ITT: Explain why communism doesn't work

ITT: Explain why communism doesn't work

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People are inherently selfish. There's nothing wrong with that. It's just human nature.
That's why an ideology based on the concept of people not being selfish will never work. Do you think Stalin wasn't selfish? Mao?

History.

giving the workers the means of production does not result in actual production

marx's analysis in general though was fairly accurate, but he did not understand psychology of motivation

Look at NK.

Ignorers the individual and instead thinks about the group aka uses collectivism

how do you think Hitler and Stalin rose to power?

>41 KB
>Anonymous (ID: BrhKlYWO) 11/18/17(Sat)02:03:24 No.14990
If someone can do what you cannot, and they do it anyways... Who owns what is done?

People are inherently not equal

cuz everytime someone "tries" to implement it they're just doing it to gain power

also its not redpilled enough about how political power or even humans really work

Workers are bad at self-organizing, and some people are more motivated than others. Starting a business is hard enough without the government making it illegal.

Yeah wow they look miserable

WOW DUDE YOU LIKE *deep inhale from marijuana water pipe device* FUCKING FIGURED IT OUT!

ALL THOSE FUCKING CHINESE EGGHEADS HAD TO WAS LIKE REALIZE PEOPLE ARE *lights end of a marihuana cigar with a wet lighter* LIKE JUST PEOPLE MAAAAN YOU CAN'T STOP IT.

LIterally a jewish scam.

Marx was an educated intellectual who felt he needed to stand up for the working class without actually being a part of it. Thus he presented ideas that were not quite aligned with the desires of the lower working classes.

A good example is culture and religion.
Such things are actually quite important to the working man and helps them get through the day. Helps one feel that they are a part of something and working for a good aspect of this. Religion has been an important part of the life of a peasant for years, and there is quite a bit of Russian literature that goes into detail about this. Having communism be inherently atheistic and anti culture is quite against what the average working man would desire.

The war on culture in China was an absolute disaster.
Meanwhile, one of the only examples of socialism properly working, kibbutzim, was heavily bound by culture and religion.

egalitarianism is unscientific

They really do though..

Even if the workers had the means of production many would not have the skill to properly use them

Because people don't like to share
Because people especially don't like to share when they work all week to give half of it to strangers.

>can't handle the truth so just shitposts instead

Compared to what? This photo of Australia? LOL

because communism is judaism in its ultimate form, with every jew having a thousand goyim slaves.

Her ass is probably sore from ridng that bicycle in that god-awful road everyday.

Because the only thing Communism manage to "accomplish" is killing millions of innocent people.

Compared to the fact that NK has escapees and we can see their concentration camps

>Tfw you've handed over your entire country's manufacturing and industry to a socialist country.

Wow better nuke NK, those koreans will be better off when we solve their sore-butt problem.

You have to keep the Americans spies out somehow

>Explain why communism doesn't work
See History. Wow that was hard.

Human error. The point of a government is to fucking try to prevent and correct human error. Communism literally gives the power to the problem.

It has absolutely nothing to do with inequality [though that exists] or people being self-interested [they usually are]. The reason Communism doesn't work is because central planning of economic activity, even at the local level, is extremely inefficient even if the planners are benevolent and superintelligent [which they seldom are]. Central Planners have to predict future demand based on nothing other then current demand and adjust prices and production based on that. The result is inevitably shortages of some goods which are underproduced, and surpluses of other goods which are overproduced [and thus go to waste]. This is why the only way to make a functional communist society is to make it where production is so high that the inherent inefficiency of the system is overcome [such as through kick starting an industrial revolution]. The second the industrial capacity can't keep up with demand, if collapses.

And even while 'functioning', it still leads to shortages, wasteful surpluses, corrupt politicians skimming off the top, stupid politicians making poor decisions, and millions dying in ideological purges as utopian socialists blame subversion for their ideology failing.

I am so fucking sick of hearing people say "Communism works fine on paper". No it doesn't, its on paper that its flaws are most evident. I am so tired of people saying human nature or greed are the reason Communism fails, and that angels can make it work. No, it fails because its an awful way to organize your economic, and if you gave angels Communism they'd immediately tear it down and start trading in bitcoin.

this

the only (((people))) advocating this nonsense are completely ignorant of its applications in the past.

inb4 it wasnt real cumminism

I have something you want, do you make it or make the state take it from me to give you?

