Have we really come to accept dlc and microtransactions as the norm?
I remember 4 years ago, if you mentioned that Nintendo was releasing DLC for smash and mariokart or Fromsoft was making DLC content while working on the base game, we would have been up in arms and asking questions like
>why the FUCK isnt that part of the base game?
Why is it OK now? Because they've jammed it down our throats long enough?
whats wrong with extra content?
There's nothing inherently wrong with DLC. it's just the way it has been implemented, and sometimes abused by a lot of major companies that's the problem.
DLC per se isn't bad
What is bad is cutting a game content and releasing the missing part as DLC
DLC are extra and aren't even a novelty, we called "expansion packs" back then and we had to purchase a whole CD for them.
There's nothing wrong with DLC. In fact I prefer it in some ways to old "release a full-price expanded version of the same game 1-2 years later" we used to get.
It just sucks when it's blatent that devs release 70% of a game and sell you the rest quite quickly later. I don't think Nintendo has been guilty of that, and their DLC so far seems to have been added content created after the main game was completed.
In this case, it WAS abused. Sakurai may talk shit all he wants about how DLC is a "scam" and he can trash talk other companies in whatever passive-aggressive way he wants, but Smash DLC is just a cashgrab for a game that's on a dying/dead console.
Hell, Bayonetta was so fucking broken she was literally a pay2win character for a long time, and if it wasn't for the competitive scene, she would've stayed that way because Nintendo (Sakurai included) don't give a single fuck, because they already got your money.
Smash DLC relied on shock value more than anything, and it just doesn't make the game feel like Smash anymore. Why is Ryu in Smash? Why is he so good to the point where he's probably one of the best in the game? Because he's DLC and he has to be good. Because money.
It's scummy, shitty, adds NOTHING to the game other than initial hype, which is forgotten in a few weeks, and lowers the quality of the game.
I've never accepted character DLC in any fighting game. If you need the extra development time to add these characters, fucking do it. DLC is not inherently bad, but it sure as fuck is bad in the modern video game industry.
The only people who do DLC sort of right are FromSoft with their massive area expansions, and Bethesda. Love them or hate them, they provide a fuckton of additional content for the same price, if not LESS, than what Smash 4 charges you for all its DLC. It's bullshit and Sakurai's a cunt.
Casuals have learned to accept being raped by publishers.
Anyone with any dignity quit videogames in the 7th gen.
I don't mind DLC, I'm just never going to buy it, and if I feel like it's necessary to buy DLC to enjoy a game to its fullest, I will not buy the game.
The character bundle in smash 4 is ok, but I think a bad value proposition. $35 for 7 characters, which is essentially only 12% of the cast, doesn't seem like a particularly fair when the base game was $60. It doesn't help that some of the DLC characters are considered top tier.
That's why I refuse to back certain games with DLC. Smash Brothers, Splatoon, Street Fighter, etc.
I don't care if you think it "adds more playtime". You will not charge me full price, then ask for more money. How dare you be so greedy? I'm the customer, you should be bending over to make me happy, not the other way around.
>Splatoon
2/10 because I took the bait
I'm talking about the cosmetics locked onto the amiibos. You can argue that they don't affect the game at all, but I don't care. You asked 60 dollars of me, so every single thing associated with the game will be free of charge.
Otherwise, your game goes back to the store.
I would love to see these same posts in Sony or Microsoft threads
Do you at least buy GOTY editions?
>In this case, it WAS abused
Everyone after Mewtwo was done AFTER the game was released and went gold. Are the expensive? Yes, but they're also par of the course for fighting game DLC.
How is this DLC a cashgrab when the demand for additional fighters is clearly there? Hell, if they announced a Round 2 of DLC characters, Sup Forums and the rest of the internet would rev up their shitty roster pictures, and start signing petitions like crazy. This makes you sound like a butthurt roster baby whose favorite character didn't get in, but if it had you never would have made this thread.
