Guys.. Is it wrong for a Christian to serve in the military..?

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No, but its wrong to serve jew interests by joining the military.

No you're serving Israel and the jews
Protect your prohet's people

Are Christians meant to be pacifists? Why did John the Baptist order soldiers to do no harm to others, yet Jesus said render unto Ceasar which would include conscription in theory? Why were early Christians ordered not to serve in militaries and yet Christ said if a Christian does not own a sword let him sell his garment and buy one? How can a Christian live in peace and nonviolence if Christians do not take arms to defend their own? What is the answer here? Is a soldier who kills living in sin, as the Kingdom of Christ is not earthly and all earthly kingdoms are impermanent?

It wasn't wrong for the crusaders to protect Christendom. It's wrong for the US military to protect the synagogue of Satan.

How..?

I feel that you're right.

yes earthly kingdoms are made of sin

According to the church, crusaders had all sins forgiven for protecting Christendom. Defending Christ and his people is a good way to get into heaven. Don't fall for commies that just repeat misinterpreted verses.

I just want to be sure, like scripturally sure.. Can anyone help me out?

Checked

nice example of a christcuck right here

Christ literally said to buy yourself a sword, so militias are a-okay.
However, for the real, salaried militaries, you have to rely on the Founding Church fathers and their interpretation that ''soldiery is an employ like all others, as in earning your own due in measure to your devotion to work, and in recognizing your superiors orders and trusting them.

not if you're a woman, cause women can't be christian

God takes care of his children , if christians got enemies then god brought them to them

You already found scripture. Jesus advocated self defense and never said owning an army is wrong. The closest he ever came to that was Luke 14:31, and that just says don't go to war whenever you're doomed to lose.

How awful of me to want to serve God and not just live by my own earthly passions like a hedonistic Dutchman.

yes. whites being masculine in any way is strictly prohibited by the pope

say 15 our fathers and suck some nigger toes

>51And, behold, one of them which were with Jesus stretched out his hand, and drew his sword, and struck a servant of the high priest's, and smote off his ear. 52Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword

John 18:36
>Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.


its pretty obvious

The early church spread like wildfire without any violence. In a perfect world, it would have countinued this way and the kingdom of the Prince of Peace would be on earth. Maybe after Rome converted and began to fight force of heathenry with force, they invited more catastrophe to manifest (the plagues, mongols, turks, saracens, moors, etc) for straying from the simple teaching of Christ and His instructions to make disciples of all nations in the simple pilgrim's way of the church fathers. Just a thought.

I'm really sick of all these 'not politics' threads. Op you're a faggot. You're part of why the quality of this board has declined. Saged.

And, behold, one of them which were with Jesus stretched out his hand, and drew his sword, and struck a servant of the high priest's, and smote off his ear. 52Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword
That just says prepare to be killed if you're going to kill. It doesn't say war is not allowed.

>John 18:36
>>Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.
His kingdom is heaven filled with angel servants, not Earth. How does this imply no war allowed?

Its literally his doctrine if you cannot see that then you are blind , the cuck religion where you have to trust god. But you do not thus we live in the hell created for our self

Love Your Enemies

(Leviticus 24:17-23; Luke 6:27-36)

>38Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth: 39But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also. 40And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloke also. 41And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain. 42Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.

>21Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment: 22But I say unto you, That whosoever is angry with his brother without a cause shall be in danger of the judgment: and whosoever shall say to his brother, Raca, shall be in danger of the council: but whosoever shall say, Thou fool, shall be in danger of hell fire. 2

>43Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy. 44But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you; 45That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust. 46For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same? 47And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so? 48Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

I think so,
Whosoever shall live by the sword shall die by the sword,
Turn the other cheek
Bless those who curse you

You're extending statements about personal enemies to whole tribes. There is a huge difference. Some of those are plain misinterpreted too.

Once I'm out I'll find something simple and honorable to do. I don't want to have guilt or doubt in my soul about where I am at in life, even if it means settling for a simple and humble life. Being young is idolizing earthly warriors and the force of arms as true manliness but growing up is disillusionment and accepting that there can never be peace or goodness in the form of an earthly kingdom, because our struggle is not against flesh and blood but against the powers of spiritual wickedness in high places.

