Thread for the discussion of topics relating to technocracy

Thread for the discussion of topics relating to technocracy.

There is a whole board for that

/r9k/?

Which one?

Are you serious?

Sup Forums

>technocracy
>/g technology

These are different.

I shit i'm a dumbass lel

Have any countries tried it?

Not fully, however many countries have used some of its elements like germany between 1943 and 1945.

What are key defining characteristics of technocracy?

The defining feature of technocracy is that in it the command of the economy is taken from capitalists and given to experts in each field. This is done in order to increase the efficiency of the economy.

What are the cons?

Economic experts?
Successful capitalists are microeconomic specialists and instead we have macroeconomic experts.
But what is done differently? Do the experts decide on tax rates, budget assignments etc?

If €2M can be spent on roads or schools, how does an economist calculate what's more efficient?

Some people are averse to it due to its authoritartian nature, but otherwise none that I would know.

Ah, by experts I mean people that are actually in the industry. For example experienced farmers would on their own plan the food production. As to how investment targets are chosen, it depends on the general plans done by the overall leadrship, as whether roads or schools are more efficient depends entirely on the situation.

We had a project like that called Cybersyn.

Sadly it was stopped by the empire.

It is indeed a pity. It would have been nice to see how it would have turned out, but US had none of it.

I'm confused.
Farmers can choose how to grow food and what food to grow. Right now they are subsidized because prices are lower than profitable. What decisions can they make that they don't know that would improve efficiency in food industry?

General plans by overall leadership, is that where strategic decisions on a country's future are made? Democratically?

How can you quantitatively compare social infrastructure and education?
Would an efficiency-focused society cut funding for health-care of elderly because they don't contribute back as mucb value anymore?

I think farming is a good example. In a technocracy the farmers would farm as effectively as possible, rather than as profitably as possible. This would be shown as the farming of different crops, and more susteinable farming for example through crop rotation. The farmers would have more control, as they would on their own decide how they will manuafacture food, rather than receiving orders from capitalists.

The overall leadership is chosen by merit. As to how this is done there is some debate, but it would likely be voted by the leaders of each industry. It doesn't make sense to try to compare apples and oranges, so the choise is made on the basis of which one is more usefull. For example, if there are plans to invest in high tech industry, then the school is chosen. Healthcare will be kept the same, as in order to improve morale.

Farmers should decide what's available in shops? Based on what can be most efficiently produced? Right now capitalist orders reflect demands of the public. Take away power from public to choose lifestyle and give to producer?
Now there is possibility of over-production, more output is not needed. Focus on profit means meeting demand with minimal expenses. Is this not efficiency? What motivation to not waste resources if no consequences?

If industry heads choose leaders, then most successful people will be at the top. Right now most successful people are in power. How is the system going to look any different?
In this system, the rulers decide what the citizen's should do by investing in areas they want to develop. You are okay choosing to being told what to do with your life for the good of national plan or moving country?

Right now capitalists are interested in generating as much profit as possible. This leads to production of food which sells well, but does not fulfil nutritional needs well. See american fastfood for example. I recommend you check out the technocratic study guide, as it’s hard for me to explain these concepts from the ground up.

Capitalists profit off hedonistic people.
Is it a good idea to force society to be better?
Government treat people as irresponsible children? Then you have nation of children, who do not make decisions. Effciency does not like risks but risks are progress.

Most popular/ powerful representatives of industry.
This is like the Merchant Guilds of old. They took power from the church and ruled.
The technocracy started in 16th century

The design of the project it's interesting.

It was based on the works of Stafford Beer and other analytic scientists and not in game theory.

...

Fully automatic communism.

But who makes up the government? The people of course. In a technocracy many people get to participate in the government, which will result in a concious and responsible people. Also risks will be taken, but in a controlled manner. You are correct in noticing the similarities to guild socialism.

I actually wonder if pinochet was put to power because the americans feared cybersyn.

...

Technocracy really is the perfect balance between autocracy and democracy.

outfit on point.

Anyways, isn't China considered a technocracy as well?

It has issues, but at least considers people, people and not greed machines.

China is a technocracy in the sense that they have well a educated leadership, which is partly why they have such great economic growth. However like many other countries they aren’t fully technocratic and organise their economy along the lines of state capitalism.

The government made up of the produces, not the consumers. capitalists represent consumers who outnumber producers.
How are the public involved in government under such a system?

The distinction between consumers and producers is arbitary. In a technocracy employment is near 100 %, meaning that everybody is a producer and a consumer.

I thought that was a design diagram for some high tech dildo at first.

I know right, "the environment" is clearly a dragon dildo

100% employment as guaranteed by the state's efficient management with the power in the hands of the workers.
Is this communism?

>Niggers
>Working
So now I know this is a pipe dream.. too good to be true finnbro.

Technocracy and communism do have some similarities, but are overall very distinct. I really recommend for you to read the study guide.

I feel like the study will conveniently gloss over the parts that wouldn't work.

Technocracy needs the government to have absolute information and control while prioritising the collective over the individual.
How can this end well?
Those that are in power can be trusted because they are the top of their industry.
How do they rise to the top of the industry?
Through ruthlessness, manipulation, coercion etc? These are the trustworthy people that represent the public?

The study guide won’t cover everything, but it will help to clear confusion about for example the leadership question. In a technocracy the overall leadership will have little power, as each sector of the economy will have great autonomy. Furthermore, as the system will be hierarchially organised, there is little room for corruption as that would make the system less effective. Ie. Corrupt officials who appoint incompetent workers will make themselves vulnerable to the people above them.

PS I’ll be afk for a couple for hours.

bump

also /his/ would be better for this topic tbqh

tfw this thread will die.

thoughts on techno fascism?

fascism is bad in all forms