WW2 discussion

Old thread: All countries would be hostile towards America. They had 140 million people in 1945, not enough to fight the entire world. No doubt they could defend themselves, but the resources and manpower + existing militaries of the Commonwealth, USSR, Nazi Germany, France, Imperial Japan and Italy would be too strong for the US to fight all at once.

Other urls found in this thread:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franco-Prussian_War
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish–Soviet_War
youtube.com/watch?v=8TCruGS4jy8
youtube.com/watch?v=YnPo7V03nbY
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_aircraft_production
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junkers_Ju_388
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Felix
twitter.com/SFWRedditGifs

Discussing a false scenario under WW2 discussion is useless when there's so much to discuss about the actual war.

20 MILLION RUSSIANS DIED AND IT WAS A GOOD THING

They don't have to physically invade anything at all. They can't be successfuly invaded, they can keep the control of oceans and the skies and at least turtle until their strategic bomber force and atomic weapons are ready.

GET REKT SLAVIC SUBUHMANS
WHAT IS THIS K/D
DO YOU EVEN GIT GUD

In any case, US eventually develops the atomic bomb first.
Cue white flags raising after shrooms start appearing

The US didn't have a means to drop these bombs beside bombers, though. With no allies, they can't reach the European or Soviet heartland without being intercepted. All their fighter escorts would need to be carrier based.
Remember Germans were very far ahead in ICBM development and the Soviets had the bomb in 1949.

Again, the US was incredibly strong, but not *that* strong.

>They can't be successfuly invaded
I didn't say that, but "defeating the entire world" means invading and defeating them on the ground.

And no, with the IJN, Royal Navy, Regia Marina, Kriegsmarine and Soviet Navy + all their production capabilities they wouldn't keep control of all oceans, same thing for airpower.

>military deaths of USSR = 13.600 000 citizens

Cute, the POW deaths are included in this, as well as the deaths of those who fought against USSR

Fuck off, this thread isn't meant for you

LESS THEN 2 MONTHS TILL THE FRENCH FORCES SURRENDERED
REPEAT AFTER ME
LESS THAN 2 FUCKING MONTHS
HOW CAN ANY MILITARY POWER EVEN COMPETE

I do not think you understand. Soviets won. The KDA is irrelevant. They were playing a different game.

This is like Hillaryfags whining about popular vote.

But US literally had bigger naval production capacity than the rest of the world combined. Look up actual data, ships produced, both capital and escorts, subs and merchants.

Besides, how do you plan on stopping B-29 raids? Especially if they went for night-time nuclear one?

US carrier task forces would dominate the sea, or at least provide the means to launch a nuclear strike.

WE SHOULD HAVE KILLED ALL THE FUCKING ANGLOS IN DUNKIRK
BUT HITLER STILL BELIEVED IN THE GOOD IN THE ETERNAL ANGLO
NEVER AGAIN

Someone forgot their medication

We've done that and we're going to have to do that in order to run the scenario.

*gommies died, and that was a very good thing

lmfao

>Germany wipes out the size of the entire Soviet army in the first year
>Croatian smugly shrugs at meager German military "power"
>mighty Croatia stronk

Hoth said that if Germany had the nuke in late 44/ 45 it wouldn't have mattered because of enemy air superiority. Same situation for the US if they go against more than one power capable of power projection

That's why I say the UK+Japan would have wrecked us by 44

Protip: They can't.

Hitler was just cautious and scared. In fact the entire front going towards the NW-W Belgium/NL / shores was overly cautious because of Hitler..

:D

DELET THIS

HahahaahhaahahahabahhahaHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHA

:D
:D

>In any case, US eventually develops the atomic bomb first.
>Cue white flags raising after shrooms start appearing

It was a kraut bomb, how does it make the average German feel to know that the Yanks used stolen German tech, reverse engineered and dropped on the Nip.

It was caution, because the tanks Rundstedt wanted to use would be mobilizing on muddy marsh terrain. Guderian backed Hitler up and said the whole thing was stupid. Guderian is the leader armor expert at this point, mind you.

they might have won the war, but they can never beat german efficency
2 times they tried to destroy us.
they took away our land, genocided our people and are still to this day indoctrinating us via the media
BUT THE GERMAN SPIRIT WILL NEVER DIE

But that's the thing, they can't compete, unless they competed together. it's like pitting 5 Womens football team against 1 mens football team.