You bring up a lot of points in the balance of the characters, but that's a problem that you're going to run into in fighting games; DLC or no DLC. Remember when Bayonetta was first released and everyone was disappointed because she "sucked"? Remember when Ryu, Lucas, and Roy got leaked and everyone was shouting "BASED NINTENDO". There doesn't need to be a reason why these characters got in. Again, butthurt roster baby.
And if you think adding fighters adds nothing to the game, then you're pretty damn stupid and shouldn't even bother posting your opinions here.
>Bethesda cock rider
I should have known.
>DLC is x% of the game so it should cost x% of the game's price
Nope.
My rule is that, if your game has any DLC and it's cosmetic, then I can let it slide if the base game is good and the price is fair (neither applies to most nintendo titles though).
However, you're gonna charge me 60 bucks, then an additional 35 bucks for DLC that vastly affects online play? And I get screwed over if I don't want to pay for it?
You don't see a problem there?
>Caring about the amiibo weapons or clothes
>Caring about cosmetics that do jack shit at all
>I remember 4 years ago when DLC was equally common and even Nintendo was releasing level packs for NSMB2 and Fire Emblem Awakening
Right.
I dont mind the bloodborne dlc since miyazaki and team were actually planning on cutting the game up and giving it the Dark souls II treatment, but instead opted to design more content after seeing the game's reception.
dark souls II and III make me mad as fuck because From, had the DLC ready at launch and opted to sell it piecewise and with season passes because they know people will buy it. after Dark Souls II, I only buy the GOTY editions for souls games. Fuck paying 90$ for the full experience.
Only DLC I ever got was bonus pre-order DLC or if it was part of a Collectors Edition where it was bundled with physical goods.
Wait, you're ok with companies charging you for skins, re-colors, and the sort, but you're upset when a company charges you for a unique fighter? What? And how does not buying the DLC affect you at all? You don't have to buy any of them, you know that right? Just because you buy Bayonetta, doesn't mean you're automatically not going to get screwed online.
Cosmetics like that do more damage than you think. Look at TF2 and Overwatch for example. Although the hats didn't affect the game, it turned everyone into attention whores, and before you knew it, every single discussion that ever happened afterward was just a circlejerk about people showing off their reskins and cosmetics. So that's also a problem I have with cosmetics, especially ones behind a paywall. People who buy it act like asshats who think they're better.
I'd wager the DLC was the only thing keeping SSB4 alive for as long as it did.
I don't think it's bad at all. The alternative is to release the same game again with some extra characters a year later, add a 2 to the title and charge everyone $60. The first game becomes worthless then too.
because if WE didn't buy it, the everyday average joe would.
we could do NOTHING to curb it save for starting when horse armor came out and fought it hard.
really though, most of the shit on fallout 3 was like old school expansion packs you would have bought for $20-$30 back in the 90's
i still remember buying shit like master levels for doom 2, hell, i even still HAVE my boxed copy.
its going nowhere user, at best we can have like what nintendo did for mario kart, giving us several new racers, 16 tracks and such for 11.99. that is how you make dlc good, make it cheap for me to care.
>My rule is that
My rule is that, I don't give a fuck about your rule and if they had to follow every single stupid fuck's arbitrary rule then there would be NO DLC.
Sakurai did nothing wrong.
So it's a community problem. Not the game's or the company.
And FYI, Splatoon doesn't face said problem because the amiibo shit is hardly anything worth bragging about
He made smash 4 pay more to win more though
>Wait, you're ok with companies charging you for skins, re-colors, and the sort, but you're upset when a company charges you for a unique fighter?
Read between the lines. I said it was only okay if it was reasonable.I'm talking all DLC for the game forever for maybe 2-3 dollars, and the game is good even without them. But if neither is met, then the game is clearly just masking its inability to have good gameplay with pricey, flashy garbage.
>You don't have to buy any of them, you know that right?
