Why are you so dead, MMO genre?

why are you so dead, MMO genre?

last thread was great

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I played silkroad online for like 3 years

it's the worst MMO I ever played but I only played wow, silkroad, everquest, dark age of camelot or some shit and guild wars nightfall and factions

but holy shit silkroad was really bad.

Because even the good ones have issues. Like Tree of Savior. And all the ones that used to be good were killed by their companies. Like MapleStory and WoW and the like.

been playing the secret world. bretty gud. wish there were more people.

microtransactions killed mmos. publishers believe mmos are microtransaction machines, not living communities

It evolved into the sandbox genre w/ emergent gameplay.

Players are tired of tasklist themeparks.

Everyone is trying to do the same thing at the same time

>Everyone is tired of theme park MMOs
>All of the modern sandbox MMOs on the market are shit
>Instance lobby MMOs only work in Asia (DFO, PSO2, etc)

they thrive on people, and people are pretty cancerous now

its not rocket science

>Play MMO
>Expect to get into a party and go into awesome adventures togheter
>Finding teammates takes longer than doing the quest itself because most people play solo for god knows what reason
>Also the teammates don't try to interact at all, I can't tell a difference between an AI and an actual player since they are just as cold as them

I dunno man. I might just as well play a single player rpg at this point.

>add 50% exp boost for leveling with another player
>suddenly groups start forming again

50% might be too much but you need to give players a reason to group nowadays

Westerners expect every MMO to be casual WoW shit and nobody brings good MMOs to the states anymore unless it's casual WoW shit.

>make things near impossible to do solo
>???
wow we fixed it

Common misconception. Many MMOs with mobs that are "near impossible to solo" were soloable. You just needed to be very good, very rich or have a specific class.

>have a specific class.
This was fine, ragnarok did it very well, every class had their own types of monsters they could do alone well but it was never as effective as getting a group.

I'm playing FFXIV right now, I don't see why people hate it so much. The client is very optimized, the graphics are good, it plays like a ATB style Final Fantasy game, and the community is friendly here on Primal/Leviathan.

>I don't see why people hate it so much

Because it's shit compared to XI. Sit in queue and ERP simulator.

What's wrong with queuing with friends you made in-game to instantly access content?

>burned out on MMOs
>none of them seem to give what I want in an MMO
>want high level caps, unique classes/builds, several viable builds instead of one accepted 'best' cookie cutter build, comfy leveling grind
>ToS announced, looks like everything I could possibly want in an MMO
>Sup Forums says it's shit
>play it anyway
>fucking love it, literally all I could ever want in an MMO
>still in early access and no one to fucking play with
>everyone transferring to the SEA and SA servers has left the international servers a barren wasteland where you literally have to wait 50 mins to queue up for the dungeon matchmaking
Why? Why must life be so awful?

It still makes you sit and wait even if you have a formed party, and you don't get equal rewards for making a party. All of this is just the tip of the iceberg. You can "access content" from anywhere at any time. It kills any and all feeling of immersion or adventure. There's no open world PvP, there's nothing in the world that poses a threat to players unless they're massively retarded. Rare monsters aren't fun to hunt and don't give suitable rewards. Crafting is shit and 99% useless along with gathering. Most assets in the game are recycled from other final fantasy games. The console version bogs down the game as a whole.

I could go on and on.

>not being a healslut in FF14

all of those are not true or subjective...

Nobody has patience and only care about instant-gratification these days, which makes for boring and unchallenging design choices to cater to the casuals. Long gone is the days of MMORPGs actually having social interaction and vast worlds to explore freely.

forced singleplayer campaign
why bother playing an MMO if I need to play alone

>none of this is true

Oh boy it's an ignorant ARR fanboi episode.

you don't have to play alone though...

What MMO hurt you the most Sup Forums?

>Experience point and capacity point gains will be doubled
>returnees will be able to experience battle content even easier than before!
>Raise your item level to 119 by completing a tutorial quest!

Queues ruined MMO's. Sure dungeon queue's are faster but actually meeting people, becoming friends, FUCKING TALKING was far better, you may as well be doing dungeons with NPC's you interact with them as much.

