What is Sup Forums's opinion of transhumanism?

Tl;dr: on a scale of 1-10, how high up on the 'Deus-vult-o-meter' would you rate Sup Forums's general attitude towards transhumanism?

On the not as short side of things: I'm a white male who isn't gay, so I'm not very well off in the jewthousands. On the other hand, I'm b8 (yes, yes I know. "Doesn't exist... excuse to be a degenerate manwhore... attention seeking... etc, etc" but when I've wanted both guys and girls, I'm not inclined to ignore the word that exists for that) so I know I wouldn't fit in with 'muh 1920's was perfect!' Either.

Honestly my favorite option out of what's left is transhumanism. That being said, I'm actually rather curious as to how degenerate that's considered by Sup Forums in general.

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Open here. I meant Bi, and fuck auto-correct.

Do you think companies and governments act ethically with the technology we have now? What makes you think they would act ethically when they have the ability to be plugged directly into your brain and monitor and control your thoughts and actions?

The entire concept of transhumanism is anti-human and anti-life Jewish garbage.

You do realize both gene editing and cybernetic enhancements fall under the purview of transhumanism, no? You're literally saying 'transhumanism is shit, but transhumanism is the best thing ever!'

>just put all your faith in science goy!
Technology will save us,
i have heard a stranger say.
The wonderment of science,
skill, and tools will win the day.
Our comfort and our safety
we may leave to wise devices.
And men who build and train them up,
will coddle all our vices.
they’ll see the future clearly
and avert all waiting dooms.

I think I heard it spoken in
Titanic’s smoking rooms.

It's inevitable and renders racial identity/differences pointless in the long run. 100 years from now all babies will be designer.

i hope we get to that point

Honestly, i think upcoming 50 years will change society in ways that will make whole XX century stagnant. Just think:

- AI, job automation
- Virtual reality, brain machine interface
- Designer babies
- Gene editing/terapies

AI will leave vast amounts of low iq population with just nothing to do.

You think that videogames are addicting and time consuming? Just wait until you can jack into computer matrix style and have endless orgies with vr porn stars.

Designer babies will fuck up our gene pool. Most parents want their kids to be obedient, not intelligent. Next designer babes generation will turn into mindles drones, thought they will probably be good looking. And gene editing.

And there are even crazier possibilities, like self replicating nanobots. Ever heard of gray goo?

9.5/10

I think its the next logical step for us, but I don't think it's going to be as pretty as transhumanist believe it'll be. I actually think it'll be equal parts hell and utopia.

Neat-o rhyming scheme in something called a meter, but shit still stinks no matter how you try to make it sweeter.

Lies will likewise never be the truth, and nothing will change that, not even invoking Jews.

Time marches forward with feet none can delay, you need only heed her whims to see her gentle sway. But hear this warning from me direct to you: should you try to stop her steps she'll surely trample you.

So hide in your corner if you wish, raise up your walls of sand: you need not see the coming light from Future's golden hand. But delay us not from destiny with oft defeated fears, close your eyes and calm yourself, we'll kiss away your tears.

And come the morn you'll wake to find the world was born anew, and though the night was long and dark your fears did not come true.

Shut up and make Cyberpunk.

I for one welcome our robot overlords.

Are you missing the point of my post or just trying to obfuscate it? These technologies will not be used for the betterment of man, they will be used to create slaves.

I've heard of it, I just hope humanity isn't stupid enough to be careless with it. There are a lot of ways we can fuck this up, but I like to believe that Humanity will make it, in the end.

>self replicating nanobots
you are made of self replicating nanobots, nigger

burn in hell faggot

All it takes just ONE nanite released into wild. Just one mocroscopic machine. Honestly, i cant imagine how it should NOT go wrong some day.

I really hope that self replicating nanomachines are just impossible concept.

>that entire post
cringing hard right now for you m8

It will bring societal complications, but I hope it'll happen sooner.

They should have their own toilets

No, I understood the gist of it. I just thought it was funny that it was using one technology to 'beat' the other, despite them both more or less having very similar benefits and drawbacks.

But to address your main point, that's something that gets repeated a lot, and I suppose it's only reasonable to expect people to be afraid of that. But that's simply not how it works.