Yes, and tell me, how does that help me online when I play against other people? You tell me what happens. I either have to avoid the people who do have the DLC (reducing the amount of people I'm allowed to play with), or I get screwed because Hackurai doesn't know balance and just made every DLC character OP as hell.
Nobody should be allowed to buy an advantage like that.
people was never against DLC, its been since the start of PCs.
they started bitching when they were on consoles, because it was new for them and console space etc, but it only turned into a problem when actual parts of the game like THE FUCKING ENDING were sold separately.
thats when the line was cross.
how do you feel about SFV's "you can play the game to get all the stuff or buy it immediately"
Nigga you're retarded and one of the hardliners that are impossible to please and might as well just fuck off.
>The alternative is to release the same game again
Or you could just stop being greedy and release the game for free. Or lower the base price of the game.
Shovel Knight had no problem doing that. 3 brand new campaigns, and I don't have to pay a dime for them. Terraria too. 4-5 years of support and new content, not a penny extra.
>4 years ago
4 years ago nothing was different. Street Fighter got another "new" separate entry with DLC, DLC was used to make up for shitty endings, and even Nintendo was doing it.
I fucking hate blind biased "muh favorite years" faggots like you who pretend times were better when hardly anything changed.
>there would be no DLC
That sounds heavenly. Make it so #1.
>And FYI, Splatoon doesn't face said problem because the amiibo shit is hardly anything worth bragging about
Look at the hovel known as /splatoon general/ and tell me that with a straight face.
>b-but /vg/ generals are supposed to be bad!
No, they're not. People just let it slide because they don't want to improve their communities.
The only DLC character to ever win a big tournament is Mewtwo. The base cast is good enough to win.
How so? I had no problems beating DLC characters in tourney's and people who have the time for major's had no trouble either, people only complained because there were a bunch of frauds that were scared their ego would be hit because some characters had custom like jank.
Though if you're good you wouldn't fall for that shit, but you can be like zero and dodge until a nerf.
Both of those are insignificant compared to what we have now. They were nintendo's horse armor. I consider e-Reader to be the shitty precursor to amiibos.
event pokemon dont matter they were free except for the jirachi you could get with pokemon channel.
>So it's a community problem
>No, just look at the community
You're proving him right.
>just fuck off because you have standards
I'm sorry I don't want everything to become Mass Effect 3 and selling endings and characters as DLC, when your game is already full priced.
Its shit but expansion packs were just as if not more cancerous
We grew up
>/ink/ is the whole splatoon community
I want you to go there and reference me to a post where they brag their amiibo shit, if they aren't busy posting Marie or Callie.
Even fucking Miiverse doesn't brag amiibo shit at all or start circlejerks about it.
>Or you could just stop being greedy and release the game for free. Or lower the base price of the game.
Money comes first for companies. Don't tell me you're one of those imbeciles that cries about companies like Sony and Nintendo changing; about how they used to genuinely care for you.
Shut UP AND BUY MORE AMIIBO
>Why is it OK now?
Its been around for years
>B-B-B-But it's different now
Not really
>B-B-B-But I hate it
Join the vocal minority
>W-W-Why are you defending it
I'm not
>Shovel Knight
>Free content
Shovel Knight did something even more cancerous by having a Kickstarter. People paid for that content before they even knew if it would be good, let alone actually ever release.
Same deal with Terraria, only that was Early Access.
I hope everyone in this thread has a restless sleep and doesn't wake up refreshed
>Shovel Knight
>conveniently leaving out that it had a Kickstarter, where people pay more for things that aren't even in development yet
That kind of "community" never existed before cosmetic whoring.
Compare TF2 and Counterstrike's vanilla launches and the fans who came in around that time. Then compare that to when Valve decided that everything needed neon green pony hats everywhere, and the F2Ps and the BRs and the 10 year olds swamped in to show off their stout shakos.
