Are techies mostly leftists?

Hacker News comments seems to be a lot more right wing now than I remembered. What happened?

Other urls found in this thread:

cr.yp.to/djbdns/axfr-notes.html
youtube.com/watch?v=DalpdfqgW4c
twitter.com/NSFWRedditImage

I haven't noticed.

I remember a thread where everyone, including those identifying as right, prefaced their comment with "Trump is the worst thing to have happened to this country."

I was reading the interview threads, amazing amount of sour grapes in there. Maybe it's just snowflake complaining and wanting special treatment I guess.

You can see hints of right when they can't pass the Google interview and blames h1bs

Jesus, what is that picture?

techies are the morally dead pleasure seekers who haven't discovered a substance that ruined their lives yet, such as drugs or seditious women

they are not natural leftists but get pulled that way by the ones who control them.

Left to their own devices, layed-off, or divorced the techie becomes a AnCap moron

Yea it's weird.
I'm a programmer myself and all colleagues hate trump and value many liberal ideas.
Programmers are smart people, but it seems anything "not technical" they don't think through very far.

Just the other day my buddy was going on about how the evil corporations like Samsung trick us into buying phones so they can sell our data.
He added that this is one of the consequences of the evil of capitalism.
I told him it's not evil. If you don't like what Samsung does, don't buy their fucking phones? No one is forcing you.
He literally responded: "Yea you're right, I haven't thought of it that way before."

My point being, this is a very shallow discussion and they haven't even thought that far.
TL;DR Programmers don't think very deeply about politics.

It's the inner mind of a techie.

Sunset District San Fran

San Francisco I believe.

Continued:
Another fella also pointed out the other day how evil the USA is for interfering in these middle eastern countries.
It's not the USA's business.

I asked him if he saw some woman getting raped next to the road if he'd just walk by, seeing as it's none of his business?
Arguably it's often eviler not get involved in conflict than to get involved.
He said "Yea but you don't have to kill the rapist. And it's wrong of the government to take people's tax dollars to do it."
I said "You expect them to capture everyone? And use everyone's tax dollars to take care of them in prison for life instead?"
He goes "Yea alright, it's not as simple as it sounds I just don't like the current system man."

From what I see working contracts in the US and Europe sometimes for specialized development most people don't know how to do well (concurrent systems architecture, Erlang, financial networks, etc.) YES, most "techies" in terms of code monkey headcount are super lefties.

But let me clarify.

Most web developers or people whose biggest problem might be whether or not the box the user might click is 64% or 87% translucent blue are lefties. Most clueless dipshits who answer the phone for local tech support but have yet to actually land a productive job are lefties. Most people who write a script or two to tie together some frameworks other people wrote are lefties. This is most tech work overall by headcount.

The vast majority of hardware engineers, concurrent systems engineers and embedded systems developers are either super libertarian (or very close), or avowed communists.

The ones who work with concurrent systems tend to be the most libertarian. I think this is because to do concurrent systems design you have to first understand that you don't understand, and that many things are out of your control -- so you write small components that work in a locally sane way in an effort to mitigate the inevitable chaos across the system as a whole.

This is very similar to the way economists describe economy and can only work in relatively vague theory:
- They can give you a concrete formula for causing a shortage
- They cannot give you any formula for prosperity

I've met hardware engineers who were communists. Once again I think this is a strong parallel to their work assumptions. They live in a single-threaded world of hard-time interrupts, firmly bounded constraints, and everything is directly under their control (to the point that multiple layers of hardware error correction are built into their style of thinking). They assume that if you can just know enough about economy then you could plan it much the way a data bus is organized to operate efficiently.

All we ever wanted was ethics in game journalism

My experience as well user.
Though I don't understand how my colleagues can possibly enjoy the benefits of being a programmer designing programs and getting lots of cash for it.
And at the same time bitching about the evils of capitalism.
They would be useless in a communist society and innovative programs would grind to a halt.

Silicon valley and leading tech companies is pushing for this leftist culture so if you want a job there you better embraise their values. I heard they also have a inoffical black list they share which each other, so if you mess up (dont play by their rules), at one place the others will know about it.

Shut up nip, we don't worry about translucency as much as we do making sure the boxes work properly and when you autistically enter in some bullshit we make sure to show you a nice error message so you don't throw one of your fits.

