I thought he was dead

I thought he was dead

Tbh I hope he ruins Hitagi and Koyomi's relationship.

No one actually dies in this series.

Nobody important does. Guillotinecutter and Numachi are pretty fucked.

Nasu- I mean Nisio is a hack!

You can't just kill best girl

He is. That's his twin brother, Mikey.

It's just a con

He is, but Suruga can see ghosts

Along with Hachikuji, Numachi, Ononoki, Tadatsuru and Tooe.

>implying the wait staff and front desk girl can see/hear ghosts.

He just felt that made the better story. He is an unreliable narrator.

>implying oddities exist
Fucking chuunis

You're so mature. Probably a kyoanifag.

>implying you exist.
Nice try, faggot but you cannot fool me.

He IS dead, Hanamonogatari is all about Suruga seeing dead people. Kaiki turned into a ghost because he had unfinished business.
There are plenty of hints that suggest this.

I always thought Kaiki and Crab were endgame in the far future. The fuck you saying he is dead?

He's not dead, you can see him bandaged up in a crowd in one of the scenes after his stabbing.

Don't spill those dirty lies around my board man. H-he's alive. Right guys?
E-even t-the wiki says s-so...

>wiki

These people are clinically dead.
>Snail
>First Minion
>Cutter
>Tooe
>Math's mother

>There is no truth in this world, everything is a lie.
>Uso Uso Uso Uso Bakari!
Nadeko, is that you?

see this

"dont believe anything i tell you" he constantly tells you

he is the narrator in the scene where he "dies"

>kyoanifag
is that supposed to be koyomifag? Whatever it is, what exactly do they believe in?

>Kaiki turned into a ghost
No, Kaiki is dead and his soul is already in hell. The one we saw in hana is spooky wearing his skin.

Kaiki would not allow himself to die until he gets his hands all over monkey. His obsession with Tooe had been transferred to her. He is just lurking in the shadow and waiting for the right time to attack. Monkey is being hunted.

>Snail
>so dead that even after "dying" after her actual death she still comes back

why do you keep making the same autistic thread?

> Still not technically alive after being brought back from double death

She deserves a medal

Even RRG said that she is more immortal than bat because she will age while snail will never age. She will remain the same as she has the moment she died.

>Kike-y
>every dying

jej

Serious question though. Do oddities exist ? Ever since I saw Nise I think it's just a huge scam and only reflects the psyche of the different characters. Or am I just getting Shaft'd ?

They are a reflection on the psyche of the different characters, but they do physically exist because of that.

It's been that way since the beginning, oddities in that world exist because people think they do, and they're based around those specific expectations.

Basically the same as saying an idea exists as long as someone thinks about it, only again, in Monogatari's case, they are also physical.

I haven't read Nise yet but the Ragi vs Karen fight seemed just so rediculous to me. Tearing down entire highways with karate is just impossible. But I guess that's just the form of presentation Shaft chose ? Is it different in the book ?

I don't know about in the book, but yes I figured they were just overdoing it for the sake of visuals.

He's fine, didn't you see him in Owari 2?

>Do oddities exist ?
Of course they do. Ordinary people could even see someone like bat.
>Or am I just getting Shaft'd ?
You are getting autistified. Just make sure you don't go symbolism at full throttle.

Or is that Araragi lying for the sake of the story?

>Of course they do. Ordinary people could even see someone like bat.
But the whole presentation is just so supernatural that you can't really trust anything that is said or that happens.
>You are getting autistified. Just make sure you don't go symbolism at full throttle.
How ? If you leave out the supernatural stuff you still get a pretty coherent story. Hitagi Crab could work without the crab and it would still make a decent story.

> Hitagi crab could work without the crab

But could Monkey? Could Cat? Could Ougi?

> The whole presentation is just so supernatural that you can't really trust anything that is said or that happens.

You're pushing it too far, it's a supernatural world with supernatural things in it, doesn't mean none of it exists just because it's magic.

>Hitagi Crab could work without the crab
That isn't the only story. And even then it already starts the break apart because Koyomi heals from the stapler pretty much immediately.

I see no reason why Cat wouldn't work.
Monkey is also fine.
Ougi would require some work, because Ougi and Araragi are obviously the same person, but it's not like it's the first time a story turned one person into multiples.