Because MMOfags continue to support the same shit from AAA publishers that would rather attempt to be the next World of Warcraft than settle for a viable niche. The ultimate irony is, these people don't know any better, and they go from themepark to themepark thinking "THIS WILL BE THE ONE"

Meanwhile, the last AAA sandbox games to be released were Star Wars Galaxies/EVE Online in 2003.

Go support crowdfunded MMOs because that's the only way you're not going to get the same shit in a different setting at this point.

Check these out.
Albion Online
Chronicles of Elyria (most promising)
Gloria Victis
Shards Online
The Repopulation
Star Citizen

Actually do you. Most of the job quests don't allow you to take other players in to help you.

>but this is a good thing

No, it's bullshit forced single player content in an MMORPG because "people won't learn otherwise." It's a flawed system. If people actually enjoyed the game and were challenged somewhere between level 1 and 50 or 60 you wouldn't need forced single player encounters. 1-50 in XIV is a giant tutorial and it's fucking gay.

It's taken a few years, but MMO market is finally at the same level as Korea is, filled with p2w, gachapon and cash shop bullshit to the point of destroying the games.

you mean the class quests? something that is missing in a lot of mmos these days?

>something that is missing in a lot of mmos these days?

And should stay that way.

>tfw youre the only one of your guild that keeps playing.

That one.

I actually think gw2 is a fun little collectathon. I don't really play it as an mmo, more like a multiplayer brawler. I really don't understand the hate towards it other than buttblasted gw1 players. It has the best f2p model I have ever seen. The classes are diverse, the maps are interesting and the expansion added a much needed challenge to the overworld. I personally enjoy it a lot.

Whats an mmo of any sort where I can focus on buffing the shit out of my teammates instead of being the holy trinity

This is why I like sandbox games. There's minimal interference in between you and the "good stuff"

How can people be tired of what they haven't had in 13+ years? If you're into sandbox games, you have the choice between EVE and uh..... *insert Kickstarter MMO still in development alpha*

As many people have said microtransactions are killing mmo's but I also want to add:

Quest to lv up instead of zone grinding is killing 50% of the fun.
Faction oriented game.
No open world pvp.

>other than buttblasted gw1 players

It's almost like people expected a good MMO and not a "play your way, I don't play it as an MMO multi-player brawler" or something.

FF14 is a dead game that nobody plays

People would still find a way to solo. Adding an experience incentive would make it so people at the very least grouped up during the grind. Forcing them to group up all the time might not be appealing to everyone.

>muh grinding is enjoyable
Anyone past the age of 18 doesn't want to spend hours collecting 10 boar assholes or grinding mobs.

I won't play games that don't respect my time. This is why I play EVE and Galaxies and Ultima Online (all sandbox games that were extremely open and community-based).

You said it, the free to play model. I bought the game for 60 bucks, then it became basically worthless, because f2p players can access the same shit as me. Fuck the new ANet. Also, it's not even Guild Wars anymore.

I'd problably have to even it out on city of heroes and trickster online

somewhere near that point I'd add mabinogi too, but that isn't dead so it's not as bad.
>forcing them to group up all the time might not be appealing to everyone.
MMOs in general won't be appealing to everyone, but yeah, XP should be piss low unless you're partying.

>95% of content is soloable
>The remaining 5% has a built in groupfinder that goes across realms
>Few to no incentives to create or maintain a party
>Few incentives to maintain a guild outside of communication
>Distinct and growing lack of objectives outside of instancing
>lack of horizontal or meaningful alternative progression
>Less social hubs (taverns, stages, inns, etc.) which server a purpose (See: Mabinogi)
>Less changing environments such as certain enemies only appearing at night or day, weather changing in zones that affect spawns, and lunar/solar cycles that could shift gathering professions
>Less meaningful player housing
>Content that doesn't encourage role diversity as long as you have a healer/tank/DPS

All this can be accomplished in a theme park. It doesnt have to be a directionless character driven sandbox by any means.