Make me a robot dog, then kys.

As for "what happened" on Hacker News...

I think there is some backlash right now from European programmers because of actually seeing Muslims firsthand in formerly nice areas of their own countries.

AND (probably more influential, especially with Americans)

There is slowly growing backlash against the "every community needs to have a Code of Conduct" subversion effort to cuck the shit out of every community that does concrete, generative good in the world.

Having a CoC sounds like a good thing. Until you go to a conference where feminazis are manning the door making you sign a statement that basically says you agree not to talk to anyone because you might hurt their feelings and hurt feelings are just like being raped. Oh, and half the fucking schedule at the conference is SJW issues, not tech.

So yeah, fuck that. And a lot of people are finally just fed up with it. Also, the most solid women I've met at conferences were all super right wing anyway and were wonderful to spend time with because they thought it was great that I am not a pussy AND also am a developer.

So many cucks in the flimsy-side of tech right now.

There is a great article by James Mickens called "The Night Watch" (I think) that describes some of the mentality difference (in really funny terms, and Mickens is himself a black guy -- but very much on the /ourguy/ side of things, utterly lacking in nigger credentials. If we had more blacks like Mickens and, say, Thomas Sowell, would really be a nice thing).

Add Larry Elder to that list too.
Good man.
Born in the wrong skin though.

...which must be checked again on the backend anyway because whoever actually does final checks of input in interface code on client side is... well, anyway, I hope you are having fun with your job.

Woah you're right, server side validation totally mitigates the usefulness of a user interface.

Not everyone is a 100% cool coder.

They are bred and brough up in a leftist environment. Also techs are generally more intelligent and know well never to share a conservative opinion, especially because corporations are leftist and to thrive, you must at least pretend to be a leftist as well.

Give an anonymous platform and there will be fair amount of right wing opinions even if the universities and the corporations only tolerate liberal lefts.

Thanks senpai, I haven't kept up with the valley but I might have to go back there soon.

Ah, yes! This guy is really pointed and funny when he finds a good spot to point out inconsistency on the Left.

Anyway, this shows it really is a culture thing, not race exactly. Really based and smart outliers from a normally shit race may join in with a decent one, and shit outliers from a normally good one may join a bad one -- in culture.

I think this is the most powerful thing about the older American model: it acted as a brain and gumption magnet on the world by NOT promising anything except that you wouldn't be fucked with for no reason.

Now that is totally off the table. But the legend lives on.

Hopefully that will be restored. American old-style zero-social-support was probably best "melting pot" model ever devised.

I remember Hacker News used to shadowban anyone and everyone who made right comments, so it was a big surpise the comments on there now.

The valley is shit, imo, unless you want to pitch some really stupid shit to really stupid people who walked into money by being good at lying more than delivering.

Go to Austin. Or Raleigh.

In my experience, those who argue in favor of communism are usually the ones who don't understand how markets work. They also tend to say that they will work in the upper party while they assume that there will always be someone else to be the proletariat, even though it is unlikely that they will actually be one of the few to work in the party they would probability be forced to work as the proletariat and would hate communism.

CENTRISTS BTFO

Backlash against rabid intolerance.

Leftist utopia. Not quite Commieblocks, but it's the closest they can get with zoning restrictions for earthquake risks.

This.
Exactly.

They believe in it like a system they will get to design, but not have to actually participate as a part of.

HN is a mix, they just know to leave political garbage at the door before leaving a comment and stick to the point of the thread. About 90% of their comments are this, which makes it a great place to learn from experts and others.

not chadtech i.e. embedded, hdl, and other low-level implementation fields
nu-male le abstracted language 6 gorillion koder tecchies are literally niggers

Would you believe me if I told you, "Energy"?

An actual programming professionals would quickly understand that you can't replace human preferences and choices in drastically different environments with a piece of code.

They are not communists for being programmers, they are communists for being spineless low-T men who never worked out a day in their lives. It's a demographic notorious for their personal weakness.

Yes, there is a good reason why people who lived in a communist nation do not want to live in a communist nation again.

Well you can't be white and work at google as new hires anymore so ya... google is riding off the legacy code produced in the early stages by whites and jews.