Monkey and Cat could work,too. Dunno about Ougi.
>you're pushing it too far, it's a supernatural world with supernatural things in it
I get that and for the most part I never questioned that but some scenes are just so over the top that it makes the entire presentation rather fishy. That's why I asked.

Maybe that's just part of the presentation. Obviously supernatural stuff is part of the story. It's like wondering how Snail can be a ghost if ghosts don't exist.

It's nothing like that in the book. Karen does stuff that would have potentially killed a normal person since the ground was concrete, but that's about it. The town in the book wouldn't even have a big intersection like in the anime. It was just taking place at their local bus stop.

Don't be an idiot, supernatual shit exists in monogatari because it's a supernatural story, again, you don't need to read that far into it.

I see. That makes more sense

Again, is it a supernatural story because there are supernatural things or is it a supernatural story, because the supernatural is a metaphor

I am not going for muh symbolism but Karen demolishing entire intersections without being afflicted with an oddity just goes against this idea.

it's not a metaphor, it's just a supernatural story,

The Meme in Route X gathered information from independent individuals who witnessed bat and RRG after they went back in time. That is how he was able to deduce that they are indeed the bat & RRG in the alienate timeline. Even if Araragi was the narrator, he would not twist the contents of the letter. There is no reason for him to change its content.

See Shaft goes overboard so they can have great visuals.

Elaborate. Why wouldn't Ragi know this ?

That's all I wanted to know. But it still kinda makes up for an interesting discussion I believe.

Why would it not be a metaphor?
In the Crab arc the loss of the weight is a metaphor for repressed memories. Even Araragi gaining that same weight Crab lost at the end of the arc is a metaphor for Crab becoming "his weight" as his girlfriend. The supernatural is only metaphor here.

Not that user but Monogatari is a supernatural story first.
People hamfist this "Its a metaphor" shit into the series but then don't take into account all the oddities which aren't metaphors.
Things like Werewolves, Golems, Mermaids etc are all very real oddities with not metaphorical attachment to the character.

Shit even Shinobu isn't a metaphor.

Explain how Crab can fall for several feat and be completely fine being caught by Araragi with neither of them slamming to the ground with gravity.

>but then don't take into account all the oddities which aren't metaphors
Of which we have seen how many?
I count 0, but I may be wrong here.

>Shinobu isn't a metaphor.
She totally is though. She's Araragi's desire to get his dick wet, in both of her incarnations.

Pick one, either works
>metaphor for Araragi finding out about her past
>him embellishing the story

>I count 0, but I may be wrong here.

Werewolf, Golem and Mermaid. Those are three actual ones in series.
Shinobu isn't a metaphor either. Araragi meeting Kiss-shot isn't a metaphor for him wanting to get his dick wet.
Hanekawa is the metaphor for him wanting to get his dick wet. She is the impetus for the entire meeting with Kiss-shot and getting the porn.

I feel like you're having trouble with the word metaphor.

>Hanekawa is the metaphor for him wanting to get his dick wet
There's no metaphor here, Araragi sees Hanekawa and wants to fuck her.

I might be, it's 1.40am and I joined in this conversation halfway through.
The three oddities not being metaphors still stands though.

Araragi's house literally got damaged by Ononoki's attack on trying to kill Tsukihi, even Karen notes of how its like "a car crashed into our house".

Yotsugi is one of the things I can't really explain.

>implying it's not a giant metaphor for rough Lesbian sex.

I'll chalk that up to Araragi's narration, with the damage to the house being "damage" to the family through the exposure of the fact that Tsukihi is adopted.

Why does there have to be a metaphors all the time? Why can't we just admit that things happen because they do instead of melting our brains to derived a symbolism out of it? It would be better to enjoy the story instead.

Why are you viewing thoughtful interpretation as something negative?

Maybe Araragi is just a chuuni and wants to tell a cool story

Karen literally says that the front of their house is destroyed.

The story is told by Araragi, not Karen.
What Karen said is what Araragi says Karen said.