>Doesn't know what socialism is but know it has something to do with sharing.

DUDE *chews intensely on a marijuana flower, spit flying all over the inside of his 2001 Toyota Camry, droplets landing on his catatonic friends face* LIKE ONE GUYS GONNA KEEP ALL THE RICE OR SOME SHIT MAAAN.

Name one example of it actually working, ever.

This is mostly correct, you would need utopian conditions to enact it and enact it internationally. Fundamentalist communism and capitalism can't coexist.

>unironically being a xing jing ping bing blau boom pow thot in 2k17
chinese characteristics = asemitic judaism = capitalism
DUH OH BWOSHALISS yeah fuck you sorry, it is what it is

Jesus man how often do you listen to Chapo?

You wouldn't need utopian conditions, you'd need to have a central planner who had a vast enough pool of data to always know fully the present demand, and was superintelligent enough to make decisions based on that data, and adapt to new data as it arises.

In short, you'd need an omniscient being running the system and making the decisions. Its a ridiculous system inherently. There is no feasible way of making it work, and no good moral reason it SHOULD work.

>ITT: Explain why communism doesn't work
It's Jewish.

literally no one can define communism. it's all vague shit.
here i'll test it
In your communism
1. Will there be private property
2. Will there be currency
3. How will you decide how they are paid
4. How will you buy things from other countries
5. are there rich people
6. Are there poor people
7. do you retire

just to start

don't really like them desu

Shit arguments.

Communism does work. Just kill every individuals not following your retarded ideology in order to create a docile race after a few generations.

explain when it has worked

>when your ideology sucks so horribly the second it leaves paper that it gets destroyed by "shit arguments"

lol

Because people are corrupt.

...

Because it glorifies unemployment. No need to work when You'll just get what you need from those who do.

It does work if people want it. Thats about all it takes. But people dont want it so it dont work. Its a little like anal sex in a way. It dont really work unless you both want it

bUt ThaT WAsnT ReaL CumAnIZmS

Only two things can compel a person to do anything, the carrot and the stick. Communism throws out the carrot. Also planned economies always fail

Are you retarded? Youre forced to work. Its better than welfare gibs.

Singapore.

>1 post by this ID

SLIDE THREAD, IGONRE AND SAGE

Socially, it is impossible to achieve. Science does most of the work here (you can't change skin color, biological sex/gender, etc.) and the human condition does the rest.

Marx was a deadbeat who didn't understand the working man as well as he thought he did and primarily leeched off his father. Most people who bitch about society or Capitalism being the problem often have poor judgment or don't man up to their bad financial planning, work ethics or poor life choices. Or when they do have the means of production to actually succeed, they aren't ambitious or smart enough to make it work (lack of analysis, market changes, etc.).

The path to Anarcho-Communism (the true end goal of communism) never leaves State control, which is a step after the revolution. The State is supposed to release control but they never do. In social systems, people often crave power and compensation and no amount of changing the culture or society will suppress this.

Not to mention the 100M+ dead and the fact there are Lefties out there that got indoctrinated and only read the theory, but lack the execution know how.
This from an economic standpoint. It is basically terrible fiscal planning and scores of wasted spending, exploitation and corruption. Also, every individuals needs are different financially.

Communism and Socialism is nothing more than exploitation of human vices and slave control under the false guise of good intentions.

I am also reminded of something Gad Saad once said: Right idea, wrong species.

It doesn't account for Human behavior, people don't give a fuck about other people, Communism is not really meant to benefit the people anyways, it's just a way for jews to seize total control

Because of the belief that objective truth didin't even exist. Communism is about dogmas allegedly being superior to reality.

Only people who have never worked manual labor have to ask that question.

fuck off reddit

Cause It's predicated on the guarantee that every moving part (person) is working (contributing), while the anarchy requires no such guarantee cause everyone's doing their own thing probably.

>Communism
The idea that people will voluntarily give up their private property and everyone can do nothing and still expect to be well off and taken care of AND still produce surplus.

seems reasonable

I want something that you can provide, say, your skills in woodworking.
Will you;
Ask me to compensate you for your time and work, being paid based on your own prices
Or
>Have the state force you by any means neccisary to meet my demands and receive a fixed pay also set by the state

There are good answers already, but the final answer is that the system itself is immoral. Much immorality can come from any system but take capitalism for example, while immorality can be an end result, the system itself is moral.

