I watch these movies and I really appreciate them. I think they designs and animation and top notch. Not only that, but they're also very tasteful - they're not just something I would call "yeah it's good looking trash", they have a sense of decorum and are the opposite of "whorish" (and not just in the erotic sense). They have beautiful music and their stories set a very consistent, rich tone and atmosphere.
...but I just don't love them. I haven't seen them all but most of the ones I did just kind of bored me. I don't understand why. Maybe it's something to do with their "childlike innocence" thing. Oh, it's not all sunshine and flowers - there's plenty of deep suffering and grief in those movies. But there's very little cynicism, confusion, pettiness, Schadenfreude, existential dread or any other stuff that's dark and not strictly romantic; or if there is, it's usually some character's quirk and not something the movie really groks.
Am I really this jaded? It's not like I don't like plenty of stuff that's optimistic and "wholesome". I got titled "most cheerful" in high school, I'm not some edgelord who walks around saying "heh...nothing in life matters, kid". But I'm too edgy for this, apparently.
Help? Teach me to understand these movies. Or validate my lack of love for them, lol.
I recently watched Spirited away for the first time since I was a kid. It was a well made movie on a technical level, but it was fucking boring and the aesthetics were bland. I'll never think of any Ghibli movie when thinking about good music or character designs in anime.
Michael Ward
Which ones have you seen all the way through?
Isaac Mitchell
i mean you don't have to watch their movies if you don't like them. i've watched their movies and i don't dislike them but they're not even close to my favorite anime movies i've watched
Colton Hernandez
There's nothing really at stake in these movies. It's always about some pretty boring MC getting 'saved' from having a boring/sad life. Humans don't like these kind of stories, people watch this stuff mostly for the visuals. Can't blame em, either because ghibli movies are fucking gorgeous.
Dominic Taylor
You should ask Sup Forums instead. Sup Forums is notoriously not into Miyazaki in general. Whoever likes him already talked about him to death and the rest dislikes his messages and his popularity.
>Humans don't like these kind of stories It takes talent to be this autistic.
Asher Flores
Yeah, I know how that sounds. I'm really not trying to show this off as a good or "tragically beautiful" thing, but it's really how I feel.
Seems so. It's weird how LESS tiddies and gratuitous violence makes it more popular among the general audience.
Don't like Heinlein?
Mononoke, Spirited Away, Grave of the Fireflies, Totoro, Howl's Moving Castle, Porco Rosso
Yeah, I don't think I'm being forced to watch them lol. I just wish I could have the emotional experience of this guy like everyone else. I mean, once in a while, I see something everyone likes and my reaction is "why does everyone like this? it's total shit!". But I can't say this about Ghibli. I know they're not shit, and I understand, intellectually, why not. I just don't FEEL it.
Cooper Young
Stupid opinion. I'll bet you haven't even seen them all. This.
I personally love all Ghibli films, but l don't think there's anything wrong with you disliking/not caring about them. They're simply not your cup of tea, and that's fine; don't try to force yourself to like them. I feel the same way with Haruhi, it's incredibly popular in the medium, but I could never get into it.
They tend to be heavily atmospheric, and if the way it's conveyed doesn't really fit with you, I could see why you'd get bored of them. Also, some Ghibli moves differ from others. Personally I fucking adore Marnie and The Cat Returns, but I only thought of Kiki as okay, and I didn't like Kaguya at all.
Everyone has their niche, user. Don't beat yourself up over not enjoying things, even if everyone else loves it.
Name a sweeter scene in Ghibli history than the "Give me your hand" one from The Wind Rises. I'll wait.
Anthony Harris
This one
Tyler Bailey
Totoro's theme is super catchy. Porco Rosso is probably my favorite of all of those because I love interbellum Europe, and the style of magical realism that puts an inexplicable pigman in the middle of a tumultuous historical period.
Don't know anything about 50 Shades, but Twilight is totally repellent. I've actually read a few chapters and it's really as bad as people say. Ghibli movies are not repellent. I like them, and I almost love them, but there's something missing.
It just seems like I'm the sort of person who should like them. I don't have the (surprisingly common) biases against animation, Japan, fantasy, childhood, gentleness, cuteness etc. also they're the only anime some of my normie friends have seen, so if I don't relate to them with this then how will I ever get them into Evangelion??
