religion is a completely human delusion. it is quite beautiful and spiritual but it's made in our minds, not outside them.
you believe to be the only one to have had psychedelic experience, you're not
people condradicting your views doesn't mean they didn't have those experiences, stop gate keeping
I've known people that used them multiple times a month, due to either 'chasing the dragon' or just the habits and associations of it. Kind of a bummer.
You get spiritual insights while on psykedelika they say, but is it real? Is it not just a creation of your own imagination? Maybe everything is.
And that's why alcool is forbidden right?
>ever eat food?
don't be so obtuse toothpaste
It's a hit or miss.
You either realize something about yourself that causes you to improve, or you start getting hooked to the feeling of "not existing" and get addicted and become a vegetable.
In most countries you can easily order some HWBR and try it out (gray zone, allowed to order the seeds, not consume them), that type won't give you any spectacular visions but it will erase you from reality. Just don't overdo it and take 10 seeds. Heavy vasoconstriction (itching like fuck) and having a bad trip is extremely likely. If you already have problems with vasoconstriction due to disease or have any heart problems, stay the fuck away.
Basic home remedies to ease the itching and keep the vasoconstriction to a minimum is Cayenne Pepper (Need to consume like 1 tablespoon or 2 of it, put it into pills if needed) or just consume a big bar of the darkest chocolate you can find before you do the seeds.
If you can, find a real vasodilator instead.
Overall, I recommend finding the real stuff instead if you insist on having such a experience. Just gave you a quasi legal option. Just shave the seeds first, rinse the seeds in cold water for 15 seconds. chew 4 of them to a pulp and keep the spit and the seed pulp in your mouth for 30-50 minutes swishing it around. Drink a tablespoon of the spit (not the pulp) and spit out the rest to avoid some of the nasuea.
And prepare to get fucked (Takes 2-4 hours before it kicks in, can last for 12 hours or more). If you are prone to freakouts get a sitter that can spend atleast 8 hours with you after it kicks in. The other chemicals in the seeds are toxic and can do a number on your liver kinda like nutmeg, so it's a once a month thing. Resistance builds very fast too.
And get a puke bucket. Puking is very likely.
You're still a pleb.
>you believe to be the only one to have had psychedelic experience
>but is it real?
Can you prove the existence of god? Can you prove that my god is the god of your understanding? My prayers don't go the same place yours do and mine are answered pretty regularly. Does that tell me that you are praying to the wrong god?
which quote was it?
I can imagine that most psyc increase the activity in your pineal gland, in addition to slowing your brain wave activity. It would be as a wake dream in other words. I haven't tried any of it, but i am tempted to try something.
All I'm saying is drugs don't reveal you any great truths and things you experience while on drugs don't actually mean anything, they're just your brain chemistry being all wonky for a bit.
Ffs I've studied the fabric of reality until I learnt how to meld my consciousness into it and essentially become one with time and space itself. Was a wild ride but doesn't change the fact that in reality I was drooling on my friends carpet
And on today's episode of ; things that NEVER happened, pt 1.
>Personally they've given me immeasurable insight into myself and my environment
As long as you recognize that this insight is just drugs allowing you to perceive things in a way you couldn't before. Reality has stayed the same, you're just seeing it differently
Replace crime syndicates with the deep state and yes.
>in reality I was drooling on my friends carpet
O great Sage, teach me your ways! I am but a humble acolyte, my greatest attainment is staring slack-jawed at the wall!
Any self respecting white man in this thread that has never done an amphetamine or strong natural psychadelic you are a disgrace.
Amphetamines are the white man's drug.
Ive tried only lsa so far and it was fucking great
DMT is one helluva drug. Definitely once in a lifetime thing for me, that shit was just way too intense
>Do psychedelic drugs give you any valid spiritual insight, or do they just make you go crazy?
I had meditative breakthroughs that were akin to religious experiences before I ever took drugs and it's the same thing. Which makes sense if you think about it, the psychedelic drugs aren't adding anything new, they're just flooding your mind, something you can do by steadfast meditation, fasting, exertion, tiredness.. it's just much harder.