>Supplying error messages
Thanks for identifying your server/architecture/libraries
Your local expliot dev community thanks you

At least this means they have now a critical vulnerability... Beginning of the end. It will not be the first time this has happened to The Company du Jour.

that pic looks just like a regular sim city 4 poor-class neighborhood

It's kind of like there has been a movement in US by the left to normalize putting "morals" before logic. They will moral police you, and not tolerate anything that doesn't match with their "moral" compass.


Made worse by JS it's the gorillions lines of dependecy. Any 80 iq faggot spends a days learning JS or php and calls himself a developer. World is truly turning to shit. Here we have hundrends of millions of these "coders", they work for Rs 7000 per month and contribute to making world shittier every passing minute.

Most are but there are a good amount of conservatives too.

Engineers are pretty logical and reasonable. They never go full retard

What are you talking about? I'm talking about a user interface giving feedback, and you're talking about how that might be somehow a security risk? lol

You sound like you know a few buzzwords and are just spewing them back up.

Are exceptions thrown, caught, then shot on sight?

In golang there are no exceptions, everthing is equal.

Also funny to me how web people do everything in text. So like every system is always running in debug mode.

Maybe people get used to everytime not having bandwidth or process constraint issues.

My favorite pitch for "web services" is "you don't have enough computing resources, so let us write everything to run in the most inefficient environment possible and load it into your unsecurable browser in its entirety every time you open the program fresh".

Instead of the real reason: "The kids today to not know how to write socket code or design binary protocols (and da fuk is ASN.1?!?), and deployment is a nut new 'agile' companies have never come close to cracking, so fuck it, shovel more forked-to-shit JS framework crap over the web and force you to upgrade client systems and network just so you can run everything in a browser."

And... security? Um. Yeah. Sure. The web is securable... because DNS has no holes to speak of and EVERY CA chain is totally vetted... like totally...

>I told him it's not evil. If you don't like what Samsung does, don't buy their fucking phones? No one is forcing you.
>He literally responded: "Yea you're right, I haven't thought of it that way before."

He was probably sarcastic.

You sound like a clueless developer who can't into security because its soooo 'hard'. People like you are why I make money hand over fist.

Any information about an environment can be weaponized dumbass. There are three entire schools of hacking based around it (external enumeration, priv esc, exploit). Any error you give helps me locate code to potentially fuzz and break.

Whoa! You are maybe the 3rd Indian coder I would probably enjoy working with. I've met many who were more obsessed with India pride than actually writing code that other people could read. Or maybe they were doing "job security" master play.

Anyway... based people like you are the only hope of the Indian coding economy. Good luck! And if that fails there you can go anywhere you want because most people are talentless.

Yes, but we have to "stay in the closet" about political beliefs most of the time. So even when 80% are, say, MAGA, they stay completely silent because the fringe 5% of useless people will make a lot of noise and legal threat about things like (not kidding) failing to have the company stock the men's room with tampons.

I actually saw this on a contract before. Tampons. In the men's room.

I'm in the physical sciences and you tend to see lots of leftists in the technology side, in such a way where you wouldn't want to be outed as rightwing because they are very presumptuous and demand proofs of your beliefs and think CNN is actually fair. Many of them, including some I've met from China, want nothing to do with politics anywhere and devote themselves to their work, this is just my experience at the research-heavy universities.
Perhaps at the engineering schools you see a bit less of it as conservatives tend to aim straight for the industries but it's still really common I think. That being said, there's still plenty of conservative and religious people I've met in the sciences but they aren't outspoken, although some of them are just old blue-bloods.

Never said it was secure; but DNSSEC in dbjdns isn't that bad. You have to not be part of the problem if you want to see results. :)

cr.yp.to/djbdns/axfr-notes.html

js, java, perl, go, rust, c#, and any other poo poo language is trash and only faggot developers use it
Ada, VHDL, Lisp, Haskell, Pascal, and C/C++ for embedded platforms, also fortran and assembly
those are the languages to use to avoid the poo and nu-males in the industry

I wish he was user.
Dude was dead serious.

Well code rot and technical debt will increase, and a new company should topple it unless they hire Whites andor Jews andor Japs come in to reverse engineer their bullshit.

