Reminder that "Medicare for All" is the only real solution to the healthcare crisis in the U.S

Reminder that "Medicare for All" is the only real solution to the healthcare crisis in the U.S.

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nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMsa054479#t=article
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Diversity is the biggest barrier to that.

You should look into the studies of Putnam and other liberals on how people 'hunker down' in diverse countries and are less likely to support social programs that subsidize others.

Further subsidies to the medical industry will only drive prices higher by creating artificial demand.

The solution is to allow for the importation of drugs from foreign countries and to change health insurance to give direct cash payments based on the cost of the procedure and allowing the patient to get their own care which might entail going to a foreign country for the procedure.

This would subject the healthcare industry to free market competition and encourage consumer choice for lower prices.

PS: Bernie Sanders and Rand Paul both supported a bill earlier this year that would have allowed for importation of Canadaian drugs; but it was killed by the establishment of both the Democratic and Republican parties finding common ground to defend the healthcare industry and screw the American people.

Doesn't seem unachievable to me. Some social programs are good for the economy.
Medicare for All would allow job applicants to not worry about whether their boss was nice enough to pay for a healthcare plan for them.
We should be encouraging stuff like this, it promotes job growth.

>Further subsidies to the medical industry will only drive prices higher by creating artificial demand.
"artificial demand" meaning Americans getting the healthcare they need. Stop spreading lies.

>The solution is to allow for the importation of drugs from foreign countries
I'm not opposed to this.

>and to change health insurance to give direct cash payments based on the cost of the procedure and allowing the patient to get their own care which might entail going to a foreign country for the procedure.
I'm all for price transparency, but "direct cash" doesn't mean much. This is what they already do?
And no exporting to foreign countries.

>I'm all for price transparency, but "direct cash" doesn't mean much. This is what they already do?

No its not. At the moment you go get the drug or the procedure and your insurance pays 100% of it minus the deductible regardless of the cost.

This takes away the consumer pressure for lower prices. If the generic costs $10 and Pfzer's version costs $150 an your insurance will pay for either one you're likely to get the name brand even though the generic is chemically identical. This keeps prices high.

If instead you were given a check for say $75 and you could either choose to spend an extra $75 and buy Pfzer or buy the generic and pocket $65 then there would be much more consumer pressure for lower prices.

>"artificial demand" meaning Americans getting the healthcare they need. Stop spreading lies.

Whenever you subsidize something with state funds to make it cheaper people will buy more of it because the cost is cheaper thus increasing demand.

Now in some cases this is poor people buying drugs they should be taking but couldn't afford; but in others its hypochondriacs getting medical procedures they don't need or drugs of questionable benefit.

My mother is like this, she's taking 20 different prescriptions and she regularly has problems with her medications; but the Doctors keep writing her new prescriptions and make no effort to minimize the amount of crap she's taking. I'm sure she needs a few of those drugs; but the system is designed to sell drugs not treat patients so she ends up taking a bunch of shit she doesn't need.

I would prefer price controls on medical care. Medical care in the U.S. is drastically over priced. But, we still want some prices to prevent over-use, because hypochondriacs still exist.

>muh real socialism

And who the fuck is gonna pick up the tab for that?

Just lower the fucking cost of healthcare.

It's just ridiculously expensive. No one has the balls to say it's the hospitals/pharma companies themselves jacking up the prices. Too many people have their hands in the pie from all the money it makes.

The doctors and nurses give you shit treatment anyway unless they are the best of the best or they are on a mission from God to help people.

Breadline Bernie can suck my upper middle class white cock

The top 1/10th of the 1% faggot. Simple math.

>THIS IS MUH HEALTHCARE, DONKAY!

Medicare for all, universal income for all, food for all, nobody has to pay into the system destroy all taxes, this is how you create an ultimate society of perfection and happiness for all. #GoBernOrGoHome

Slaughter the permanently unemployed seems like a more viable solution.

Everybody having medical insurance has nothing to do with Socialism, but nevertheless everybody had healthcare during Socialism.

...

To be honest, giving everyone $5K cash a year makes more sense than welfare where select people get $30K in benefits to sell drugs on the side. Enough for a car and gym memebership for the based downtrodden.
Working in a grocery store in the ghetto may have made me slightly biased. Fucking nigs pulling out rolls to pay for cigs after getting lobster on ebt whilst I'm struggling my ass off.

