Any physics phaggots here that can disprove or confirm this analysis?
Forensic acoustic proof of SECOND shooter in the Las Vegas massacre
Nathan Richardson
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Jacob Campbell
He doesn't account for .308 rounds that would have different ballistics than .223
Just one of several things wrong with his video.
Leo Long
>Almost 30 minutes long
Hell no, man.
Give me a short breakdown on it
Levi Sullivan
The lag differential he describe is far too big to account for 308 to 223 and most other dumb shit.
Only real counter explanation is that he fudged his waveform analysis.
Christopher Allen
So not a physics major or anything but here goes:
>be scientist
>fbi asks for help identifying crime scene
>have ballistics experience and 3 hours to kill on a Sunday
>download YT vids of LV shooting and load into software
>pull out the bullet impact sounds from the slower riffle reports (bullets travel 3x faster than sound...assumed by .223 riffle)
>do maths
>determine that there are two different times between bullet hitting ground sound and the slower riffle shot sound arriving at ground zero
>look to see what distance you’d have to be from impact site to account for different times
>establish distance 1 is about 450 yards and consistent with SP shooting from MB hotel
>establish distance 2 is about 250 yards and hypothesize multiple second gunman locations
>slap fbi in face with 8 inches of limp dick about how easy this is to prove, via physics, here we’re at least 2 shooters desu
Hunter Lewis
Seems like he started with an assumption and worked backwards to fill in the data. Also, organic chemistry and mass spectrometry have fuck all to do with using ambient sound to determine location. In what way is this dude qualified?
Juan Bailey
Yeah I don’t disagree. Trying to find someone who can ‘do the maths’ for real and check his work to call bullshit or call it plausible.
Seems this may be an angle that is able to bust any attempt at coverup since the vids are out in public domain already. Would be huge if someone could go msm with hard physical evidence disproving single shooter theory.
This guy on the vid seems pompous and may not have credentials in acoustic forensics (I think he says as much in vid) but if he’s right and the only way to disprove what he’s saying is “shooter used magic” then we gotta spread the word.
Nathan Nelson
Lincoln Baker
Negative.
700 fps faster and 3 times the weight, the .308 would reach its destination much sooner than the .223 which sheds its velocity at a much faster rate than the .308.
That stuff doesn't matter anyway since the audio sources were not the same throughout the analysis.
The recording device would have to be in the same spot for his theory to work.
The area being shot at is large. It wasn't a set distance, so the range could be anywhere from 300yd to 500yd, all while the people recording it are moving.
No fucking way this proves anything.
Jackson Cox
Audio from YT vids is a tricky thing. Thinks about all the objects that sound would bounce off, reverberate and echo from before they got to the tiny microphone on somebody's constantly moving phone. Then throw in several different vids with audio from several different locations, all with different acoustic qualities. Then try to accurately detect minute changes in the report of shots within a torrent of shots. Doesn't seem like the kind of thing that can be proven
Evan Lopez
...
Evan Gutierrez
This
Cooper Cruz
>Negative.
>700 fps faster and 3 times the weight, the .308 would reach its destination much sooner than the .223 which sheds its velocity at a much faster rate than the .308.
Not twice as fast even from that fucking distance you stupid fuck. Stop talking out of your own fucking ass.
Landon Russell
I’d tend to agree but for two things:
1. Audio + video would give additional position details allowing each different recording to be the plotted and analyzed. Multiple recordings would not muddy the waters but allow for multiple checks leading to triangulation.
2. People and therefore recording devices were certainly moving, but all that is needed is one overlapping clip where shooter 1 and shooter 2 fire nearly the same time to establish distance at that recording location.
Carson Martin
this this forensic have an awfully hot coffe cup?
what do you think?
probably not.
Cooper Gonzalez
Ok shill, the average .223 is traveling 3000 feet per second out of the muzzle, which is faster than the average .308 round which is normally about 2900 fps. Regardless of his exact math, the general rule is that impact sound is FIRST, followed by sound of cartridge firing. Most any deer hunter can tell you that.