>that one ERP furfaggot server has players guys

Woopdie-fucking-doo.

>might not be appealing to everyone

So make an unlockable class that can solo. Problem solved. If they need to solo all day every day they should at least have to earn it.

so you support games that give you abilities right away upon leveling instead of earning them?

How much did you pay for max level characters on WoW?

But user it still is an mmo. Just not what gw1 players were expecting. It's an mmo brawler collectathon and that's perfectly fine. I log on with my buds, do fractals with them, work on legendary collections, do some map completion, grind some more resources for our guild hall, its perfectly comfy.

Why didnt you stick to any of the other MMOs you tried out like ToS? ToS sure did fail miserably.

I tried, but didnt for the very reason you just said.

XI gave you an ability right away. I don't see the problem.

>It's an mmo brawler collectathon and that's perfectly fine

No, it isn't.

>all these themepark shitters
Yeah, I'm totally sure that *insert new collect 10 boar assholes quest simulator* will be totally different than the thousand MMOs that do the same thing before it

You faggots are the cancer ruining the industry. The last sandbox we got was EVE/Star Wars Galaxies in 2003 and think about the regard in which these games are held. Every fucking article that comes out about EVE, there's a thousand people saying "God, I wish I could play EVE on the ground, I love the player interaction/community but I don't like the gameplay/setting"

Why isn't there a modern EVE-esque on the ground? Chronicles of Elyria is one, but why isn't a AAA publisher doing something like it?

>Hey guys I know you greenlit us on steam and beta tested the game for hundreds of hours
>but fuck you pay for this early access server

Gee why did this game fail?

I keep thinking about going back to Mabi but with Ariadust dead or moved on I have nothing but frustration in store if I did that, even though now I can buy Nexonbucks.

But user that's the perfect b2p/f2p model. Its what every other game should have. Buy the game, no sub fee and a shop to buy cosmetics and other non p2w things which you can use ingame gold as well as real money.

>babby who never touched mabigoogoo or haven and hearth

The shitty pasta is getting old.

Im playing with a friend, he gave me that armor im wearing that costs at least 6m.

But yeah sometimes i feel kinda lonely, specially when i dont spend a single penny in the game and every new gachapon is filled with overpowered gear.

XI had a shit ton of ability bloat and was terrible to play.

Not only is the translation terrible, the optimization is abysmal, theres no battlegrounds (yet), no WoE, guilds are still able to be wardec against their will, open PvP is single digit FPS anyway, the trade restrictions are the worst ive seen in a game yet bots are still rampant, and the cash shop while not the worst even is still worse than just a monthly fee.

why do so many of those + so many not mentioned require building a base? It seems like minecraft is creeping into every game nowadays and its the 1 thing that really turns me off from a game. Even fallout had settlement building, luckily it wasn't required or I would have put even less time into it.

Is sandbox / building really a selling point for people now?

I don't play WoW because I hate collect 10 boar assholes I am the hero sent to save the world type games.

I'd much rather have an immersive world/universe with a bunch of mechanics to let me live out my medieval bandit/space diplomat fantasies

I understand it's difficult to explain this to babby born in 2XXX that hasn't played a MMO not inspired by World of Warcraft, but they used to be different in a better way.

Watch this. Seriously
youtube.com/watch?v=nvK8fua6O64

>Why isn't there a modern EVE-esque on the ground?
People don't like to take risks, especially when it comes to big corporations and their money.

>I won't play games that don't respect my time
1hr of solo questing or 1hr of group grinding still wastes 1hr of your free time I don't see any difference.

Why isn't it fine, because people were expecting gw1 with better graphics? That's not a very good reason. The game is fun the way it is.

look at all those bots

>2016-02-29
>Math group dungeon
Is that suppose to be the dungeon revamp? How is it?

>bloat

I bet you don't even know what that word is supposed to mean. If you want to talk about bloat just look at any modern MMO. It's 99% bloat.

Sounds like I didn't miss anything. They should have brought Wolfknights over here in stead of ToS anyway.

Because people were expecting a good game.

What's the bigger risk? Making the thousandth WoW clone or making something different that people want?