>But US literally had bigger naval production capacity than the rest of the world combined. Look up actual data, ships produced, both capital and escorts, subs and merchants.
OK, until the rest uses their advantage in resources to outproduce the US eventually.
Still they have larger existing navies and not by any means small ship building capabilities.
>Besides, how do you plan on stopping B-29 raids?
5000 km range. Not enough to make it back home to the US mainland. Not carrier capable. Germans and Brits had sophisticated night-fighter and high-altitude interceptors.
>US carrier task forces would dominate the sea, or at least provide the means to launch a nuclear strike.
Again, no carrier plane could transport a nuke, and the range of the airplanes was to little to penetrate deep into Europe/Soviet Union.
Not to mention the Carriers would be under constant threat of land based bombers and more capable land based fighters.
>how does it make the average German feel
Indifferent. On the one hand we got defeated, on the other it was objectively for the better of the world, no matter how Stormfags will screech.

>german efficency
Your production during the war was dreadful.

>BUT THE GERMAN SPIRIT WILL NEVER DIE
Germany will have 20 million muslim population before 2030.

>BUT THE GERMAN SPIRIT WILL NEVER DIE

I'm sad to say, but the german spirit died in 2000

1 month and 5 days to totally defeat poland
it was like a casual summer stroll for the germam forces

Care to explain?

I don't think so. If the UK provided the aluminum, oil, and rubber to Japan then their industry would have exploded. They'd easily be able to nab the PI, and we only won battles like Midway because of sheer luck. We found them before they found us on accident, and we could produce more BB's and destroyers. If they had more industry, it even with those victories the war for the Pacific would've lasted at least another year without decisive American victory.

We actually had plans to fight the UK and Japan, plans orange and red. Basically we'd have to fight in Canada and get mollywhopped by their combined fleet in the Pacific. We'd have to then defeat two extremely powerful and experienced navies. They'd be sharing tech so UK would have long range torpedoes and Japan would, fuck me, have radar. We couldn't even hit India, plan red regarded that.

Massive wastes of resources, far too many designs, dumb decisions by Hitler and other top Nazis, war economy adopted too late etc etc

>all the young men are fighting against the jews somewhere far away from home
>huh i wonder why there is no one in the factories

It's true they didn't go into war economy until 44. But if they did

Ever pondered why Germany wanted to spread to east?

Junge du nervst heftig. Wir haben 5 Millionen Mann verloren und über eine Million Zivilisten, hör auf dich damit zu brüsten.
...the war would have lasted 3 months longer. The difference was just too huge, USA, Commonwealth, Soviet Union were no match in an industrial war.

>smug about needing the soviet union, germany and czechoslovakia, taking over a month to conquer a single, completely surrounded, alone, country.

brah, the invasion was a disaster, Hitler planned his victory parade in Warsaw on september 6th, the city didnt give up until Sept 26th.

Seriously, Germany, you need to learn how to win wars, you never won any.

poles truly are pathetic. even with billions of foreign aid you are not able to build a economy stronger than subsaharan-africa-tier
still to this day your economy is based only on the lands that you stole from us, or more like the land that was given to you because you would never be able to achieve anything on your own

>Seriously, Germany, you need to learn how to win wars, you never won any.
Dumb meme en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Franco-Prussian_War

And that's only because Germany united only fought 3 wars
Fuck off already

be careful, i will report to the german police that you posted something about the holocaust not being real, you gonna get jailtime baby!!

>The difference was just too huge, USA, Commonwealth, Soviet Union were no match in an industrial war.

Hitler wasn't a complete lunatic though, he just underestimated how much control international Jewry had over the Commonwealth. He went into war with the British thinking it could be a limited war and that his main focus could be against the Jew led Bolsheviks.

1, then, good job.

the soviets didnt invade until you were fully beaten
they would have probably lost half their army if they tried to do so

What? So you're telling me that if Germany did the program in 40,ended in 42, then they wouldn't have been able to complete the Goering plan in 41 and cut off the UK from the Med, import oil from allied middle east, and invade the UK by 42? Then invade the USSR in 43?

Yeah, and we still occupied you within months in the two other wars we lost so horribly, really funny, isn't it?
Yes.

...

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish–Soviet_War

They did try to invade Poland by themselves, and they got btfo hardcore

Dear heavens. Consider the following:
>most German aerial losses were due to the USSR
>oil issue resolved
>Africa corps was doing fine until recalled due to supplies going to eastern front
>Turkey could've been used as a staging ground to snatch the vital Caucasus region in the first 6 months
>Britbong royal navy is a joke. Germany could simply fly torpedo bombers to inflict maximum losses around the intended invasion points
>they captured enough French civilian vessels for transport despite them sinking their own ships

How about now?