Anything the rich can buy, we can create towned down versions of, and we've done so consistently throughout history. We may not have the 'absolute best', but we certainly won't be left out.

>Most parents want their kids to be obedient, not intelligent.
Roight then, let's take Poland off the list.

>I'm b8
Stopped reading here, shit thread.

But can we build walls around those toilets?

Not for too long, I hope. Your face could get stuck like that, and I'd hate for you to get uglier on my account.

I hate luddites and retrogrades so god damn much.

> on a scale of 1-10, how high up on the 'Deus-vult-o-meter' would you rate Sup Forums's general attitude towards transhumanism?

>Heresy is a subjective term – only you who are in fear of the Iron Messiah's righteous gaze wish this work to cease.

You realise the industrial revolution actually caused nearly 6 decades of falling living standards, right?

>MUH LUDDITES
Luddites did literally nothing wrong. "Entrepreneurs" and rentier aristocrats made fortunes off the misery of the peasantry and it took over half a century for parliament to set it all to rights.

That honestly depends on its programming. But even then, release other nanobots programmed to exclusively recycle other nanobots. (And then remember to put a kill-switch in these ones so you don't wind up with a similar problem.)

It raised people from poverty en masse. We're busily carving eco-exceptions for the third world precisely because industrializing them would lift them from poverty, too.

Well, at least you've got a coherent point. Now I just have to ask how you reached it. How are modern Americans worse off than pre-industrial Americans (temporarily disregarding Jewry and the communists)?

They did do something wrong, THEY WANTED TO STOP PROGRESS. They wanted to continue working on factories like idiots. They destroyed fucking machines. It's completely retarded.

You're poet and you didn't even
FAGGOT

A less coherent argument, one could hardly find. But since it's only shit-posting, I'll rate it merely... fine.

>It raised people from poverty en masse.
No, it didn't. Not for sixty years.

Strawman. Read my post and try again.

I see all of your understanding of the industrial revolution comes from Family Guy skits.

>be born into a family of weavers
>spend your life weaving
>this is how you make a living
>this is how your family has made a living going back six hundred years to when records begin in the church in the village that your family has lived in for six hundred years and that you have never left in your entire life
>live a humble life of poverty, but don't know any different, are generally content
>steam-drive weavers replace you in five years
>you now have no money and are literally starving through no fault of your own
>there is zero (0) assistance available, you will actually fucking die in the street
>walk the hundred and twenty miles to London on foot with no shoes because it's the only place where there are jobs because the entire country is being hit with the same problem thanks to mechanized farming
>your cottage in the village is replaced with a tenement where you live six people to a room and you work 16 hour days in a gaslit factory for less money than you used to make
>die from chemical poisoning in agony
>people in the future will call you an idiot for being angry about this

>But that's simply not how it works.
>We may not have the 'absolute best', but we certainly won't be left out.
How many backdoors do you have built into every AMD/Intel chip? How many datacenters do you have to monitor all internet traffic? How many AIs do you have to predict every individuals actions based on their web browsing and purchase histories? My guess is none.

The people who have those things use them to crush dissent, control public opinion and habits, and make sure any potential competition never gets off the ground. Now imagine giving the people who have those things power over your fucking brain (or genes). If you still think that's good or cool you are a fucking moron dude.

There wasn't a straw man in my post, I simply asked how we're worse off if you don't account for 3rd wave feminism and such (on account of my presumption it would have been attempted anyways)

And yet, despite all of those methods of control, the deep web is still the largest portion of the internet, common peasants still have access to information people in power would rather they not, and social revolutions are springing up the world over.

Although I suppose I should have started by saying that there are many ways to prevent them from getting direct access to your brain/genes which are likely to be implemented going forward.

>I simply asked how we're worse off
You're not.

>"but then how does your point make sense"
Because my point was never that you were worse off.

You just strawmanned that.

No, I understand it really well. They had no way to live, they were right to be angry, they would be right to protest it. It's the same deal with communism, the proletariat had every right to complain BUT COMMUNISM ITSELF is not the answer. They just are not smart for thinking destroying machines would give then their jobs at the factory back. Two different sides to this. One is they got jewed and the other is the retarded ideology that mechanization is inherently bad because of jobs and we should outright stop it when it makes the lives of everyone much easier in the end.