She should have targeted a little lower. She totally missed the correct spot. She probably removed part of the fallopian tube and the upper part of the uterus. Come to think of it, she will be eternally virgin because her hymen will just repair itself once the foreign body is ejected.

Isn't it cheating to say a ghost is more "immortal" in comparison to a vampire? They're both technically undead anyways, which is kind of a different class from "immortal".

I'm pretty sure Nisioisin intentionally keeps it ambiguous as to whether they really exist or are just complicated symbolism intended to abstractify a more mundane story.

In that case what if Araragi was lying that Tsukihi wasn't related to him? What if all the girls Araragi met are just his imagination? What if Meme is actually Araragi's homeless dad? What if they are actually in the stone age with dinosaurs?

See how fucking stupid your logic is?

I agree. I guess you can argue either way

Yotsugi is a terrible lesbian. Its why she hangs out with Yozuru. To get fisting practice.

Nah, he just did a half-assed shave job and moved to a cartoon based on Hugh Jackman's Wolverine.

Yes, they do. Can't explain Kizumonogatari other way.

Need Rouka and Kaiki scene to be animated.

>What if Meme is actually Araragi's homeless dad?
>What if they are actually in the stone age with dinosaurs?
rotfl. I hope they get it already tbqh.

I think that's people overthinking it and would have been written pretty differently if that's what Nisio was aiming for.

...

>believing the narrator in 'monogatari ever

there is your problem Sup Forumsnon. Kaiki wanted to "spice" up the story a bit and narrated himself getting killed because he thought it would be more interesting.

>the short story where Hitagi and Kaiki talk about Fahrenheit 451
Reeeeeee Kaiki she's pure

That is the ghost

Noel Crombie circa 1980 is a slightly better match (if you ignore the goatee)

He also said that the the change is bare minimum. There could have no changes done all and he was just lying that he would change something.

it's meant to be ambiguous. Especially since they're mostly representations of people's inner demons/psychological hangups on some level. Does Ougi exist? who knows. Do any of them exist?

We just don't know. If you read the story as if they don't exist then it's really a story about a bunch of kids coping with growing up and becoming adults. Teen drama at it's core. You have a hyper pressured and mentally/physically abused girl acting out like a pyromaniac slut, you have a victimized girl who was nearly sexually assaulted from a broken home who goes around assaulting people with box cutters and staplers, you have a wannabe justice warrior who's a loner who hates himself and wants to kill himself because he chickened out from saving yet another friend of his from abusive parents and a mental breakdown and bullying from their class. There is a young Kohei who wants to kill the boyfriend of her sempai who she wants to fuck, and there is a younger girl who is spoiled rotten by her parents and who uses her cuteness to get whatever the fuck she wants who suffers a mental breakdown when the boy she likes falls in love with another girl.

Overall the story is pretty normal when you iron out all the "oddities" like that.

Koyomi broke off with hitagi, date the cat, and then the crab last seen together with the conman.

You forget about the girl pretending to be a legendary vampire that was turned into a little girl. Who have a delusion that she could live in someone else's shadow and pretend that she needs blood to survive. But in truth, she really needs to eat, so she pretends to eat donuts and drink coffee just for the fun of it. She is a real nutcase im this series. I can't believe that RRG is going along with her crap. I hope RRG would get rid of her already and surrender her to child care.

>implying Senjougahara wouldn't run off to date Cat first

>the short story where Araragi spits on Tsukihi's hair
Nisio what's wrong with you

They was thinking of the same thing so they ended up being rivals. Cat was so happy getting pampered by the two of them but bat got mad with all the commotion so she vampire punched RRG and drag his butt all the way home. In the end, crab won so she gets to have cat. Cat was a little upset but was still happy because deep inside she loves crab too.

They were*

So why didn't he die? Did he literally trick the audience?

>Sex between Cat and Crab
I can only get so excited.

In the book, there's a mention of Kaiki having false teeth after the attack. It happened, he just left out the part where he woke up an hour later with half of his teeth knocked out and a bad headache.

>In the book, there's a mention of Kaiki having false teeth after the attack.
That is pretty bad. I hope he had implants and not dentures. What book exactly, I want to read all the details too?

That's always just been some weird false spoiler.

>the short story where Araragi cuts off Hanekawa's braids
Nisio please