Sebastian Taylor
You've been watching the popular adventure Miyazaki stuff and got away with the wrong overall view. Check out Takahata's stuff and Whisper of the Heart.
Camden Diaz
Ending scene from Omoide Poroporo, easily.
Dominic Moore
Also if you liked Porco Rosso, you might as well watch Kazeni Tachinu.
Ethan Stewart
Actually cried at that scene. Goddamn it was so unexpected
Xavier Hill
then enlighten me, my supposedly non-autistic brothers
There was something about The Wind Rises that left me depressed. Not even the cathartic kind of depressed like I felt with Texhnolyze, just straight up sad.
Jace Allen
But I like anime and Ghibli is my favourite
Ayden Cook
Good choice there.
There's also the part in Omoide Poro Poro where the protagonist confesses to a boy and flies out of the screen.
It is a particularly sad film. Miyazaki's next film I feel will be in the same vibe.
Josiah Hughes
>Omoide Poro Poro where the protagonist confesses to a boy and flies out of the screen. The entire film is great. Definitely an underrated gem like every other Ghibli film directed by Takahata.
>I haven't seen them all but most of the ones I did just kind of bored me. I don't understand why. You kidding? They're not made the instill real interest nor did they even once designed a compelling character or a thought-invoking storyline (not even Mononoke). Princess Mononoke and Howl's Moving Castle are probably the closes Ghibli's ever gotten to a more interesting and complex character building and storytelling and it's exactly in those two movies where you see all of the limitations Myazaki's character and world building. They're simply well stylized and charmingly animated one-shooter movies that are nothing more than imitations of Disney cartoons. You're not supposed to get into them or love them, those that claim they do are mostly autists are low IQ dipshits looking for intellectual recognition.
Best advice I can give you: watch them when you're high, especially My Neighour Totoro.
>Princess Mononoke and Howl's Moving Castle are probably the closes Ghibli's ever gotten to a more interesting and complex character building and storytelling and it's exactly in those two movies where you see all of the limitations Myazaki's character and world building. >Disney comparison
Wrong, but cute.
Landon White
>nor did they even once designed a compelling character
>Miyazaki: … The hallmark of this film [Kiki’s Delivery Service] is the expression of the many faces of a person. In the presence of her parents, Kiki is childish, but on her own she thinks things over with a serious expression. She may speak roughly and bluntly to a boy her own age, but to her seniors, especially to people important to her, she acts politely. These faces are not calculated but rather come out either naturally or as a result of what she has learned from her parents. My thought was that one characteristic of adolescence is learning to understand the appropriate use of these various facial expressions.
>–The main character is a girl who has these various faces she shows to others.
>Miyazaki: This is a very natural thing in our everyday lives. If it seems somewhat calculated, it is the unavoidable folly of youth [laughs], something that is common. My aim in making this film was not to express my opinion about each of these faces, but to make this kind of girl happy. [laughs]
>Here I do want to note that Kiki goes into a slump when she finds she can’t fly. Kiki will be depressed about other things in the future as well. She may become sad, but she will climb out of that feeling. That’s how I wanted to end the film. I didn’t want it to have a happy ending with her business becoming a success or her becoming the town’s sweetheart. I wanted to give the sense that she will repeatedly become dejected and then regain her cheery vitality … I was careful from the start to avoid making it a career success story.
Levi Baker
You're not jaded you just entirely don't understand the concept of stylistic expression. Not every movie has to pander to every philosophical message.
Carson Martin
You sound like you are more into cinema in general rather than anime. You already know Miyazaki's style isn't your thing. That alone made it worthy to watch those titles.
Give up on trying to make other people watch anime. The interest must come from them. If you shove it onto them, it will just make them antagonize jap animation.
>those that claim they do are mostly autists are low IQ dipshits looking for intellectual recognition. No, little guy. That's you.
Carter Torres
People who claim Miyazaki's characters aren't complex are embarrassingly stupid and imperceptive.
