Shadow Warrior 2013

Thoughts?

Also is anyone else excited for Shadow Warrior 2? Based on gameplay it already looks like a worthy successor.

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shameless bump, I never see anyone ever mention this game

I thought it was pretty mediocre as an FPS. The guns were kind of shit for the most part and I wish the RPG upgrade bullshit wasn't there.

Funnily enough, SW2013 made me play the original just to see if this series was ever any good and I enjoyed that one much better.

From the footage I've seen SW2 looks even worse in my eyes, with MMO-style fetch quests, procedurally generated parts of the level, Borderlands randomized loot and terrible dialogue.

Could just be me of course, I thought Wolf TNO was also pretty mediocre so what do I know.

It was fun for a playthrough, melee lacked variety but felt great and the guns were shit ecxept for the crossbow.
The sequel looks nice so far, I just hope the co-op shit doesn't interfere with the SP, I have nobody to play games with.

I think a lot of people agreed that SW13 was average but it had potential for a sequel

shame that they turned it into Borderlands

The sword is fun, but gets monotonous after a while.
Level design is boring. Just one arena fight after another.
Guns are awful.

Sequel looks like it might be more interesting, with better shooting and new movement abilities, but we'll see.

I'm still baffled as to why they called it Shadow Warrior when it barely has anything to do with the original.

I mean yeah you play an asian guy who has a katana and there are some similar weapons but that's about it. None of the enemies are like the original, most of the weapons are missing (why did they omit the railgun, that was the coolest weapon), and the gameplay was more Painkiller than Shadow Warrior.

Am I wrong? Was the original Shadow Warrior popular?

>Thoughts?
I found it really flawed. There are things about that are great (swordplay, powers, speed, visuals and art direction). But the level design was pretty awful, bullet spongy enemies obnoxious, and worst of all, the upgrade system was poorly designed and actually worked against the game. Most weapons felt like shit when you aquired them. They got really fun once you upgraded them, but there simply wasn't enough money to go around to upgrade them all, and it resulted in a situation where you were always anxious about investing money into weapon to make it not-absolute shit because for all you knew there could be a better weapon more worth investing into around the next corner.

Plus the looting really broke the flow of the game, and the scarsity of money and it's association with upgrades made you feel like you REALLY have autistically scan the environment not to miss out on anything, rather then flowing through it at your own pace.

As for SW2 - well, I don't know. The combat looks really amazing, but the even greater emphasis on loot and equipment worries me. I'm not a fan of the looter principle in games in the first place. In some ways, it makes sense to transform the game into a looter-shooter, and if they manage to not make you feel constantly underpowered, it could be a lot of fun, but I think it's an iffy proposition at best.

>I'm still baffled as to why they called it Shadow Warrior when it barely has anything to do with the original.

How?

It's easy to understand.

>New IP
>Name out of nowhere
>Nobody is sure of how it will be so they take more risk

vs

>New game
>Uses name that's already established
>Generate more buzz just on that alone

Old Shadow Warrior wasn't popular either, it was always a poor man's Duke still fun though and it was completely left in the dust along with Blood due to Quake and 3D becoming big.

developers really need to rebalance enemy HP pools, especially on higher difficulties because it's just not fun to fight bullet sponges
instead they are doing some borderlands-like shit in the sequel for whatever reason

Duke 3D seems to be the most popular Build engine game. SW seems like it might be the least. Blood in the middle. They're all great, though. Some of the best FPS level design around.

I was particularly disappointed with the shotgun, compared to the awesome riot gun in the original.

>They got really fun once you upgraded them
Not really, at least not the majority of them.
>fully upgrade the shotgun
>STILL can't kill a basic trash mob with one shot

Well if the old Shadow Warrior wasn't popular and the gameplay is pretty different, again, why call it Shadow Warrior?

Could have called it Blood Ninja or whatever and people would still play it.

It's like Bethesda rebooting Tzar an an action RPG.

Did they ever fix how easily that game can fish eye if you change the FoV?

Brand name always sells. It's very simple: established brand name is ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS more viable than a new IP. Even if the original game wasn't particularly succesful.
And while the new Shadow Warrior has little to do with the original, it has a LOT to do with the 2013 one. It's marketed towards the people who liked the 2013 one.

>there are people who defend this piece of shit

Honestly the original Riot Shotgun felt a bit underpowered as well, but at least it had an interesting design going for it.

The one in SW2013 is underpowered and hideous.

Fuck's sake even Duke Nukem Forever had a better shotgun

First was fun, if flawed. Looking forward to 2. Is there a rough release date yet?

September, I think

It doesn't matter if it's identical in the slightest.
It also doesn't matter if the game was hugely successful either.

The fact remains is that it's already building off something that was already established. This is what matters and this boosts its chance for success.