Plus essentially no administration costs. And fuck affirmative action. So many brainless black chicks from HS have jobs they are in no way qualified for.

What second of USA history did people have price control over medical costs? Only Socialism has price control. The price in capitalism with or without Bernie is never determined by people, always determined by capitalists and whatever they decide you little wannabe individum will pay.

"Big pharma" does screw us a bit, but at the same time, R&D costs are immense and there's a reason the US invents most modern medicines.

Hello SERCO saleswhore, how's that raped asshole of yours doing today. I don't care
Anyways, no, this is a terrible idea and will only punish the American people more just for the enjoyment of the cunt Lizardbreth and her HPV wannabe prince.
Say NO to SERCObummercare, NO NO NO

FPBP

The main reason other Western countries have universal health care but Burgerland doesn't is because we are 56% white and have millions of niggers leeching off the system.

Yeah, but this is a case where it's probably more beneficial to have the medicare for all and not cut ones nose off to spite one's face.

Single payer healthcare costs half per capita as other options. That's a huge benefit and a bad thing for the other side to be right about. We need to take this issue from them, or they'll bring a whole lot of bad shit along with it when they finally get it.

>Further subsidies to the medical industry will only drive prices higher by creating artificial demand.
>The solution is to allow for the importation of drugs from foreign countries
Isn't the reason why healthcare is cheaper in foreign countries due to the fact that their governments negotiate the costs of medications, etc.?

You invent like 99% of shit that doesn't works and have huge failures in treatments. Maybe also check that. USA invents a lot of shit, that's true, but most of it isn't working. So at end of the day USA doesn't invents a lot. USA is more of an investor than inventor anyway, you pay cash people go to USA. There's nothing in American soil or air that creates inventors, only maybe more niggers.

If it were not for the need to be a full time employee to get health insurance, I would make tons more hopping from contract to contract and feel even more secure in my employment.

Those systems work in places like Norway in Switzerland, high nominal GDP and a relatively small majority white population

Compare it to 56% land, with niggers, kikes, and Mexican bikes, who are actively draining tax dolalrs rather than adding anything of value to society, and it doesn't work

And*, not in. Small but significant mistake

You fail to understand the difference between Socialism and capitalism and constitutional monarchy.
Switzerland, Norway and Denmark are based monarchy based, they have high tax and this pays their greedy medical corporations, is party regulated by EU and government.
USA is based on capitalism, your government itself is regulated by corporations, so it makes zero difference if your government controls it or rich people, it's all the same shit. Your thrown gun into corn and allow them to lobby into government as much as they want and pass their laws. As result you will have high inflation, which is just another tax and on top of that you will also have high prices.
Socialism on other hand is totally different, since there are no insurance companies, there's no competition. If insurance company exists, that's just symbolic, since company is fully controlled by people, there's no promotion, people decide how much money they want to pay into medical system. Insurance company in Socialism is just an account you take money from when needed, there's no promotion. And besides that Socialism has mandatory fitness in school and it doesn't has a lot of fat people. Socialism also aborts retarded people, those few that exist are normally taken care of families or themselves since in Socialism land and apartments aren't difficult to buy, since land you don't buy, while profits from company all go to workers, not boss.

Medicare for all isn't going to save any of us from death.

We are all going to die.

It's all in God's hands.

Why waste a trillion dollars on free healthcare for everyone when we are only given on average 80 years to live?

Hahaha oh god the absolute pinnacle of american ingenuity everyone *calps*

>Isn't the reason why healthcare is cheaper in foreign countries due to the fact that their governments negotiate the costs of medications, etc.?

Partly yes. We effectively subsidize the world's healthcare by throwing subsidy money at our healthcare industry and allowing them to charge our citizens whatever they please. So we pay absurd prices to cover the research costs and then they buy them at a reasonable rate.

Allowing for importation would end regional price controls on drugs and force their price to be based on market demand.

Our drug prices would go down and the prices for the Euros would go up which is only fair since they and our drug companies have been gaming the system for decades.

Medicare for all. Ok, Bernie. Will there be death panels? No?
>Charlie Gard ordered to die, per the request of hospital administration.
No fucking thank you.

>government causes a problem
>the solution is more government

This is because hospitals have to treat everyone even if they can't pay, so just remove that law and see prices drop, and see a drop in dependants too.