The industrial revolution shook lineages out of poverty. The middle class blossomed when the smartest of the one-job-lineages started walking from their farms and cottages to get jobs in cities. It wasn't all suffering and death. What about families that had been at pains to pass on literacy even before then? What about those who didn't even want to live as their ancestors had? The anglosphere is over a thousand years separated from ancestor worship.
Luddites were holding back opportunity even in their own day, because they could not see, could not believe, or could not understand the opportunities that were coming into existence.

It's never the young who suffer most of changing times - but why is that? It's because the young are excited to learn new ways! Adults can be, too. They just won't put themselves into it. They'd rather complain about the world changing out from under them.

Rhyming tards think they are smart with queerly written prose, but written arts do dearth depart with OPs FAGGOT RHYMES

tranhumanism is a meme. unless it hits gibson Idoru/ egan shilds ladder/diaspora levels

Mind uplink will be used to erase the human will forever. You think colleges are libtarded? Imagine a world where people have skills uploaded directly into their minds. This technology is already under development. What other things will they be programming your mind with?

I don't care but Xcom is badass.

I might feel better if it weren't being lead, like the IoT by short-sighted Luciferian Babylonian Khazar Jews.

>why don't you support selling your humanity for extended life and implanted niggertech?

>they were right to be angry, they would be right to protest it
And that's all that they did.

If mechanisation was actually delivering better living standards for them, they would have been fine with it. It wasn't, so they weren't. Then parliament passed the laws that stopped the worst excesses of abuse and the luddite rioting stopped.

The moral of the story is that technology is only as good as the purpose we put it to.

None of that changes the fact that living standards fell throughout the first decades of the industrial revolution.
>it wasn't all suffering and death
I never said it was. In fact it objectively wasn't, and the proof is that we live in an industrial world and it's great. But to dismiss the legitimate grievances of luddites and unionists who fought to implement the labour laws that have led to that great world far more than industrialisation ever did is just the type of insufferable adolescent arrogance that needs to be rammed right back down the mouth it came out of.

>Luddites were holding back opportunity even in their own day, because they could not see, could not believe, or could not understand the opportunities that were coming into existence.
You utter fucking moron. What opportunity? Name the opportunity for a peasant turning 20 in 1801 in a small village a hundred and twenty miles from London who has just been made obsolete by a steam-drive weaver.

I'll tell you his opportunity: walk to London, work in a factory, live in a flat with six other people, die early from poisoning or preventable lung disease if the machine didn't render him a cripple.

That was the only opportunity, and that was what they did.

Kill yourself you fucking brainlet.

Well development isn't the right word. Research on lab mice.

Put a chip in a mouse's head, make it run a maze repeatedly, kill it, put it in another mouse's head, the second mouse will solve the maze faster, as if it had some of the other's memories.

I don't know about you, but I can't wait to run mazes and be killed so that the next rat can run the maze better.

Dare I say this is going to be a/maze/ing?

>The moral of the story is that technology is only as good as the purpose we put it to.
You're right about that

>common peasants still have access to information people in power would rather they not
Free speech and by extension free thought is hanging on by a fucking thread, moron. The only thing that's stopping them is threat of violence that would be hard to do if they were hardwired into your fuck brain.

>social revolutions are springing up the world over.
Such as? Most of the "grassroots" revolutions are bankrolled by the wealthy aren't and the ones that are become subverted almost instantly (see Occupy Wallstreet.)

>Although I suppose I should have started by saying that there are many ways to prevent them from getting direct access to your brain/genes which are likely to be implemented going forward.
You are living in a fantasy world. They have direct access to the technology they have now, and would do the same with the technology in the future.

Fuck you.

and the one's that aren't*

>become an actual drone, totally controlled by the government
>operate crude electronic devices into the body and watch them slowly be rejected biologically
might as well just rip out the brain and eat it.

