Is Britain ever going to leave the EU?

Any inside knowledge here?

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Yeah, in 2019 or sooner.

It took Greenland 3 years to leave the EEC after voting.

It took the UK 12 years of negotiations to join the EEC.

So in 2019 will be completely free?

As long as liberal cuck-ocrats and labour stay out of any power 2019
Imagine negotiating a price to buy a car and saying there’s no possible way I’m not buying that car. You’d get royally fucked

Yes.

But what if you already bought the car together with your bros and are now negotiating your withdrawal from your car sharing agreement with your bros. Your bros are mad, but agree to it... and you want to continue to drive the car after leaving the car sharing agreement, but don't wanna pay for the lease rates. What then? Would your bros not say you wanna fuck em in the ass royally?

Next general election is 2022 so it will be all done and dusted before labour gets chance to sniff power.

>Next general election is 2022 so it will be all done and dusted before labour gets chance to sniff power.
based on what? We are 18 months in and no progress.

we dont want to continue driving the fucking car. we've bought our own car. you want it, you pay for it. we were always in the back seat anyway.

based on governments having 5 year terms unless they call a snap election, which they wont.

we're off out in 2019, deal or no deal. thats the deadline.

Why are anglos so slow in everything? It takes you literally ages to take a resolution in anything.

>we dont want to continue driving the fucking car.
Ok then, but why do you then need access to the car and want to take the care from point A to point B with you in it? Because that is what you want. No change to your relationship with the car, except you don't wanna pay for the lease agreement... and you want the right to agree with others to drive their cars as well, even though we said we would all stick together as bros.

because the EU commission has been tied by the very strict, inflexible mandate given to it by the european council. Barnier has admitted this.

It is the UK which is being pragmatic and flexible in the hope of getting a deal.

>we're off out in 2019, deal or no deal. thats the deadline.
And yet there is a 2-3 year transition period in which "nothing changes" to quote your PM.

What happens if there is no agreement in 2019 on transition? Wouldn't you just extend the negotiation deadline for 1-2 years and then have a 3-5yr transition period... and then call it all off after Labour takes power?

stop. you've stretched the metaphor to breaking point, you're not making any sense now.

what are you actually trying to say?

>we dont want to continue driving the fucking car. we've bought our own car
This x 1000

>because the EU commission has been tied by the very strict, inflexible mandate given to it by the european council.
Watch this.

youtube.com/watch?v=6-W8CMC0HX0

Davis literally says that the British government hasn't come to a view on a variety of things, including on e.g. EMEA or the post-Brexit terms of a trade deal or on tariffs or WTO plus etc.

So how is the EU Commission to blame for Britain not stating what it wants post-Brexit?

the transition period has been rejected.

both sides are now preparing for no deal.

we're leaving Hans, bye bye

The car is the single market.

The bros are the 27.

The UK is leaving the single market, but still wants full access to it without paying for anything.

This is the metaphor. Now tell me how it is wrong. Because YES, no country in the world has completely free access to the single market with the exception of the members. For good reason - plain field competition. Only single market members apply the rules of the single market and thus are on a level playing field as competitors.

If the UK doesn't want to accept the rules, it cannot drive the cars after it leaves the car sharing agreement.

>the transition period has been rejected.
By who?

The EU Commission and the EU Council have agreed to it already in principle. The UK government has announced it as official policy.

>230 Billion to be paid in euros

>post-Brexit terms of a trade deal or on tariffs or WTO plus

EU refuses to discuss any of this until UK agrees to pay a huge divorce bill. It is the EU which is being inflexible.

No one is forcing you to stay in the single market and you can leave with no deal, if you are not happy to oblige by the indisputable terms offered by the EU commission. Brits are just born inherently arrogant and always want to eat all the cake without the extra responsibilities.

