When will these useless fucks be removed from the game?

When will these useless fucks be removed from the game?

>No Defense Heroes!
Every
Single
Time

It makes me feel like I should switch but fuck that

They suck, though.

>tfw best girl is the most useless

>Basion and torb are area denial
>squishy flankers have abilities to easily counter area denial
Why?

junkrat is pretty usefull sometimes

>Bastion
>useless

>being a sub 50 shitter
>ever

>sometimes

Exactly. People don't use Junkrat "sometimes," though. They use him every fucking match, whether on attack, defense, or KOTH. Enemy has a Pharah, teammate stays Junkrat.

Yes, Bastion absolutely is useless if the enemy team has any type of coordination, which why the higher the rank, the lesser he shows up. But then again, that's true for all defense heroes.

The only thing he can do is break Reinhardt's shield.
Too bad the enemy team can mow you down while you waste your time breaking it.

Why do people expect DPS from the Defense classes? The point is that theyy sacrifice a little damage for a little more utility, something that will help them maintain a defensive hold.

Hanzo and Widowmaker provide reconnaissance on the enemy positions.

Torbjorn does too to some extent with his turret's laser sight, but mostly his utility comes from having an extra "teammate" in the form of his turret, and his armor of course.

Junkrat provides utility via his traps and his ability to hold a choke point by himself.

Mei provides utility by blocking chokes with her wall, or delaying a point capture via her Ice Block.

Bastion is literally the only Defense hero that doesn't sacrifice damage for utility. His gimmick is that he IS the damage. Usually the enemy team is forced to deal with him before attempting to make a move on the point/payload.

try sub 30
every single teamcomp has somebody who shits on bastion, including the two good supports

Okay if you want defense heros to be more utility based they STILL need to be better

Basically every defense hero is almost unplayable at any reasonable level

thats the problem. People know where the enemies are coming from. So why not just have them die quicker rather than having information you already had

I like how the D.Va buffs actively help make 4 out of the 6 defense heros unviable

You can tell Blizzard really thinks things out well!

>use Bastion on attack Hanamura
>people mock me for using Bastion
>use him, get 3 golds and win out hard as fuck thanks to the help of an Ana

I think he's solid but every time he shoots it's like a big sign that says "KILL THIS FUCK" so basically any decently organized team can drop him quickly.

Still, he can get some crazy mileage if you actually move around a lot as him and don't stick around as a turret. His mobile rifle does solid damage and can kill 200 health heroes in a single mag and transforming causes his gun to come up with a full mag. I think people just want to stay still and rake in the damage when you should be moving to cover the second someone shoots you.

Nah mercy is fine.

>The point is that theyy sacrifice a little damage for a little more utility

Except they have no utility. There is literally no reason, outside of the element of surprise, to pick a defense hero instead of the standard 2 attack, support, and tanks. Junkrat is good on defense in a few maps, and that's basically it. Widow can be good if one has godlike aim--but if they have godlike aim, they should just go McCree.

Defense heroes are shit and the game would lose nothing at all if every single one of them were removed. Just take out the temptation for idiots to pick these awful characters solely because they are easy to use.

Bastion is fun but he can get countered and countered hard. Genji can fuck with him all day, roadhog getting semi close to him can end his life easily, Pharah can harass him endlessly, Zarya can get loads of charge off of him. Shit's just rough for him.

They do have utility, though. I listed their utility in my post. You, personally, just value damage way more than utility.

I like torb more than symmetra honestly

>gives 50 more hp
>turret does good damage and lasts for a bit
>one of the best q's in the game
>Frequent potg's

Being able to see the enemy is not utility. Don't be retarded.

>play FPS
>picking a character that does no damage and just sort of tells you where people are

No. You are bad at video games.

All the defense heroes are objectively bad and the ability to make a wall and do a shitty Mccree impersonation with your ice blaster does not make a character good or even playable.

These characters need buffs

>gaurentees headshots at any corner or chokepoint
>not utility

vision is always utility
never play mobas with that opinion

But she's not though.

Wall hacks for your team doesn't count as utility? What?

>complains that utility isn't as useful as outright damage

Thanks for proving my point.