>techies are the morally dead pleasure seekers who haven't discovered a substance that ruined their lives yet, such as drugs or seditious women
kek
well said user
>tfw you realize that most people don't think any further past what your co-workers think
I think it's time one of you nerds wrote a Future of Tech Industry Manifesto, like the Google Doc but minus the autism. Call for workspaces where you don't have to be concerned with women's issues because they have fuck all to do with the work and how it does nothing but distract.

The rapist comment works for most places but not the Middle East. In the Middle East after rescuing her from the rapist she stabs you in the back and then cries over the rapist body.

Where in any of my comments am I suggesting that the message being displayed on the user interface has any system information in it?

I am talking about how user interfaces have messages that say, for example "Transaction failed - your card may be expired" and how they are important feedback for users. However nippon just dismisses HCI altogether and I was responding to him.

The problem is that you can simplify anything down to just APIs talking to one-another when it comes to tech. Are you a hardware dev (let me suck your dick)? Oh what you just bought that WiFi chip and were supplied with a pin-out diagram? What, you don't mine your own sand and fab your own chips.

It must suck knowing the world has chosen the web and all you do is complain.

The tech industry used to be completely overrun with libertarians. It was literally nothing but Randian objectivists. Then the leftist social justice types infiltrated. You can generally tell who the infiltrators are because they're not actually talented technically. But these people became extremely powerful very quickly, and they converted a lot of people to their retardation. There is currently pushback from reasonable people, but the radical purple-haired anti-white multi-gendered retards are still running the show.

Actually, Google is white as fuck. Kinda ironic... They definitely don't do what they preach.

Whites are under-represented at Google based on population demographic averages for US adults.

In massively concurrent system?

No, you crash. Because can never repeat the state of the system. Anything you did not anticipate is either a really huge bug that will bring the whole system down (in which case you will catch this immediately when exposed for human testing) or some Heisenbug that nobody can ever find again without spending a huge amount of time (dev money) investigating.

So just crash and usually retry (or let sending system do the retry). Worst thing you can do is try to recover from a mystery and pass along data that is fucked up in unknown ways. Does not matter if its because of a cosmic event in your hardware or a malformed message -- you can never know in the time the universe will give you to investigate.

Most amazing thing about this phenomenon is that you will NEVER catch these cases in "unit testing". Strong typespecs is actually much more effective than unit testing overall (because declared intent tends to be more correct than handwritten checks of coded procedure). Best case is strong typespecs + property-based testing so an AI can spam system with messages good and bad, and zero on the exact cases faulting the system.

But even without that, "let is crash" works a lot better. This also implies recovery management and crashing at smallest scale possible and absolute component/process isolation, etc. This is why I work mostly in Erlang, actually. It has all these properties built in. Also, almost nobody knows it so very easy to get contract job at any price I want to say that day.

(But stay away from Elixir, community full of Ruby refugees who have learned nothing from their experience about WHY Ruby needed to be run away from anyway. Just using EVM as "a faster Ruby". Which is exactly like nignogs and sandniggers flooding Europe, not learning that all the "culture" they bring with them is exactly the reason for the need to flee to begin with.)

Well, most other valley companies are like 70-90% indian though

Is that sim city ?

>tfw there are other Sup Forumstards who browse HN

inb4 this thread gets posted on HN

No but I do write my own firmware :-)

You make a fair point though; all the same good/badboy messages are still very useful when debugging, but that is an evil that isn't going away in the foreseeable future...

>APIs talking to one another
this kills the devop

You're right. The middle east is more akin to domestic abuse than rape.
You arrest the wife beater and then the wife stabs you as you turn away.
I'm not a big fan of it myself either.
But I do think it can be noble of a country to interfere when no one is else is willing to.

Anyways, I'm not saying my way of thinking is absolutely correct.
There's plenty of argument to be had about the middle east, and capitalism etc.
These colleagues of mine just don't have that many.

I was just giving you a hard time, by the way. Prior reaction by interface is indeed a good quality to have.

My point is that no mistake on that end will cause a critical fault (unless overall system is just totally crazy, which is sometimes the case I'm sure). But there is a big difference here between the mindset of a guy who is writing a binary debugger or init instruction set for a motherboard bus (and cannot use tooling because the tools that build the other dev tools are what he is working on) and a guy who is doing web interface code. The impact of a fuckup is so vastly different.