It's a fool'a errand to wage war for empires or societies or ideologies that are doomed to collapse, like maintaining sandcastles in the path of a tide.. Better to exert oneself for the kingdom that shall never perish.

then were is the scripture on attacking another tribe
he even acknowledges and condones roman occupation

yes and the message is clear do not kill anybody or you will be in danger of hellfire a christian needs to be better then a jew

Matthew 5
>20For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

Ultimately Rome was conquered by Christ's message despite Christians never taking up arms against an earthly emperor to do so. The jews, however, disregarded His message and rose up against Rome and held up in a mountain fortress, and as Christ predicted, the temple was destroyed and the rebels were hunted down to the last man like dogs or committed suicide. How many other empires all the way up until the Third Reich tried to defeat darkness by force of arms, literally only to be thrown into a chasm at the brink of victory and see their people annihilated. The war is spiritual, it can't be won by flesh and blood.

Honestly I feel like if half the people on Sup Forums prayed earnestly and sincerely every day for the redemption of their people and fatherland, and the healing of their society from the selfish decadence and atheistic degeneracy of godlessness more good would be done then by any force of arms in the world. The true enemy is stubborness and inability to rely on God's strength through the prayers of His faithful. That's what I've come to believe.

gotquestions.org/military-Christian.html

>Thou shalt not kill
murder

NT:
34"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.

OT:
16 “Only in the cities of these peoples that the LORD your God is giving you as an inheritance, you shall not leave alive anything that breathes. 17 “But you shall utterly destroy them, the Hittite and the Amorite, the Canaanite and the Perizzite, the Hivite and the Jebusite, as the LORD your God has commanded you,

Christianity doesn't call for attacking other tribes. It doesn't call for not attacking them either. It just says don't fight a losing battle

>Or suppose a king is about to go to war against another king. Won't he first sit down and consider whether he is able with ten thousand men to oppose the one coming against him with twenty thousand?
Luke 14:31

The fifth commandment is accurately translated thou shalt not murder. It disallows unlawful killing, otherwise Yahweh commanded the Israelites to sin many times.

How can you be a soldier when Jesus told you to love your neighbours, and your enemies ?

During the 2 first centuries, people becoming christian stopped their military activities

Old Testament is the old law, Jesus was very clear on that. And so was always taught that "to bring a sword" meant that he was severing the old law from the Gospel.

34"Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.

Thats literally the only verse

and in context

The Sword of the Gospel

(Luke 12:49-53)

>34Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. 35For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. 36And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.

war is useless so it's not just Christians

>do not kill anybody or you will be in danger of hellfire a christian needs to be better then a jew
It's literally nowhere.

Jesus doesn't mention that you shouldn't KILL anyone, or you shouldn't be a soldier or protect your people. Not one single time he speaks out against murder.

He's preaching about how people should strive to be on good terms with each other, how you should turn the other cheek and help your fellows, but not one single time he condemns murder or war explicitly as something abominable. Since for a Christian murder is not a sin. The lack of love is being fallen from God, but just ending someone's mundane life is not an especially bad thing.

Ending someone life is the worse possible thing when you are supposed to love this person. Christians have to love their enemies too. Can't kill what you love

And the gospel led to violence and the death of numerous people, as even a very common man could've predicted. Jesus wasn't against that. In Christianity nowhere death on Earth was seen as a bad thing.

>Old Testament is the old law, Jesus was very clear on that.
OLD TESTAMENT STILL VALID
“Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. (NIV, Matthew 5:17–18)

>And so was always taught that "to bring a sword" meant that he was severing the old law from the Gospel.
Your autism is the epitome of cringe.

It's wrong for anyone to serve in the military. Don't join the military. You're only destroying countries for Israel and are thrown down the shitter if you survive and come back. Get armed and stay in the states.

You only come with wrong translations or luke a parable about a king .... accept the fact that jesus was the prince of peace and he preached it


Its not murder when your god commands it offcourse

Jesus performed miracles for Roman centurions, so I would guess that it isn't...

It's not. He "fulfilled" the law, the law was fulfilled, Jesus died, the contract ended.

Why would Jesus tell everyone to buy a sword for self defense and then rebuke his disciple for drawing a sword against a Roman soldier to protect him? That kind of cognitive dissonance on your part is pretty autistic if you ask me.

yes. true christians should have no part of the system of the beast.

>You only come with wrong translations
Sure buddy, whatever keeps you cucked at night
>Its not murder when your god commands it offcourse
It's not murder when it's lawful.

Generally yes, this is why on an individual level Christians should not kill. Because they should try to help instead of destroy.

