Fuck Sonic

I gave replaying the classics a chance; I somehow convinced myself that they were great when I was a kid, but nah...these game are absolut shit.
I don't know how to describe it, but it's more dissociative than any other platforming series I've played...does anyone know this feel?

Other urls found in this thread:

youtube.com/watch?v=OkmMCjYKvaQ
twitter.com/SFWRedditVideos

should I go on a Sonic or Star Wars binge?

>its bad but I can't explain why

nice bait, mate

>more dissociative
What?

I just got done replaying Sonic 2 and it's even better than I remember so no, I don't know what the fuck you're talking about.

>does anyone know this feel?
IGN does.

I know that feel all too well. Everyone associates Sonic with speed, but unless you have encyclopedic knowledge of the game, it's a very methodical game where you just progress through the levels and take care to avoid obstacles. Mario games give you more to do/appreciate, while Sonic is just jumping and trying to build up and maintain speed

What does IGN say?

Sonic is a simple to parse, one-button game where you can use knowledge of Sonic's movement physics combined with the environment to approach a near infinite skill ceiling. it's a game that never gets old and you can discover new ways of going through levels and switching between paths every time you play, even if you're not focusing on getting the fastest time.

Sonic is a bizarre topic because most of the critiques people make about it are based on pre-conceived notions of the game, and would never be brought up as a negative aspect in another platformer.

>If I go as fast as possible I can't react to traps without memorizing them
>If I watch out for traps I am going slow
Both of these points are true for Mario and most other platformers ever made as well, but no one would ever consider them a flaw in Mario's core game design. For some reason just because sonic was described as fast in commercials and in cartoons people have this idea that they aren't having fun if they can't go top speed, which would be a completely ludicrous assumption about any other game except maybe F-Zero

youtube.com/watch?v=OkmMCjYKvaQ

What part of Sonic is trial and error? I can only think of the special stages in the first game and bottomless pit areas in the Dimps games.

What a load of horseshit. Not even a single statement you made there is legit.

I'm not even going to waste the effort to refute that garbage video. Guys who are shit at vidya spending 20 minutes going back to a retro game that doesn't hold your hand like 90% of the shit they play + pre convinced ideas about Sonic from 10 year old deviantart submissions = shit opinions

Yeah guys... I wasn't alive when Sonic came out but I am so much smarter than anyone that I know the game was never actually good at all... it just sold well because everyone was under mass hypnosis from the gaming media. Wake up sheeple. You're so lucky you have a logical millennial unclouded by judgement to reveal the truth of this game franchise to you.

I agree

I like the music in the games and that is about it.

This holds true for me too. I've tried playing some of the more acclaimed Sonic games but found them to be pretty lame. They rarely played up to the iconic speed surrounding the character and the so called "physics" shit is never used. It all boils down to

>do you have enough speed to go up this ramp?
>if yes, go through
>if no, walk back, charge a spin dash, and proceed on to more poorly designed levels with enemies and hazards you'd never see if you actually did try to go fast

That, and rolling down a hill to gain speed, is about the limits of the games so called intensive "momentum engine". The 2D games are especially notorious for this bullshit shilling. I've also played Sonic Adventure, Sonic Adventure 2, Sonic Heroes, and Shadow the Hedgehog. All of them but Sonic Adventure (the first one), I found to be infinitely better games than the old 2D ones. Still flawed in their own way, but much more playable and not as misleading. I liked playing as the red guy and finding the green crystals and other shit. The characters all look cool, the graphics are always pleasing, and the music is some of the best in the industry. But that's about my relationship with Sonic. I also have the Sonic Unleashed and Sonic Generations demos on my Xbox 360. The ones where you boost, I play those sometimes. Sonic Unleashed is jaw dropping gorgeous and Sonic Generations remade Green Hill into HD and 3D, pretty cool.

Fucking capped.

>They rarely played up to the iconic speed surrounding the character
Oh boy here we go, yet another fag that thinks Sonic is about going fast and not platforming.

You should try reading some more. The "platforming" in those games is mediocre as fuck and the highly praised use of physics is largely absent outside of speed checkpoints like ramps or loops where it measures if you have enough to continue into mediocre levels.

>you can use knowledge of Sonic's movement physics combined with the environment to approach a near infinite skill ceiling

This is so fucking spot on. In a 2D Mario game, character momentum and the relationship between the physics and the surface planes is ridiculously simplistic, which makes for good pick-up-and-play appeal, but also makes them very easy for the most part. Super Mario World is an almost insultingly easy game with the shallowest of difficulty curves.