By 1943, the American navy was better than all the world's navies combined. The U.S. had approximately 25 top-tier carriers (not counting escort carriers) by early 1944.

You wouldn't have even made it past the Canary Islands.

(Also, by late 1944, the U.S. had a solution to the then-superior German tanks, the M26 Pershing. Bad. Ass.)

Sadly OP these theads are ruined ASAP by retarded kids.

>everyone I don't like is disabled and of lesser age than me

Argue or gtfo. I spent too damn long reading a lot of dry shit for a faggot ass uneducated pleb fuck to square up and say shit without backing it up.

>In 1940 when our army is still squishy, the US gets invaded by the unified world army hosted by UK's real son, Canada

>most German aerial losses were due to the USSR
Fair enough
>oil issue resolved
Not without a successful invasion, because the British and Soviets would simply occupy the ME like they did IRL
>Africa corps was doing fine until recalled due to supplies going to eastern front
No it wasn't, the defeat was due to the massive logistical advantage the Allies had in NA and due to the limits in power projection possible from Tunisia/Lybia into Egypt (only one railway, no harbors)
>Turkey could've been used as a staging ground to snatch the vital Caucasus region in the first 6 months
Possible, but only if Turkey joined the Axis, which they didn't.
>Britbong royal navy is a joke. Germany could simply fly torpedo bombers to inflict maximum losses around the intended invasion points
That's simply false.

Royal Navy and Air Force never lost air superiority over Britain and were always able to conduct operations over the channel. An amphibious invasion without complete areal and naval supremacy is a suicide mission.

youtube.com/watch?v=8TCruGS4jy8

Yeah, should have known that. The last one was nice though

What post, I just skimmed the thread, it's mostly shitflinging.

>By 1943

The war was won in the East in 1941 so good job there. Before that the German navy was decimating US shipping, so much so that it's true numbers of tonnage lost is still secret.

>they captured enough French civilian vessels for transport despite them sinking their own ships

You mean despite the Brits sinking all the French ships hahaha. Funniest part of the whole war

Fuck, copied a wrong video from the last thread youtube.com/watch?v=YnPo7V03nbY

The Soviets raped your people so much that they altered Germany's gene frequencies.
Seems to me the German spirit got SLAV'D.

If Hitler didn't go east, would Stalin have eventually pushed west??

I think we actually talked about a lot of this earlier.

So as far as the ME goes, the Goering plan would've had corps sent to fight in the near areas but not as far as Iran.

As far as logistics in Africa and ME go, they're perfectly square. They were going to use the Balkan and transmit areas through Turkish and Levant lands. They already worked out the necessary agreements. Egypt is a done deal. They could then thrust westward. They could move through France, then Spain, and attack Gibraltar directly. This would squeeze them out of the two narrowest ports required to enter the Med. The Goering plan is without a doubt rock solid. Only problem is the aforementioned supplies and lack of war economy.

Explain how the torpedo strat is false. It literally worked every single place it was tried from the Battle of Taranto to the Japanese sinking two of the UK's finest battleships with torpedo bombers.

>Royal Navy and Air Force never lost air superiority over Britain and were always able to conduct operations over the channel. An amphibious invasion without complete areal and naval supremacy is a suicide mission.

Here we go.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_aircraft_production

See how the UK is ahead of Germany? No take the war economy 43-44 numbers and use those instead.That's why this plan is based on the war economy being completed by 42. This is neglecting the fact the British RAF had to stage a massive amount of aircraft to ward off the Japs from sinking their precious BB's.

This is the correct answer. There's really nothing more to it. The simple fact of the matter is this entire thread is idiotic due to the the simple fact that during WWII there was really only three naval powers, two of which could maintain their naval force levels and only one that could grow rapidly.

The Soviets deserved every death they had for their hand in starting the war.

>fully beaten

of course, of course, and the earth is flat.
check your own historical records, german army was tragically behind schedule, the moment you met at the middle with your soviet friends, the wehrmacht had supplies left for barely 2 more weeks of continued fighting, and winter was literally 2 weeks away.
the entire campaign was a disaster, if you didnt get the help of 3 million soviets coming from the east, WW2 would probably not even be a WW, and would end in 3 months.
anybody with basic historical and military acumen will tell you the same.

only 1 country deserves to be smug about WW2, and thats Russia.
i dont even like the russians, but god damn, they deserve almost all the credit.