"If your right eye causes you to stumble, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell."

You can only kill to save, to protect, and even when you do that, you are imperfect, since a completely saintly man shouldn't do that. It is an imperfection in morality that only the weak men have.

It is not the Beast system yet.

No need to kill, you can incapacitate.

>And the gospel led to violence and the death of numerous people,

What has that to do with anything ? the gospel preaches peace , if people want to create their own versions let them be unrighteous , but its not jesus they are following

>He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.

I'm glad I have time to repent now and make things right. I've never harmed anyone indirectly in my service but now more than ever I hope that I never do.. My conversion is sincere, I truly don't want to harm anyone ever again.

not the gospel, the false teaching of false teacher.

God is patient with you too. Now pray him to get help to know him. He will find the way to your door.

Because you're taking everything out of context. He had to die on the cross to fulfill the prophecy. What was he supposed to do just say I'm not doing the crucifixion anymore because I believe in self defense, or tell Peter to knock it off?

Thank you user, I will.

If they did not have a sword he could have never used the epic quote and make a point that violence leads to death

>prince of peace
>Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.

>no direct preaching against war
>not a single word against protecting the people you love and care about
>the only sacrifice ever asked for is self sacrifice

if you can, you should, if you can't you can't
> the gospel preaches peace
It doesn't.
>>Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.
Is the words of Jesus Christ, directly in the gospel.

>>He that is unjust, let him be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy still.
Is against aggression, not against war.

You should kill to protect your own, you should wage war to protect your people, you can't use war to convince others, you can't use wars to spread the faith, but you will go to war, when you spread the faith and people see the truth and others will attack you for it.

Right after that He said he who lived by the sword dies by the sword.

>if you can, you should, if you can't you can't

You always have the choice.

>How can a Christian live in peace and nonviolence if Christians do not take arms to defend their own?
By living in peace and passively resisting tyranny. Besides if someone wants to execute you you should be happy as a Christian its like getting to cut in line to get into heaven.

I never understood why people would be afraid of being martyred unless they didn't actually believe their religion.

it falls into the old theory of "speak softly and carry a big stick", the purpose is to hope to not need to use the stick, yet, here we are finding it needed. good thing we have it.

I'm not anymore user, I agree with you, I'm just trying to sort it all out.

>>>Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword.
>Is the words of Jesus Christ, directly in the gospel.

i already quoted your meme verseThe Sword of the Gospel

(Luke 12:49-53)

>34Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword. 35For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law. 36And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.

O RLY? Who'd of thought if you try to kill people you might get hurt? That's not a command to not carry a sword, because that would contradict what he said earlier about selling your cloak to buy one.

>passively resisting tyranny

only when these tyranny want to prevent you from serving God.

Isn't it better to try to see your enemies saved as well rather than killing them knowing they will go to hell and never have another chance because you killed them..? I don't think I could live with myself. Isn't it better for me to die in faith instead knowing that I will be with the Lord and that my example might lead to them being saved as well?

youtu.be/WRmKylcc0Ac?t=6m
start directly at 6 minute.

No you don't. Because you can only sacrifice yourself.

If you abandon your duty you kill other people. Your own people.

Again: it's not a commandment to not kill, it's not a commandment to not wage war, it's definitely not a commandment to leave the suffering, the the innocent to their faith of destruction and flee from the fight.

It's all a conjuration.

You quoted, but that doesn't mean anything. What I'm referencing is the word of Christ, what you are backing up is conjuration. What you are referring to is situational:

if you take up the sword you die.

Is not a commandment that you shouldn't take up the sword. Then it would be:

DO NOT FIGHT!
DO NOT KILL YOUR FELLOW MAN!
DO NOT TAKE UP THE SWORD!

But it's not. Jesus didn't want Peter to die for him right there, so he shouldn't take up the sword right there, in that situation. Not a commandment, especially since:
>die by the sword
vs
>Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body in hell.

Those who take up the sword DIE by the SWORD. They didn't go to Hell. They won't be punished by God. They will die in this world.

That's the whole point: it is not a sin to kill a man. It is not condemned by the Father. It is condemned by the laws of the World.

It's believed he was referring to the destruction of the Temple and the Jews as the trigger for the abolition of the Law. That's what he meant by "accomplished." No reason to mention accomplishing something as a condition of abolishing the Law unless you expect/want it to happen.

John he Baptist was telling soldiers not to take advantage of their station, to not loot, steal, or rape, to be content with their wages.