UK Chancellor:

'"It is self-evident to me that a transitional arrangement is a wasting asset. It has a value today. It will still have a very high value at Christmas, early in the new year. But as we move through 2018 its value to everybody will diminish significantly," Hammond told the Treasury Committee of the UK parliament in Westminster.'

what responsibilities? we have paid enough money to french farmers.

some goodwill from the EU considering everything the UK has done from them would be expected. We have simply decided that the EU is going down a federalist superstate path and we dont want to follow. we want to continue to trade, but we dont want your flag, we dont want your comission, we dont want your anthem and we dont want your immigrants.

we have said we are leaving the single market... even labour acknowledges this

Youre gay for not pulling yourself up by the automoblie shoestrings

Its like trying to get rid of that clingy friend. You just don't how you're going to do it or when.

What sort of market has to be paid for? How can one pay for a market? It doesn't even make any sense hypothetically.

Fair competition is achieved through harmonisation, not cash, in what way is the UK not harmonised to EU regulations?

You aren't even doing a good job of hiding the real issue Franz.

As a market its dysfunctional. The EU didn't stop Germany's car makers lying about emissions. They've killed millions with particulate pollution purely out of greed with no consequences. A civilised country would refund every car at its full retail cost to get them off the roads. Then again, killing millions and just shrugging about it is in the national character for some people.

Would you sign up to a car sharing deal where where 6 people paid for it and 21 got access without paying? What if you found that the small print also gave everyone else on the scheme to live in your house too? What if they also now want to write your house rules? What if they have also decided they want to use your house as homeless shelter and you have no say in it? This car share scheme seems to have gone a bit too far if you ask me.

>18 months
Didn't negotiations only start a few months ago? the whole process wasn't triggered until this year. The vote wasn't even 18 months ago.

No one would go into a deal like that. Also any service provider/insurer would install telematic devices (tracker, cameras) in the vehicle in order to make sure it is being used fairly under such terms.

>we want to continue to trade, but we dont want your flag, we dont want your comission, we dont want your anthem and we dont want your immigrants.

So basically we want to have our cake and eat it too

japan, canada, turkey, mexico, israel etc etc all have free trade deals with the EU

But they pay in order to be able to trade with EU. There is no space with free loaders.

Do we, or anyone else, need to become the 51st state in order to trade with the USA?

The answer is no, and the entire idea is retarded.

Surely you are aware that they are under significantly different terms right...

We. Don't. Want. To. Be. In. The. Single. Market.

How clear do we have to make this shit to you?
The only ones that want to stay in are the liberal retards and the bankers/multinationals that don't want the gravy train to stop.

Staying in the single market and leaving the EU doesn't make any fucking sense, right now I'd say 50% of the country or more just want to get out with no deal because Junker, Tusk and Barnier seem to think this is some sort of war, where they're going to conquer gibraltar from us, and beat us into submission, when it is a trade negotiation.
The jumped up little prigs have just made the world hate them

>The jumped up little prigs have just made the world hate them

No, only in the local Daily Mails/Express EU hate section

OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

>...Junker, Tusk and Barnier seem to think this is some sort of war, where they're going to conquer gibraltar from us, and beat us into submission, when it is a trade negotiation.

No one in Brussels is looking at this as a trade negotiation.
For them this is about the survival of the EU and in their mind the only way they can ensure that the EU survives is to show to the other EU states that leaving the EU has ZERO BENEFITS.

Only if you look at the negotiations with that in mind does the EU's stance make sense.
Economics simply doesn't matter to them.

youtube.com/watch?v=ZUZgV9yfvfo

Man you really can't see beyond your right wing tabloid world view.

It is not just a couple of Bruxelles politicians, it's the people of EU who demand that Juncker, Tusk and Barnier looks out for their interest.

If the EU can gain from a deal that is bad for UK, that is what we want. That's the whole point of the Union, and it's pretty amazing how you guys could be surprised by us acting in our own self interest.

They want us to pay for their gibs for access to trade. Somebodies got to pay for those 2 million "refugees" per year.

Economics and politics do sometime walk hand in hand, and ensuring that the single market actually consists of more countries than Germany and France is worth a lot of short term damage to UK and EU.

It really makes sense every way you look at it.