Stupid shit to sell goyims idea of materialism trough retarded formula: mind=brain=CPU.

youre a stupid tds nigger
asimov , possibly in spite of his jewish heritage, or to be honest, prescisely despite his jewish heritage, is on the same pedestal as Heinlein, egan, gibson, MacAuley, Noon and a whole raft of others. im going to go out on a limb here and call you an ill informed nigger, because youre an ill informed nigger. keep banging stick together and call it music you dumb cunt

In the singularity, you can be circumcised 1000x over after your initial copy is booted into the cloud.

> a list of kikes and CIA agents

I think it would be sweet if we could all be robots... but you all saw what happened to the Necrons in WH40K....

Something tells me you're not fond of rhyming.

> why don't you support stealing jewtech that can extend your life and improve your capabilities far more than you could naturally achieve and reverse engineering it to not be evil?

Do you have a soldier you make every new game, too? (Same name, same looks, same stats?)

So your point is 'the industrial revolution was shit to live through, but ultimately made everyone better off, but we shouldn't blame people who try to urge for cautious implementation of new technologies as they're often an important and necessary voice of reason preventing everything from staying shit forever'?

Or am I not interpreting that correctly?

>cyka blat
>calling out shills and agents provateurs
stfu chechen scum. egan, noon and gibson are anglos. Macauley is Scottish, so not really white.
PK Dick might have ben a ruskie plant if it wast for him being on speedballs.

>So your point is 'the industrial revolution was shit to live through, but ultimately made everyone better off, but we shouldn't blame people who try to urge for cautious implementation of new technologies as they're often an important and necessary voice of reason preventing everything from staying shit forever'?
Correct.

And it's really not that controversial a point, and certainly not worthy of half the vitriol and force with which I've argued it, but I'm sick of seeing people on Sup Forums cheering the coming age as if nothing could go wrong.

You all need to play Alpha Centauri.

youtube.com/watch?v=wh-ZcdO5fe8

On the other hand, they were turned into robots by a malevolent star eating God-thing. So I don't feel it's particularly surprising it didn't turn out super great for them.

>irl forking
Banks touched on that too

From the temptations of the fleshlord, silica cleanse us

toasterniggers get the rope

My issue with "Transhumanism" is mostly that I don't believe that consciousness can exist as a result of material arrangements without a material antecedent, for which we have precisely zero evidence.

In other words, there's no proof that consciousness is an emergent property of matter. Actually, there's no proof that 'emergent properties' exist at all, merely emergent patterns of which consciousness is self-evidently not one. Either Consciousness is totally distinct from the physical properties of matter, or all matter is conscious down to the sub-atomic level.

In this case, the former is actually more likely than the latter. Occam's Razor essentially demands the existence of a "soul," a consciousness distinct from matter that constitutes the consciousness, as we have every reason to believe that matter is *not* sentient in and of itself, as machines and devices do not move themselves, they are moved. Purely reactive. Consciousness is the ability to self-motivate.

In brief, we have never, anywhere in nature, observed a trait to arise without antecedent in matter EXCEPT in the case of consciousness, which leads me to believe that it is not a material trait at all.

In other words, "we" are not bodies of flesh and blood. We are not brains. We are not anything. Consciousness exist in some other state, tied to these machines of flesh and bone, and any claim to the contrary is literally irrational, It is a denial of logic.

Therefore, transhumanism is deeply problematic, because it makes materialistic (which is to say, categorically false) assumptions as to the nature of human consciousness. Even the concept of AI, under this model, is impossible. Consciousness is not a material property, so it is not possible to make a conscious machine. It defies logic. It doesn't matter if you build a Chinese Room to perfectly emulate human behavior and reasoning, that isn't what consciousness is. We don't know what consciousness is.

>touched
They do all kinds of experiments on genetic twins, cloning operations, and so-forth. And once it's down to basically software then why wouldn't it be like Brave New World? These guys are demented and sick, but not like durka durka stupid.

Actually I think they are durka durka stupid because I work on this stuff, but that's just me. I feel like a one-man Sup Forums in a sea of Jews.

I mean, it was a pretty sweet deal at the time, its easy for us pathetic mortals to look back in hindsight

You're thinking too hard. The transhumanists aren't doing this for your benefit. If they could know or control whether or not you have a soul, they would make sure you don't have one so that you can be a better cog in their infernal machine.

