Between the financial success of Kemono Friends, and the artistic success of Houseki no Kuni, do you think the anime community will be accepting of there being more and more CG series in the face of these successes?
CG Anime
Jose Hernandez
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Anthony Flores
>Houseki no Kuni
It may be a massive improvement but it's still not that great, I don't see it becoming a trend for a while longer
Adrian Wright
>artistic success of Houseki no Kuni
Here's a pity (You).
Matthew Murphy
Only if it looks good, or if the series has enough good things going for it that awkward looking CG can be overlooked.
Houseki no Kuni happened to have an ideal scenario for using CG, since the characters are distinctly not human and you can use some nice effects for the hair and the lighting off gemstone surfaces in that scenario, but they also mix in a lot of 2D animation, which is not something that every studio will do. Also, they need to calm down with the camera movement for action scenes.
James Evans
Absolute garbage
I'll accept a nigger president sooner than CG anime
Liam Collins
Houseki no Kuni got forgiven because of glowing gem-hair. It's miles better than some other stuff, but still not good.
Logan Rogers
This, but I felt like the panelling was still too static considering it's a CG anime they didn't benefit too much from having the camera rotate all over the place
Austin Cox
Houseki no Kuni had some amazingly good scenes, obviously I'm a fan, and it goes way beyond what other cg anime have accomplished.
But although I hate how some fans just blindly hated on HnK for being cg and lumped it in with crappy cg without taking a closer look... I also have to say I dread the possibility of a day when cg takes over anime.
There is something really wonderfully expressive about 2D, drawings coming to life. Japan has been the last stronghold of high quality 2D animation with complex forms (not gonna get into bashing western animation here but most of it today is either very simplistic forms, deliberately ugly/comical, or else it jumps straight to Disney/Pixar 3D).
Plus, HnK had an unusual opportunity for 3D because the realistic gem/metal textures would've been nearly impossible to manage in 2D (without a movie-level budget), and those added a ton to the watching experience. Imagine Phos's gold arms in 2D, there's a good chance it would've looked literally like either melted cheese or runny poop.
David Walker
Maybe I'm too used to western CGI, but HnK still looks like it was made by amateurs to me. The only TV CGI anime I've seen that looks professional, or at the very least competently made, is Etotama.
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The expressions, body animation and camera work is very well made, lots of people are praising HnK camera work but to me it's very blunt and the rotations when the camera is tracking a character feels too linear.
Ayden Parker
I'm happy to see progress with 3d animation at least.
Bentley Reyes
Houseki is he one and ony animation enriched by the cg (cuz to the gem shine theme)
The only one
David Thomas
For the most part, what I've seen of HnK is on just barely on par with RWBY. It may be well written, but CG in anime still has a long way to go compared to CG in western cartoons.
But maybe that's just because most CG artists in Japan only know about MMD. I dunno, but it certainly seems that it'll only improve from here.
Daniel Kelly
>Gem reflections can't be made in 2D
Dominic Harris
No one is saying that. What people are saying is that animating moving hair reflections for the entire episode, every episode, would be insanity.
Here's what it looked like when they tried to do Houseki no Kuni in 2D, and I doubt they could've kept this up for 12 whole episodes.
Nicholas Myers
I sure hope that people are willing to give more CG a chance from now on but I really doubt much will change unless we get a string of CG that aren't garbage and the proper advertisement for it.
As we are now, KF & HnK will just be considered hidden gems or lucky hits.
Levi Morales
The average Kyoani anime hair looks as detailed as that to be honest. Not to mention the eyes that look like literal gems.
Angel Gonzalez
Neither that PV nor Kyoani really convey just how lustrous the hair is supposed to be, coming from the manga. I think CG was a good choice.
That doesn't mean that CG should be used in every instance, I think it was just a good artistic decision to use it in HnK.
Xavier Richardson
You must be one of those execs that give no shit about their animator's lifespan.
Isaac Phillips
This is a small item that will not be in every scene, and when worn (I believe it's a brooch) it could be smaller and simplified except when attention is drawn to it.
This level of detail for all the characters' hair, which you cannot exactly hide or simplify without it becoming glaringly obvious something's off, is going to cost an insane budget.
Levi Martin
Of course not, Kyoani girls have never had gem hair, what I'm saying is that they or maybe a couple other studios could do a good job at drawing that detail in. It wouldn't be impossible for a 2D HnK anime to look great.