In contrast, the relationship between Sonic's momentum, the different surface planes of each level (curves, hills, loops), and the methods with which the player can gain and sustain speed are much more complex. It takes longer to fully grasp, but it affords the player much more control and allows the player to navigate stages far faster than they ever could in a Mario game.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Mario is Platforming 101 and Sonic Platforming 201.

I would say classic Sonic games do not translate to modern playstyles because gaming culture was different in the 90s.

In the 90s you got maybe 1 or 2 games for summer, and you had to play the fuck out of them because that's all you had.

Which is the polar opposite of the steam/lets play era. Where you have so many games you'll never even play them all, let alone finish and get skilled that them.

Mario is faster than Sonic. Sonic feels super sluggish. He's supposed to be amazingly fast, yet it feels like he's constantly caught in molasses. Sonic also has a very 'floaty' jump. Sonic has never felt solid to me.

Adding to this, having to memorize levels wasn't as big a deal because that was your one game and all you played so you gradually memorized them over time.

These days it doesn't fly so much as people are looking for a complete experience and not a quarter stealing arcade lite experience. And they're not wrong for wanting that. It's just that games were designed differently back then. Early days of the NES, Genesis and the like still designed games as if they were for arcades meant to Jew you out and be all about replay ability.

Why is Amy so fucking big? She's literally half Sonic's age, she should be much smaller than him.

That's just a case of the "gitguds", not that Sonic is slow.

True. At the time my parents were the ones buying games. You played the one game you had until A: friend lets you borrow a game, or B: Parents buy you a new game. Sonic one came with our Genesis. So we played the hell out of it.

Spot on counterargument, I applaud your excellent deconstruction of the points he made on what Sonic's about and responses to criticism!

I've cleared all the games as they came out. All the emeralds. Sonic is just fucking slow as hell. I never felt like any of the original games were 'fast', and that was what he was advertised as. All of the contemporary Mario games had a faster feeling and more solid platforming. I never really played the 3D games. When they came out I was on to bigger and better things. Sonic had really great music, but so did Mario.

cartoon

Try Sonic Advance 2 or Sonic Unleashed if you want speed. If speed is what you value most in a Sonic game, those are definitely must plays.

Clearing a game doesn't mean you got good, you can beat Sonic games going slow.

And it seems that you only just "felt" that Mario was faster because you played it faster.

Only significant games i havent played now are heroes, unleased, and lost world

How are they?

I agree but I wouldn't call them shit just decent games. I enjoyed games like SBM3, DKC and Yoshi's Island alot more.

Unpopular opinion: Heroes is flawed but still very fucking fun

Unleashed is one of the best games in the series

Lost World is competently made, but awkwardly designed and is the worst of these 3. Definitely play Heroes and Unleashed (360) though

>Heroes
It's okay

>Unleashed
Divisive, try it to see how you feel

>Lost World
Divisive with more leaning to not liking it. It has a weird control system.

>I don't know how to describe it
That's because you don't know what it is that you're complaining about. And that's because you weren't paying attention while trying to play video games.

>I'm shitty at video games please validate my whining!

>I can play this game too
Classic 2D Mario games just seem way too easy and simple to me. Levels are very simple and boil down to just a handful of different rectangular platforms and boring slow enemies with "walk straight" AI arranged in slightly different ways. And you can beat them all super fast with the obvious secret warps that every baby n00b ever found on their first try. I don't get the hype. It isn't nearly as complex as Crash Bandicoot.

>I wasn't alive when Sonic came out
We know, kid

Heroes is sloppy, but has some depth. Gets really monotonous and tedious.

Unleashed is half of very polished game. The other half is boring and monotonous, and you're required to slog through it every step of the way if you want to continue playing the good half.

Haven't touched Lost World, as it looks even worse.

I swear every sonic game is divisive. Most divisive series

>come into thread looking for legit 2D Sonic criticism
>see only the most shallow points made followed by post after post of how the 3D games are good
>people unironically saying Sonic Heroes isn't utter shit
Millennials truly are the worst.