Where does government do anything in USA? Does Trump write laws? No. Does Trump run medical system? No. American government doesn't do anything. Even military and banks are privatized. American government is there for people to be as stupid as you. You seriously can't this retarded to think Trump runs medical system.

It's true. We keep limping along with this "insurance system". For the uninformed, insurance based systems only work when EVERYONE that stands to benefit from it, pay into it. I don't like it, but that's what we got.

Stop FreeRiders!

Please, consider suicide.

>So we pay absurd prices to cover the research costs and then they buy them at a reasonable rate.
But to what degree is research a part of those costs, and not just extra profits? That being said, I'm not denying that they fit into the bill somewhere.

>Allowing for importation would end regional price controls on drugs and force their price to be based on market demand.
Sounds good.

>and the prices for the Euros would go up
Would it though? If their governments are still able to negotiate the prices for medications, I don't see why any extra demand would increase prices for their own citizens. I'm pretty sure negotiations are based on cost of production rather than their market price.

So if everyone has medicare what is going to stop people from even being more self destructive? The person getting some heart disease because he/she is a fatty would be cover under medicare and what would stop them from doing it again?

Remember, terrible people will continue to be terrible people even if you "save" them no matter the white knighting.

Faggot, should be logical to you that if you pick your green to gold or whatever insurance plan that it isn't tax. You don't pick the tax nigger. You pick insurance plan, that's a private choice, like you pick your bank card from green to gold or whatever. Gold or platinum card can lift more money, similarly platinum insurance can cover more medical bills. There's nothing national debt burdening here, that's your own private debt. USA has massive national debt because rich people don't work and create money without working. A human life exists for 2 billion seconds, now think about how can some have more money than seconds in life. Did they worked for it? No.

>Would it though? If their governments are still able to negotiate the prices for medications, I don't see why any extra demand would increase prices for their own citizens. I'm pretty sure negotiations are based on cost of production rather than their market price.

Lets say you've negotiated a price of $5 a bottle for drugs. Those drugs can be used at that price or they can be sold to us Murricans for $10 a bottle.

The entire supply of your drugs are going to go towards filling that demand at twice the price. Eventually the drug companies aren't going to keep selling your drugs at that price.

>The entire supply of your drugs are going to go towards filling that demand at twice the price.
Sure, companies would prioritize maximizing their profits by selling in those countries first. That being said, there's still extra profit that can be made in other markets on top of that, even if it's less.

>Eventually the drug companies aren't going to keep selling your drugs at that price.
If they try charging too much for their product in a specific country, then they wouldn't be allowed to sell at all there, correct? Even if they choose no profits over less profits, at that point, wouldn't other companies step in who are willing to utilize that market?

Exactly. Hop from job to job without caring about where your healthcare insurance is going to come from.
Better for everyone involved.

Come up with a fair way to penalize people who are purposing sabotaging their own health and I'll hear you.
I don't want moochers any more than you do, but that is the price you pay with many systems.
I'd rather have Medicare for All and slap people abusing the system with fees.

Well the best medicine is prevention.

Same logic that stops you from addiction.

#RepealAndReplace

A Medicare for All system is our best long term solution.
Good for jobs and good for America.

Medicare for All is not a "leech" system, as it would be paid via payroll taxes.
It is not "free".
It is the promise of basic healthcare coverage for every working man, woman, and their family.

Bahamian has the correct answer. The problem is the hyperinflated cost of healthcare, not the cost of insurance. Exclusive medical supply contracts are a problem, so are frivolous lawsuits that lead to expensive malpractice insurance.

Berniefags literally don't understand that "free" means someone else pays for it. They think healthcare and college magically becomes complimentary.

>A 2006 study done by the New England School of Medicine found that only 3% of the claims studied had no adverse outcome from medical care and that 63% were directly attributed to error.
nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMsa054479#t=article

I agree that medical contracts and pharmaceutical supplies are an issue though.

Did you not look at the image? It's a payroll tax.
Which means anyone who works, pays.
That's both you and me.

American hospitals and insurance companies aren't public owned, they are private owned. If they were public owned and everybody paid you could reduced the medical costs, since shared workload. But lets talk about something important like why don't hospitals or insurance companies have enough money to cover their bills when they clearly collect more money than in other countries. Well the answer is simple, somebody ate the money. What's even more strange is for Americans claiming this somehow overflows to national debt, which can only happen if private bosses collude with government and get bailed out, but not even then national debt can happen for sure, only deficit can happen. So lets say payroll tax happens without public ownership of insurance companies and hospital companies, then again bosses can steal money, since nobody supervises them.