Aside from the hair, the CGI in the show can be really rough some times, specially the character animation, and that comes from lack of training from Japanese 3D animators, something that isn't really a problem in a decent 2D production.
Cooper Anderson
Houseki no Kuni is 2D and 3D not full CG and there is a huge difference is that.
Camden Hill
I'd actually love to see a 3D anime movie done with the budget of a Disney/Pixar release. But not with the Disney/Pixar style, of course. Just that budget.
And for god's sake not the creepy, creeeeeepy anime-eyes-on-real-person thing that live action Alita's got going on.
Grayson Hughes
What part of HnK was 2D?
Logan Reed
The new Godzilla thing is going to be cg as well
Caleb Bell
...
Kayden Allen
the problem isnt CGi itself
the porblem is when they mix 2d with CGI that makes them look ugly
Evan Long
That's CG.
Kayden Lewis
Not the eyes and the mouth. It's pretty obvious from the animation and the overall style.
Bentley Garcia
Japan can make great CGI but TV anime isn't a priority
Coproduction with Square Enix, Visual Works and two western CGI studios
youtube.com
Cell shaded Toei and Bandai
youtube.com
Jacob Thomas
The actual CG animation in HnK wasn't that amazing though, it was more the direction, character designs and the music that made it look and feel good.
Daniel Evans
When seeing HnK animation, i see the horrible japanese acting. I can't unsee.
Jordan Mitchell
That's what made it good.
Static great backgrounds > Dynamic shitty ugly backgrounds.
Grayson Diaz
>artistic success of Houseki no Kuni
this is pathetic
Jaxon Carter
...
Jacob Carter
You're pathetic faggot
Ayden Martin
I legit liked ID-0.
That being said, it still needs a lot more work put into it. Maybe rather than framing a 3DCG work like it was an animu, they could make full use of what 3DCG can offer on top of that.
Andrew Miller
>wanting mediocre cg
No thanks, it will only allow hacks to do their mediocre projects more easily trough mediocre CG
Cameron Scott
Rather mediocre CG and a good anime than shit like Akira or Miyazaki
Dominic Davis
>shit like Akira or Miyazaki
(You)
Angel Thomas
I hope these are good incentive to improve the art and make better models and workflows. Etotama is fucking beautiful but mostly unknown.
Josiah Myers
Sorry, but you can throw as much budget on a piece of turd. It still will not be something I as an adult will want to see. This is not your safespace.
William White
>do you think the anime community will be accepting of there being more and more CG series in the face of these successes?
Maybe, if CG was what made either of those shows successful.
Luke Williams
>CG thread
>no mention of Bubuki Buranki
Seriously one of the best mecha shows of the past few years, completely CG.
Elijah Williams
>one of the best mecha shows of the past few years
Admittedly, I dropped this after the first season, but I still believe that there's no way you're not just trolling.
Henry Jenkins
Most close-ups are hand drawn, and the hibernation outfits were all 2D too.
Alexander Diaz
Kemono Friends was popular despite it's CG, meaning companies can see they can get away with cheaper production costs. Houseki's visuals were enhanced by its CG, specifically the hair.
Isaiah Howard
I know it's a low bar, but its seriously really consistent and interesting all the way through, something that's pretty unheard of in modern mecha. The last mecha show I can think of that's honestly better is Gundam Build Fighters.
Austin Sullivan
i dont mind CG anime but what trigger me is those low FPS
why can't nips get into smooth animation? it's literally only changing some rendering options there is some format limitants or some shit?
Brayden Gonzalez
I need...second season...nowww...
Once a month chapters are so painful, too. I do appreciate that Ichikawa makes the chapters count and I feel I can trust her to take the plot to a proper ending. That's been an issue with other mangas in the past, once it gets popular the quality drops as the creator decides to just wring money out of it for as many years as fans will put up with unnaturally slow pacing and filler sideplots.
Liam Barnes
no, just normalfags, Japan is basically going through right now what we did with Toy Story 20 years ago, well not that they didn't enjoy Toy Story, but just more so.
Hunter Ward
moving CG models isn't impressive, mkaing drawing after drawing and making the end result greater than the some of it's parts is impressive.
Nathaniel Thompson
You don't even have a justification as to why you believe those things.
Aiden Smith
I seen 2D animation and I've seen what goes into it, I've seen 3D animation and I've seen what goes into, and now the kinds of people that work in each and the 3D animators are some the least interesting people on the planet and are completely uninspired, 2D animators are god that have fucking died for their craft, it's incomparable.