Mario is empirically faster. Does that mean that Mario is better than Sonic? No. Is Mario's speed his main characteristic? No. Is speed Sonic's main characteristic? Yes. He's the fastest thing alive. He isn't even the fastest thing in his own fucking game. Robotnik/Eggman is faster than him. What is the qualification for being 'good' at Sonic? I've played the first two game too many times to count? Is it completion speed? What rubric are we using to measure one's 'goodn-ess' at Sonic games?
Cool. This is mostly a subjective this after all.

Ah that's right. People aren't nearing 40 like you are and actually grew up with a different generation of Sonic. Truly everyone that isn't pushing 40 like you is just an underage kid.

Stupid excuse, cartoons portray young children as being smaller than people in their late teens.

>I played the first sonic game and it sucks. I secretly stopped playing before 2 and 3 to make this post
Yea we know sonic 1 sucks. What a great retrospective you conducted.

Yup.

If you want a game where Sonic's faster, play Advance 2 or 3 and enjoy running into shit all the time.

There's a reason Sonic isn't super fast in the Genesis games, because it'd make them harder to control.

Remember, Mario has a run button. Sonic does not since his gameplay is momentum based.

I know, I love it. While Mario is either love, like, or don't care.

How OP remembers sonic

It also takes less to maintain top speed with Mario. I'm not saying this to downplay it, but it's just a fact of how they design his levels. Aside from castles and autoscrollers, most Mario games are very vertically open and forgiving in terms of giving you room to move, run, and jump. You hold run, you react to your environment and whatever fun and clever sequences or level gimmicks/enemy combos a new world or level throws at you.

With Sonic, the only game of the classics that I could see as sluggish is Sonic 1 because it has a stricter speed cap. With Sonic CD/2 onward, the SpinDash/Peel-Out is integral to keeping and choosing when's the right places charge up, run, or roll. Mario only has one method of gaining speed, while Sonic usually has two or three. Also, he breaks his speed cap differently depending on what your doing. Launching yourself off a cliff with a Spin Dash + jump at the right place and time will give you a heck of a lot more speed than just running straight and jumping, and this varies depending on levels and their respective layouts.

I can understand why Sonic might feel sluggish if you play him by running normally and reacting to enemies or platforms with jumps. Sonic's a game that gets more fun the more you replay it, while you can have fun with Mario and not feel like your missing anything just picking it up and playing even for your first time. Whether that makes Sonic deeper (and better) or Mario more accessible (and also better) is totally subjective at that point.

ahahaha is that a romhack? I want it.

This is obviously b8, but I'll respond anyways.

I'm not much of a Sonic fan. I played the originals on the Genesis and they were good. Good memories playing 2 with my younger sisters. Revisited them later on Sonic Mega Collection for GC. Some of the gameboy games are good. CD is my personal favorite. The one place I'd say the originals failed is the lack of fast paced gameplay emphasizing Sonic's speed, which is why as 2D platformers they're not the best.

Obviously the 3D installments are terrible, mostly. Some good ones. But the originals are definately good games, definately fun to play.

I feel like modern Sonic's problems come from trying to incorporate Sonic into a realistic setting as well as the lack of focus on speed and dexterity centered gameplay. With a more toonish style and gameplay focused on bypassing obstacles while going as fast as possible, the series could be good again. That's why Colors and Generations are well received. They emphasize what Sonic is good at.

And unleashed, where that gameplay was birthed and also plays much better, once again gets no credit. But the shitfest that is colors does. what a joke

Yeah and just like any game that births something, its successors usually improve upon it. Sonic Unleashed is basically Sonic 1 and Colors/Generations are Sonic 2 and Sonic 3.

I don't think the comparison really works, Colors has a lot more slow platforming than the Unleashed day stages.

Colors is an entirely different game from unleashed. What you said on what would make sonic good, "bypassing ostacles while going as fast as possible" was done most extensively in Unleashed. Colors has next to none of this and its severely limited in Generations when directly compared to Unleashed, which is nothing but high speed obstacle courses. But then people, being shit that they are, said that they are broken or some shit. And so Sonics speed was gutted, as was the 3D, as was the spectacle. And then you get Colors which may as well be a mario game.

Unleashed was ok. The art was nice, the world worked, and the gameplay was decently solid.

What killed it for me was the premise. The Sonic franchise seems to try too hard with unique premises. I'll admit I was somewhat fond of it because I'm a fan of softcore horror themes, but it felt too cheesy. Also, Sonic doesn't need more new characters.