Name one communist country where communism worked well.
When you fail to be able to do so after as many attempts at it in history you may understand.

Allocative efficiency

>You're forced to work
>Expects freedom loving Americans to get behind giving that much power to the state.

Communism works really well annon dont listen to these faggots. Ok heres how it works you work really really hard for your "country" and then you give me half of your pay check so i can sit on my ass all day.

Also bread lines.

>"it's wrong because i say it is" t. burgerson mcjewstein
itt

1. There is no equality between human beings in their varied attributes, personalities and natural gifts.

2. Every social/religous/cultural/ethnic/national identity in the world cannot be dissolved into the abstraction of 'global labour'. That all the different peoples of the world have general shared interests such as wanting a job that pays better is not the basis for them unifying to overthrow the planetary economy and division of labour. A planned society of any kind will actually have to take this into account, hence demands for deportations, end of multiculture are actually more realistic and concrete than the Marxist illusion. Planning means demographic planning. That means taking into account what is natural and normal in human beings, your doctrine be damned.

3. The division of labour - is not going anywhere. Man will not fish in the morning and criticise theatre in the afternoon and do brain surgery in the evening. Anyone who has worked in a professional area, or any part of the economy where many years of experience and training are required knows this. People will not be freed from the 'curse' of specialisation of work.

4. IQ - The market allows sortation of people to jobs based, imperfectly it is true, on their abilities and drive. A planned society would have to give people IQ tests and then assign them to the jobs that matched their low/average/above average abilities. Telling people "We measured you and you're semi-retarded, its official, the Labour Board is sending you down the mines." is cruler than letting people find their own level.

5. A fully planned economy - Planned how and by who? Take a look at the websites and programmes of any left group you like. Look at the most detail oriented lefty forums where they discuss how their utopia will actually bloody work: they have no idea. There is no agreement. This is the main plank of their whole vision and they are clueless. Something else is driving their leftism, some kind of psychological need.

Economic calculation is impossible without independent economic actors.

It means central planners can't even decide whether a pencil is worth more than a car.

For example, the way the Soviet Union survived for so long despite this problem was:
* They sold a few goods on the international market;
* they sent spies to the US to gather price data;
* they extrapolated from the foregoing to make guesses (albeit extremely poor guesses) at what other things should be worth.
* A large fraction of their economy was in the black market, which generated some real price information.

For more info, look up the "economic calculation problem."

No amount of claiming "it wasn't real communism" will solve these challenges.

Humans are greedy, it's just who we are.

open a history book

Because niggers.

Autism

So you just explained why communism doesn't function because humans are selfish? gotcha.

CIA

>The Cambodian Killing Fields are a number of sites in Cambodia where collectively more than a million people were killed and buried by the Khmer Rouge regime, during its rule of the country from 1975 to 1979
>Analysis of 20,000 mass grave sites by the DC-Cam Mapping Program and Yale University indicate at least 1,386,734 victims of execution. Estimates of the total number of deaths resulting from Khmer Rouge policies, including disease and starvation, range from 1.7 to 2.5 million out of a 1975 population of roughly 8 million.

To me it looks like communism works great and that the middle east and africa could use 4-5 times stronger communism than cambodia.

Because it's retarded. Well it was designed by kikes and only the mentally disabled follow it.

>No one can own anything anymore
Ok, so how does anyone think this will work?
>I want to read this book
No, you don't own that anymore.
>I want to wear these clothes
No, you don't own that anymore.

Is it supposed that everyone gets the same amount of shitty grey clothes worldwide?

Everyone gets the same amount of food as well? What about chronically ill? What about pregnant women? What about someone, who is sick?

>Everyone works without getting paid or getting any incentive
So why should a doctor work 24/7 anymore? Why should anyone even be a doctor? It's tons of work. I would rather be a lazy leftist ass.

Only a moron could have thought this up and only morons will think it all makes sense.