>As long as you recognize that this insight is just drugs allowing you to perceive things in a way you couldn't before. Reality has stayed the same, you're just seeing it differently
>drugs don't reveal you any great truths and things you experience while on drugs don't actually mean anything, they're just your brain chemistry being all wonky for a bit.
Nihilism from a finn who would have guessed. If you realize "it's all chemicals man" then the experiences on drugs are just as real as anything else, aren't they? All you're thinking and feeling right now is just chemicals too. Any insights you get without drugs.. just chemicals.
Asserting one is more real than the other is pretty strange.
amphetamines are the crutch of a weak mans soul
hitler fucked up when he introduced them to the populace.
meth is the number one drug killing our race
true fax
>Do psychedelic drugs give you any valid spiritual insight,
yes, but you wont get spiritual insight taking LSD at a festival.
you should make a think out of it instead. like wake up early and go into the forest. take some LSD,mushrooms or what ever you have access to. the important thing is that you are in a environment whit as litel outside distraction as possible
Degenerate
They are illegal because of three reasons (all having to do with LSD):
1) Timothy Leary --- for continuously lying about the drug and what it is capapble of, advertising it as a miracle drug for all situations. Leary is a literal CIA shill btw, so it really jogs the noggin.
2) Hippies --- for being annoying as fuck and attracting so many teenagers who then ran away from home to go California and waste away on drugs.
3) The Death --- the daughter of a rich man killed herself by jumping out a window. The father blamed it on LSD, and solidified LSD's status as a dangerous drug. Of course, there was no LSD in her system but that didn't matter to lawmakers.
They have no reason to be illegal at any level. Weed has more reasons to be illegal than any psychedelic.
How it's this a fucking/pol/ related?
How is drug legality not a political issue?
>then the experiences on drugs are just as real as anything else, aren't they?
In the sense that they are indeed things you experience, but you often experience things that just aren't fucking real when you are on drugs.
>All you're thinking and feeling right now is just chemicals too. Any insights you get without drugs.. just chemicals.
Can't argue with that, however I hope the things that I'm thinking and feeling are the result of the reality I'm experiencing
Take the physical redpill, take DMT.
faith can move mountains but only knowladge can move them to the right place
they are illegal for a lot of reasons.
if anything they should be legal under guided therapy
but the general populace can't handle them.
the 60s/70s ruined their image by associating
them with "that" culture. Change their image
and less wacky people will gravitate toward
them. the silicon valley people microdosing
stuff is helping but the baby boomers really
fucked it up like everything else.
There's a psychedelic renaissance currently going on though I'm sure why. Could be since more people are "depressed" than ever and they don't want to be popping pills everyday. Or maybe it could be because of the Darknet Markets making easy to obtain in high purity (until Alphabay and Hansa got F E D D E D, but they are recovering slowly).
For a Sup Forumsack reason, you could say that whites want to escape their reality of constant hatred towards them since TV, Movies, and music all have an anti-white agenda. I've seen a ton of posts across the internet about people starting to turn to shit like fascism after taking LSD, which is the opposite of what Boomers did when they turned to Marxism and Communism.
I predict that a legitimate movement to make psychedelics legal will begin very soon. The stigma from Boomers and Hippies is dying off fast.
though I'm NOT sure why*
phoneposting from work...
>strapped down to a gurney
>IVS in both arms
>I grip the sides of the beds handles, unable to move
>hovering above me, an dark entity crowned with a white hood, on each side of his head were swirling swastikas
>I turn my head to the left and see a sort of vending machine that reaches to the heavens
>each button is labeled something like "tobacco, alcohol, sugar...etc"
>the machine is hooked up to the IVs in my arms
>drones hover around the Stretcher
>images of every camera in America
flash through my mind
>with opened eyes, I am no longer myself, only an orb with 360 degree vision
reading half of Beyond Good and Evil or talking to a stoner 16 year old will tell you the same thing, I really don't understand why and how this is so ground breaking for every psychonaut. Reinventing the wheel one trip at a time.
...