>reference a post where they brag about amiibo shit
I think this post might count, either way it proves my other point that people jerk off over cosmetics.
ctrl+f The rest of the thread is, surprise, circlejerking about very unpleasant, not video game related content. And they're having a board war with Undertale general. It's funny.
>3 brand new campaigns, and I don't have to pay a dime for them
Well no shit. Other people did.
Do you not know how Kickstarter works?
I never thought companies genuinely cared. but I believe in the power of the customer. If I say something is unfair, you don't get my money for it, and I don't consider it a good product. The customer is always right.
The point was that I got the content for free. If some schlub wanted to pay for the kickstarter, that was his decision.
Well, a price being "reasonable" is a complete subjective matter. What you might find unreasonable, might be perfectly ok with someone else. All that is completely subjective, so moot point.
And again, if you buy the DLC or not, if you SUCK at the game, you're still going to get rekt either way. You're acting as if these characters are completely broken. Yes, they are good, but I'd say considering the size of the overall roster, the balance ain't that bad. Considering that ZZS, Sheik and Diddy Kong have all sat on top of the tier list at one point or another, renders your argument moot. Again. I bet you a million dollars that if these characters were FREE, and they stayed exactly as is, you would be complaining about them being too OP still.
If you get so miffed about character balance, then you might want to find different games to play.
>complaining about corporations being greedy
>defending Kickstarter and early access
ME3 ending wasn't paid though
>that feel when you bought all the DLC but pirated the game
Jokes on you faggot, that doesnt bother me.
Now i'll sleep at 9pm just to spite you.
If Smash Brothers worked the same way, I wouldn't have a problem. If the DLC was free and was already paid for by Nintendo, then I wouldn't have a problem. They can do it with most of the DLC for Splatoon, what's their excuse here?
>We want money
Okay, but I'm not paying for it.
>And again, if you buy the DLC or not, if you SUCK at the game, you're still going to get rekt either way.
That doesn't matter in the slightest. I want the characters for free because I paid full price for the game. It's price gouging corporate greed at its worst.
It's just like the control schemes for Kid Icarus, or Splatoon, or Star Fox. Yeah, I can learn them if I have to, and learn how to get better with them, but I don't want to. I'm sick of paying high prices for products that continue asking of me, as if I didn't earn this game with money that I worked hard for.
>The customer is always right.
So why are you playing contrarian and complaining about DLC? The average customer thinks it's a good thing.
The average customer is only right if they're within the interests of themselves and customers in general. Traitors obviously need not apply.
>I'm sick of paying high prices for products that continue asking of me, as if I didn't earn this game with money that I worked hard for.
Yet you keep doing it.
I think you're legitimately retarded.
Your post had absolutely NOTHING to with amiibo bragging. It just quoted someguy posting a picture of some kid with IN GAME (and included with the game) cosmetics. Never did the post include bragging about paid cosmetics.
>The rest of the thread is, surprise, circlejerking about very unpleasant, not video game related content. And they're having a board war with Undertale general. It's funny.
So what does that have to do with the game and DLC? You're moving goalposts
You sound like a complete leech, and I'd hate to be the poor bastard that calls you a "customer".
I'm having a hard time thinking of any games that didn't have dlc that came out in the last like 3 years or so. I'm sorry your autism is preventing you from experiencing so many great games
>>The average customer is only right if
The customer is ALWAYS right. You said it, not me.
>kickstarter is evil meme
Come on, I know we are all pissed because of MN9 but not everything that comes from there is a scam
I downloaded all the DLC characters and stages for Smash 4, so apparently yes.
Fuck the mii costumes though.
theres nothing wrong with DLC as long as it adds something substantial to the game, like extra characters or an additonal 7 hours of game play
A customer is someone who buys a product. If they shill for a product, they're no longer a customer. Defending bad practices counts as shilling.
Better that than a marketer.
I'm pointing out his hypocrisy.