The main problem with an invasion to the american mainland, would be that everyone and their dog would be waiting and willing to fight.

>25 top-tier carriers

Daily reminder that every ace that has over 100 aerial victorys comes from germany. Would really like to see your conscript grade pilots fight against literal gods in planes

>With no allies, they can't reach the European or Soviet heartland without being intercepted.

B-36 was a true intercontinental bomber and its production was only delayed because there was no threat of the UK falling. It also flew higher than anything else around and shamed more than a few F-86 pilots when they showed that it could out dogfight them at its operational altitude where the first generation of jets struggled to maintain controllability.

lmao yeah pic related

Yes, it was covered extensively in the last thread.

145976067

I must of skipped over that part.

REE on my part

Obvious shitpost, but just to clarify, the Slavic influence in Germans comes from the assimilation of Slavic tribes during the medieval Ostsiedlung (German expansion eastwards).
>then Spain, and attack Gibraltar
Franco was never willing to join the war.

>The Goering plan is without a doubt rock solid.
How exactly were the Germans going to secure the ME and Egypt before the Soviets and Brits just occupied it with their existing (colonial) troops in the region?
>Explain how the torpedo strat is false.
You need air superiority to successfully interrupt shipping with bombers. The Luftwaffe didn't have air superiority.
>Last paragraph
You're forgetting the US

>Daily reminder that every ace that has over 100 aerial victorys comes from germany.

You should actually read up on Erich Hartmann and his disdain for Soviet aviation tactics.

>loses war
>brags that they didn't lose quickly enough

Pathetic. Is this what it's like to be unAmerican?

>if everyone goes to war with the US, and the UK gives them radar, then why is this even a discussion
>especially since we'd be squaring off with them in Canada first

Those gods became gods because they sent them on missions until they died. Luftwaffe didn't rotate pilots which means that overall quality suffered terribly in late war.
Also, Soviet aviation was quite inferior for most of war.

In 1945, the US had more warmaking power than the rest of the world combined, kraut.

Not to mention, the rest of the world would have been incapable of waging war without US aid. The US destroyed the Imperial Japanese Navy within 2-1/2 years, and the Bongistan Navy was nowhere near as capable as the IJN. Denied the use of the seas, the pitiful collection of feeble milkweeds would have had little chance, and it would have been a foregone conclusion that the US would cuck the rest of the world, which is what happened IRL as we know.

It's still an idiotic scenario. Literally 'The Entire world vs one country'. It's so fucking retarded it shouldn't even be mentioned and just reeks of anal anguish.

Franco didn't have to join the war. He just has to let Germans move through is territory. And ffs, are you even reading this? This is without Germany declaring war on the USSR and assuming the USSR wouldn't be ready before 43. The Brits don't stand a chance. They station troops but it wouldn't mean squat if proven Germans manhandle the Britbongs there.

As far as the air superiority goes, read the charts and compare the numbers, then subtract the substantial number of aircraft the Brits would have to place in the far east. The Germans would have dominated by mid 41 and had free reign in 42.

Forgetting the US though? You think they would invade Germany in 41 or 42? I'm pressing "D" for doubt friendo.

>You should actually read up on Erich Hartmann and his disdain for Soviet aviation tactics.

>soviets flying low and slow with no change in direction or evasive maneuvers is tactics

can you read?

>brags that they didn't lose quickly enough

im "bragging" that any other country would get raped in a day, holding our for a month and 12 days against literally millions upon millions of troops invading from all sides is a fucking miracle.

>Pathetic.

it is, learn to read.

Germans had existing high-altitude interceptors with high-caliber cannons that would have shredded B-36 without fighter support. Consider that these were at least a generation behind the B-36 (meaning there would be better designs) and that every country would build them, the B-36s would be fucked.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Junkers_Ju_388
>He just has to let Germans move through is territory
He always denied that, the Germans already had plans: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Felix
>The Brits don't stand a chance
But they did IRL. They won Africa.
>You think they would invade Germany in 41 or 42?
No, but their massive production capacity would easily outproduce Germany, like IRL.

holding out***
god damn phone.

Daily reminder that it's not rape if you want it

...

>the Bongistan Navy was nowhere near as capable as the IJN.

