>Saber is supposed to have Rank A instinct
>She is a servant who are faster than fighter jets and have god like agility
>Some human on magic drugs who isn't on Servant level was able to land "Hits" on her despite everything
Is it just me, or is Saber literally a punching bag?
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But it did put him on servant level
Instinct isn't Clairvoyance.
>mom I posted it again!
Saber is pretty much a jobber in FSN, she's built up to be amazing and awesome but she mostly loses so the reader knows how dangerous the villains are.
>Kuzuki is already formidable as a regular human
>Gets buffed through some really good magic
Isn't this side of the nasu verse supposed show humans at the top of the food chain? Why is it a shock that some humans can fight servants when servants were once humans capable of some crazy shit?
There is never a time when Caster is seen as an unstoppable villain, like Gil, Berserker, the Shadow, or even Assassin on the high ground. I see her as having the potential but never reaching it. She has it just as bad as Lancer but none of the glory.
This same franchise makes (or at least used to make) a big deal about how heroes can't be born in the modern world.
At her peak she wrangled together a team of 4 servants+ Kuzuki, which in theory could steamroll everyone in any scenario in the franchise (cept whatever ridiculous shit GO pulls next), but it fell apart quickly. Assassin doesn't care about her and can't leave the gate, Saber was defiant the whole way through, and Archer was plotting against her the whole time.
Because before this, the narration had told us that Servants were an existence that Masters could never reach/compare to. F/SN breaks this point multiple times. F/Z didn't once.
Zecchan: "Could Kerry or Kirei in their prime have taken on Servants?"
Iri: "they could, depending on their methods"
This is partially bullshit, mind you, since you need an attack capable of physically harming them. See Kirei pinning Assassin to a tree with enchanted black keys. Did absolutely no damage. He could still potentially kill a Servant if he pumped enough command spells into a single attack but Kerry has zero way of inflicting damage.
Weren't her stats nerfed pretty bad when Shirou was her master.
They were still Cs and Bs in everything on top of things like instinct, charisma and mana burst being A rank, imo Shirou Saber is pretty average maybe above it if she whips out Excalibur(Can rip Herc to shreds in a single burst) if she whipped out Excalibur she would've mangled Kuzuki and by proxy Caster because her Master died.
That's the other half of it; Saber's mana is capped so Excalibur is a last resort. Like she couldn't use it on Berserker cause she spent it on Rider. Zero tries to replicate this with Gae Buidhe's cut but had to turn her into an idiot to accomplish this and gave it up as soon as something showed up that needed an Excaliblast.
>believing stats
Her power is plot, just like every main character that ever existed.
Real servants can dematerialize and shank anyone at anytime. Saber for whatever reason, just sticks around like she's a living being.
Wasn't that because shirou is a shit magus and she doesn't have enough Mana from him to do that
Kerry's mere existence causes extreme emotional damage to Archer.
>kek someone actually used my pasta
Good on you for the bait
Saberfags BTFO
Read Fate route. Insufficient magic was just a cover. It's because she is still a living being, not a spirit.
Enkidu
is p cool
why the fuck is he so strong isn't he just a teacher?
The actual truth is that Zero and Stay Night are both quite shit. Grand Order saved the franchise; there's no need to talk about those piles of trash anymore.
...
Saber was nerfed because Shirou is a bad magus, and Caster was based enough with her magic to make a human strong like that.
In the HA is explained that he was trained as a assassin since his chilhood
But what happened in UBW when Rin made a contract with Saber?
She got a stat boost, but she still couldn't dematerialize. Same thing in Zero.
Kuzuki's fighting style is anti-instinct by nature, as its meant to be an assassination tool.
Instinct is a higher level Eye of the Mind (False) that can't be trained, which itself is a hax copy of Eye of the Mind (True) that is derived from natural ability/6th sense rather than training. Clairvoyance is the ability to see the future. Instinct just predict movement, which plays straight into Snake's unusual movement. In comparison, Archer's fighting style (which manifest as Eye of the Mind (True) ranked B) where he intentionally leave obvious holes in his defense to bait the opponents into attacking where he's capable of defending, would work perfectly fine against it.