>questing
>group grinding
You're talking in World of Warcraft terms user. I play sandbox games.

Watch this user's video

>tfw you will never get to 30k AP for the full Radiant armor set before GW3 is released

I played Haven &Hearth 2. A bunch of Goons play it with me. It's pretty fun but it's not mainstream at all and it has an incredibly small budget.

Not worth going back to mabi the very moment they started giving r1 BiS gear in the gachapons.
New dresses and pets come in gachapons too.
The game went full gamble mode to get as much money as possible from the remaining suckers.

I'd login, do G20 if you haven't yet, and logout. The new squire system fucking sucks anyway.

Get a load of all these useless spells, makes it such a good game right?

is black desert online any good

Funny thing is that I never played WoW.

Westerners have evolved into their hybrid action mmos like Warframe and The Division.
The future is upon us, the conventional mmo's of Orcs spamming 1234 while they look plate greaves off of a chicken are over.

Idk if I like the new direction but its pretty clear that conventional mmos are dying out in favor of hybrid mmos. Unfortunately no matter what you play you can guarantee it will have microtransactions because cell phone/tablet gaming sparked a business trend.

You've played World of Warcraft even if you haven't played World of Warcraft by playing literally any MMO released in the last 12 years because there hasn't been ANYTHING different.

Unless you have played the rare exception (Ultima Online/Asheron's Call/Star Wars Galaxies/EVE Online/Haven and Hearth/Mortal Online), I would argue that you haven't played a MMORPG

>play Resident Evil game because you're expecting a survival horror game
>you're punching the shit out of giant boulders with your near superhuman strength
>expecting a survival horror franchise to make a survival horror game is a very good reason to hate said game

It's a shame too, mabinogi itself is pretty much still a fine game but the only people playing it still are people who have done FUCKING EVERYTHING and as such you're left to run around alone.

They fucked up the pvp and siege system.

Warframe is still doing good though, but Division is dying hard. If there was a good Warframe competitor then more MMOFPS games could work in the future.

So not worth buying, basically?

Yeah but theres a difference between saying its a bad game and saying its a bad RE game.

There's a future in MMORPGs, not MMOs

A MMO is a questing simulator with shit gameplay due to networking restrictions, while a MMORPG takes advantage of the thousands of players on the shard through meaningful player interaction.

A MMORPG's gameplay can be forgiven for providing meaningful player interaction in a way that isn't possible in other games.... But why would I play a MMO like World of Warcraft when I could play The Witcher 3 or Dragon Age Cisquisition, get the same "YOU ARE THE HERO NOW BRING ME BACK 10 EAGLE FEATHERS" experience?

I like this one.

its the future, I think the trend will continue.
The new forumla is out and more companies are going to throw their hate into the fray.

>mmos are dying out
>blockbuster FPS is dying out (Halo and COD are both bombing)
>combine the two
>new business
It will be the next craze, at least for awhile.

I don't know if it was revamped, what's exactly different here? I just ran into here and some new players invited me in, we ran some dungeons and had a blast.

You upgrade those spells or get completely new ones. It's not bloat unless you're some sort of special snowflake that needs to cast Fire II instead of IV because it's his faborite spell.

I miss NavyField
Anyone still playing?

hat*

This. Elder Scrolls going full co-op is inevitable, and at that point, there will be group dungeons and probably PVP content, so what appeal is there behind World of Warcraft-esque games?

I can see the appeal in games like EVE Online. I can see none in World of Warcraft clone #1902091290129012901290

Dungeon revamp adjusts the difficulty for the old dungeons and completely revamps Peaca. I just felt surprised pubs were doing dungeons, normally in NA Mabi people do shadow mission pubs.

Guys, are there some forums where people collect info to make server emulators for MMOs?

Have you guys ever done drawings/stuff of your MMO characters?

Pic related.

Is ToS recovering, or going to even deeper shit?
I registered steam just for that game

what mmo lets me play lots of different classes and mixmatch my builds

I see what you're saying but your " 'MMO' means this 'MMORPG' means this" is fucking dumb