>That doesn't matter in the slightest. I want the characters for free because I paid full price for the game.
Holy shit the entitlement.
You paid for the game as it was. Not for shit that came afterwards. If you want DLC included with the game wait for GOTY editions.
>If they shill for a product, they're no longer a customer
user-kun, that makes you not a customer too.
>doesn't matter in the slightest
But you keep complaining about other players having an advantage over you, because they did pay for them. You just proved yourself to be a grade A retard. Nobody gives a shit about what you think is "fair", and why you think you're entitled to extra content, because "I PAID FOR THE GAME, WHY ARE YOU CHARGING ME MORE FOR MORE GAME".
>Money I worked hard for
Hardest part about autismbux is opening up the envelope faggot.
>Defending bad practices counts as shilling
So does defending good practices.
I know you're bored on this Sunday evening/Monday morning, but at least TRY not to be like that guy who fumbles less than an hour into his own thread.
>entitlement is now a bad thing
Why?
>Better that than a marketer.
>the opposite extreme
not really
I'm waiting for a response here you goalpost mover.
Your parents didn't have to raise you
Sure, microtransactions are bad. But then you have shit like the Witcher DLC, which aren't really traditional DLC and are more like expansions. Those are fine, and have existed for decades. Same with Dark Souls shit.
Character packs are a bit egregious, however.
...
Do you throw a shitfit when you buy a phone, and a week later down the line they announce an updated version of it, then complain you should get it for free because you already paid for a phone?
>implying entitlement is a good thing
Quit shilling for entitlement.
He was posting cosmetics. That's all that mattered. He wasn't talking about gameplay.
Thanks to Undertale shitposting, there wasn't enough posts of amiibo exclusive content.
Did you guys happen to shill for paid mods when they first came out?
>He was posting cosmetics
which had nothing to do with bragging about amiibo
Did you shill for oxygen when the doctor slapped your ass after exiting the womb?
Theres nothing wrong with DLC.
Everyone had an understandable problem with it when it was arm and a leg cost for next to nothing. Selling weapons and progress in single player modes of yearly installments of games. Paying for shit thats literally already on the disc you just bought.
Bad practice in DLC has left DLC as a concept tarnished and mistrusted. If DLC allows shit like the Mario Kart 8 cups to happen, I'm okay with it.
The only way bad practices will stop is if you stop buying it.
The smash DLC I am fine with, they're characters that came much later.
If they never release a Smash Bros definitive pack that has all the characters already on it in a year or so though then poo to them.
Holy shit, OP just close this tab and never look back. Stop. You're embarrassing autists everywhere.
Cosmetics are all tied to amiibos regardless. They teach you to not play the game, but instead dress up your character. None of them should've been in the game, and the reason is that cosmetics are cancer. What I wouldn't do to rewind time with TF2 before the kids decided to dedicate millions of servers to idle and minecraft trade plazas.
You lack reading comprehension so i'll put it to you simple.
>He posted cosmetics
Yes
>Was it paid cosmetics
No
>But its still cosmetics
Cosmetics that everyone else can get in game
>He wasn't talking about gameplay.
God forbid I want to talk about something else, like meta, lore or a character
You complained about PAID cosmetics. You're stawmaning so hard.
>le all dlc is bad meme
reminds me of when expansion packs were becoming popular and all the kiddies got mad because their parents just bought them a new game
>God forbid I want to talk about something else, like meta, lore or a character
You're playing a GAME. thus you talk about the gameplay. That's not a hard concept.
Some genres must drive your autism up the wall
>but instead dress up your character
to play as them
this thread is disappointing
you're supposed to be pushing against other posters, not moving further back
I talk about video games, so I don't get driven up walls that much.
I don't know why you posted a cinematic experience though. Shouldn't that be on Sup Forums?
>or Fromsoft was making DLC content while working on the base game
They were literally doing this four years ago.
You might want to try edging so you don't finish so quickly.