How could Germany have won ww2...

How could Germany have won ww2? I believe they were fucked from the very start and blitzkrieg was such a success by pure luck.

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They could if they didn't declare war on everyone.

True.

If they found the oil deposits near norway they would have been able to fuel their war machine much longer

People have suggested many possible ways for the Axis to win WW2, from the Germans winning the Battle of Britain by not switching to a terror bombing campaign against British cities to the Japanese actually catching the American aircraft carriers at anchor in Pearl Harbor. The way I'd suggest isa fairly simple one, and it doesn't count on good luck, just good foresight on the part of the Nazi leadership. Ultimately the Second World War was a battle of industrial might. Superior tactics and training may have given the Germans an edge in the early stages of thewar, and differences in technology and leadership certainly played a rolein various countries’ fortunes, but ultimately by the war's later stages all of the major combatants were on pretty much the same page with regards to these variables. Victory would lie with whichever side could produce the most tanks, guns andplanes and could readily equip and train the most fighting men.It is not widely known to casual students of WW2 that Hitler did not in fact fullymobilize the Reich for war until the tidehad alreadywell and truly turned against Germany. Onlyafter theWehrmacht's disastrous defeat at Stalingrad in February 1943 did the Nazis brace the population for total war.Hitler had originally believed the Russian campaign would last no more than a few months, so dismissive was he (not without some justification, Google 'Winter War') of the Soviet system.

cont

. Despite increasingly destructive Allied bombing raids and the loss of vast stretches of resource-rich occupied territory, German war production increased all the way until late 1944. From 1940 until 1942 the Germans averagedjust under a thousand aircraft produced each month, by 1944 this figure had jumped to over 3,000. Tank production rose even more dramatically, from a mere 500 a month in 1941 to over 2,000 by 1944. The Soviets and British mobilized their economies much quicker than the Germans did.British aircraft productionfor example, was actually higher thanthat of the Germansfrom 1940-43.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_aircraft_production
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_production_during_World_War_II

Germany had blitzkrieg becouse of Stalin and his plan to conquer europe to the atlantic. Amerifats broke his plans tho. Germans was merely a puppet.

cont 2

Of course the Allies' trump card in this armaments racewas the industrial might of the United States. Of the nearly 800,000 aircraft (including fighters, bombers, land attack, reconnaissance, training, transport, etc) produced during World War Two over 300,000 were made by the Americans. American industrial power however only really made itself felt from 1944 onwards. A German victory on the European continent before then could have made both superpowers' homelandsallbut invulnerable to one another. German support could then have been used to aid Japan in its fight against the US.

Mobilise Total War from 1939 and not from 1943 (Tigers would have arrived by 1941 if so, FW190 would have been earlier), not sperg out against Poland and get the Allies onside to fight the Soviets. Realistically there would have been a Communist revolt in France that would have scared Britain into siding with the Germans.

Most importantly keep Hitler away from the OKW and let them do their fucking job. He micro-managed everything after France fell and that's when the Wehrmacht became hamstrung in all its efforts especially in Russia

if America didn't fund the allies and join later on the Western front they might've been able to pull it off.

If we didn't join they probably could've crushed the last of British resistance and focused fully on the Eastern front.

I know its a big meme that Americans had anything to do with the war but I think if we didn't join it would've been for the best.

Of course this is all especulation. I dont think wed ever see a german invasion of america. But certainly a nuclear powered and fortified Germany in a cold war with America\Japan with logistics and fortifications making American liberation of Europe a daunting prospect.

I assume it was americans who liberated poland

I believe not being lead by a meth addicted bavarian lance corporal would have been crucial part of not losing the world war.

they had no choice.

once Britain declared war, i twas a snow ball.

Japan attacked the US, that was it. Was only a matter of time before russia attacked germany. Once they saw, the germans were not going west (no operation sea lion) and britian was not capitulating. so it was only a matter of time before germany attacked them.

He was the personality that held everything together. His presence is necessary. Good foresight a bit more delegation would have made a huge impact without sacrificing the magnetic presence of Hitler.

No, the fall of the Soviet Union did.

Same thing with Stalin on the SU side. I dont see any other leader having the political control to keep the country together and productive facing such a brutal invasion. For all his many many mistakes, he was crucial in breaking Germany.