So the web guy thinks "Oh, some startup instructions? That is only what, like a thousand lines of code and it took you TWO MONTHS?!? Must be retarded" without realizing what goes into that because measuring LoC is not all the same, especially when measuring output from additional macros, framework inclusion and code generation from a "softer" language into another one.

If you really want to know:

There's a quiet reformation going on in the tech world. STEM circles and tech companies have, in particular, been targeted under the current regime for ideological non-conformance (see: WHY NOT MORE WIMMINZ? EVERYTHING U NERDS DO IS RAPE)

NRx (neo-reactionaries) are the tech version of reactionary backlash. Intellectual and commercial obsessed. And the tech companies are getting big and powerful enough now that they're realizing that the US government and the diversity industry is essentially extorting them with the help of journalists. A good chunk of techies cuck out, or embrace surrender because they think they can't fight back. A significant portion, however, have been redpilled to some degree, they're rich and powerful, and they're trying to figure out how to change things.

Im a 1337 hacker and im a national socialist

No discrimination laws are also a necessity, unless you add viewpoint as a protected class.

Commie Marxist bullshit.

Hey man, Ruby has its place. It was designed for exploit frameworks, and it works for exploit frameworks. Don't blame the screwdriver when people try to use it as a hammer.

looks like immigration camp

Berniebro and Hillaryshill Soyboys started programming courses at uni, failed and became code monkeys at some shitty IT company. Programming used to be all about anarchism, but now its statists who control the general narrative

tech companies will eliminate you if you have any values or skills that scare them.
If they want skills, they pull that down from above.
They only hire silent expressionless robots that trigger smile at moving objects and can use barcode scanners.
Playing pokemon or jacksocking MLP toys will get you far.

>don't blame the screwdriver when people try to use it as a hammer
I like that saying user, will be using it in future

They need actual talent for their tech. But they probably inflate their multi-cultualism with the bullshit jobs.

I prefer to instead just always maintain assumption that every environment and message is hostile until proven otherwise. So DNS is useful, sure, even if impossible to secure -- but that means it is an unreliable alias resolution system at best, and this is in fact what it is.

Most systems I work on are distributed partial-peer trees handling business data. So we solve for this problem with redirects and fixed assignment of the tree root, which usually bypasses DNS, or if does not bypass DNS then DNS is only used on first request until a node (peer or client) has begun to map and cache significant ongoing network locations so can rejoin without DNS unless everything else has failed first (which I've never seen happen, actually, but it COULD so in the case all cached locations fail then reconnect is via DNS for shortcut instead of spamming world with UDP and hoping for the best like freenet style).

But getting started on a system of this style took several months. And that is both why it was worth doing AND why almost nobody does anything like this. Because "a few months" is an insane amount of time to work on an infrastructure problem, even if it is really the right thing to do, as measured in San Francisco Faggot Money Time.

SFFMT is a flexible unit of time that always expects Front Ahead Design methodology is in full play (look up "Front Ahead Design methodology if this is new to you).

someone said that "the way brexit happened was disgusting"
i asked if there was a process they could have followed that would have made it not disgusting
i got banned for asking that as i have a history of "too many political opinions" or something like that

which is funny, considering it's called hacker news and the original hackers were anarchists and borderline antisocial

This. I’m a software engineer at Apple (ICT5) working out of Cupertino. There are some people at work that make snide remarks about Trump, but most people stfu about politics because they have shit to do and aren’t interested in getting in burning bridges with coworkers.

>I think it's time one of you nerds wrote a Future of Tech Industry Manifesto, like the Google Doc but minus the autism. Call for workspaces where you don't have to be concerned with women's issues because they have fuck all to do with the work and how it does nothing but distract.
a good idea, imo

Autistic's trying to fit in.... That's what happened.

I've been meaning to check out Erlang, I'll read more into it now, thanks

in leafland you get to be a social outcast not only on Sup Forums for being a fucking leaf but also in leafland because everyone won't shut the fuck up about how everyone hates trump

my god. What fresh hell have you shown me

Yup, they ban anyone for expressing right wing views. But there's a lot of subtle comments on the recent threads now where say 5 years ago there were none.