They are acting like children spitting their dummy out of the pram, complete disprespect to the prime minister, complete obtuseness in negotiation, the Gibraltar insanity, the ever rising bill.

This is not how a reasonable statesman acts, and to leak private details of meetings to try and make a world leader look foolish just shows the level of pathetic power playing that Junker and the like use.

They are not looking out for the european peoples you brainwahsed retard, they are looking out for the EU, their institution.

By playing this hardnosed impossible deal game they are just hurting the economies of the nation state exporters, and probably losing a few million jobs for them at the least by chancing that we won't just tell the EU to fuck off and have no trade deal whatsoever.
Absolutely correct

>japan has free trade deals with the EU
Are you sure?

We EU civilians are actually punished by heavy import taxation fees to discourage us from purchasing things from Japan.

That doesn't sound like very free trade to me.

Wonderful analogy

No one's surprised by Europeans acting in their own interest. We're surprised that the EU negotiating team doesn't seem to understand that negotiation involves compromise. Arbitrarily setting a figure and then insisting that the other party commit to paying this figure before you'll even consider negotiating on any other topic is not compromise. Constantly screaming about the "rights" of Europeans and then refusing to guarantee those rights when possible because you want some sort of extraterritoriality clause is not compromise. A partnership with the EU is desirable and should be possible, but if the attitude taken in Brussels is that they can dictate terms then it's not going to work.

You are aware that we are on opposite sides of this negotiation right? You do know that any concessions given to you will harm me?

I voted remain, so hopefully never.

I live in a 99% white neighbourhood, so I give two shits about what's going on outside. I just travel a lot to europe and I'm not a racist pig.

errr no they dont, they dont have acces to the single market. they have free trade deals.

yes, we dont need single market access.

EU trade is already declining year on year as a percentage of UK trade

>it's the people of EU who demand that Juncker, Tusk and Barnier looks out for their interest.

no its not. those three arent even elected. the 'people of the EU' are just bystanders. They view the UK differently depending on where they are, from envy that we are able to leave to spite that we are supposedly spurning them

free trade deals differ from deal to deal.

>I'm not a racist pig
>I live in a 99% white neighbourhood

but those fuckers who have to live side by side with immigrants, have their jobs taken from them, have their communities changed beyond recognition, have to send their kids to schools where most of the kids dont speak english as their first language - THEY are racist pigs.

the luxury of being a middle class whitey who doesnt have to rub shoulders with the diversity they claim to love.

admittedly I know fuck all about the lead up to Brexit and I assume it was an unplanned for success. In my uninformed opinion had Britain made preparations to have trades that would also favor a brexit then they would not be dragging things out in an attempt to get as many gibs as they can before going. Uk's only action now is to play the mooching friend till EU just gives them what they want. England may need to tell the north of Ireland to pull their fucking weight or throw them back to us.

In my opinion would be good as clearly Ireland at the moment has not learned the lessons from the failed Celtic Tiger. It would also steal focus away from Immigration. My home was never meant to have it good for that very same reason.

They do not harm you, they harm the EU's coffers and the freedom of movement of your citizens into our countries.

Adding tarriffs to your goods that are traded with us does not benefit you, it harms you, as companies will just use cheaper goods from wherever they can find them to save costs.

The purpose of the EU is to enforce uniform regulation and tariff-free trade between states as well as free-movement between nation states for work, the latter two could be done with a piece of paper and the first has been commandeered by lobbyist for favourable laws.

The whole thing is essentially pointless, and to think it looks out for you or is on your side is laughable

I know this probably make sense in your own head, and I know that decades of indoctrination of British exceptionalism has probably led you to believe this. But it is just not the reality on the continent.

Except from the edgelords who want Bruxelles to burn, people support their stance.

Why don't you just man up and stand by the decision instead of whining about unfair play? This isn't a game you know, it's international politics.

They should have studied, then.
I gave up my teen years in order to be a successful person.

Spot on Sir.

Insider here. There wont be a deal. The UK wont be leaving in 2019. Something will happen next year which will mean the negotiations will be put on hold until later, maybe 2020 or even later. Also, the UK will not be the first state to leave the EU.