My ideal Sonic game would be a return to the original comics premise. Sonic is fighting to reclaim his home planet and stop Robotnik from destroying the enviroment. Plenty of characters there, and a good theme.

I didn't mean to undercut Unleashed, it just wasn't all around good.

I'm pretty sure Unleashed introduced only one character.

Yeah, the weird fairy thing. Was his name Chip? Seemed very out of place.

Two if you wanna count wherehog sonic. Other games have done worse, so not too bad considering.

Well chip actually had a purpose in the story and a part of the game (as well as one of the themes) was travelling around the world seeing if restoring temples would help get his memory back. He finally remembered his role at the end and then sacrificed himself gloriously, as sonic had several near death moments at the end. I dont know what your priorities are or how easy you get triggered by the mere thought of someone that isn't sonic or tails, but as far as new characters go, chip was pretty useful

He was Omochao the whole game, then he was the Deus ex Machina at the end. Great character, wow. Even genie was better.

I'm not super touchy about new characters, I just think it goes overboard when there are so many old characters you could revive or current ones to use.

Chip was relevant to the story, but as a Sonic character he felt odd and the story itself wasn't that special. You could argue Silver was relevant and important in '06, but most people despise Silver.

I just think the Sonic series should focus more on what it has rather than adding things to make up for its faults. Emphasize its strengths rather than cover up shortcomings. Chip was also sort of an annoying Navi type character. Not a huge fan.

It doesn't help anything that its cool to hate on Sonic these days.

I also kind of enjoyed the free roam aspect of Boom, although it was altogether a shit show. I think a Sonic game that focuses on traversing open but complex landscapes could be interesting. Its been in the back of my head since those cool Sonic CD videos.

Sonic is the anti-platformer.

Slow, clumsy, slidey character, levels designed to be explored but such a cluster fuck you just want to run through it without taking advantage of any possible creative level design. The levels are also designed to slow your momentum as punishment for not memorizing the levels that arent well thought out and have fluidity like a mario level. Mario will typically punish you for fucking up a jump you are able to see well in advance, sonic is in a horrible screen position and is a bigger sprite and there is honestly way too much shit happening on the screen sometimes for this kind of gameplay. The biggest problem with sonic? His walk speed/slower speeds are fucking painful. Mario's walk doesn't feel like I'm dragging an elephant behind me, he has a good speed both fast and slow and sonic is shit all around. This makes it terrible to consider the obstacles in my way because the game becomes unfun when i cant go anywhere without taking ages and double/triple checking whatever spike or, god forbid, spring could be waiting to send me back several paces and it taking ages to fucking do so. Mario can snap from slow to fast quickly, sonic needs a mile long strech without anythign fucking you up. His jump is also shit, wtf is that shitty slow arch?

Mario has a perfect reward/punishment system. Sonic's is ass out the trash shitty.

>Let's make a character that goes fast
>But we must design the levels in a way that this character can't go fast
Shit design 101

>For some reason just because sonic was described as fast in commercials and in cartoons
Bullshit, even in the game the whole idea was making Sonic going fast, why in the fuck you think it doesn't have a run button? It was made just to make Sonic go fast with that momentum bullshit, which also made the whole game play awkward as hell.

You dont understand. People that arent sonic fans actually get triggered at the mere thought of characters that arent sonic and tails. They think anyone that shows maturity beyond toddler shows like barney or telletubbies is to dark and edgy and bad for the series.

Shadow and knuckles were planned to be in unleashed originally but the years of barrage against other characters got them scrapped. This probably simplified the story greatly in the process and allowed them to focus on a true adventure and bonding experience between sonic and chip. The story in unleashed is exactly where the tone of the series should be, at least for the modern half of things. There is an urgent threat that is destroying the world but its not overbearing yet is still clearly a threat, and there is silly moments sprinkled throughout to balance it. While classic sonic had it right with stopping eggman to protect the animals and environment thing. I wont say that characters like chip, but for the purpose of the game and its story progression, he wasnt shoehorned in or felt out of place. They were good friends, sonic helped him remember who he was, he returned to his role, and he scarified himself while a song in the credits made you feel for him, as sonic runs off carrying a memoir of him, signifying he'll never forget the adventure they shared.

