Fate/stay night

Who had the best route: Saber, Rin or Sakura?

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They were all equally shit in one way or another.
Cherrypicking good moments from each HF takes the cake but not because of the slut.

Illya did, so none of the above.

Rich old man redemption route was my favourite so far.


It's UBW but not because of Rin..or Shirou.

Fate was the best overall narrative.
UBW had the Best moment.
HF had the most great moments.

All 3 heroines were bland and boring. Nasu should've kept the Ilya and Caster routes he was planning to initially have in the game. Even a Taiga route would've been good

>All 3 heroines were bland and boring

What's wrong with them?

Saber - boring Arcueid clone
Rin - ugly Mary tSuendere
Sakura - sluttier Kohaku clone with extra /d/

Fate was shit

Easily Sakura. Best girl, best route.


Fate>Heaven's Feel> UBW


UBW is shit.


Explain yourselves.


>muh strongest servants get shit on thanks to imaginary element, yet also the only route that shows off more of what Cu is really capable of
>only route where best girl doesn't die
>Kotomine does-it-all Kirei
>Rin actually being useful
>Ilya actually serving a purpose beyond being a grail vessel
>best dead ends in the entire VN
>actually connects to other TM works


t. Shirou

Kohaku was very different in situation from Sakura.

Kohaku and Hisui were born into a family with special powers, but Sakura was born never having a choice thanks to bad family planning among other factors.

Then we have the thing that Makihisa literally self-destructed and actually has a conscience, where Zouken just thought of Sakura as a lab rat and literally calls her "the Tohsaka material" or "meat".

Makihisa literally gave Kohaku at a young age a man who knew the biological weaknesses of demon hybrids and a college level tutelage in medicine. And Akiha gave her and Hisui a large stipend when they decide to leave the Tohno manor. Kohaku's revenge was almost laid at her lap.

Zouken would have ruined Sakura body and soul if her potential wasn't so great and her will wasn't as strong as it was. She got none of the things Kohaku got, and her brat of a stepbrother was no where near as supportive as Akiha.

So trying to say Sakura's past was exaggerated or /d/ like is wrong because it dismisses how magi are basically all like that. The reason that there seems to be a more "gross" and "less tasteful" presentation is that Sakura was a human experiment, while Kohaku was just used to satiate the needs of the hybrids of the Tohno clan. As harsh as it was, you could "tastefully" explain it away in a diary of a scared and traumatized child. Basically, you could make it more dramatic in prose. With human experimentation, you can't really make something less "gross" when you talk about man eating familiars who eat whatever is placed before them, and swim amongst corpses. Having a child in that environment will make you naseous. It's not supposed to be humane, that's the point.

There is no tactful way to do that. Hell, Nasu made it as tactful as possible when Sakura's punishments and abuse are all off screen and merely described.

But the two are demonstrably different situations.

Having finished stay night, am I better watching the zero anime or reading the light novel first? I'll do both eventually either way.

Read the light novel. The anime is a great adaptation at first, but then it suddenly shits the bed completely during the last two episodes.

>but then it suddenly shits the bed completely during the last two episodes.


Anime, but also check the last chapters of the LN.

The anime changes the final battle between Kiritsugu and Kotomine in a really stupid way that leaves one unable to take it seriously, almost completely cuts out Saber vs Berserker, and a scene that's vital to understanding Sakura's mentality is needlessly changed just to make her look bad.

Thanks anons.

The best servant has arrived

Fuck off.

Just found this. Is this the actual movie?

>Going too far with the special snowflake treatment and ruining characters (See:Artoria,Nero,Jeanne)
>Expanding the universe by handing it off to the wrong people(Higashide,Sakurai)
>Currently fucking up Grand Order by spinning its wheels with shitty-who-cares servants+story arcs granted you can blame some of this on DW
>As big,popular and likely immensely easy it is for it to get support it's STILL twiddling its thumbs with the Tsukihime remake

When TM gets it right they get it right but when they get it WRONG they usually drag a perfectly enjoyable/okay character down with them in that wrongness.

He appeared in the OVA, retard


they skipped the revival of gilgamesh

Can you do saber in unlimited blade works? I cant find my way

Wowzers are you going to post this outdated pasta in every thread?

What's wrong with Sakurai?

>silver haired fuckboi99.0
how original

>glorified mobage trailer consisting of talking heads
Not an excuse.

Muh Septem and Extella nerowank

>Being this retarded
Lol. Bet you think Gilmeme is the strongest servant too

FGOfags, everyone.

Might just be this.

>No argument
>Didn't watch the OVA but shittalks about it
>Probably didn't even read Strange Fake nor El Melloi II Case Files either
Secondaries, everyone!

Nobody cares about those shitty spinoffs, tertiary. F/SN, F/Z and F/HA is all that matters.

>Admits being a poser
Whatever you say, fag.

All you need to know about it is already mentioned in F/SN.

>He just read those 3

>F/SN, F/Z and F/HA is all that matters.

No CCC or Grand Order?

I swear to god, every FGO shitposter is a power level fag straight from /fgog/. Literally what ruined the fucking franchise.

