Kemono Friends

It all returns to nothing.

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youtube.com/watch?v=pFTeJX6KrXc
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It doesn't even feel like it happened at all.
I'm crushed.

No more

Is it not the case that Ishidate fought with Yaoyorozu and quit because things had "gotten political" after people pushed too hard?

I don't want to be running around casting shade but if Yaoyorozu was taking an uncompromising line in negotiations it would be perfectly normal in any other circumstance for the animation studio to be dismissed. It's only cause for explosive outrage in this case because of the power imbalance involved and the fact that all people agree that this is the studio that turned a garbage fire into a gold mine.

Thing with Tesabu was, that Ishidate left a complete version of the script for TesaPuru before he left. So he made sure the series would end the proper way and wouldn't turn into another Armageddon.

> That image
> That lyric

Come one user, don't be so morose right off the bat. That just makes the thread unpleasant for everyone.

Shit like this is what I thrive on.

Yeah, my bad. I was going to get a picture from the Kemono Friends smile project but it was too hard. Next time I'll wait for someone less depressing to make the thread.

It's too late. There is nothing left but a dark void and heaps of despair.

New vid on niconico dug up some KDKW internal email from KF websites' with some ip WHOIS shit

Link user

Couldn't have linked it or anything could you

[citation needed]

www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm32008934
I don't know if it's a good idea

So, what is your foil of choice when creating your helmets? Tin, aluminium or enriched uranium?

It was announced as a resignation but what was going on behind the scenes is still entirely unknown and that's probably the way it will end up being here too. The way he has posted about having control of IP has made me think that he was unhappy with the way Tesagure was being handled by the committee involved in some way though. That is just my own personal speculation.

I wasn't trying to say anything bad about Yaoyorozu by the way just that they have had a similar thing happen in the past with a director leaving a show. Even if the way in which it happened was entirely different.

So he has basically worked out the format their e-mails follow and is saying if you look at the list of staff and adapt that to their names you should have all their internal e-mail addresses to spam?

The offical response from the production committee stated that Yaoyorozu was using the IP without consulting all concerned parties, and didn't agree to a normalization of the relationship.

>Yaoyorozu was using the IP without consulting all concerned parties
This is probably 12.1-related. It's technically not wrong. It is, however, still bullshit.

I'm thinking that "normalization of the relationship" thing is probably code for a rights dispute.

...

>thing is probably code for a rights dispute.
It likely is since they also said Yaoyoruzu used the IP without consent form the committee.

If Yaoyoruzu didn't back down, then Kadokawa is completely in the right to switch the studio.

The committee gave explicit consent for doujin works to be created you can see this consent on their website stating any use of the IP is fine as long as it doesn't make unreasonable profits. Yaoyorozu didn't use the IP without consent. irodori (a doujin circle) created 12.1 not Yaoyorozu. It is a bullshit excuse and nothing more.

They would have to be suicidal or insane to think they could make demands from Kadokawa; it never happened.

So thinking about it some more, it goes like this:

- Kadokawa and Yaoyorozu are negotiating the S2 contract, or whatever.
- Kadokawa and Yaoyorozu cannot agree on some aspect of the agreement.
- Kadokawa issues an ultimatum: if you don't split these rights, we will drop you from S2.
- Yaoyorozu declines to accept the ultimatum. Contract broken. (Or as phrased by Kadokawa, "Yaoyorozu decided to withdraw.")
- [possible: negotiation continues behind the scenes (?)]
- Eventually: Tatsuki is informed that he should cease work on Kemono Friends.

>they also said Yaoyoruzu used the IP without consent form the committee.
That's 12.1, and let's face it: Kadokawa doesn't actually give that much of a shit about 12.1. After the fact, though, it's something they can point to.

He was given creative freedom, so there was no "wrong" when he took 12.1 out. Kusokawa's just picking at straws like with all of their tries to cover their fuck up.

>That's 12.1
We don' know. They never specified what the problem was.

What about the book vs animation dispute theory the last thread have ?

Everything else was proven to have been approved by Kusokawa. It's the only one they can hang on to for a "reason".

>yfw committee never approved Hululu cut-out being left in the zoo

>He was given creative freedom,
Who was it exactly that told him he could continue work? Was it Yoshizaki, or an official representative of KFP?

I don't think anyone can deny that there is something that is just a little bit non-standard about using official assets to produce doujin work. Somebody not particularly Kadokawa-sympathetic commented (I can't find the tweet right now) that Tatsuki might have crossed a dangerous bridge at the time.

All other possibilities are out, and it fits the bill. Again, they don't actually care. But it does allow them to say "Tatsuki used Kemono Friends assets without pre-approval" and not be lying when they do so.

Sorry but 12.1 is not a doujin, it's made by the offical staff and used the models from the tv series ( which should theoretically be illegal).

>given creative freedom
There is a difference between creative freedom and freedom of distribution.

Getting rid of Tatsuki.

I don't care why or how it happened, I'm just glad it happened.

