Why libertarians are natsoc allies

In short: they are both middle class movements

There is no use in bickering since fascists and libertarians are both identified as reactionary by the left and globalism. Both depend on the preservation of a race. For libertarians whites engender liberal values and respect for private property. For fascists, whites are the basis of a Western nation, and have traditions that address degeneracy, modern class divisions, and failures of democracy. Hans Herman hoppe has apparently realized this in his most recent speech, condemning libertarians opposed to nationalism

After trump's election and bernie's show liberals are sharply more aware of race and class and so should libertarians, who need to temporarily get on board with fascist solutions to these two issues that the left uses to undermine your individualism.

This piece by the nation references the 'mass psychology of fascism' in explaining that trump and fascism, occasionally praised by people like Mises, has its base in the 'patriarchal' family unit and the middle class. This is also the basis of conservativism, libertarianism, and pretty much the ideal West.

It says fascism is a 'petit bourgeois movement', which is an idea crafted by trotsky. Libertarianism is one as well. Most founding fathers were small property owners.

It also says the working class is captured by a race consciousness that prevents it from working with blacks and hispanics to achieve economic justice. It even references the communists as an example of people trying to change this.

After trump won and the white working class sunk the blue wall, shitlibs are going to try and court them especially if 2018 ends badly.

Fascists will have the same old duty of steering the working class away from leftism while protecting society from the cannibalism of class warfare.

But this is america and not europe, so they need the support of libertarians and ancaps to do it.

thenation.com/article/trumpism-its-coming-from-the-suburbs/

Other urls found in this thread:

archive.is/gfN87
prri.org/research/white-working-class-attitudes-economy-trade-immigration-election-donald-trump/
twitter.com/NSFWRedditImage

we only seek friendship and a mutually beneficial relationship

>a group against authoritarian intrusion is an ally to authoritarian regimes

Kulak/bourgeoisie= White person
Understand that is the model the current marxists are using and it becomes simple to understand their movements.

Much of the current fascist movement is made up of disillusioned libertarians of the past 2-3 years who realized freedom is only feasible with white people.

natsoc = very good roads
lolbertarians = no roads

it would just never work out user

...

I am not of the middle class, and the National Socialists determined that they were not fundamentally middle class. It's about more than that.

>There is no use in bickering since fascists and libertarians are both identified as reactionary by the left and globalism.
>It says fascism is a 'petit bourgeois movement', which is an idea crafted by trotsky.

Who my allies are should not be determined by the ideology of my enemies, but by moral virtue. If the Libertarians wish to remove (((you know who))) from places of power, homogenize society and eliminate degeneracy, then they are my allies. But that effectively means that they are no longer libertarians.

We are not compatible.

Explain Mises's kind words for natsoc and hayek's preference for dictatorship over leftism

Fascism is just an answer to modernity squeezing the middle class and worsening class divisions. It is perfectly compatible with libertarianism if it acts as a transitional state after safeguarding a social fabric that is culturally favorable to libertarianism

To translate the NatSoc's words
>it's a race over who gets to "long knife" the other first

Love that meme

Libertarianism is just a phase everyone has to go through before realizing its foolishness and ditching it.

That's also another really good point, as kulaks were a nascent class of land owning peasant that were the basis of the market reforms of lenin's NEP. They were destroyed by stalin's collectivization

Libertarianism cannot win on virtue of argument alone sadly, it's being threatened by a much more powerful and sinister internal threat, and it needs allies

As america becomes more unequal and the middle class shrinks, it'll only become more irrelevant as we resemble weimerica and people lose faith in the liberal philosophy libertarianism is born from

>a group against authoritarian intrusion are such retards that they're not willing to become authoritarian to defend their common sovereignty against authoritarian intrusion
Dictators are for the short-term, not the long-term.

The fact is that libertarianism is totally incompatible with democracy.

You're saying your allies are whoever holds the same ideals

I'm saying our allies are whoever is in the same material predicament. That would be libertarians.