Logan Long
So basically you're trying to compare the animators of Redline to the animators of PBS Kids cartoons.
Good job, you're a retard and you don't understand anything about either craft.
Joseph Moore
CG is an artistic choice. Who gives a fuck if "the community" accepts it or not (especially if said "community" is a bunch of western circlejerkers), Japan will continue using it when they see a reason to do so and there's ＮＯＴＨＩＮＧ you can do about it.
At this level it isn't even elitism or anything to do with a sense of superiority, it's just autism caused by associating things incorrectly that some people refuse to get rid of.
Joseph Lewis
CG is the absolute best and most efficient pleb filter (given how it only affects western fags) so I hope we get more and more shows animated entirely that way.
Jack Kelly
>once it gets popular
HnK was already quite popular in Japan long before the anime. I've seen it rank highly in some top-20's, and Mushi to Uta won a best debut award back in the day.
Yet Ichikawa consistently puts out chapters every month for 5 years now (and even when she was working on Pokemon).
Blake Gutierrez
Oh, you're a literal brainlet, okay nevermind.
Landon Gomez
>CG is the absolute best and most efficient pleb filter
This truthfully. It's one thing when the CG is actually bad, but there are people who literally would not watch something on the basis of it being CG, and then it's thankful that the CG filters out idiots like that from the threads automatically.
Xavier Bailey
You're saying this as if good CG anime was the norm. HnK is one of the few good shows that happen to be CG
Juan Hill
iv not watched all the anime, but iv read the manga.
from what iv seen, that clip looks way better than the anime we actually got
fuck CG its shit and will allways be the poor mans anime
Oliver Morris
Shut up brainlet
Jayden Rogers
They try to emulate the look and feel of the current anime industry. There is no other reason. The CG anime that aren't crap know that they should intertwine the 2d and 3d mediums instead of designing 3d to emulate 2d, which never works out in practice.
Hudson Lewis
get filtered pleb
Ian Phillips
You forgot FAGs was one of the best selling series of its season as well, although that was possibly due to exclusive kits being packed into the BDs.
Was still a well received series though.
Gavin Powell
There's nothing wrong with the anime community and CG. It's just not worth it to make good CG or 3D animation. It cost too much compared to traditional 2D for anime tv series. Now it's not so expensive and the tech/skills are spreading. Japanese video games have been doing this shit for years and it gets accepted just fine. But games sell far better than anime, so yea the economics work better there.
Daniel Flores
Make way for real time motion capture improve 3D
Anthony Flores
...
Michael Foster
>houseki no shit
>artistic success
hahahahahahahah. Most successful proper 3D anime (not kememe shit) is still Arpeggio.
Nathan Gray
>Houseki no Kuni
is still an ideal case for CG that does not generalize to all shows.
>isolated location with few features
>copy-paste character bodies
>copy-paste enemies
>few costume changes needed
>physical features of gems (refraction and partial transparency)
And they still looked kinda bad at all the things that CG is not so good at (without expensive proprietary plugins), for example the tentacles or shiro's fur.
Plus the backgrounds were mostly painted and while the CG grass was glorious it apparently was too much effort to use it consistently, most of the time they again used static, painted grass.
CG sucks at everything where you need tons of one-off assets such as changing locations, costume swaps, forest landscapes and so on.
It also sucks at destructive modification of the environment. Which is bad for action heavy shows.
Stretch and smear is also more difficult to achieve in CG, although the tooling is improving in the area.
It's certainly progress, but not there yet.
Bentley Hill
2D still looked better than 3D
Brody Robinson
Yep, and literally any show with characters with normal hair will never look as good in CG.
The hair moved a bit stiffly in HnK too but that made sense given what the characters are.
My main issue with it was sometimes outside of action scenes characters' movements looked subtly stiff and off. They did do a better job than the vast majority of CG anime out there, certainly better than many low budget 2D too, and in the scenes where they expended the most effort it was beautiful, but I'm not about to take this as an example of 3D somehow being ready to replace or overtake 2D.
That said, I look forward to more well-crafted CG anime and I'll keep an open mind to it. At the end of the day, the important thing whatever the technique is getting the visual storytelling right for the particular characters and story being presented.
Nolan Butler
Toei's CG anime hair is making progress though. Not perfect, but it works, at least in the polished scenes.