Austin Bell
>Audio + video would give additional position details allowing each different recording to be the plotted and analyzed
He didn't do this though. I'm not saying it couldn't be done, I'm saying he didn't do it.
It doesn't have to be twice as fast to effect the outcome of the analysis. Bullet velocity isn't a linear function, it is exponential. There are a fuckton of variables that he did not account for and if you account for even one or two of these things it blows his entire argument out.
Oliver Ward
Secondly, there is video out there from a taxi cab that clearly captures some kind of belt fed machine gun way off in the distance...after a long pause someone opens up right next to her car with a much lighter caliber, like a .223 ...clearly two different guns
Parker Ramirez
>Most any deer hunter can tell you that
Only if they are getting shot at. It doesn't work that way when you are doing the shooting.
Jayden Anderson
3rd...plenty of people took footage while laying immobile on the ground or behind cover. So the ability to measure impact lags is very provable with that kind of footage. And there is plenty of it circulating.
Gabriel Johnson
LOL of course it doesn't fucking work that way if you are the one doing the shooting. All the footage is from people being fucking shot at, so their phones would record impact first, with the gunshot secondary.
Zachary Foster
autism
Lincoln Ortiz
I'm old enough to remember all the other places that reported active shooters that night.
Aiden Hill
Welcome to Sup Forums
Lurk for two years before posting.
Enjoy your stay!
Elijah Foster
I think he means you can see the deer react to the bullet impact sound (if you near miss your shot) before the riffle report sound has a chance to reach the deer. Assuming distance is great enough that these two sounds are appreciably different.
Adam James
Now, why would the Tropicana report that emergency medical services were 'taking rounds' 'unknown shooter' after Paddock was already deceased on the 32nd floor?
Hudson Wood
Sweet jesus do none of you shoot guns? Your buddy is over in the pasture next to you, and he nails a deer. The first thing you hear is the projectile penetrating bone/ribs into the cavity filled with lungs and soft tissue. It sounds like a drum, and then you hear the gunfire report.
Matthew Fisher
I've been here ten years. You are being trolled. That guy just wants to drum up discussion and keep the thread active.
Noah Price
I might also mention, the sound of a .175 grain round breaking the shoulder bone and traveling through the lungs and heart of a large mammal is often time LOUDER than the sound of a rifle. The cartridge exploding is like an extremely loud firecracker, but you have a 300 lb animal that get completely penetrated and brother it's LOUD.
Nicholas Powell
dispute this....
Jason Nguyen
Ok let’s stay on target.
The vid files are out there. They fucking exist.
Can no one here replicate the calculations this guy is making and download the vids, sample the wave files and calculate the time between impact and gun reports to falsify his claim? Corroborate his chart of what distances create what time signature lags, etc? Like he says it’s not rocket science.
If I had the software I’d give it a try but I’m not trained in acoustics.
Seems this is something Sup Forums could do and prove plausibility or not.
Landon Jenkins
Based on sounds that he just assumes are real - never authenticates the recordings. It's like the guys who studied the 9/11 footage and tried to figure out if the "airplane" had extra fuel tanks etc while not realizing they were basically staring at a cartoon the whole time.
Adrian Martin
Separate issue. I have no beef with looking into what happened on 32nd floor of MB, but this bread is about plausibility of confirming a second shooter. Undeniably provable if what the guy on the YT vid said is true.
Caleb Wright
Fair enough. But he’s laid out his methods and there are plenty of legitimate vids of the event out there for the taking. Can no one replicate his claims and actually do he math so Sup Forums can call bullshit on this, or plausible?
Evan Taylor
If you can accept paddock was a shooter then you can accept there were two because there is equal evidence to prove both (SEE NONE). We literally have zero evidence that Paddock did squat. His body is there but that's the extent of it. Why is it so easy to believe he's the shooter but so hard to believe there was a second shooter?
I'm more interested in the Special agent in charge of the las vegas division... Aaron Rouse... He was counterintel, and though many may not know what that means... It is definitely a clue and most often overlooked.