We have the same exact relationship to the 'postcolonial racialized class issue' to quote a leftist, for marginally different reasons. Their solution threatens our traditions and the libertarians' property rights, an in America this is the same thing

i think some type of hybrid could happen

Economically much freer than natsoc
socially much more conservative than libertarian plus you add the importance of preserving your native population in

go back normalfag

That's probably what natsoc would look like in the English speaking part of the world. It probably wouldn't even called natsoc or use the same imagery, but it'd draw on the same ideology.

For a nationalist here the traditions are that frontier culture, the small farmer or plantation owner, or the entrepeneur. The tradition is of white male small property owners. corporatism would be un-american

maybe because they are simply at different moments on the same evolutionary path

generally it goes like this
fuck SJWs XD->classical liberal->patriotism->nationalism->national socialism

That might be it. Hoppe definitely makes it look that way when he slammed Jeffrey tucker and other libertarians for condemning the alt right

We're both white, male, middle class, and skeptical of democracy and current corrupt form of capitalism we have now. Libertarians just think the free market will fix it, but we'll never see it because of the class warfare and 'racial justice' of liberals and progressives radicalized after 2016

that's also more to the whole picture
archive.is/gfN87

>Many political commentators credit Donald Trump’s rise to white voters’ antipathy toward racial and ethnic minorities. However, we believe this focus on racial resentment obscures another important aspect of racial thinking.
In a study of white Americans’ attitudes and candidate preferences, we found that Trump’s success reflects the rise of “white identity politics” – an attempt to protect the collective interests of white voters via the ballot box. Whereas racial prejudice refers to animosity toward other racial groups, white identity reflects a sense of connection to fellow white Americans.
We’re not the first to tie Trump’s candidacy to white identity politics. But our data provide some of the clearest evidence that ongoing demographic changes in the United States are increasing white racial identity. White identity, in turn, is pushing white Americans to support Trump.
(1)

>White identity
When we talk about white identity, we’re not referring to the alt-right fringe, the white nationalist movement or others who espouse racist beliefs. Rather, we’re talking about everyday white Americans who, perhaps for the first time, are racially conscious.
The concept of “garden variety” white racial identity stands in contrast to conventional wisdom. In the last three decades of scholarship on whiteness as a race, the prevailing view has been that most whites fail to notice their own whiteness. In a society dominated by white people, whiteness simply fades into the background. Just as fish fail to notice the water around them, whites are unlikely to think about how they are members of a distinct group.
Our research shows that the era of “white invisibility” is coming to a close.
Non-Hispanic whites are projected to become a minority in the year 2044. This increasing diversity across the country is making whites’ own race harder and harder to ignore. Political and social phenomena, from Barack Obama’s presidency to the Black Lives Matter movement, are making whiteness even more salient to white Americans.
(2)

Trump and white identity politics
As whites increasingly sense that their status in society is falling, white racial identity is becoming politicized. Trump’s promise to “make America great again” speaks to these anxieties by recalling a past in which white people dominated every aspect of politics and society. That’s why media outlets from New York Magazine to The National Review have dubbed Trump an “ethnonationalist” candidate.
Hillary Clinton counters Trump’s exclusionary rhetoric with her message that all Americans are “Stronger Together.”
To test our ideas about Trump and white identity politics, we surveyed a nationally representative sample of about 1,700 white Americans. The survey covered racial identities, attitudes and political preferences. In examining the relationship between white identity and ethnic diversity, we chose to focus on an ethnic minority of particular salience in contemporary politics: Hispanics. More than any other group, Hispanics have been in the Trump campaign’s crosshairs.
Do whites from heavily Hispanic neighborhoods show stronger white racial identity? To measure identity, we used a widely used questionnaire. On a five-point scale, participants rated their agreement with items such as “Being a white person is an important part of how I see myself” and “I feel solidarity with other white people.” As shown in the graph below, there is a positive relationship between exposure to Hispanics and white respondents’ sense of racial identity.
(3)