Still physical. Shirou/mana supply had nothing to do with it. Zero never brought it up, but it's why she bothered with the suit.
But what happened in HF when Sakura made a contract with Saber?
Reduced to a spirit after repeated tribbing
She still can't go into spirit form. But she can go into the shadow for instant transportation between her current location and Sakura.
Saber turned into a magical girl. But then it turned out to be a lie so she became a witch.
By that logic, wouldn't Archer be better at CQC than Saber? If she's got False, and he's got True, and all.
True = Batman
False = Spidey Sense
Instinct = Path to Victory (For Combat)
Revelation = Path to Victory (For Everything)
Doesn't that just reinforce my point? Batman's power is prep-time for CQC and shit.
The problem is that Archer isn't Batman. He goes around engaging Servants in melee when he should be sniping. He gets his shit wrecked when he fights any decent Servant in melee.
The best part was when Gilgamesh laughs maniacally for like ten minutes after half killing Shirou and Saber on their date while they impotently struggled to get up out of their own blood.
Gilgamesh laughing for an uncomfortably long time in the background while other characters (generally Saber) are trying to have a moment is so good it's happened twice now, in the DEEN anime and the Fate Zero Sound Drama
The man is very easily amused.
Archer's fighting style is to compensate for the fact that he's weaker and slower than his opponent, so leaving holes in his defense bait the enemy into attacking holes he can defend, not holes he can't. Even with it, his CQC is still pretty shite, his strength is in long range snipe with his large toolkit of arrows. Hrunting for homing snipe shot, Caladbolg II for large scale nuke, etc..
EOTM True = Product of training. It is the ability to calmly calculate and predict future moves using existing experience while in combat, a nerve of steel.
EOTM False = The same ability, but come naturally through natural talent/instinct rather through an accumulation of experience. Can be boosted/refined by experience. It is false because it only resemble the effect that true provide, and it cannot be obtained through training.
Instinct: A level higher than EOTM False. Skips the analysis and go straight to the result, it allow the user to immediately asses the best possible move at any given time. Instinct can be used to predict trajectory of fire arm, EOTM False can't.
Revelation - Instinct for everything, not just combat.
Clairvoyance - Far sight. At Rank EX, it allow seeing into the future.
When did a servant fight a master in F/Z? The closest I can remember is Lancer picking up his bitch.
Waver threatens to fight Gil, but gets laughed off.
None of the masters in F/Z were irrational enough to bother some thing as suicidal as fighting a servant alone.
>FZ masters
>Not deluded irrational fuckwits
>magic drugs
you underestimate the power of boners
>Waver threatens to fight Gil, but gets laughed off.
when does this happen?
t. Stay Night fag
>Kerry
seigi no mikata autism +edge
>tokiyomi
Gil's dick holster
>Waver
lil bitch
>Kayneth
lil bitch
>Rynusooke
edge overload
>karya
#didnothingwrong
>kirei
#didnothingwrong
...
>Shirou
seigi no mikata autism +hot-headed+hypocrite
>Rin
Ruined her chances of winning for an autist.
>Shinji
lil bitch
>Illya
lil jealous bitch
>Kirei
#didnothingwrong
>Kuzuki
#didnothingwrong
that is indeed correct
what is it about HGW's that induce autism in everyone?
A human, raised from birth to be a barehanded assassin, boosted by a witch from the age of gods (who was trained by the goddess of magic herself) could probably land a hit or two on king arthur summoned by some japanese fuck with the magical talent of a commoner.
Shinji, Tokiomi, Kayneth, Kariya, and Waver were all wakames
Shirou, Kirei, Kerry, Ryuu, Sakura, and Illya were mentally ill
Rin, Kuzuki, Bazett, and Zouken were relatively well adjusted
also kinda masters
>Medea
#didnothingwrong
>zouken
isnt it nice seeing an old man spend time with his grand-kids?