RARE

Easy
>Dunkirk, don't delay the attack and kill or capture all troops
>Operation Sealion, give the order! Without the UK no landing in Europe would have been possible
>Attack the Soviets 1-2 years later, after the invasion of the UK, to refresh the troops and sort out Italy's mess
>Don't declare war on the USA

If Hitler had died in 1940, the war might have ended on some sort of stalemated basis.

If Japan hadn't signed that agreement with the Sovs, it would have forced Stalin to keep significant forces to the East.

they couldn't ever win any war. Germans are weak dogs with a superiority complex.

>attack the soviets 1-2 years later
>don't declare war on the USA
That's like saying, "we could have won the war if we didn't all die"

Hitler fully losing his sanity toward the end of the war. He pursued super weapons instead of jet fighters. Had he been able to develop jet fighter technology fully the outcome may have been very different. Plus we got nukes first.

Mobilize total war from 1939 onward. Do not let the British escape at Dunkirk. Continue the strategic bombing of Britain until operation Sea Lion can be executed, cripple their infrastructure. Have your u-boats reign terror over their Navy.

If after all of this the British do not surrender then capture the Suez Canal and sever their economic lifeline to their colonies. Offer the British peace and the restoration of France to its native territory (including Alcace and Loraine) and both countries the right to keep their colonies. In exchange for all of this the French and British must pledge to fight with Germany against the Soviets, the real enemy of Europe.

During the invasion of the USSr allow your generals to handle the logistics and do not go over their heads. Do not kill or imprison captured Soviet soldiers or civilians, instead arm them against the USSR and Stalin. These people, especially the Ukrainians, likely hold alot of animosity towards Moscow over the holodomor and would gladly fight against the Russians.

Lastly dont get cute with your special weapons and tanks, Napoleon once said "quantity has a quality all unto itself" and that still rings true to this day.

by not declaring war on the soviet union and only focusing on the western front and mostly taking out the british

>Don't attack Stalingrad
>Bomb British harbors instead of London

Those two things would have won the war for Germany. Going for the symbolic target as opposed to the practical one is why Hitler doesn't deserve respect.

There was no rush to attack the soviets. 1 or 2 more years wouldn't have made a difference and the USA would have never declared war on Germany after a successful invasion of the UK.

by not sending your forces to niggerland and having a large portion of your men stuck in the sand fighting niggers and dune coons

Yes, condemning the 6th army to extinction, sending 200k badly needed troops to fucking Tunisia, micromanaging battalion movements from 2000km away, personally involving yourself in tank design and unironically believing that a thousand tons tank was good idea were all absolutely necessary from a political figure whose entire role prior to war came down to little more than stand up performances.

Fucking wehraboos, still hopelessly braindead 70 years on.

They would have had to had God on thier side which they certainly did not.

Go straight for Moscow instead of Stalingrad. Without Russia in the picture they could take on anyone including the US.

most americans didn't want to go to war after WW1. the US had a goal of neutrality until the uboats decided i'm just going to fuck everybody up. that pissed off the americans and Pearl Harbor just made the US chimp out and kill everybody

>operation sealion
Good luck getting past the Royal Navy
>attack the Soviets 1-2 years later
*gets attacked by the soviets a few months later*
>don't declare war on the USA
USA declares war on Germany

????

If the Germans tried harder to get the Anglo nations to fight the commies with them. Whoever the Anglo nations sided with was going to win.

This. If they'd taken Poland and gone dark (waited five, ten, or fifteen years) then they would've been ignored.

Wash, rinse, repeat.

hitler should have led the 10th crusade for isreael

Did you not read about the foresight and the delegation part? I talked about his presence and magnetism, not his generalship skills. If he had been a bit less paranoid he would have trusted his officers enough to let them do their jobs. And in what part did I complement the Wehrmacht?

>Good luck getting past the Royal Navy
There are quite a lot of analyzes about this topic. The operation would have been sucessful and the casualties are acceptable

>*gets attacked by the soviets a few months later*
After the invasion of the UK, just move more division to the east. Goodluck Ivan breaking through

>USA declares war on Germany
Pic related. Are you drunk

>Are you drunk
yes it's tuesday

Let me guess, it's always tuesday for you

Might have had a better chance if this guy wasnt born.

If Barbarossa was better timed and planned and less of a hail mary zerg rush maybe they could have won

He literally didn't do shit. It was all the soviet union after 1943.