To see the power of names look at Kickstarter.

Well I guess

Still, it's fucking stupid.

The original Riot Shotgun was stupidly pathetic.
The 2013 one was also pathetic AND had to compete with the fucking sword because they didn't give that shit range.

I'm sure the new one will also have a lackluster shotgun.

Having a bad shotgun means having a bad FPS

People don't like completely new things, not much else to it besides that.

It is stupid but that's business and marketing.

Loved it. It has some of the most satisfying melee in any game ever. Some of the guns didn't feel very good though.
I'm looking forward to the sequel.

At least it looks somewhat decent this time around.

Fire sound still seems pretty weak.
youtube.com/watch?v=lu3A54rz5XQ

in that very trailer it barely flinched the HP bar of a larger enemy
i hate how those guys are "balancing" their games, those issues were in hard reset as well

it was as fun as a reskin of hard reset could have been. it has some shortcomings though like guns being relegated to just boss fights.

surprisingly decent story, im still surprised nobody made a bigger stink about the incest plot.

The design looks alright.

Hopefully it doesn't feel like shit and has good range because shotguns are basically easy mode when it comes to making a satisfying weapon.

Fucking up shotguns means the rest of the guns are going to feel like shit as well.

Upgrade system was dumb pointless and tedious
Level design was a bit boring
Levels/game too far too long to load
Gameplay could have been a bit better

Everything else was fine.

The second one doesn't appear to improve upon the 2013 game and just seems to do more bullshit instead

oh well

>BOOM GOES THE BOOM STICK

Out of all the stupid shit the new Lo Wang says, this one pisses me off the most

Since Flying Wild Hog are made of some of the Painkiller guys, I have to wonder if the weapon design/balance guy didn't get left behind.

Because it's hard to imagine the same guys who made Painkiller's shotgun to have also made Shadow Warrior's shotgun

I felt that the bulletspongy enemies, formulaic Painkiller style level design, superfluous upgrade system and overt focus on melee over gunplay were the main things holding it back from being great, but sadly it looks like they're doubling down on those specific things with the sequel

The Painkiller shotgun was shit
The only reason it "felt" okay was because enemies had basically fuck all HP

>the shotgun in Doom is shit because zombiemen and imps have fuck all HP

It's good but drags in the middle and gets a bit tedious
the sword is the highlight but the guns are still useful on hard
the level designs were really great especially early on but the arena formula doesn't stick with most people same with serious sam

It's more like you have other weapons to fall back on.

In Painkiller 80% of enemies go down in a few shots from the Minigun's bullets. Not even the rockets.
If you played Painkiller if anything besides single player you'd see the shotgun was horribly lacking.

Doom's shotgun is good in singleplayer and deathmatch.

They kept true to Painkiller's shotgun design. No range and low power. They forgot the Cryo shot and gave enemies HP so that's why it's bad.

Doom's shotgun works past 10 feet unlike Painkiller and Shadow Warrior

Doom shotgun works because most levels have the weak enemies be the majority.
And Dooms shotgun actually hits and kills from an entire screen away.

If you actually have to rip & tear, you need better weapons, but the fall back weapon is actually good.
And the pistol is completely worthless, which is its job.

I really hope they implement adjustable viewmodel FOV this time even if it's through config edits.
Having your arms and hands cover the entire screen while swinging is fucking retarded and now you can wield two swords.

I love the new Shadow Warrior eventhough it didn't look at all like the original.

I really also like the idea of a co-op Shadow Warrior, but I hope it won't be Borderlands 2.0

To add, I really want them to work on a new Hard Reset game. Although I seem to be like one of the few that loved it. I have like 5 friends who played Hard Reset and none of them liked it.

loved it, guns were fairly balanced in my opinion as long as you can aim.
I suggest you try a no sword run

Thats because the game is shit.

The hack'n'slash aspect of the sequel really bothers me. I hope the randomly generated levels won't get uninteresting and the RPG scaling won't shit out bullet-sponge ennemis.

Would make me upset if it ends up being Borderlands with katanas.

I had some fun with Hard Reset, but it had a lot of problems.

That being said, I would LOVE to see a sequel that improves on things. Hard Reset had a lot of cool ideas, like the gun that transforms into other guns, and the whole sci-fi setting, but I think it was lacking in enemy variety, memorable music, and freedom of movement. Also I guess Flying Wild Hog have a hard-on for bullet sponge enemies because Hard Reset also had them.

Nevertheless, I'd love to see another sci-fi FPS in the veins of Painkiller or Serious Sam.

Has there ever been an FPS/RPG that didn't have a bullet sponge problem?

Stalker

It did have a lot of problems, the enemies were always enormously agressive and you had very little room to move sometimes, making it quite a bit annoying. Also the difficulty levels were shitty balanced too. I have upgraded to the Redux version and will check it out after to see if they improved at all.