Nolan Williams
He has a point, though. Movies made by ghibli are often treated as masterworks but they really aren't. They're visually superior and a lot of effort and love went into the movies, but when it comes to the stories themselves, they're quite boring and unappealing.
Liam Gonzalez
He’s doing that because opening up like this makes him feel uncomfortable
Joshua Clark
I mean that's litereally one of the most basic human behaviors, you behave differently depending on who is observing. That's not even limited to humans, many animals do the same.
Jackson Fisher
Pretty much.
Carter Bailey
Yes? And how many anime make a point of portraying it to such a degree?
Luke Mitchell
>they're quite boring and unappealing. I feel bad for you user. I don't mean this in a smartass way either, I genuinely feel bad that you can't find any Ghibli work interesting.
Hunter Cook
the part in omoide poro poro where the dad bitch slaps his daughter.
Carson Lee
>Best advice I can give you: watch them when you're high, especially My Neighour Totoro. DUDE
Easton Perry
ALL THEY KIDS ARE DEAD TOTORO IS THE SHINIGAMI LMAO
Xavier Lewis
>when it comes to the stories themselves, they're quite boring and unappealing. No, this isn't the case. Not all of us need to be smacked in the face with our stories.
I'm sorry that the nuance flies over your head.
Angel Reyes
yamadas is so fucking good
Carter Cox
Depends on what you're watching. Generic action and comedy shows don't need to have that to work. Shows that focus on the characters tend to do that, but usually in a less hamfisted way. The thing about art is that it should be more than just being descriptive, which is something most ghibli movies lack. They're interesting alright, they just tend to stand in their own way sometimes. In the end the story gets resolved by a mechanism that saves the characters from whatever is ailing them. There's nothing you can learn from these stories - even the very old story of a knight descending into the dragon's lair, slaying the dragon and rescuing the princess has much more going on, despite how overused it is.
Jackson Mitchell
>when it comes to the stories themselves, they're quite boring and unappealing. people who appreciate art understand that it's not what happens that makes a good story, it's how it happens.
i've noticed that anime fans in particular seem to be largely guilty of thinking that everything needs a complex plot to be interesting. how small minded.
Tyler Ortiz
Ghibli movies are meant to be watched like normal movies. Miyazaki just chose anime as his medium because he's a big boy. See
>There's nothing you can learn from these stories I disagree, especially when it comes to his works like Mononoke and Nausicaa. To each their own though.
Tyler Smith
>There's nothing you can learn from these stories Jesus christ
Jacob Gray
Tell me what's interesting about a deus ex machina. If you take Marnie for example, it starts out being very interesting in my opinion. There's a girl who is having an identity crisis and has a lot of unresolved anger and trust issues. Then the ghost of her grandmother appears and makes everything go away. There's not much the MC is doing to resolve the issues she has, no. There has to be an external, supernatural event that gives her a new perspective and subsequently saves her.
Cooper Bennett
>Then the ghost of her grandmother appears and makes everything go away But that's the bulk of the conflict in the story comes from.
Dylan Lopez
Unless you're literally a robot the fact that humans behave differently based on which environment they're currently operating in is neither new nor shocking. It's like dedicating an entire movie around the fact that sad people tend to cry.
Justin Rogers
>. There's not much the MC is doing to resolve the issues she has I mean her issues were connected to her identity aka being a foster kid, and it's through her grandmothers ghost and moving that she learns the truth. Plus the presence of the ghost helps her come out her shell.
Logan Wilson
Not really, no. The story would work way better without the ghost.
Robert Davis
Isn't the film based off a novel anyways? If you're going to pick apart a work then at least pick an original Ghibli film.
Luke Phillips
Yes, exactly. The ghost plays a large role in resolving her issues which is the problem I have with the movie. Being saved is much less interesting compared to overcoming your inner demons yourself.
Jose Scott
That's besides the point. What you're saying would be like claiming the main conflict in the Wizard of Oz is "Dorothy was bored" and a magical adventure simply falls onto her lap and solves all her problems so she can learn "Kansas is pretty alright I guess". Totally missing the point.
It's about fragging witches.
Cameron Diaz
>overcoming your inner demons yourself. But she needed the presence of the ghost because the ghost helped her find out the truth about her past which was basically the root of her problems.