Well the Far East fleet certainly wasn't. The Home Fleet was more than a match but the RN feared another Jutland so badly that they never used its offensive capabilities like they should have. With the almost nonexistent maritime strike capabilities of the Luftwaffe the Home Fleet could have easily decimated Wilhelmshaven the Kiel Canal early in the war with minimal losses and effectively neutralized the Kriegsmarine early on.

In The Blond Knight he talks a good bit about the IL2 in particular and how whoever trained the pilots should have been shot. Notably that they maintained formation no matter what, while this was somewhat effective for something like the B-29 with its defenses the IL2 couldn't do it and it was idiotic. He talks about downing an entire squad with just his yaw controls. He also mentions that the fighter pilots weren't much better and that they routinely got into fights they couldn't win due to either a lack of patience or zealotry

>complain that Germany is "tragically behind schedule"
>this somehow isn't a Pole trying to console his defeat with the German timetables behind schedule
>Pole blames this on reading comprehension, but this is proven projection
>says he respects Russia in the war the most
>but then says any other country would get raped in a day

Work on that reading comprehension and keep your story straight bucko.

That's good info on Felix. I'll have to rethink my inks. That changes the game, certainly. And to correct that mistake yet again, Rommel pulled out from Africa because of supply redistribution. The Brits run away at Dunkirk and call it a miracle. They don't get completely decimated over Britain in the air war and call that their biggest achievement even when they lost smaller battles in the channel. They waited for Rommel and the Africa corps to be recalled due to a strategic shift and they say that's victory. How are you not getting this by now? The Brits will serve shit and call it apple pie.

>No, but their massive production capacity would easily outproduce Germany, like IRL.

What's the point if they're not utilizing it?

"In the Soviet Union, speaking to his generals in December 1940, Stalin mentioned Hitler's references to an attack on the Soviet Union in Mein Kampf and Hitler's belief that the Red Army would need four years to ready itself. Stalin declared "we must be ready much earlier" and "we will try to delay the war for another two years"."

Which speech? Must know.

I feel like he might say this about the Finns. And the Poles.

At the end of WW2 the USSR had the most powerful military on Earth (not counting nukes), so there would've been a brief period between 44 and 45 were Ivan could btfo Tubby on his own. Should clarify that late WW2 Ivan could do this in a defensive war only, he couldn't successfully invade (((USA))).

>millions and millions of troops
it was 1,6 million germans invading only from the west against 1 million poles

>has no navy
>has no nukes
>air force btfo by the combined RAF and Army Air Corps
>luckily user clarifies he thinks the reds would simply hold out
>as if that's possible against carrier and long range bomber based atom bombs pounding every red city
>a country without roads and largely without electricity is going to be able to capably fight back once it's cities are wiped

The second world war was a strange conflict indeed

"Mussolini told his son in law Count Ciano that he was personally jealous over Hitler's accomplishments and hoped that Hitler's prowess would be slowed down by Allied counterattack.[191] Mussolini went so far as to lessen Germany's successes in Europe by giving advanced notice to Belgium and the Netherlands of an imminent German invasion, of which Germany had informed Italy."

how would you get to american mainland? Germany navy couldn't even land on Britain

It's important to remember that the USSR lacked the refining capabilities to effectively feed its air force. More than half of all aviation fuel came from the US.

Jesus fucking christ, was everyone just spilling German plans everywhere? How the actual fuck did they get anything done?

Right?? I didn't even factor in lend lease or anything.

But America was never intended for occupation? Or military conquest for that matter so its a stupid question
Short answer? German militaristic culture

you wouldnt
a naval invasion over the atlantic ocean even at todays standards would be impossible

the kraut said:
>main problem with an invasion to the american mainland, would be that everyone and their dog would be waiting and willing to fight.
I asked him how could he get there

...

D'you think that the new COD and Wolfenstein will sell well? do modern Germans like these video games were your character kills Germans?

ich wette du hast cdu gewählt

If you could win against us you would attack in 1945, Murrikan. Instead you assassinated stupid Patton and gave Stalin a handshake. Later whole NATO WW3 plan was "we run, nuke West Germany behind us and hope it does not escalate"

>D'you think that the new COD and Wolfenstein will sell well?
Don't know, I don't play video games.
>do modern Germans like these video games were your character kills Germans?
Most don't care I guess, I certainly wouldn't like it. Then again, there's tons of Russians that play games in which you kill Russians.
>jeder der kein Realitätsverweigerer ist wählt CDU
Halt deine Fresse Ronny

gib doch einfach zu dass du mutti gewählt hast
oder durftest du noch gar nicht wählen?