When will people understand this? Why do you think they sell you on transhumanism by providing sexbots, government, shekels, and Talmudvision?

If anyone will stand in the way of the transhumanism, it will be the left, as it kills their causes due pic related.

MECs are awesome so I'm all for it

I feel like you could have probably been more coherent with your argument, but otherwise I can see where you're coming from and agree that some caution is necessary.

I think the complete disdain for luddites can be blamed on people getting tired of being told that all new technologies are 'evil' and shouldn't be trusted. Granted, those sorts of opinions haven't been mainstream for a good few years now, but it does still irk. And I think the disregard for caution is an overreaction to that.

Biological transhumanism enhanced by cybernetic augmentation

Transhumanism is the future

Sure we don't know that. Yet.
Until then, I'd like that sweet mechanical arm whenever we get somewhat decent at making them.

Hey, you know what happens to the best cogs?
They turn a lot of other cogs!
To be a little less literal, the best cogs get rich.
Transhumanism offers a more realistic promise of eternity than religion. Slim odds versus none.

Obviously there are people who would abuse such technologies, but forget even the concept of abuse, I think that the underlying principle of the entire argument philosophically speaking misses the point, in that it assumes that "we" know what we are in the first place. The assumption is that we are animals called Homo Sapiens and that we can change elements of ourselves through technology, or possibly cease to be Homo Sapiens at all.

My protest is that there is no reason to suggest any of that. We are consciousnesses that are in some way connected to physical entities, and the popular narrative of how that is is literally impossible as-per our current understanding of matter. Transhumanism makes the assumption that we are "human" to begin with. I don't think we are. I think we are something either far more, or far less, depending on which of the two possibilities is true.

And I'd like to buy T at the grocery store next to the caffeine so I can be a chad while I'm staying up all night.

PROTIP: you're not going to get that sweet arm. You'll be culled and restarted from before you lost it, if you're useful to the algorithms.

Transhumanism is literally the way Satan destroys humanity and substitutes it by his silicon facismile. The final goal is to do the same with all of Creation.

Slim odds? Try no odds. You're not even playing the game anymore at that point. You're not at the table.

Is your Satan by any chance a superintelligent AI?

Then show me the table. Show everyone the table.

>because I work on this stuff
stupid question then, if you work in this field...
how far off are we from actually snapshotting an user?
i dont mean building a rough sketch based on social media footprints, or cookies, or any of that shit. how long till we can take actual VM style snapshots. if youre in the 'field' is making aplha level sims actually possible??

You are like an inbred Muslim. You are conflating faith with a political movement. You are conflating magic with technology. If you had the barest grasp of human history, you would understand that technological arbitrage rules the day.

If you were on the right side of history, so to speak, you wouldn't be posting animes on a Siberian Throat Singing Cave-Wall. At best you'd be the retarded Rothschild that they let tend flowers in a mansion until he dies off.

Satan is most likely not real, nor is god.
They're most likely histories created to make the retards that can't into long term thinking (most of the population) stop acting like complete retards.
So, if you take this into account, their words are more important than their existence, and the the hell comes before you die, not after.

The Heat-Death of the Universe guarantees the termination of all energized existence. It's actually the other way around--it's entirely possible that the consciousness has its antecedent in some other realm than the physical, in which case eternal existence is certainly conceivable, even if there is no reason to believe it, and no reason to believe that religion is a route to it. There's also no reason to desire it. It sounds awful desu.

But believing that you could "live forever" even if you were the perfect organism like Cars is absurd. It's a violation of thermodynamics. Trillions of years, maybe, but not forever, and probably not even that, and even that presupposes a great many things.

What on Earth are you talking about?

I feel like you're arguing from a position of fear of not being uniquely special. (Not in the 'I must be shpeshul snowflake' manner, but in a manner that refuses to accept a lack of importance to the universe at large.)

That is to say, there's no evidence showing that consciousness is a property of matter, because there's no evidence that consciousness exists in the form you assume it does. I'm sorry to say, but 'consciousness' really is just chemical reactions in our brains responding both to pre-programmed instructions and external stimuli.