If youre expecting stories like adventure 1 and 2 again, where a bunch of characters are all thrown into something bigger than themselves, then you are going to be waiting years for that. Tails will be the only character to have dialogue, while everyone else will be flanderized as sonics cheerleaders in the background who root for him during the ending battle. You claim to not be a big sonic fan and so you must not know much of what the fans want, but in the last few years, there has been a call of return for stories like Unleasheds. Wheres theres some stakes, some drama to keep things going. Instead of the shitty toddler stories now

I think that's a "Chill out and relax" romhack for sonic. I vaguely remember some really chill guy playing it on youtube, and that shit almost put me to sleep- in a good way.

>Remember, Mario has a run button. Sonic does not since his gameplay is momentum based.
Thats the biggest issue with it. The levels arent designed with this in mind.

You're right, the entire game is. That's why it's not full throttle at all times, it's gradual. You can go slow AND fast.

The build up from slow to fast is also terribley done. Takes too long to build speed and it feels clunky. Mario levels, especially Mario 2(not usa) have very creative, or downright unfair designs but the gameplay to complete the trails is fast, fun, exciting and smooth. Sonic doesn't accomplish good level design nor does it accomplish good character physics.

That is the problem with sonic, its terrible as a platformer no matter what their goal gameplay wise was because they didn't spend anytime actually thinking about the physics in the engine.

Sure sonic can go fast but it's pointless if you rush into enemies, spikes and other shit. So you have to memorize the stage from countless failures before you can smoothly rush through the entire stage without fucking up.

That's the problem with old school Sonic games. It's all about memorizing the stages and exactly when to jump.

You can't just pick up sonic games and expect to do well because you're going too fast without knowing what's ahead of you. That is why mario games were better.

underrated mocking comment

Sonic, Dr. Eggman, Tails, and Knuckles are characters that are capable of being serious and mature, but it's a cartoony world so the tone shouldn't take them too seriously, unless it's a rare situation in which the stakes are dire. Guys like Shadow and Blaze are just silly, they need to stay in the dark ages.

Unleashed's worldbuilding storytelling was a lot better than Colors' or Lost Worlds, but Sonic 3 & Knuckles is still da best in that regard, it gains more points for it being non-verbal as well. Chip is okay, but pretty annoying in-game. You need just over an hour's worth of long, frequent cutscenes and rows of dialogue to like him. In a platformer.

I'm agreed with you on the oversimplification of the story and the rejection of certain characters as "edgy". I like Knuckles personally cuz he's tough but moralistic, unlike other characters who are just good guys. As for Shadow, he is kind of edgy, and fairly unnecessary what with metal Sonic being a thing thing before. Still, I like him well enough. I was actually really excited for his game when it released and then immediately disappointed.

I'm not against new characters or characters like Chip who are unique to a specific story. Its part of crafting an overarching narrative, you get some one off's. I just wasn't a huge fan of Chip specifically. Not gonna hate if you personally like the character, I just don't. Like I said, there's a wealth of characters already in the Sonic universe. But I guess if you have to make a new one, ok. Just seems too much. I also hate the games where characters are just thrown in smoothie style. Does absolutely nothing for me. There are core characters like Sonic and Tails, but beyond that, there needs to be more caution when selecting which and how many characters to include.

I said I wasn't much of a fan because I wanted to distance myself from the more diehard types. I do love Sonic and his games, and have followed them since the beginning. Played most of the new ones as well. I just wanna see Sonic get a game he deserves. And I do want a return to better story telling. I just don't want it to move too far away from Sonic's style, and I don't think it needs to be terribly complex or invigorating.

I just want the series as a whole to be more true to itself. Stronger.

This era of Sonic was best.

Top tier Sonic.

>I also hate the games where characters are just thrown in smoothie style. Does absolutely nothing for me. There are core characters like Sonic and Tails, but beyond that, there needs to be more caution when selecting which and how many characters to include.
I agree with that. That's why I'm hoping Sonic Mania has the same level of storytelling as Sonic CD or Sonic 3&Knuckles, and I want justification for Knuckles having a playable role. No matter how minor or glanced over the reason is, I at least want it to be addressed.

Agreed. Its always those little details that help. Big hopes for Mania and 2017.

Also, CD is best Sonic game. If this image doesn't give you a boner, you're probably not human.

My favorite too.
This is the version I have.

high quality bait

CD a best.

>Sonic is too hard!!

Do you fags don't play anything made before 1997?

Sonic games are kind of comfy actually, unleashed took me a while to master but after that i get a game i can replay anytime and have a good time.