Why?

Threating seiyuu.

...

End me Sup Forumsnons
KF was the only thing that keep me away to start a mass shooting on my mall center

Smearing Mine.
What's next?

This is the last thing I had saved before the fiasco.
This feels like I saved this in a previous life, not 5 days ago.

>Sorry but 12.1 is not a doujin
12.1 complies with the KFP-approved guidelines for doujin work.

>which should theoretically be illegal
Tatsuki was an employee of Yaoyorozu, not Kadokawa. The models belonged to Yaoyorozu. If Yaoyorozu (the legal entity) permitted irodori (the legal entity) to use their models for a project, there is no legal breach.

Fucking Ceruleans, not even once.

I have some old Kemono Friends tabs still open that keep loading from cache and I can't bring myself to close them anymore.

The models are likely owned by Kadokawa since they payed Yaoyorozu to create the tv series.

I was asleep for most of yesterday and haven't reviewed the original sources, so I can't say.

Have you watched Hidamari Sketch? Helped me to repress such tendencies.

>template 21
>template 14

Why do you think they dropped YYZ in the first place? They wanted their assets but YYZ wouldn't just give it to them because they had no right over anything they created for the show.

I don't know how the standard animation studio contract works but that wouldn't be true unless it included a clause that specifies that everything Yaoyorozu produces, including "internal assets", belongs to Kadokawa.

I don't think it's in there, but I've never seen one, so I can't exactly say.

>I don't think anyone can deny that there is something that is just a little bit non-standard about using official assets to produce doujin work
I didn't deny that.

Made by official staff has nothing to do with being doujin or not. Official staff publishing doujin work from productions they have worked on is common place. The only thing out of the ordinary here was that it was actual anime rather than just drawings.

Why would they say they are restarting S2 from scratch if they had the models? If there really will be a S2 it will look completely different.

Nothing makes a sad little man happier than others' pain does.

Are we sure if it's 12.1, or is it a dispute in production?

Friends never die, buddy.

I love these wise-birds

The first response was for you.

...

The basis for the sentence in Kadokawa's press release that states that Kemono Friends IP was used without notifying all parties cannot refer to anything other than 12.1.

However, nobody seriously believes that it was the cause of the break.

12.1 is Kusokawa's excuse. Real reason is still unknown though it's probably nothing more than terrible business practice and straightforward stupidity.

>Are we sure if
NOPE

HNNNNNNGH

The idea of it having something to do with 12.1 is based on them saying the IP was used without authorisation and a process of elimination of everything else it could have been. Personally I think 12,1 is just being used as an excuse for some other real motive.

Just think about it, why the fuck would you remove the studio that made your franchise a success instead of a failure over something so small that they didn't financially benefit from at all but just generated a lot more good will and positivity for the franchise with?

IP is an undying kraken. You can make your own models but it's ultimately still KDKW's perogative if you can even use these models or not because it's touching their copyright, isn't it?

Good thing the internet shits all over IP or else culture would be fucking sad, but companies can't entirely do that.

>Why do you think they dropped YYZ in the first place?
Because of YYZ not going through proper channels and their misuse of the IP.

>that wouldn't be true unless it included a clause that specifies that everything Yaoyorozu produces, including "internal assets", belongs to Kadokawa.
Normally assets of a project are owned by the committee, they pay the studio to create a certain piece of media and therefore should have the rights to all material YYZ creates for KF.
This is generally standart prectice in publishing and it would be weird if it was different in KFs case.

That's pretty cute man!

>The Japanese are so mad they're doxxing Kadokawa and flooding their business email inboxes

What a time to be alive.

>it's ultimately still KDKW's perogative if you can even use these models or not because it's touching their copyright, isn't it?
The doujin work guidelines released by KFP authorize third parties to use Kemono Friends IP within the guidelines. 12.1 falls within those guidelines and therefore does not infringe on anyone's rights.

>they pay the studio to create a certain piece of media
Yes.

>therefore should have the rights to all material YYZ creates for KF.
Again, I have never seen an animation studio contract (or any publishing contract, really) so I can't say what was likely to be in said contract. In the industry that I do work in, I would say that if my company was contracted to do programming work for another company, it would be extremely non-standard for them to have ownership of all intermediate assets used in the development of the final work.

>Usual beta Nips getting off their asses and actually doing something
It'd be nice if this achieves something, but I can't imagine it actually happening

Yaoyorozu did not make 12.1 stop repeating this nonsense.

Yaoyorozu would likely own the models themselves but Kadokawa would own the rights to use the characters.

12.1 is likely unauthorized use of the IP.
YYZ didn't want to normalize the relationship(rights dispute) and therefore the committee changed the studio.

Their staff did, and must have had authorization from YYZ to use their assets.

Aren't people just overreacting?

No.