>sakura
THE DEVIL
>Zouken
>Relatively well adjusted
all he did was have worms rape his kids for generation to try and summon satan to remake the world to get his crush back - perfectly well adjusted
...
...
When Shirou goes to meet him at the Matou mansion in HF, Zouken says his goal is to attain perfect immortality by giving shape to the soul, which is alluding to the Third. It's just that somewhere along the way he forgot that he wanted to make a paradise for mankind by elevating everybody and started obsessing over the fact that he didn't want to die, personally
I really want to dive more into this series but hte juxtaposition of it being primarily porn and this much complexity is offputting
>primarily porn
it really isnt - what little H scenes are in the base VN are removed in realta nua
the complexity is mostly semantic- its just shitposting at its heart
>primarily porn
unctuous mollusk
It's only 75 hours of your time to finish FSN and FHA, user
>only 75 hours
Sorry I'm not a NEET so I don't have that kind of time investing on porn
Yeah, but Saber is the only Servant who always manages to survive until the very final battle.
You have to remember that in Fate/stay night, EVERYONE jobs. Sure, Saber jobs a lot, but so does Berserker, Caster, Rider, Archer, Lancer and Gilgamesh. The only one who doesn't job as much are the Assassins, because one barely gets to fight and the other is only in one route.
Don't you feel at least a little bit embarrassed writing all this?
That's part of his gameplan. When he gets serious, he pulls out the bow. Melee is his way of gauging the enemy.
His bow is basically his trump card. Archer doesn't have a special bow, so normal arrows are worthless. He needs to use Broken Phantasms to really compare to other Servants, but those are his trump cards. He can't afford to show them off so carelessly, but he can't get a good read on his opponent with just normal arrows, so he has to get in close.
i think this statement is untrue because shiro turned out to be one of the greatest heros the holygrail got its hands on
>shiro turned out to be one of the greatest janitors the holygrail got its hands on
Fixed that for you.
Let's go through her wins and losses one by one. In FSN she was stated-down by Shirou and has a very strict mana capacity:
-Pushed back Lancer, survived the Bulge
-gutted Archer once in each route
-Got gutted by Berserker in Fate and HF which is no shame since he's motherfucking Heracles
-Stalemate with Assassin, who is the most elder god tier super swordsman in the whole series.
-Shinji Rider never even registered as a threat before she broke out pegasus
-Eventually beat Heracles
-lost to Gilgamesh, the most OP servant ever (for a time). Managed to withstand Ea.
-Beat Gilgamesh
-Stunned by Kuzuki, who was a freakish assassin backed by age of gods magic. Kind of a stretch, but bizarre surprise attack by a Nanaya level mountain assassin. His technique only works one time against someone and that's why he pussed out from ever trying to go after her again.
-Ruuru breakaa'd while being held back via command seal. then went on to resist Caster's attempts to break her the whole time
-Beat Assassin
-gutted Rider and "killed" Zouken
-killed Caster
-got ringed out by the shadow while fighting True Assassin
-Saber Vs. Archer. Scenario was very unique and not indicative of either's aptitudes. She can't move much cause he's aiming for Shirou the whole time, but she uses a command spell to close the gap.
-Got Frag'd by Bazett, which took god knows how many retries for her to pull off.
-Swatted some avenger corpses
>pushed back Lancer
She pushed back jack shit. Lancer was forced to return by Kotomine because he's a massive faggot who enjoys Lancer's suffering.
>She pushed back jack shit.
lol but Lancer was a hot headed happy trigger so calling him back its the wise option
in Zero, however, she has no handicap other than being written by Butcher:
-Lost to Diarmuid cause she made extremely stupid mistakes in her fight with him
-Almost got her head smashed in by a lamppost until Diarmuid saved her.
-Bullymeat for Kiritsugu
-doesn't kill Caster despite hating him and having several opportunities
-Has to be saved from caster's monsters by Diarmuid.