The redux version probably was a way to garner interest in the title. Though I doubt it worked since there are not many reviews on the Steam page.

I played through the Redix version when it came out and I remember being less annoyed than when I played the original game, so they did SOMETHING right.

It's pretty mediocre but it's a step up from their previous game Hard Reset which was fucking terrible but with pretty graphix

How the fuck is it so hard making a proper classic style FPS
Why is everyone missing the mark

Likely they want to make it modern too. Modern game design and gamedesign from way back just clash hard. They probably just want to find a middle ground, and that way there is nothing about it that stands out from other games. Just a pile of mediocrity.

Level design and pacing fucks over modern game designers.

They love long corridors and enemies being sturdy as fuck instead of being kind of fragile with dangerous attacks.

the guns are good as long as you upgrade them AND play on normal

the amount of damage enemies can soak up on higher difficulties just makes them a chore to fight

To be honest and I hate to be this guy since every dude who loves classic FPS' disagrees with me, but I don't really miss the labyrinth design in classic FPS' nor the key fetching. I don't necessarily want it to be completely a straight corridor but even though I love exploration in most games, in action focused FPS' it only feels like a chore to me, I'm only in it for the guns and going fadst. And it's still fucking bizarre to me why modern devs just flat out refuse to make a fast character and projectile based evading attacks. Just fucking do it you retards, what's so bad about it, even the new doom isn't that fast

I personally love the Shadow Warrior reboot but I'd be lying if I said it's designed well.

The upgrade system is fucking terrible. I hate having to access that three page menue, spending my karma points/money/chi crystals on upgrades. They should have hidden said upgrades in secrets locations instead of the blood pools etc. Sure, it'd mean that the player has no freedom in choosing the optimal upgrades for their build but it'd also encourage secret hunting.

Weapons, not including the katana are a bit too weak. They did this so players focus more on the sword combat. Even though I enjoy the sword combat, it's not diverse enough to be interesting for the whole 17 chapter campaign. As other have already mentioned, you know somethings wrong when the shotgun in its base form can't kill Crawlers in one hit reliably.

Hiding cash and ammo in furniture is fucking stupid, why do I need to hug every cupboard and press a button just to loot it? Just have that shit lying around in the level or make enemies drop them. It's just like in Wolfenstein: Press key to pick something up instead of walking over it.

Combat rating system doesn't work. I can finish a fight without ever taking a hit and as fast as possible = 3 stars. Have another one go terribly wrong and tank damage like a retard = 4,5 stars. Yo what the fuck.

Regenerating health. The good thing is that you can get through this game by just picking up health bags, but why have that bullshit to begin with? It's just lazy and makes the game way too easy. Earning less karma by using it is not enough to be a relevant consequence.

Still my GOTY 2013.

Yeah the rating system really annoyed me because it didn't make sense most of the time.

The original game was the best build engine game I've played. I didn't like the reboot because every article I've read about it said that it's oldschool gameplay which is a lie. It's basically Painkiller, where you're locked in an arena and have to fight waves of enemies, only more tedious because of how long the game is.

I found Shadow Warrior's melee to be pretty horrid. it had no weight to it whatsoever and attacks never lined up with their effects. The whole thing just felt so wrong.

I thought it was pretty fun. About on par with Doom 2016.

I uninstalled after the first level. The IQ is a valuable thing, you know?

All of his dialogue was pretty cringy tbqh.

You mean that stupid sprint effect? You can turn that off.

>bullet sponge enemies

Why do developers insist on putting those into the game? Who finds these fun?

>every article I've read about it said that it's oldschool gameplay which is a lie

Fucking THIS
Maybe "oldschool" now means "anything that isn't Call of Duty"
But still, almost NO ONE pointed out that this is almost nothing like the original

This is why the FPS genre is so bland these days. Developers just don't know how to make challenging high level enemies that aren't bullet sponges.

I liked it but the sword overshadowed the rest of the weapons too much and the upgrades and abilities were also mostly in the way. Can't say I liked the original SW as much as other FPS games of its' time but I would have liked it if the game was more like it, focusing on a simple but fun gunplay. Will probably buy SW2 on day one regardless, I'm pretty starved.

the original had even worse jokes and puns than SW13 did

did you even play it?

Original Lo Wang at least had a distinct voice and personality.

More like SPLITOH PERSONALITY

Eyyyyy

The argument about bullet sponge-like enemies isn't even an issue, especially if you played the game at a harder difficulty you'd kinda have to wonder what else could've been done differently.

With that being said the 2013 version was pretty decent and the only issues I had with it were some of the poorly designed mid game levels and monster spwans.

I think this is one of those games where you kinda have to wait and see what's up after release.