No, CCC is just HF for brainlets, and FGO is pure cancer.

>anime secondary who got peer pressured into finally reading the VNs still pissing himself with anger because there's more content than Shirou's story
Typical. Where do you argue the cutoff between good typemoon and bad is if CCC/Extra "don't matter?"

>CCC has sakura innit and I've even seen people compare it to HF! I have the perfect defense for this!

The special (not an OVA, what the fuck are you talking about) was total shit even as someone up to date on the story.
Shitty goodbye to Olga as a "character", while also providing speculation fuel for a possible role in part 2. There's nothing good in it and Galahad's design is total garbage, arguably worse blandness syndrome than Charles. Stop defending trash just because you feel some sort of loyalty towards a shitty mobage.

Powerlevels were a joke since the Fate route, FGO did nothing to change that. Gilgameshfags and Karnafags are the idiots for going all "muh powerlevels" even when those two servants job hard 90% of the times.

Gilmeme isn't the strongest servant in the context of FSN/FZ?

Kara no Kyoukai
Plus Disc
Kagetsu Tohya
Melty Blood (original story mode, not the excuse plot arcade modes in the later versions)

Franchise milking trash:
The rest

CCC isn't even translated so it's pointless to expect people to be familiar with it.

Gee, user stop sperging. Where did Grand Order ever touch you.

remember when TM made visual novels?

The actual cutoff is in 2015 with the launch of Grand Order.
Extra and CCC were a decline in terms of pandering and character depth (showed some of the trends that would eventually completely consume what made TM good) but they were still serviceable/good in their own unique ways. I could agree with someone saying FSN was the last great thing from TM though, Nasu hasn't attempted any project of the same scale and ambition ever since.

But Lostroom was legitimately bad, poorly animated and Olga has a shitty party would not friend request/10

Technically, yes. Practically, no. The fact he holds back due to pride makes him a joke, and all the power of Ea means nothing if you can either beat him before using it (Shirou, Sakura) or protect against it (Saber with Avalon). Should he have less pride, he certainly would be more powerful.

Saber, her route got stuck with the introductory role where nothing really happens and most of the story is still hidden.

It completely took over TM due to its huge newfag audience that make tons of money? For anyone who enjoyed TM putting effort into stuff and releasing products that aren't titled "Fate", that's plenty of reason to hate it.

And as the other user said, Lostroom sucked. The whole thing was riding on people being hyped to see Galahad for the first time.

That I will admit. That thing was just to promote the game further and wank Galahad hard

>I could agree with someone saying FSN was the last great thing from TM though, Nasu hasn't attempted any project of the same scale and ambition ever since.

Why not?

I don't see a reason to hate it just for that. If anything, I'd hate Apocrypha more than I'd ever hate FGO.

Agreed on Lostroom though

>If anything, I'd hate Apocrypha more than I'd ever hate FGO.


Because it's easier to get easy money from milking your legitimately good works, and more people ended up liking a collab mobage about Servants that involves gambling. He kind of attempted some brand new stuff with the Extra universe, but that's about it. He's too old and lazy to care.

Why? Apocrypha did not damage TM's creativity or future content in any significant way. It's a shitty fanfic-tier spin-off, easily ignorable. Unless you care what people on Sup Forums think about Fate from having only watched anime adaptations.
FGO did far more to damage the core of the franchise, by completely replacing it with something else.

>TM released nothing but fate for nearly a decade outside of minor changes to Melty Blood
>but when Grand Order comes out and delivers fresh content it's entirely the fault of its existence
really makes me think

Because we had half a year of another garbage fate anime that could've been used on anything else in TM's library?

Which is better, FSN or FGO?

I don't know why TMfags get so spergy about 'secondaries'. Like, yeah, I watched the ufotable shows and movies, thought they were great. And then tried to get into GO and Apocrypha and they were fucking garbage. (Character designs are utter trash)
I don't know why you feel this high ground for shovelling shit into your mouth.
Like, does any other group of fans sperg out so hard because "hurrr you watched a great adaption of this work, how dare you criticise the shit adaptions"

Extra/CCC might be okay, but
>main character is a completely unrelated character who looks exactly like Saber, and follows her gimmick of 'actually a girl' and makes it way less interesting and special
is retarded and makes me completely uninterested in trying it.


I don't see FGO, nor Apocrypha as something that damages the core of the franchise. I see both of them as lazy jobs, yes. Things with more potential that could have been better definitely. But with mobbages in every corner nowadays, I just see FGO as one of those simple games without much effort put in it.

Apocrypha on the other hand, well, I actually like it. But the inconsistencies and the whole potential squandered really angers me sometimes. A big cast, a war different from others with two sides, some great heroes and in the end everything was misused. Actually, the most bizarre part is how FGO actually somehow fucking MANAGED to expand on some of these servants better, including Amakusa Shirou.

It's as if this author couldn't handle big casts and didn't even research the legends of heroes well or what he said with implications of the novel and all that got even worse in the anime that skips shit even more. 5 masters of red sidelined right away, a lot of Karna wanking, we have Spartacus, yet he is just immobilized and then mutates into a big monster and self-destructs. Unnecessary plot on the homunculus Sieg and the homunculi rebellion taking too much focus, many stuff only mentipned once or twice that could pass off as big Deus Ex Machinas, and so on.