Payroll tax is both employer and employee. It's a ton of fucking money

i live in the US. there is no healthcare crisis.

It's how social security and medicare work currently.
The employer pays a portion.

If you want Medicare run out and get pozzed. It's easy enough. Besides, that's how life goes under communism.

>If they try charging too much for their product in a specific country, then they wouldn't be allowed to sell at all there, correct?

If there are drug imports then they wouldn't be able to sell pills at a higher rate at all because of the economic pressure from cheaper imported drugs.

Lets say you're Pfzer and you're trying to sell pills for $100 a bottle and I run a drug importation company that buys the pills in Europe at $10 a bottle, imports them to the US and jumps through FDA hoops for about $5 and then sell the drugs for say $25 a bottle.

There's simply no way Pfzer would be able to sell an identical product at 4 times the price of my imported version. This is how the free market is supposed to work and it would work this way if our government weren't actively screwing us to protect the drug companies by protecting them from drug imports.

No it isn’t

The vast majority of Americans are happy with their healthcare like 90%

The primary problem with health care (to the extent that there even was one in 2009, when 5/6ths of people had health insurance and 88% of those with insurance were satisfied with it) is that health care is too fucking valuable and paid for by someone else.
Whether it's the government paying for it, or your insurance company, there is a large disconnect between 1) the cost for all that medical school, licensing, and nigger lotto malpractice suits and 2) your co-pay and monthly premium. The disconnect stops people both as individuals and voters from trying to bring costs down.
It's like taxes. Poorfags think they're paying their fair share but in reality 90% of people aren't paying jack shit. Medicine is even worse because almost nobody injured or sick is paying jack shit compared to the cost of their problem.
The problem for Berniefags is that unlike food or shelter, all tiers of health care are recognized as a "human right" instead of a luxury good. Especially to we Amerifats. We tend to consume as much as we possibly can and are only stopped by our insurance company telling us to fuck ourselves. If our Medicare-for-all hospital rationed health care to keep costs down we would be on the phone with our Congressman. Europeans vote like fags on this issue but they understand at least somewhat that rationing is necessary in the system they voted for. We burgers don't go in for that shit. We would bankrupt a European system within 2 years.
Of course the leftists are fine with that because that means more Democrat voters forever calling for moar money for Berniecare, while the Republicuck party would quickly McConnell into their standard Democrat Lite position as the more responsible stewards of ever-expanding government.

What a dumb bastard.

>Some social programs are good for the economy.

Haha. It's no wonder thinkers like you want to make the income taxes more progressive but never mention all the taxes we have on the books that are regressive. It just shows how dumb and uninformed you are about our country.

>Insults and nonsense
>Conservatards actually think this proves their point.

>He actually think this proves his point even though he brought up no evidence in the first place.

My point was that you are too uninformed to have a good point.

>If there are drug imports then they wouldn't be able to sell pills at a higher rate at all because of the economic pressure from cheaper imported drugs.
Sure, I'm definitely not denying that. However, I'm still referring to:
>the prices for the Euros would go up
...apparently as a result of allowing drug importation into the U.S. My point though is that if a drug has already been negotiated to $5 a bottle by a government in some European country, then I don't see why that would suddenly raise any higher for the citizens there, even if those companies can get $10 for a bottle in the U.S. (due to no government negotiation).
Allowing drug importation is without a doubt a step in the right direction, and I'm all for it. However, it still seems like those in the EU could see lower prices of the same drug, even after it's imported to America (as the amount of profits those companies can make off a drug would be limited by that specific county's government).

>then I don't see why that would suddenly raise any higher for the citizens there, even if those companies can get $10 for a bottle in the U.S. (due to no government negotiation).

Here's how it would likely play out.

Drug importation starts. Countries that have negotiated good prices can make a killing exporting drugs to the US. They order as much as they can at the low prices for export. US drug companies see this is hurting their profits and try to restrict exports and try to negotiate higher prices to these countries. After much dicking around and lawyering eventually you see prices level out and become more or less the same in all countries based on research and manufacturing costs.

Basically there's no real reason why these drugs should cost more in one country than they do any other aside from the hurdles put in place by state regulations.