And does white identity lead to support for Donald Trump? We examined the relationship between white identity and respondents’ likelihood of supporting Trump for the presidency versus Hillary Clinton or several Republican primary challengers. Consistent with others’ analyses, white identity strongly predicts a preference for Trump.
Whites at the high end of the racial identity scale are more than four times as likely to support Trump than those at the low end of the scale. Perhaps that’s because whites highest in racial identity are also the ones most likely to harbor negative attitudes against Latinos. Indeed, we found white identity was significantly correlated with another characteristic – prejudice.
However, differences in prejudice don’t explain the relationship between white identity and Trump support. The pattern in the figure above was tested while statistically controlling for levels of anti-Hispanic prejudice. Because the relationship between identity and support for Trump remains strong, we are confident that white identity independently predicts greater Trump support.
(4)

We’ve seen that living close to Hispanics leads whites to develop a strong sense of racial identity and that strong racial identity is associated with support for Donald Trump. We should therefore expect whites in heavily Hispanic neighborhoods support Trump more often than those in neighborhoods with fewer Hispanics. This prediction gains credence from work by political scientist Ryan Enos, who finds that everyday exposure to Latinos can increase support for restrictive immigration policies.
Whites’ support for Donald Trump is, in fact, greatest in areas with a large Hispanic population.
These findings leave open a crucial question: Do whites in heavily Hispanic neighborhoods support Trump because they tend to be high in white identity? Using a statistical approach called “mediation analysis,” we tested whether white identity accounted for the relationship between exposure to Hispanics and support for Trump. We found that identity does indeed serve as a significant link between Hispanic exposure and Trump support.

Trump, despite his outsize importance as a candidate and symbol, will eventually fade from the political scene. We therefore sought to examine the interplay of demographics and identity beyond the context of his candidacy. Specifically, we asked respondents for their views on white identity politics itself.
We had participants rate their agreement with a series of statements. For example, “There is nothing wrong with a white person choosing to support a political candidate because that candidate is white” and “Blacks, Latinos, and Asians engage in ‘identity politics,’ and there’s nothing wrong with whites doing the same.”
Exactly the same patterns emerged for these questions as for Trump support: Endorsement of white identity politics was highest in heavily Hispanic neighborhoods and was strongly correlated with white racial identity. These results suggest that America’s growing ethnic diversity is creating a politicized form of white identity that has clear repercussions for future elections.
Why does it matter that whites’ politics are driven by concerns about the interests of their racial group? It suggests that racial bias increasingly reflects attention to the welfare of one’s own group rather than animus toward other groups. These collective concerns are only going to become more pronounced as the nation becomes more diverse.
Recent research in social psychology suggests that when whites engage in discrimination based on their perceived collective interests, it’s hard to convince them that such discrimination is wrong. After all, doesn’t every group have a right to prioritize its own members? We believe our results portend increasing difficulty in achieving the democratic aim of getting race out of American politics.

Bump.

Globalization and multiculturalism have done wonders to stimulate racial consciousness among whites as it annihilates social trust and cohesion. They realize they're being dispossessed. I'm reminded of this

>Nearly two-thirds (65%) of white working-class Americans believe American culture and way of life has deteriorated since the 1950s.
>Nearly half (48%) of white working-class Americans say, “things have changed so much that I often feel like a stranger in my own country.”
>Nearly seven in ten (68%) white working-class Americans believe the American way of life needs to be protected from foreign influence. In contrast, fewer than half (44%) of white college-educated Americans express this view.

prri.org/research/white-working-class-attitudes-economy-trade-immigration-election-donald-trump/

>
Maybe because they expect you to do (((that))).

Interesting. Also bump

this is true.

Also, libertarianism isn't only Rand and AnCaps. It's a spectrum of ideologies.

State or racial collectivism is antithetical to the cause of human liberty. You are no better than the imperialists. You have more in common with neo-segregationists in the SJW movement than with us.

This meme pretty much says it all.

>We believe our results portend increasing difficulty in achieving the democratic aim of getting race out of American politics
Yeah and I'm willing to bet these same people probably see no problem with there being a Black and Hispanic caucus, all Black schools, free-scholarships based on race and ethnicity. Lower standards on tests and job interviews based on race and ethnicity. Nope it's all just because Whites are unreasonable and "fighting for their own interests." Disliking Hispanics in an area with high exposure to Hispanics is prejudice, not experience.

Kek