'The lion in the East is yet show its claws.'

Screencap this.

>They do not harm you, they harm the EU's coffers and the freedom of movement of your citizens into our countries.

Jesus christ, do you not fucking understand that I pay into those coffers, Christ. It's like arguing with a fucking brick wall...

I'm sorry but wake the fuck up. The sooner you and your peers get into your fucking heads that we are in opposition to each other the sooner you will actually understand how to navigate in these negotiations.

This shit is bordering insanity

Which will get lowered to 100-150 or less and repaid over 5 decades or more. Bongistan won't just give 230B like that the day they leave.

so why is every EU state voting for parties with anti-EU, anti-immigrant policies? Denmark particularly.

we wont pay a single brass farthing if we leave with no deal, we are under no legal obligation to do so in that event.

Would you agree to discuss post Brexit trade relationships, when you haven’t agreed on what happens pre-Brexit?

Take Erasmus as an example. Should the EU agree that the UK takes part in Erasmus post Brexit, when there is no agreement whether the UK pays its outstanding obligations on Erasmus pre-Brexit? That is like prolonging a loan before it is clear whether the lender pays back outstanding loan payments.

France is a net payer.

Net contributions all go to Eastern and Southern Europe. Britain is essentially paying Poland, Hungary and Greece money for the immigrants it gets from there.

Edgelords. Or people who have failed in society, and who naturally blame the guys in charge for all their sufferings.

They are everywhere.

And EU of course gets a little more flack, since it is a new power structure so you can't go with "muh national romantisicm".

Doesn't change the fact that Brexit has caused people to rally behind the cause across the continent.

Correct, leaving the single market, but “wanting the best possible access to it” also called CETA plus or Norway minus. CETA would be fine without any payments and regulatory alignments, but Norway is not. So CETA with a small plus is possible, Norway with a small minus is not.

You pay into those coffers and what do you get in return? Legislation and muslims, just because your country has been duped as ours was does not mean the organization is looking out for your interests.

That is what you need to realise, you are under the impression the EU is in your best interest, which is patently false, that is what I am saying.

We are not against you, we are not against any european country, we are against the monstrosity that has come about from what was essentially a non-aggression pact and trade deal that has now turned into a political union.
You should all be doing the same thing, but you think the EU is europe or even good for europe for whatever reason, and don't understand that they only look out for themselves, the power they have been slowly building up over the past 70 years

russia and turkey take part in erasmus. not an issue.

vast majority of foreign students in the UK are non-EU anyway.

He is right you know. We didn't elect Junker.

And he isn't looking out for our interests. He is looking out for His own interests, and his little Tax haven Luxembourg.

If you leave with no negotiations, you're still technically in, and your obligations continue.

and UK is a larger net contibutor.

france gets a huge amount of the CAP budget

lol technically we would NOT be in.

>Fair competition is achieved through harmonisation, not cash, in what way is the UK not harmonised to EU regulations?

The single market requires equalization payments to underdeveloped countries for swooping up their skilled labour and supporting their infrastructure and farmers. Look it up.

As to harmonization, yes, that is key. The UK is currently 100 percent harmonized and if it agrees, like Norway, to stay harmonized, we have no issue. But the UK already said it wants to deviate in every sector to allow its industry to undercut competition on environmental, regulatory and other issues ... also creating tax haven rules.

It is 10 people who pay and 18 receive money. Put there are other goodies, the 18 receiving members keep your garden tidy, walk your dog and clean your toilets.

Fuck off the moral high ground.

The Eurozone allows Germany free rein to pursue a mercantilist strategy of seeking export domination (Export Weltmeister Deutschland) by enjoying a significantly lower currency exchange rate with the euro than it could enjoy on its own were it to revert to the Deutschemark. This is a consequence of the internal imbalances within the Eurozone, whereby a country like Germany, with its persistent trade surpluses, can avoid an upward currency revaluation and thus enjoy a stimulus to its domestic economy, while a country like Italy, with persistent trade deficits, cannot enjoy a downward currency devaluation and is therefore condemned to loss of competitiveness and economic stagnation domestically

>also creating tax haven rules.
So does Luxembourg, Holland, Ireland. What else is new?