Oh wait i forgot that Sup Forums doesn't play videogames, normies don't even play videogames either they just watch them, that's why they can't understand how could somebody have fun with a game even if it isn't perfect (Sonic 3&K Complete is perfection though).

I bet you guys think mobile shit is good.

To be honest, I want Mania to be a hit while the other game bombs so Sega can just turn him on a downloadable 2D game franchise so Sega stops blowing so much money on shit 3D game after shit 3D game

Sonic Team was never Sega's crown jewel.

AM2 was.

>replaying Sonic 3 standalone for the first time in ages
>it's kinda buggy

Every so often I'll get stuck inside a wall or something and have to wait for a time out. Super Sonic also seems to be borked in the sense that rolling down a hill slows me down. Pretty sure Sonic 3 & Knuckles fixes a lot of this.

Also, Launch Base is *really* unfun in the original Sonic 3. Lots of weird enemy and spike placement. You can really tell that the devs did not want this to be the last stage and just quickly slapped on a bunch of hazards.

Big Arm is also boring as fuck and makes you wait and wait and wait

These sweeping generalizations are both unconvincing and super wrong. I don't think you know much about these games at all, so stop pretending.

I'd like the same to happen, but I'm really worried about Sonic Mania. Despite the all-star dev team, somebody higher up at SEGA (probably Iizuka) has a monkey paw or something, and manages to grant fan-wishes whilst also destroying them. Remember Shadow The Hedgehog? The fans actually asked for that game, but it turned out to be one of the shittest things ever. What about Sonic Chronicles? BioWare might be SJW filth now but back then they were one of the mostly widely revered RPG devs in the industry, and they still made a shit game. After Sonic 2006, people asked for a game that was "just Sonic". They delivered, and made the speed gameplay amazing, but then threw in the Werehog. Hey, it's still "just Sonic" right? And are we forgetting that Sonic Boom was technically made by former Sonic X-Treme devs combined with old-school Naughty Dog veterans? That game shouldn't have been so shit, CryEngine or not.

Basically, I'm loving the look of Mania, and I /KNOW/ the team are immensely talented, probably the most talented 2D Sonic devs out there... I'm just waiting for the "but" in this situation. It's not too late for Iizuka or SEGA's dumb company politics to come and fuck this one up. I'm scared, bros.

Reminder that even at its absolute best, Sonic was never anything more than a poor man's Mario.

I'M BARELY BREATHIN'

But at it's best, Sonic played absolutely nothing like Mario.

I guess it was for poor men though, it was always black kids, poor kids and Europeans who seemed to have Genesis instead of SNES.

the only reason those things happened is because sega doesn't want to release 2 hour games for $60. no one will bite. on the Nights HD 2012 port, people were complaining about the amount of content it had. and it was fucking $10. sonic is going to be cursed forever unless its shitty basic 2D games till he dies.

What?

>But at it's best, Sonic played absolutely nothing like Mario.
You're right, it played like a poor imitation that has no fucking clue what a good platformer is.

>a poor imitation
I don't think you know what imitation means, fair play to you if you don't like Sonic games but it was certainly no copy of anything on the market, even if it was shit. But I'm sure you actually know that and are going to keep making unfitting comparisons of Sonic to other platformers for a few more posts just so you can squeeze one or two more (You)'s out of me. Good job champ

>Mania comes out
>it's excellent
>gets mediocre reviews because of retards like the OP and

I can see this shit happening, too. Dibs on IGN claiming none of the levels are new or some shit like that.

Well mario had only 2 mainline games on the entire SNES and sonic had 4 so i guess idorts won in the end.

I think it had to do with nintendo wanting to go 3D as soon as possible so they didn't cared much about producing tons of games for the SNES.

Unlike sega which was in love with the genesis success even after saturn came out and didn't really wanted to move on.

Sonic was never good, never ever, only autistic child with big mental issue loved that game

Prove me wrong fucking autistic faggot

I hope Sonic Mania is the most perfect loving rendition of the old Sonic games with brand new levels so that we can all shit on it all over again. It will be yet another blow on the "Sonic is good" meme

>Prove me wrong
Uh I'm pretty sure that for this argument to work, you'd need to provide your reasoning for thinking Sonic was never good. You can't just say it and expect people to think you're not baiting if you don't explain yourself.

>Sonic adventure 2 was never good, never ever, only autistic child with big mental issue loved that game

Fixed