You can can't share limited resources equally.

reminder that in a proper communist revolution the proletarians, the "winners" are the working class men.

the bourgeoisie that will have their brains splattered against the wall in the event of the revolution are the low t soy latte sipping bugmen that encouraged and welcome that revolution with open arms in the first place.

in other words: the people who fight against communism are the ones who would actually "advantage" from communism the most and the people who actually want communism are welcoming their own demise. lmao.

Pilgrims tried it when they first landed in New England. Lazy people did nothing because hard working people took up thier slack. Didn't matter how hard one worked they all got the same amount of food. So harder working people started to say why should I work hard I get the same amount of food as everyone else. Result is collective decrease in productivity by rewarding poor performance by giving them food they didn't produce and punishing high performance by taking away food they produce. People nearly starved only to be saved by generous Indians. (Happy thanks giving) And change in policy for the following years has created the greatest country In the world. little history omitted by history book.

Because everyone has to put in equal effort to get equal gibs

And not everyone is equal

Because people like owning things, you fucking retard.
Reminder to sage all commie niggerdom.

Here is the thing "the working class" is not you and me, "the working class" are who ever supports monetary the communist party or as militants to the movement. I fuck you not this is how most communist i came across think, to them the working class are literally the only people who don't work at our society.

Communism is like a Dam in the Amazon river, sure it'll work for a while but you gotta keep fixing the damn thing or it'll collapse and the river will flow as it ever has.

im saying communism goes against human nature. it tries to control and manage us, that'll just create a lack of diversity and make us vulnerable to extinction.

Homogeneity is Death for civilization.

gotta shed that skin like our Lizard Over Lords ya know.

All Hail Snek McKek!

In capitalist system working class can work hard and buy and OWN some things such as wedget maker. Then he can use the wedget maker that he OWNS and make widgets and sell it at agreeed price of both parties. Now the working man worked hard and became OWNER of his company. In communism you are told by your owners (government) what you can have and what you can do all for the good of the collective. You can never own any thing as it belongs to the "people" let alone become the owner your self.

False. It will never work. Not even if everyone wanted it to. It has failed miserably every time, no matter it's origins. Read history. Communism is a failed, utterly retarded, oppressive ideology. It's adherents should be publicly set on fire.

Jews in charge. Same with capitalism, unironically

*widget. If you're gonna try to econ, econ right my dude

So if you worked hard and became sucessful you (white Christian guy) can be in charge too. Only 3% of US is Jewish so if 25% of "white Christian guys" became successful there would be for more "white Christian guy" in charge then Jewish people in charge right? Now get off Sup Forums enroll your self in online college get to it!! Ill give you some direction. Take any courses that has to do with money. And stop going into debt with expensive cars and other things that make you look "rich" you don't get rich by buying expensive things. Negotiate everything penny saved is penny earned. Let me how when you are done and look at your self in a mirror you have become .........

It's been 15years since I read a text book or talked about widgets.

>one of the only examples of socialism properly working, kibbutzim

Meh, they had clean and pretty neighborhoods, but they were still inefficient as hell and relied heavily on capitalism.

I will explain at 07:41

amazon.com/Why-Socialism-Works-Harrison-Lievesley/dp/1521531218

Autism speaks.

Communism doesn’t make the assumption that people are unselfish.

If capitalism is so inefficient and communism is efficient why was working class people who communism claims is champion of thier cause jumping over Berlin Wall to escape communism and chose to live under capitalism. If communism was superior why nobody ever tried escaping capitalism in to east Germany? Why did polish people immigrated to capitalist US when they were under the loving arm of communism? Why do North Koreans escape to south but no South Koreans escape to North Korea into loving communism?

Lack of competition, the innate vulnerability of the system to corruption/nepotism, lack of any personal freedom... I could go on with this for the whole day but I won't because in the end you'll just claim that it wasn't communism.

I am really not convinced that central planning is impossible to do efficently, considering how large corporations can for example do it.

People are naturally hedonistic and consumerist. Capitalism is obviously better from that perspective. You know some people jump the border to communist states also?

You do realize if you're in communist country and caught using Sup Forums you'd be off to labor camp right?

Did you know some people jump off bridges? If you own your labor you are a free man. If someone else owns it then you are a slave. Since in communism the collective owns your labor and it tell you how much to keep you are slave to the collective. Not all slaves wanted to be free Stockholm syndrome I guess