Gabriel Lewis
Probably did a more complete/precise analysis, realized wtf he was truly looking at, and noped the fuck out of presenting anything other than a breadcrumb.
There's no way he believes his little spiel about "teaching the FBI" shit. Too opportunistic to not turn it into a marketing opportunity though.
Juan Baker
Ok more detail below if you don’t want to watch the whole vid:
There were at least two shooters firing on some 22,000 people at a country music venue in Las Vegas earlier this month, according to acoustic forensic evidence discovered by Natural News founder/editor Mike Adams, the Health Ranger, which, if the evidence holds true, adds a chilling new dimension to the largest mass murder in U.S. history.
The technique he used to isolate two separate shooters in audio and video posted online by eyewitnesses is the same one he regularly uses when conducting other research and testing at CWC Labs, where he is the science director. The technique, Mass Spec analysis, allows him to “pull signals out of noise,” which lets him isolate and ‘measure’ signals from instrument detection sequences.
In launching his explanation of what happened that night, Adams discussed a few basics of physics as they pertain to the velocity of bullets fired from the kind of weapons found in Paddock’s Mandalay Bay Casino hotel room — primarily .223 rounds common to AR-15-style rifles, several variants of which can be seen in crime scene photos published online.
But much of his analysis focused on audio examinations of available evidence. In determining that bullets were striking victims and the ground around them before sounds were heard, Adams got his first clues that more than one shooter was involved.
He determined the “lag time” — that is, the difference in time from when a bullet strikes and when it is fired from rifles used in the attack — and that, he said, “will tell you the range” of the shooter.
...to be continued
Jacob Young
Using a table he compiled based on the physics of bullet velocity, sound, lag time and other characteristics involving very specifically .223 55-grain bullets (grain refers to a bullet’s weight), Adams figured out how long it takes a round to travel 100, 200, 300, 400, 500, and 600 yards. He had already determined, based on published information, that accused shooter Stephen Paddock, 64, was about 400 yards away from the crowd below him in his hotel room on the 32nd floor of the Mandalay Bay hotel when he began firing. And he had also determined that the flight time of the bullet to the crowd from that distance was about .0528 seconds.
“Why is all of that important?” he asked rhetorically in a video presentation of the evidence. “Because forensic analysis of the audio files shows that there were two shooters. Yes. Two shooters.”
Adams said that the lag time for one of the shooters was about .559 seconds, which indicates a distance of about 425-475 yards — figures that match up to rounds fired from Paddocks’ 32nd-floor sniper position. But a second set of figures taken from some of the same audio files indicate that shots were fired from a distance of about 250-275 yards and a lag time of .374 seconds, or about half the distance of Paddock’s shots.
There is only one way to explain that, Adams contends: Two shooters.
He noted further that there is audio evidence of this second shooter intermingled throughout Paddock’s attack, as measured by the forensic acoustic analysis method.
Could Paddock have been moving throughout his attack? Not likely, if the closer firing was occurring throughout Paddock’s attack, Adams points out.
“You can’t hear the differences [in lag time] with your human ear…because the time differences are so slight,” said Adams. The difference can only be plotted using specific equipment designed to pick up on such slight acoustical differences.
...tbc
Nathan Long
On a whiteboard, Adams sketched the Vegas crime scene, showing where Paddock was firing from and where a second shooter, within a 250-yard radius, could have have been firing.
There is other anecdotal evidence to suggest Adams’ findings are correct:
— As reported by NewsTarget, an Australian man who was staying at the Mandalay Bay the night of the attack told local media he heard “multiple shooters;”
— A woman who called in to talk radio giant Michael Savage’s show on Oct. 4 also said she heard multiple shooters and claims a woman standing next to her was wounded by a round in the stomach while standing away from Paddock’s firing trajectory.
— As The National Sentinel has reported, Clark County Sheriff Joe Lombardo said in a news conference late last week that he does not believe that Paddock acted alone. “At face value, he had to have some help at some point and we want to ensure that that’s the answer,” Lombardo said. “Maybe he was a superhuman who figured this out all on his own but it would be hard for me to believe that.”