>>Operation Sealion, give the order! Without the UK no landing in Europe would have been possible
Military simulations showed that if Germany attacked, it would lose. It's simply the case of a sea empire and a land empire fighting a sea battle.
>>Attack the Soviets 1-2 years later, after the invasion of the UK, to refresh the troops and sort out Italy's mess
And count on them sitting on their thumbs the whole time? As soon as the whole German army was bound in combat, they would move and rape Germany from behind. Operation Barbarossa was clearly a desperate attempt to prevent them from doing just that.
>>Don't declare war on the USA
US had immense economic power, but little influence on international politics. They wanted war to shuffle things around. They'd find some pretext and attack.

Not always, only after monday.

you know that as soon as we declared war on poland, britain and france declared war on us.

Starting in February 1941 the opperation would have been a complete success.

That was near impossible.
Some Zionists were closer to allying with Germany than Britain.

>Operation Barbarossa was clearly a desperate attempt to prevent them from doing just that.

Barbarossa was driven by Hitler's racism and the desire to secure resources.

Americas involvement in Europe was minimal compared to their campaign against Japan who clearly took precedence and a German victory before 1944 in Europe would have made both nations virtually unassailable to each other. I don't care how badass you think Patton is, the resistance you he faced in Normandy and France was minimal compared to what the Russians faced in the east. No Russian advance = no american landing.

>And count on them sitting on their thumbs the whole time? As soon as the whole German army was bound in combat, they would move and rape Germany from behind.
Yeah like they did when we attacked France? Oh wait that never happend. The Soviets wasn't ready to attack us in 1940/41

Go back to cleaning toilets Polacke and let the big boys talk about history and politics.

By not being homosexual

Stalin was preparing for war and everyone knew it. The longer Hitler waited the stronger the SU would have been. Certainly the invasion could have been handled much better, but the decision to invade was not a wrong one.

He was part of the distraction which allowed D day to be successful. The Germans were terrified of him. To the point that they misallocated defenses majorly during the invasion.

it is possible, but the only way they could have won the war, but the amount of changes that would have to take place it's not the same Germany you are jerking off too.

>. The Germans were terrified of him
?

German Command, they percieved him as our greatest general and unhealthily believe he would lead the D day invasion.

Yes. No Uber heavy tanks and austitic wunderwaffen. Also a lot less defacto control in Hitlers hands.

Stalin might have wanted a way but not for the next 5-10 years. He knew the Red Army was not able to engage in an offensive war.

>Britains find Enigma and decipher it, basically listening to evering the Germans are sending from 1940 onwards
>Italy doesn't get its shit together, Yugoslavia war delays Sovjet war and drags it into winter. The missing weeks would have brought victory
>Again Italy: troops needed in the east have to stay in Africa
>D-Day: out of pure luck an SS-division is right next to Utah beach and already rolling to kick the Allies back. Jodl calls them back, because they operate only on direct order of Hitler who's still asleep. Nobody dares to wake him up
>Hitler stops his army rolling to Dunkirk where 250,000 Brits wait to be captured. They escape over the Channel and build a new army
>Japan and Russia sign a no-attack-treaty which allows the sovjets to bring Siberian soldiers to the front

there went so much wrong... I think the odds where that Germany should have won easily

> The Soviets wasn't ready to attack us in 1940/41
You've just proposed to give them two years more. Their while army was in the state of explosive growth.

>Go back to cleaning toilets Polacke
Do you want me to change your adult diaper too?

To win they would need to have finished their SAM program, and their nuclear power generation would have to have gotten out of the labs, and to a stage of powering domestic factories. This would have reduced their petroleum demand for power and let them use it in vehicles, while the sams could have given them arial denial.
Instead they heavily favored AA guns, and investments in defensive weapons was seen as admission of defeat.
Their nuke reactors, while operational, were only ever tests.
What I want to know, what happened to their X-RAY beam tank?

They could never win and they didnt.
Even if they bombed retreating britts, won stalingrad, USA would just NUKE berlin. And than Dresden and tgan munich and than.. you get the point.

>explosive growth

How many trucks were they manufacturing? How many trains? How many pairs of boots?

Without lend lease a Russian offensive was impossible.

The only way to win would be for them to have not attacked russia and just settled witha german empire ecompassing continental western Europe, allied with Spain and Italy, neutral with Britain. They could have become their own super power, alas they got greedy.