I really felt if it was another author or maybe a longer story it could have worked better, making full use of its cast and having more time to solve those loose threads and side-plots

>Kara no Kyoukai films
>Mahou Tsukai no Yoru
>Carnival Phantasm

TM was doing a fantastic job of keeping everyone happy up until the 10th anniversary. After Mirai Fukuin it started to wane, and FGO shit was the decisive step that made everything an accesory to more Servant shit.
And it's not even just diversity, good job ignoring the part where they don't even use their considerably larger budget for anything, and remain stuck on low effort, lazily made mobage and musou trash. If they wanted to milk Fate, you should've gotten at least a couple of actually great Fate games by now. It is 100% the fault of FGO and its newfag audience that are happy as long as they pump out more shallow Servants with sloppy designs.

FGO COULD be "just another shitty mobage" and I'd be completely fine with that, if Nasu was still writing and releasing other, actually good shit alongside it.
They're not doing that. They're treating FGO as the definitive main project, and everything else as satellite projects and spin-offs to the big one. This mediocre mobage is the main thing TM has done for 2 years, and will continue doing for the foreseeable future. And they're only being encouraged to keep it up by the fans. That's the issue.

>After Mirai Fukuin it started to wane, and FGO shit was the decisive step that made everything an accesory to more Servant shit.

Were 2012-2015 that bad?

Ok, when you look at that at FGO, I have to admit it's quite a problem. It's essentially the same shit that happened with Yugioh Duel Links and it says a lot about it when I was more interested in the fangame Empire of Dirt than official Fate things Type-Moon has recently been doing.

Still, I have to say I like some new heroes that appear here and their portrayal, like Hector finally appearing and being a direct contrast to Achilles as someone more smart and tactical.

Mirai Fukuin was late 2013. The same year as Extra CCC. So no.
In 2014 people got hyped for the ufotable F/SN serious, and everyone just rode that train until 2015. FGO cancer began shortly after the UBW anime ended.

Thank you for at least admitting you see my point.
Yes, there's plenty of really cool shit in FGO, both in lore and some of the new Servants. Some of the characters Nasu wrote are also genuinely good (Mashu, Roman, most of the knights and Cursed Arm Hassan in the Camelot chapter) and I feel bad that they're wasted in a mediocre product. Part 2 is also looking interesting, with the new Masters and getting to know the other Beasts.
Unfortunately, the average quality of FGO is not that great, and it should by no means have taken over TM in the way it did.

What went wrong?

>bland, unappealing conflict
Understandable though, first route has to be simple to introduce reader to the world and shit

>edge at it's max. Unlimited GAR works though

>best plot IMO. Best character interactions, actual moral dillema for MC

HF best, UBW second, Fate third

Rin and Sakura didn't have any routes though. UBW and HF are EMIYA and Kirei's route, respectively.

I just tried recalling my experience and damn you're right.

HF best route. Shirou is finally pressured enough to reveal a facet of himself he always had, Sakura is great, Kirei is great, Illya is great. NLBW, kirei vs Shirou. Whole day 9.

>Sakura is great
guaranteed replies

There's no need to be upset.

You can meme that all you want, but it firmly is stated to be the Rin route or Sakura route when referring to it, however you might feel about that.

Like it or not, she is actually in the top 5 females of all TM characters.

It's been almost ten years since she was actually "low" in then popularity polls. And that "low" is like "not top 10". She has been in the top ten of all characters for a long ass time now.

She's legit.

She's always been in the top 10. There was one single poll at the very beginning where she didn't make it into the top 5, but that's it.

also the most sexy

>top 5 females of all TM characters
Shiki, Seibah, Sakura, and who else?

Actually, scratch that, she was in the top 5 females even then, since Archer was part of the top 5.

>actual moral dillema for MC
Shirou completely drops everything for Sakura and keeps going without ever looking back. At some point, not specifically in HF, he states that even if he at some point knows he's wrong he's not going to stop doing whatever he's doing.
It took him until Redman to want to go back on a decision.

Rin, Arcueid.

Best route? As much as I don't like to admit it, not Fate, even though it's by far my favorite.
I never cared for HF outside of the exposition and the initial surprise about Sakura.

I wanted to say Arcuied, but wasn't sure?
But Rin? Surprising.
Even more surprising is no FGO/Extra characters.

If you asked a bunch of Japanese normalfags and otaku, they'd mostly only know GO shit characters. The dedicated TM fanbase still prefers the originals though.
Regardless, there's no good enough poll in recent times to tell.

Boring and simple plot comparing to the rest of the routes but nice romance and great heroine. It has also the best conclusion, courtesy of Last Episode.
Best plot, very cathartic with an amazing climax. I liked the Tsukihime/KnK vibes and the gloomy atmosphere. Sakura, Illya and Rin were great, Saber not so much. The exposition of the lore makes HF the route that connects the best with other Type Moon works. My favorite route so far.

No he doesn't. He goes to see Sakura with a knife for fucks sake.

Medusa. In H/A