Ive been tracking my ps4 games and its been ~50 games in a row with a junkrat on both teams. I dont get it.

Are you deaf? Not only can you hear Overwatch heroes coming from a mile off, you can pick which ones they are by their footsteps. Sacrificing 1 member out of six to get 'vision' is never worth it when including all the roles required to win a competitive match is already tight in a 6-man team.

Yes. To make utility outweigh damage you have to have quite a bit of utility

All the characters you listed have very minimal utility

Widowmaker's utility is fine and dandy but when any half decent D.Va can fly at you and cuck your shit up without even trying then the character fucking sucks

At least Junkrat is better than Pharah now.

Good Widow/Hanzo's can still fuck up your day too but there like the top 1% of people who play those characters. Torb/Mei/Bastion do suck a lot and need buffs.

>Junkrat
>Mei
>Useless

I still think Junkrat needs something more. Sure he can hold chokes pretty well but his weapon isn't very good outside tight quarters and his ult is pretty useless against a coordinated team.

Hanzo is a midrange sniper who does a worse job at long range than Widow and worse than midrange than McCree so he's in a bad spot. Both snipers however get blown the fuck out by current D.Va

Can we just agree that this is a shitty, toxic game along with LoL and Dota2?

When you play a game and all you do is shit talk your teammate, it's not a fun team based game.

I went and hopped on blops 3 (i'm just searching for a fun decent shooter that's not CS:GO) and right after the match, everyone typing gg's in the chat. In Overwatch, after the match everyone is just bitching.

That's just a little example of how shitty these games are.

>thinking either of those characters are good

How's rank 30 going my man?

It's almost sad to see how useless Hanzo and Junkrat ults are once you get above 55-60 or so.

mei is pretty useless my nigga
junkrat can do more but hes pretty shit too

Yeah Junk feels a bit underpowered.

I don't know what you'd do though. Maybe give his tire more health or make it faster? His nades and mine are pretty much as balanced as they can be without being OP.

>Mei screams a full second before Ult actually comes out
>Zarya laughs as she shields herself and a teammate and just walks away

Bear in mind Zarya is essentially always picked at this point as there isn't a single downside to the character. She fulfils the support role better than Symmetra and provide serious damage along with having one of the best Ults in the game.

Hanzo's ult is at least decent when comboed with Zarya but it can just get eaten by D.Va matrix so I dunno

Junkrats ult you can hear coming a mile away and dies to slight breeze

>Mercy
>fine
>in the current Lucio+Zenyatta meta

That's the problem with people taking a number so seriously. Like, I really don't understand it. I come mainly from fighting games where your online 'cred' doesn't mean shit and people will just laugh at you if you try and show it off. I personally apply the same mindset to Overwatch.

>b-b-but muh 60+ rank

Doesn't mean anything. Show up to an actual organised tournament and bring home some results that actually matter.

>removing characters who are important to the Overwatch lore

>I come mainly from fighting games where your online 'cred' doesn't mean shit and people will just laugh at you if you try and show it off.
I mean that holds the same for most online comp games. Pubstars are a thing.

I'd say the best way to fix Junkrat is to buff his ult slightly with like you said a bit more health or faster

I think his primary weapon needs a slight tweak too. It's just inconsistent in most scenarios compared to hitscan weapons. Maybe a slight indicator to give you an idea where your shot is going to go or have an alternate fire that's somehow a more consistent and accurate weapon but less damage to compensate (I have no ideas for what the weapon/alt fire would be)

Fighting games are different. They have the legacy of being local competitive games wherein you actually had to go to the arcade to take people on in person.

Yeah except I havent seen a single Mercy in ages, they could remove Mercy from the game and nothing would change.

Quick how do we save Mercy? I suggest give her flight just like Pharah.

>have an alternate fire that's somehow a more consistent and accurate weapon
Maybe you hold RMB to charge for a couple seconds and then the ball flies out faster and with less drop-off.

This is probably the best idea

That way his accurate dps isn't crazy and it still more rewarding to spam fire in situations that call for it

If you are defending a point away from your spawn point I prefer Symmetra thanks of her teleporter.
But near the spawn point of course it is Torbjorn.
They are both good but have different uses.