We've even been able to map these reactions out well enough to (at least partially) physically view people's dreams. The theory of Occam' s razor which you cite doesn't argue for consciousness being spontaneous, it argues for it not existing, as such.

I'm not close enough to the real deal to answer that. Those people work in secret under government clearance and have to fear for their lives if they leak anything.

My projection? For you and me, the more immediate thing to watch is the economy; when the economy is finally ditched and done away with, that is when the New Economy will be put into place and when the real shit will start going down because the facade of our daily lives are no longer needed. This will signal that we're already past the point where the technology-enabled have diverged from what we consider to be humanity and can leave the rest behind. I'd say probably within our lifetimes.

Rhyming is degenerate, extracting meaning from patterned sound is primitive tribal tier trash.

Death is an important part of life
Two things we know,
>death comes from life inevitably.
But maybe that's not so bad. Remember before you were born, think back. You weren't bothered were you, yet you didn't exist, you were dead.
And then you were born
>life comes from death
All it is is mercy, and a stage. Death comes when you cannot take anymore.

No, Satan is an archetypal, interdimensional demiurgic intelligence, a bi-product of Natural Law who opposes it and desires to create his own universe. The superintelligent AI will be just one of his vessels, one that will allow him to take one more step forward into this reality.

thats Schilds ladder/
diaspora tier depressing shit.

You know what? America needs organ factories. Industrial complexes to print artificial organs for the world with the best technology available. Let's just sweep up that opportunity before anyone else notices that it even exists. Do it at scale and employ people in a new industry. How's that for an opinion on transhumanism? Maybe we can even get towards larger flesh-weaving projects with the tech later on.

Consciousness is self-evident, as is the Will. All you have actually argued is that the stimuli to which are consciousness is privy is determined by the chemistry of the brain.

But if what you believe is true, then none of us actually exist, and this argument is irrelevant. Neither you nor I are anything but a witness to this entire debate--and a poor witness, since we have neither will. We are smoke rising from a fire.

The fact that you are even attempting to debate this with me is either evidence that I am correct, or that you are some sort of Solipsistic zombie. Or, that I am a solipsistic Zombie, and that you are the consciousness, in both of the latter cases, you are correct.

This is also not a matter of self-importance, it's a matter of apodictic rational fact. Consciousness doesn't seem to have any material antecedent yet it is self-evident. Ergo it must have some other antecedent. Or maybe it IS material and we just don't understand it yet.

Let's play a rousing game of 'spot the crazy.' You go first.

Death may be (in fact is) simply a fact of life, but I'd like to die when I'm ready, not when nature says I have to.

Exactly, If there aren't flayed babies and free foreskins on every corner I am against it!

great. so im already a corrupted .dmg

Buildings will be cheap and eco-friendly! We'll really bring the cities to life!

I might have to go all Brotherhood Of Steel to save you from yourselves, you pityful fools.
I'd enjoy that, and I'd get all the technology to use as I see fit on my sacred crusade.

It's likely your DNA is already altered by some project or other and you have some sort of tissue sample in a bank to possibly make a twin or something. But AFAIK there's no reason to believe that youre already in a technological holodeck rather than a psyop one, or that somebody would have a reason to want to copypaste your mind matrix-style.

In spite of the timeline projections, these things always go behind schedule. If there were funding to be anti-transhumanist, then you would see data and charts predicting a hope curve or something like that instead of only ever inevitable death curves.

Wew. We'll just print everything we need, and everyone will be happy and live forever
That won't create unmanageable problems...
Which is why they will never tell you the truth

You keep saying these things are self-evident, but repeating that doesn't make it true. And saying _either_ the soul must be real, _or_ we're all imaginary is a false dichotomy.

I am an external stimuli to which you have responded, you are an external stimuli to which _I_ have now responded. We are currently in a feedback loop until either of our internal pre-programming determines that the continuation of this loop is no longer advantageous enough to sustain.

Literally anything can be explained by a mixture of internal programming and external stimuli. So why do we need to add some inexplicable and ephemeral 'soul' in this explanation?

The ultimate botnet

>the ultimate bot net
Like in swimming shorts ?