-Bullymeat for Rider and Gil
-Attacked by JETS. She's never hit but is bailed out by Diarmuid and Gil
-Saved by Diarmuid for the fourth fucking time by breaking his spear to let her Excaliblast Caster
-Killed Caster
-Exclibast somehow not fast enough to kill Rider's slow ass. She lets him go afterwards
-Bullymeat for Lancelot
-Pushed back by Lancelot using Arondight but doesn't manage to kill her (somewhat impressive considering her very low morale and having Dragon alignment).
-Kills Lancelot with Invisible Air of all things when it didn't scratch him earlier (somehow)
-Beat by Gil's light GoB spam in the finale
F/SN has a few strengths, but consistence is not one of them.
It was already established that he would never be able to do that against Saber ever again. It was a surprise attack by a style she had no clue about. After that fight, she knows thus he's fucked. that was why he told Caster to bail (the scene was much different then how the anime portrayed which is no shock as ufotable messes up a good number of things in both zero and UBW)
I no longer want to watch UBW after this, wtf
Neat
It's also confirmed that he fell in love with Caster at first sight if I remember correctly. Irrelevant but I thought it was cute.
But UBW the VN has this? To be fair the VN actually explained how (basically Kuzuki's fighting style counter Saber's Instinct)
This is a problem with Ufotable as a whole, they hardly ever explain anything or worse, change events. I don't know what worse the fact that Saber was able to kill Herc in the graveyard, Archer using UBW in his fight with Shiirou or how they handled the Lancelot fight ending.
the animation you tard
Some of those frames don't even look like seibah
It's not a threat, but a matter-of-fact statement about the fact that he would do it in theory, which he makes to Gil after Iskandar dies.
>"But, boy, if you truly are a loyal subject, you have a duty to take revenge for your deceased King, do you not?"
>Even with the second question, Waver answered with a strangely calm heart. “… If I challenged you, I would die.”
>“Of course.”
>“I can’t do that. I was ordered to live.”
F/SN has an absurd amount of plot holes and incosistencies. The stats are just there for show; they don't explain any of the battle's outcomes.
animation got progressively worse as the series went on. They did some good stuff in S2 but the quality decline became very noticeable.
>edgy anime throw
I wanted her to get sent flying like a baseball.
this adaptation sucks balls.
Maybe they think the VN's Shirou vs Archer was hard to adapt, considering it's the two narrative and thought processes running in parallel that make that fight so interesting. So instead they opt for visuals and dialogue in the anime by using UBW
Which might have worked, had they not mentioned he was too low in mana. It's bad enough we already have Archer having to clean up a mess in the ending so UBW didn't end with Shirou ripping his arm off and having no one to celebrate because Tin got Saber to excaliblast her. Ufotable didn't think ahead at all or make the proper changes to make this choice work.
Rin*
>the Fate Zero Sound Drama
Where might this be available now? Does anyone know? I can't seem to find an available version with nyaa dead, bakabt MIA, etc, etc. There are, of course, parts of it available on Youtube - Kerry vs Kirei, and the ilk - but not the full work.
At least in that scene Nasu tries to explain by having Kuzuki's style being able to change target instantly to fuck with Instinct
this Shirou became a counter guardian, no hero. Basically his kind just appeared where turmoil was happening, he appeared and killed everyone regardless of their affiliation or who caused it hence EMIYA being so butthurt.
Power levels mean jack shit in FNS, most fights are about NP, compatibility between servants and their own creativity.
But is it a mary sue?
Rin did it, not the narration. It's not like it's some universal fact. Saying that a Master can never beat a Servant is like saying a single soldier can never beat a tank. Both statements are technically true, but exceptions do exist.
Only the strong survive in education
He's not, and fuck you don't call him "it"
If Gil doesn't call him "it", I sure as hell won't
He's got a distinctive character that scares some people and attracts others, he's not supposed to exist in the world as a Servant, he has at least one clearly-defined weakness; he's not a Sue.