Maybe for short timers who are currently being pumped out of code "academies" but most other web developers I meet have a deep respect for the critical systems and low-level systems guys. It's a shame it isn't reciprocated.

Anyone thinking purely on a LoC basis should just be put out of their misery.

Back to the OP, I think that HN has become more conservative just by virtue of tech people, once it is all said and done, are mostly rational people grounded soundly in reality and as the left's arguments have become more and more hyperbolic more and more tech people are returning to rationality. I'd say the majority of tech people are centerists and because the conservatives are putting forward the most logical arguments compared to a lot of the idealistic bullshit the left pumps out AT THE MOMENT then those centerists are presently voting/acting more conservative.

I saw this going off-track so responded elsewhere -- but anyway, I was giving you a hard time about interface code.

> It must suck knowing the world has chosen the web and all you do is complain.
No, it is just clear that web will either collapse or (more likely) change form to correct deficiencies inherent in it right now. Many of the young techies that started doing shitty interface coding years ago are learning the hard way the lessons from 40 years ago -- and this time working very hard to teach those lessons (and occasionally event discovering prior art in the field!).

It is a messy process, but I see some small hope here. Right now Mozilla runtime and Rust teams are working on very different concepts that are better aligned with reality that "web" is really two things:
1- An inherently unsecurable document broadcast protocol
2- Something we really, really wish were actually an application and utility browsing protocol

And without turning it into SOAP or something else super annoying, are trying to align better with #2. But it is, of course, hard.

I don't really see any solution to that overall, so I have sidestepped entirely and work on a very different area now that I see some hope for making non-tech businesses much more efficient. And this is a good thing. Occasionally I still contract if the timing is good for my family, but I prefer to stay home when I can.

There are a lot of places where rescuing the woman would work out as intended. But the Middle East should just fucking burn.

I think they must have changed their views and realised they were brainwashed into some stupid ideologies. I have noticed the same thing as well with regards to HN comments.

Obviously any field where people had to go through university will be a little bit more left due to the fact that universities are very left-leaning.

Very true. Most people do not know this, but everyone knows about Rails.

In my opinion Rails killed Ruby.

Yes. Lefties would never fall for some of the bullshit techspeak larps that have appeared on this board. That shit fools only the rural and suburban retards on Sup Forums. Tho to be fair, 8/pol/ has some tech literate folks.

>What happened?
Left wing people are generally better educated than Jethro and his uncle-dad.

Yes, you're literally all inbred retards.

Your observation and question have opposing logic. Fucking CIA nigger.

Would you agree that there is a positive correlation between competence in tech and right or libertarian leaning views, especially regarding the economy?

Nope

youtube.com/watch?v=DalpdfqgW4c

t.Techie

I have found there is this entire group of shit programmers who virtue signal by starring github repositories that they have never even used....

The language is actually very small. Syntax like Prolog, so look funny to you for the first week or so, but not hard to learn. You can learn sequential Erlang in a week, easily.

Concurrent Erlang is where the simplicity of the language suddenly allows you to build systems of a complexity you never thought about before, so very quickly the inherent complexity of your actual business problem come to the surface. This is VERY good for developing systems that are impossible to build any other way, but it is also a huge responsibility because you are writing systems with millions of things living on all their own timeline suddenly.

And so OTP is how we manage that, but understanding OTP takes more time. OTP and the Erlang runtime have a huge amount of interesting points, but are confusing (maybe frustrating) to beginners who are not familiar with concurrent systems or robust system design.

So take your time and write some programs and ask lots of questions. Anyway, I think it is very fun, and the only way I think it is reasonable to write a concurrent (as opposed to merely parallel) program for a 128 core system is with Erlang, actually.

You are a refined gentleman, I wish I could mail you some fine scotch & cigars.

...

It is a mess but I think things are starting to look better. We are slowly moving towards less dependencies for a while it was every-browser-for-itself, then npm came along and people went mad, but now those lessons are being learned and things seem to be heading towards minimising dependencies and the browsers are tending to be implementing APIs in a much more rational and sane manner than they used to.

I agree with your point about people having to learn lessons from 40 years ago the hard way but I think that is one of those tendencies of life, for there to be the need for the lesson to loop back around and be taught.