Ethan King
No, their number problem really is that they have to finish up TV anime within record time.
Robert Barnes
Dumb garden poster, the gems are on screen 100% of the time, this isn't.
Liam Brooks
Please go back to you're Violent Evershit threads, Kyoanus-fag
Blake Gray
Never
CGI is the devil, and evil always loses in the end
Benjamin Wright
But if you wanted that you could just watch vidya gaem cutscenes on youtube.
Mason Roberts
nobody needs your approval though.
Wyatt Turner
Why is that flame always in front of the pan?
Kayden Price
>the anime community will be accepting of there being more and more CG series
I assume you mean the WESTERN anime community? Because your entire understanding of how Japan views CG is incorrect.
Christopher Murphy
What about Ajin? It still suffers from that weird framerate, but other than that it was enjoyable.
Xavier Howard
Evil's working out great for the moonies, thanks for asking
Luke Wright
no, its cel shading looked like shit
Jordan Harris
>kemono furries
>financial success
uhm no sweetie
Levi Ward
Well where are you gonna get giant lizards.
Hudson Powell
Naria Girls was a miracle of MMD.
It also gave me a clipping fetish
Julian Rodriguez
Anime community has no fucking choice. Every season there's gonna be more and more of this crap, and people (newfags) will pick out the least shitty turd from this sea of crap and start circlejerking to it like it's something amazing. Repeat this over a significantly long period of time, and you'll see people looking at 3DCG and saying,
>man this is really great, look how far CGI has evolved, I wouldn't actually mind if all anime were like that
Already you can see an abundance of posts like this, all the while anyone with a good pair of eyes has only to travel a decade or two into the past to be utterly convinced that 3DCG is still nowhere near real animation. Between now and the fabled future where super-AIs produce animation indistinguishable from the real thing lies a long, long dark age where real animation is already dead, but 3DCG is still in its infancy.
Alexander Gray
Angela a cute!!
Andrew Morales
3dcg has never looked good imo. High, low, medium budgets don't matter, the 3D modelling lack the sharpness and unique fluidity that 2D animation will always excel at.
Sure you can say that the technology will improve and 3D animation will eventually evolve into its own thing. But 2D anime will not be going anywhere anytime soon and will coexist with the 3D boom for better or worse until the end of time.
Mason Miller
You realize cgi is 90% of western childrens cartoons correct? Its the oposite of a filter. I wouldn't be surprised if Disney showed Kemono friendship is magic for the 5-11 bracket.
Nicholas Rivera
>Arpeggio
Wow, there are still people who aren't complete newfriends left on Sup Forums and know about things that happened more than a year ago.
Arpeggio >> HnK >> KF
And Arpeggio is 4 years old, so nothing has been learned, and CD continues to be the go-to way for a studio to cut corners. The problem is that it's still more expensive to hire people with 3D modeling and animation expertise, so the same budget will buy you either less frames or less polys. Some shows like KF succeed in spite of low quality animation, this doesn't translate at all to other shows.
Gavin Ward
Arpeggio was fucking dross compared to its manga.
Dylan Reyes
Can you Kememefags stop mixing Houseki with your garbage dead series?
Dominic Russell
The problem with Japan's cgi is they dont know how to animatw in it. Slide, float, all sorts of beginner problems. Your typical western freshman art student can animate better after a semester than an entire anime studio. Its stiff, they rely too much on abusing camera moves to cover shirty animation.
And lets not get started on the rig and shader issues. They are getting better, but still a long time to go. And compositing? Just drop the model on a bg works for them apparently.
And lets not forget- its cheap. Studios are already using it in kids shows and "hard" sequences like dance. This unfortunately makes actual good animators less important, and long run (10-20years) they die off and no one teaches good animation. Then the industry stagnated/dies and goes else where (look at western animation history- just repeating. Currently japans in a "golden" era where their movies are getting global appeal but it wont last when bottom dollar and China/Korea learning from the masters).
Anyone ok with cgi doesnt know enough history to know why this is a bad precedent.
Zachary Sullivan
Honestly I don't remember Arpeggio being that good, or that much better than HnK. It was the first full 3D anime that I watched without a paper bag, but it was pretty bad, to be frank. I can name only two redeeming qualities to it.
Leo Moore
As the official reference Japanese on Sup Forums, I believe CG series are fine.
Mason Johnson
Don't yall remember GitS Innocence? It has been a possibility, the question is how are they going to do it for TV.