European citizens are slaves to international/globalist corporations. And Junker and his ilk are their servants.

and lower wages, raise unemployment, fuck up working class communities, put strain on public services...

i dont blame eastern european from wanting to come to britain to better themselves but the model of open door immigration is unsustainable.

And a free trade deal like CETA with Canada or TTIP with the US is what the EU says is no problem whatsoever.

The problem is the UK wants much much more than that. E.g. they want the financial service sector in London to have unfettered access to the single market... while being a lot less taxed and be exempt from European oversight and regulation, basically killing all of their European competitors in the EU single market.

No moron in the world would agree to that. Brits will have to agree to implememt European financial regulation and minimum tax standards to access the single market in the financial area... just like Norway and Switzerland.

Okay so now you are trying to change the discussion to whether the EU is good or bad. That's okay, but I take it you then agree that we are on the opposite sides in this fight.

With that settled we can go on to discuss what the EU actually does.

The EU has always been a political union, "Ever closing union" was in the treaty you signed when you entered, so nothing has been hidden from you. Unless, of course your own politicians omitted parts of what that agreement actually was.

And just like democracy in general, the EU isn't perfect - but it's the best solution available to the challenges European countries face today.

Never. They are too busy shitposting and waisting time instigating petty arguments on the internet to actually do the work in becoming independent. They are a bunch of trolls that never do anything important. They will never have independence, they don't want it.

Plus the krauts will not let them leave. Gas all the krauts. It's thier only hope.

The Jap deal is not in effect yet, it has just been finalized and will be applied next year after ratification.

You'll only exit after the negotiations.
When juncker was asked what he thinks f BREXIT he said he cant state anything before the negotiations till then UK is still part of EU.

I demand a Swexit

Is Germany ever going to win a war?

Seriously why do you cunts keep bringing this up? I'm sure if they could push a button and leave they would, the paperwork and bartering on this must be insane.

Not to mention aligning free trade with the Commonwealth, China, Japan and U.S at the same time.

I am part of the people of the EU and yes, I want my government which rules the EU to get the best possible deal for Germany/EU.

2019 the re-enter the EU with thier tail between thier legs. Save this post. It will be true.

Gas the Krauts

Whatever, I'm almost certain it's only corporations who get benefits.

The average citizen slaves will still be heavily taxed for daring to trade outside EU.

>found the edgelord

The same can be said for Lars Lokke Rasmussen.

And we kind of elected Junker, you know. He was appointed by the European Parliament who we have voted for.

But it's so easy to make a scapegoat out of Brussels, right. I'm actually extremely happy about Brexit, since it has shown us what consequences there are if you take the anti EU populists by their word.

Have you noticed how quiet DF has been on EU recently? It's only crooked Messerschmidt who still rambles about them from time to time.

>The EU has always been a political union
not when we vote to remain a member of the EEC in 1975

What has Junker done for us?

Other than producing more islamic terrorists?

what you want is neither here nor there. you havent been consulted.

If Russia leaves Erasmus without paying outstanding bills, I am sure the EU won’t let them join Erasmus again before they pay those bills. Wouldn’t you agree?

Giving money is a myth. You are forcing Loans on to us, whats more its this kind of loan where on paper you write you gave us 1 euro but in fact V4 countries gets only 14 eurocents from every euro.

Whats more we are not allowed to use this money on industry but we have to use it on useless staff like footbal fields in every smallest village where are even not many kids.

The thing with EU is that we are kept hostages and the longer we stay in it, the more disasembled and drained by Germans our economy is.

no he was appointed by the commsion and approved by the parliament

juncker was the only candidate....

like a soviet 'election'

what are the consequence?

EU/Krauts will never ever let UK leave EU. even if they paid the money eu demands from them, full exit where UK is fully independent will not happen without war