The official statement was lack of notification from YYZ on something, and refusal by YYZ to then run all future decisions by Kadokawa

There's no explicit reference to 12.1

>Template 2

>12.1 is likely unauthorized use of the IP.
Stop using the word "unauthorized." Even Kadokawa didn't use the word "unauthorized" in their official press release. What they said is that Yaoyorozu used Kemono Friends IP without informing everyone before hand. They did not allege that Yaoyorozu lacked the legal right to do so.

Technically speaking Yaoyorozu did not actually "use" Kemono Friends IP in 12.1 because Yaoyorozu did not produce 12.1. However, Yaoyorozu contributed to the creation of 12.1 by releasing model data to irodori. (At least, legally that's what happened.)

>Why do you think they dropped YYZ in the first place?
Judging from the Bushiroad exec's quickly tweeted demand to stop airing dirty laundry in public, I'm going with an ultimatum from Bushiroad and Kadokawa that S2 be made using the new game's models and designs, not S1's. Then, instead of caving as they were supposed to, YYZ said, "sounds like we're not needed, good luck with S2", then left.

youtube.com/watch?v=pFTeJX6KrXc

Mitty = Kemono Friends
Nanachi = Fans
Bonedad = Kadokawa

Read some threads from the nips on the 12.1 issue, and they've ruled it out because the episode hasn't been taken down.

With the original writer, the original animation studio and the original director, how exactly is S2 even going to be vaguely similar

More than likely it wouldn't have escalated this far if KDKW kept their mouths shut or just offered a one sentence apology for KF going away, but they were caught lying four times in a row now to try and shift blame away from themselves. The Japanese still feel strongly about honor and righteousness.

...

Which is litteraly what unauthorized means. The committee owns the IP and YYZ needs their approval to produce something.

>12.1. However, Yaoyorozu contributed to the creation of 12.1 by releasing model data to irodori. (At least, legally that's what happened.)
Which is likely the reason for the axing of YYZ.

That is the weakest link in the chain. Most people agree that irodori did not seek explicit permission from KFP to produce 12.1 and that he was not required to. The fact that KFP declined to issue a takedown afterwards does not change this.

>YYZ said, "sounds like we're not needed, good luck with S2", then left.
That's not even close to what happened. Tatsuki couldn't have set the internet more on fire if he had tried.

They did indeed allow irodori to use the assets they developed for the show but like has been said Yaoyorozu likely owned those assets but not the rights to use the characters as they like so they would be within their rights to do that. Then irodori are within their rights to use the IP for a doujin work because the official website says that using the IP in doujin work is allowed as long as it isn't making unreasonable profit. No rules were broken in making 12.1. At the worst it ticked Kadokawa off because it wasn't run by them first but nothing more than that.

I laughed.

>Tatsuki couldn't have set the internet more on fire if he had tried.
"Good luck with S2" was supposed to come off as sarcasm.

>"I wish that I could turn back in time"
>"Cause now all the guilt is on Mine"
Holy shit!

If you genuinely believe Kadokawa got rid of everyone that made their franchise a success because of a 2 minute animation you are deluded. At worst that annoyed them and there was something much more serious going on in the background like the references to a lack of information sharing.

>The committee owns the IP and YYZ needs their approval to produce something.
That is factually untrue. I can legally produce Kemono Friends work without seeking explicit authorization from KFP because the "Secondary Work Guidelines" available at the top-right corner of kemono-friends.jp explicitly authorize all parties to do so. Legally speaking, irodori is in the same boat.

>or just offered a one sentence apology for KF going away

You must have a short memory. They did apologize and even that was interpreted as somehow being evil of them because they got the VAs to do it.

Japanese love people taking responsibility, but I doubt they have enough power to make someone who was actually involved apologie

What if YYZ distributed content to unauthorized third parties but not to the general public?

Hmm, maybe it's because the VA's did nothing wrong?
Maybe it's because that apology was useless because Kadokawa is too proud to own up to its mistakes by itself?
The apology was also very half-assed and indirect.

Getting VAs to apologise for the commotion is not the same as a company publicly apologising for ruining a franchise.

I don't buy into the "chansaki was literally choking back tears" theory or actually find that there was anything particularly offensive about the KF Hour opening statement, but if you think that the brief statement by the VAs constitutes an apology on Kadokawa's part you are delusional.

I don't know any specifics or sources, but I recall some people saying that using the VAs is what might have caused the problem.

As far as I know using the pre existing voice clips from the show, LINE stickers, etc is what's the problem, so I don't know where the legality of having the seiyuu themselves record new lines lies.

>because they got the VAs to do it.
Grown men hiding behind young women is a really bad visual. It looked more cowardly than evil, though.

Here's the apk of Alarm I promised the last thread. my.mixtape.moe/ercwcq.apk Hopefully it works, let me know if it doesn't and I will see what I can do.

What's very obviously the "problem" with 12.1 is that 12.1 looks, feels, and basically is (but legally is not) part of the official Kemono Friends animation project. Legally speaking I assume that the VAs involved had their involvement cleared with their agencies, as I imagine their contracts require it.