>Quick how do we save Mercy?
>Mercy ulti is now global

>quick how to we save Mercy

Best way would be to nerf Lucio (he's been amazing since the game released) and rein back a bit on those Zen buffs.

>what if we took tf2's stick launcher charge and put it on tf2's pipe launcher?

Junkrat should be able to throw the trap farther like he does with his mine.
As it is now, the distance the trap travels is fixed and is very short.

tfw playing ana
tfw enemy bastion

Show your rank right now

More like buff back up Zen's counters.

Same situation as Genji.

How do we fix them then?

I think it'd just be easier to nerf Zenyatta slightly

Just take a little bit off his discord damage amp and maybe slow his movement down on his ult a tad and I think he'd be in a good place

>Rank 70
>people still switch to bastion when they start losing

Personally I think discord should build up the damage debuff the longer it is attached, with a cap at 50%. SO upon attach it's something like 15% and over time racks up.

Congrats, now Zen is useless again.

If you make Zen's counters not garbage then you're simultaneously making him a less strong pick and bringing the low tiers back up to speed.

Pretty good idea

I don't like how easy it is to discord a target, melt them, whip around and switch targets and have a McCree or something melt them too.

We remove them from the game. As somebody already said, they are annoying first and foremost, so buffing them will bring more annoyance into the game. They really shouldn't exist, since the other classes can defend better than they can, and they are useful on both attack and defense.

People pick Torb, Bastion, and Junkrat because they are easy to use, and one doesn't have to do much to get kills. People pick Mei for griefing, basically; as long as they block the enemy spawn and stall for five seconds, that makes the rest of the match, being a useless piece of shit, worth it. Hanzo was used for his luck arrows, and now that they are nerfed, there isn't a single good reason to use him. Finally, Widow is used for her "sick snipes," but McCree fills the sniper role better than she does, and he can actually play the objective.

I hate fighting junkrat and torb

It would help someone like Winston out a lot. Right now Zen can legitimately 1v1 and outright beat a Winston who jumps in on him, because the latter is dealing damage so slowly compared to Zen - particularly if you see the jump coming, discord and get a shot or two in before Winston lands

>nerfing a few percentile off his discord and movespeed buff make him from tier 0 must pick to useless

Don't exaggerate you dense fuck. The guy got a lot of meaningful buffs at once, he wouldn't get instantly binned because you slightly tweaked numbers on 2 things. Off yourself shitter

>Torb/Junkrat
>easy to use
They have higher skillcaps than most of the currently popular meta heroes. They're just underpowered.

My mains are Reaper and Soldier 76.
I use Zenyetta for support.

I don't usually use tanks but if i do its Zarya and Fat Pig.

Is that good for ranked?

Unless you are a literal god at landing hooks Rein is better for comp.

Nerfing the movespeed makes him unable to keep up to teammates while ulting and makes it fucking garbage again.

Taking away some of the damage amp will remove the only reason he's even picked in the first place since he already got his projectiles nerfed in damage and hitbox, you'll just go back to running Lucio/Mercy every game instead since at least she can actually heal decently.

Walking mode Bastion is pretty fun. He does slightly more damage than 76's gun. I just walk around popping headshots on scrublets with no aim. If they reduced his spread and allowed him to burstfire properly I think he could be legit useful. Walk around shooting an accurate as fuck gun and occasionally going in turret to catch people off guard around corners and shit.

He's not picked for his healing. He has literally no HP. You nerf discord you nerf the reason you use him. You nerf movement speed he might as well be dead as he spawns.

>the Overwatch lore

You realize I'm not saying take his 200% movespeed increase and make it like 25% right?

Im saying take his 50% damage buff orb and make it like 40% and make his speed like 175%

He would still be able to catch up to teams with that ult and discord would still be deadly.

Mei is definitely weak.
But Junkrat is not nearly as bad as people are making him sound.

>Make it 40%
Mercy's damage boost is 35%, why not just pick her?

He doesn't even go that fast when ulting, why on earth would you want to nerf that?

>Mercy's damage boost is 35%
Huh? Last i checked it was still 30%.