Sooner than that. In conversation with Soviet High Command he was aiming for something like mid 1942. Might not have been realistic, but that's what he was aiming for.

Hitler should have let Stalin invade Poland first.
Then "come to the aid of Poland" while asking the British and the Americans for help.
Destroy Russia
Save Europe
Win

This. Hitler's weak point is that he was a racist and didn't want to fight the British. He should have killed or captured all troops at Dunkirk and gone full tilt boogie against Britain, only then turning against Soviet Union.

His war machine had the capability of annihilating Britain in less than a year, but he had an eternal soft spot for them that was his undoing.

Also we had already in 1935 the first real jet fighter concept but Hiter thought it was a useless toy. Imagine having Messerschmitt Me 262 or similar planes as early as 1939.

Germany would have dominated the sky

I highly doubt the Soviets would have been ready for war till then. And even if they declared war, with shorter supply lines Germany could have probably defended their eastern borders with ease.

They would've probably needed tech that was available by the end of the way such as the STG-44, the more advanced tanks, and of course the nuclear bomb. Being more fierce about dunkirk and invading russia earlier would have helped too.

Fuck, you germans should be prohibited talking about history you stupid fuck

fucking burger education

they literally think Germany declared war on everybody

and how should they bomb Berlin when they couldn't take off from Britain or somewhere else in Europe?

Do you want a long or a short answer?

>guys that answer right away without reading the whole thread first

>blitzkrieg was such a success by pure luck.
>completely revolutionized modern warfare
>luck

The 262 had shitty engines.

Apparently Speer was able to supply 270 % of the german army so lack of industrial power definetely wasn’t the problem.

>The Soviets wasn't ready to attack us in 1940/41
But we didn't know that.
Easy to say that after the fact.
All that was known is that the Soviets for ten or more years spend all their money on armaments.

the Brits themselves had a study where they came to the conclusion that they couldn't stop the invasion

He wouldn't have been able to. Danzig/Gdansk was a national goal that he wasn't shy of expressing publicly.

> not attacked Soviet Union
> made peace with Britain
It is like you have no knowledge of the war whatsoever. These countries were totally dedicated to the eradication of Germany and Germans. The only option available to Hitler was to fight, win and install a nationalist government.

>Germany invades Britain
>exhaust itself defeating it
>Soviet Union steps in
>wipes through a weakened Europe in 1942

If Stalin would invade Poland first, Germans would have Stalingrad in Poznań and with enemy at the gates.

There was no way, Hitler would have chance to win this. Americans would not have chance to kill this warmachine CCCP would be, so they would deal with them instead. The course of action of everything could change atomic bomb, but noone knew it will have such impact.

Actually that is very little that went wrong compared to all the high risk operations that went right.

It is almost like starting WW2 was stupid.

Couldnt?? Dude, you got bbq in dresden, you got your dams busted and bimbed to oblivion. They would nuke you just like japan. The fact they didnt give shit about radiation only confirms they would keep nuking you untill you surrendered

The Japs fucked Hitler with Pearl Harbor. Without the US help Europe would have fallen to the Nazis.

Had Hitler not lost his ability to reason because of sickness they would have won. He would not have made the mistakes he did, like not ordering the Me-209 into full production sooner. Had he done thae they would have owned the sky over europe.

>euorpoor education

what is the lend lease act

without these supplies soviets would have been overrun

>implying the soviet union wasen't always planning to invade and the entire reason the war was started was to stop it

Me-262* brain fart.

Yes.

It was a brilliant move by the Jews
And why not when America is full of good goy mind slaves?

There is only one correct answer and it's quite simple - turn the war machine towards the resource rich mid east instead (or at least before) Barbarossa and the outcome of the whole thing would have been different. A lot of the disastrous decisions such as Stalingrad and Pearl Harbor where desperate gambles that wouldnt have been needed if the axis has the oil they needed.

But before England declared war Germany could have avoided WW2 by NOT invading czechoslovakia Austria and poland

Germany had work camps all over europe. People didnt get there voluntarily. So, whats your point again? They borrowed whilst you took?tsk tsk

>declare war on everyone
Poland and the Sovjet Union is everyone now?

do you even read the posts you're answering to? imagine Germany controlling entire Europe, from where should the American start a plane heading to Germany?
A carrier would be detected and destroyed easily