This shows you can be a soldier, OP. Do not abuse your power, treat all others as you would wish to be treated, and if you are fighting for the defense of your land and people, fight for all you have. God has an affinity to soldiers, the good soldier is a model of a good Christian. War is sin, but defense of life, and in most cases property, you have a right to defend. Read about the ideas of the just war among theologians, even though most theologians are fucking tools.

>If you abandon your duty you kill other people. Your own people.

You don't press the trigger. This is a fallacy

>selling your cloak to buy one.

he literally says he needs the swords to fulfill scripture

35And he said unto them, When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing. 36Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one. 37For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me, And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end. 38And they said, Lord, behold, here are two swords. And he said unto them, It is enough.

>For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me,

Yes, don't know about your heretical sect but Orthodoxy condemns murder.

Pacifism is anti-Christian. Christ was very clear that he did not oppose organized violence for the right reasons. If you hold all killing as inherently wrong, then you are disagreeing with Christ's morality.

>he literally says he needs the swords to fulfill scripture

It was done when Peter used it.

I mean Christ was the same person who said to forgive degenerates like Mary Magdalene so I don't exactly give his word much weight anyway.

I can't force anyone to accept Christ. That's up to them. If they refuse and try to kill me, I have the right to defend myself.

You can defend but can't kill. Your love, your christian qualities may still change them...

>You quoted, but that doesn't mean anything.

Jesus literally explains right after what the sword is.. but its about war

>I can't force anyone to accept Christ.
Than you are a monster. From a Christian perspective letting one to not accept Christ is worse than murder, after all hell is infinitely worse than death.

Also your pic is retarded considering the crusades started before the jihads.

Only if you are a nigger.

Generally, I don't think so, but look at what defending the US means today.

>defending sodomy
>defending child murder
>defending cross dressing
>defending feminism
>defending apostasy and freedom to practice Satanism and witchcraft

No Christian should put his life on the line to defend these things.

get a hike, Kant, your whole philosophy is a fallacy

you can fight to protect your own

situationally it can be right or wrong to kill and fight according to the laws of the world (strategy), but it is never a SIN or against the commandment of the Father to kill someone to protect the innocent, to protect your own

Love your enemy.

i guess luke wasnt an strategist
or the enemy had iron chariots
"The Lord was with the men of Judah. They took possession of the hill country, but they were unable to drive the people from the plains, because they had chariots fitted with iron."

If someone is truly repentant and really does change then they should most certainly be forgiven. No one is righteous, only in repentance is there forgiveness.

yeah, it is indeed further elaborated later:
>“But now if you have a purse, take it, and also a bag; and if you don’t have a sword, sell your cloak and buy one.”

I can kill. I just can't kill unlawfully.

>From a Christian perspective letting one to not accept Christ is worse than murder,
You're right but you're also stupid. I let them accept Christ. If they refuse that's their problem. If they try to kill me they'll have even bigger problems.

The lord is jesus , jesus is not omniscience and all powerfull

and Love thy neighbor

you can and should sacrifice yourself in your love, but if you are a father and let your enemy kill your child, you do not love your child or your enemy. Killing your enemy to prevent him from committing sin and saving your child is morally right.

>protect your own
what if its an offensive war

user that really makes me feel like an absolute tool..

read the bible the passage is not referring to jesus

this is the 4th most french post i have read on this website. the other three were french anons complaining about their sexual feelings for their family.

To reject those words is to reject Christ..

when does he say what to do with the sword
maybe he intended for you to have one as a deterant but not actually use it

like i said it is to fullfill scripture note that it happens at the end , that means jesus had been preaching for 3 years without swords , now all the sudden they had swords why not prior

Jesus Predicts Peter's Denial

(Matthew 26:31-35; Mark 14:27-31; John 13:36-38)

31And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat: 32But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren. 33And he said unto him, Lord, I am ready to go with thee, both into prison, and to death. 34And he said, I tell thee, Peter, the cock shall not crow this day, before that thou shalt thrice deny that thou knowest me.

35And he said unto them, When I sent you without purse, and scrip, and shoes, lacked ye any thing? And they said, Nothing. 36Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one. 37For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me, And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end. 38And they said, Lord, behold, here are two swords. And he said unto them, It is enough.

No. Think of the soldier whose daughter was healed by Christ. He said that the man had a great faith. He didn't tell the soldier to quit.