Jackson Lewis
People tend to resolve their problems without the help of their dead ancestors, though. Of course it's much harder to do so, which is exactly my point. The supernatural elements in the Wizard of Oz are not really integral to the story, though. Well, they are, but only in that they function as metaphors. Like the wolf in Red Riding Hood represents the danger posed by strangers.
Ian Hill
Are Toto and Kiki movies that will leave you feeling good in the end, or are they really happy and upbeat throughout and it's incredibly depressing when it's over?
Oliver Campbell
Sure, but what you're doing is overblowing the framing narrative. A character is introduced and has a problem. They go on an adventure, or whatever. The adventure ends. They solve the earlier problem, thus displaying their growth and what they learned. It's simple stuff.
Logan Lewis
>People tend to resolve their problems without the help of their dead ancestors, though Wow, it's almost as if we're talking about a fictional piece of work, and not real life.
Watch them. You'll end up feeling good and warm, especially with Totoro.
Nathaniel Howard
Yes, and dragons also don't exist and they don't have lairs and don't kidnap pretty girls, yet the story of a knight slaying a dragon and rescuing a princess has much more to it than the ghost of your grandmother helping you resolve your issues. Supernatural or entirely fictional events and entities work as an obstacle to overcome, not as something to take your worries away.
Lincoln Morris
>adventure The adventure is usually meant to represent overcoming challenges. If the adventure consists of you being simply saved, it isn't much of an adventure.
Aiden Turner
???????????????????????? I can't even fathom the logic you're using here. This could all be a good troll.
Her problems aren't solved by meeting a ghost. She learns through her interactions with a supernatural phenomenon. Sure, a story doesn't need magic, but having magic makes it a DIFFERENT story than if it didn't.
Benjamin Hall
Oh I'm sure, I'm in pretty deep.
Camden Perez
Totoro makes me cry because of how kind everyone is
Jason Lewis
I honestly have no idea what you're even trying to say here.
Robert Howard
>Her problems aren't solved by meeting a ghost But they are. That supernatural elements work as obstacles to overcome. You're faced with something that's far greater than you, and people want to know how you're going to deal with it. If that supernatural element resolves the entire story for you, it's far less interesting.
Jason Richardson
I'm starting to get the idea that you're either joking or some sort of crazy person.
>A story about dogs has much more going on than a story about cats. Everyone knows that!
Christian Mitchell
I don't see what's so hard to understand about it, honestly. It's not about dragons and ghosts being supernatural, it's about which roles they fulfill. A benevolent dragon that appears out of nowhere to solve your problems is as boring as a benevolent ghost that solves your problems for you. In the same way an evil ghost can play the role the evil dragon usually plays, being the obstacle that the hero needs to overcome.
Isaac Edwards
That's your personal issue then. I loved Marnie.
Grayson Wilson
Maybe you just have an opinion you fucking pretzel.
A story isn't a checklist. Every element other than the protagonist in the plot doesn't have to be an obstacle. A film could be about two people talking and nothing else. If one of them happens to be a ghost, that doesn't mean the protagonist has to exorcise them to prove they've learned something. You're being way too dogmatic about something you've completely invented yourself. In short,
Aaron Jenkins
>That's your personal issue then. It's more about how the entire story is built around a plot device. I can and did enjoy Marnie regardless but I would've enjoyed it much more if some actual thought was put into it.
Jackson Evans
You can do whatever story you want, I enjoyed The Man from Earth for example and that was nothing more than a bunch of people talking for one and a half hours. But Marnie features a very classical story structure but fails to execute it properly.
Caleb Thomas
>But Marnie features a very classical story structure Which is?
Sebastian Kelly
Protagonist faces adversary, in this case her inner demons. Normally, you'd expect some kind of journey for the hero to overcome the adversary, but in this case, an external, convenient plot device solves the problem for the hero. It's like the modern version of Red Riding Hood, where the hunter saves Red instead of Red being simply eaten or saving herself through tricking the wolf.
Landon Brooks
I feel like you're just forcing your own idea on what should have happened onto the story.
Austin Wilson
Well, a deus ex machina is usually criticized as a poor way to solve a problem but hey, whatever floats your boat.