This isn't a MOBA though, this is an FPS with a couple borrowed elements. Honestly people like this are the ones I prefer playing with over anyone else, because situational awareness trumps everything.

Besides the people I've met playing the game, I have 2 main groups of friends I play with, some old CS1.6/S buddies, and a group of guys who got me into LoL for a little bit. Most games are stomps with the CS team, most games we get crushed with the MOBA team. It's not any type of surprise to me nor is there any question why. The game is casual as fuck, but playing positioning, cornering, etc. regardless of hero will always net you a better success rate.

That's because console aiming.

Maybe because him and Mercy are radically different? Are you dense? Marking a target for damage increase is a lot different then buffing one teammate. Also Zenyatta is like a hybrid and does a lot of damage too, and Mercy not so much. There ults are also completely different. Saying that by lowing discord damage amp slightly would just INSTANTLY make Zenyatta an objectively shitty version of Mercy makes me flag you as a complete retard.

>he doesn't go that fast when ulting

He goes reasonably fast. Also I bet if he went from 200% to 175% buff from his ult you would barely notice it. Besides that his ult movement speed isn't even that important overall, you aren't using it to sprint halfway across Gibraltar to heal your team for the last tick of it.

>blind aoe damage
>auto-locking turret that gets kills for you
>not easy to use

You are mistaking "high skill cap" for being worthless. Even if they did have a high skill cap, why play them at all when one can do just as much and more with any other class?

Junkrat is situational. Junkrat's ult is essentially useless against any decent team comp with people who pay attention, you can hear the thing coming a mile away and most characters can take it out the moment it pops into view. As a defensive character he's pretty solid on most maps, but there are plenty of times (Industry point 1) where there's just so much open movement available that his area denial doesn't mean shit when everyone just goes one of the other 4 ways to get to the point.

Pair this with the fact that people play with him on attack CONSTANTLY, especially when it's not just that he's weak but he's actively detrimental to the team (Watchpoint last point push, flinging grenades around the corner and keeping the enemy team from pushing too far forward like idiots, actually making it harder to push by pulling a decent couple picks.) and people rage hard over his presence because he's attractive to little kids and shitters because they get that gold splash damage achievement and think they actually contributed much because of it, instead of just charging the enemy healer ults.

Apparently Torb's left click which is one of the hardest to land in the game doesn't exist.

A Junkrat that can actually aim is also going to be a thousand times better than one that just mindlessly spams.

Not the guy you're replying to, but zen doesn't need any nerfs. Thank you.

I knew Sup Forums was casual, but this takes the cake. Junkrat and Torb are great characters, and Mei can hold a point for ages if you have even a slight amount of skill.

Sombra.

Yeah I'm sure Zenyatta is just ironically (must pick in every game every side) S tier :^)

Please kill yourself

Post rank

>junkrat
>useless
I'll fucking kill you

>Apparently Torb's left click which is one of the hardest to land in the game doesn't exist.

So it sucks, basically... It's a projectile, not hitscan, and projectiles were nerfed. So, there's basically no reason to use Torbjorn.

>They use him every fucking match, whether on attack, defense, or KOTH

Because Junkrat is the only defense hero that is good on anything.

I enjoy using him on the first point of Anubis and Volskaya on defense.

Other than that, I agree. It's a shame though cause he has the potential to be a powerhouse even on his own.

Why the fuck does this game have 20+ characters if Blizzard knew before hand that less than half of them would really do anything at any time?

Is having tons of characters really that much of a selling point?

>Mercy
>Fine

Lucio, Ana and Zenyatta are better

...

>Because Junkrat is the only defense hero that is good on anything.

Maybe at rank 40 or lower this statement is correct

...

But it's a heavy steel trap. It makes sense logically that he should be throwing it short. Plus, the trade off is you have to lay them in good spots to work as a trap. If you can just throw them any distance, it's not a trap anymore.

>all the people in the thread that said "p-p-p-p-p-p-please don't nerf Zenyatta. H-h-h-he's fine...."

How do you pick someone more than 100% of the time?

>widowmaker has a trap
>it's cool if she throws it across the entire map

It's a video game. Shut up.