Holy shit MGS4 didn't aged well at all. It feels super outdated these days. It's so weird because I know games that are older than it and they still hold up. Even MGS3. I mean that game didn't feel outdated when it was 8 years old. So what happened? Why did MGS4 got old so quick?
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Outdated? How?
Still controls fine and movement is fluid
Sure but it still feels way older than it is somehow. I really don't know what's going on.
It's the artstyle and the fact that the visuals are just clear enough to see the low resolution textures and yet muddy enough to look dirty and brown and ugly.
You'll have to explain better than that. Only thing that's old is Solid Snake. Gameplay is pretty solid and graphics still hold up.
you got problems.
#4 is the most "modern" of the classic MGS titles; a steep contrast compared to the original trilogy alone.
IMO MGS4 > 5 in every way. Only PW was better.
I played it for the first time back in August and it's feels perfectly modern. It has easily the most fluid controls of any other MGS I've played, the graphics are still passable too.
What? I replayed it just last month. It still looks and plays like a dream
I guess I played it so much it start feeling like I broke it or something.
MGS4 was during a time when people wanted games to be more like movies.
MGS4 was also in development pre-Gears of War but released post-Gears of War, so the TPS is very tacked on and unbalanced.
Looks pretty good to me. Try being less of a cynical cry baby.
You made this thread just to make an accelerated aging joke
It aged like fine wine, just like MGS 1, 2, and 3. It looks great and has a good, rock-solid frame rate to boot. It's stunning that it came out so early in the PS3's lifetime.
MGSV will age like milk tho.
I like this game better than phantom pain because It at least felt finished and gave us a conclusion and didnt leave any giant things to question even if retarded. Also has real world guns unlike phantom pain. The only thing phantom pain has is graphics, movement/shooting(god I admit, they nailed it well), and prolougue.
I dont know about tacked on as the game doesnt allow you to shoot without aiming over the shoulder. As for unbalanced I agree, it is easy to go full rambo in this game...on normal. Hardest has you die in like 3-6 hits.
I loved it and I'm really excited to go back and play it again, since I feel like playing the whole series back to back
>rock-solid frame rate
God fucking no
With the night vision goggles you get 60fps in some places and as for framedrops I dont remember any that werent in cutscenes or due to alot of explosions except for maybe the motercycle section.
Are you telling me I'm wrong? I remember it being really consistent outside of some dips during the busier parts of the middle east.
I miss bro tier Snake...
>those character models
Almost makes up for the shit ass textures.
I think no game since has really been so much of a Movie: the Game like MGS4 was in the sheer number of cutscene hours you sat through. Modern games have kept taking controls away from the players, but MGS4 was really going for a "sit back and watch the movie" experience.
Oddly enough, I was fine with it. It worked, and most of the cutscenes were really well done.
Nothing willl top the microwave scene
Solid the true hero of the franchise
I love Raging Raven. I am sad I will never have her
Solid is the best, no argument. He's also the only one who actually followed the Boss' will, which is pretty crazy with how centric that is.
That design is FAR superior than the modern "cinematic experiunsh" shit we get today, as it 99% of the time means you merely got an illusion of control and gameplay. In reality though, you only got linear pipes, and fancy set-pieces where you momentarily rush against the clock and deal with button-prompts and QTEs.
When MGS gives you control, it's pure and legit, even videogame-y gameplay.
It's also weird to see people do that "lol movie!" meme on MGS4, when it has exactly the same cutscene:gameplay ratio as MGS2, with the HUGE benefit of having actual real-time FMVs, instead of mere talking heads in Codec.
Even when it came out the textures were mediocre.
It has decent models, but that's it.
Gameplay is shit, story is shit, cutscenes are shit.
Also, everything is brown and gray.
>It looks great and has a good, rock-solid frame rate to boot
>It's also weird to see people do that "lol movie!" meme on MGS4, when it has exactly the same cutscene:gameplay ratio as MGS2, with the HUGE benefit of having actual real-time FMVs, instead of mere talking heads in Codec.
Because you can fast forward through codec dialogs so you can shorten drastically without skipping altogether,
...people do that?
I was always furious as fuck if I even accidentally pressed a skip-forward button in past MGS games, as it meant I'd be missing on the voice-acting and sound effects.
I played the entire franchise for MGSV, and i'm simply amazed at the sheer drop of quality after MGS3.
MGS3 was actually really good, while MGS4 is a legitimately bad videogame.
Seriously, I think I hate it almost as much as Mass Effect 3, but at least Mass Effect 3 didn't leave me constantly begging for gameplay to come back.
The first two chapters happen in really boring and uninspired places, the third is a 2 hour long chase, 4 is fanservice butchered by the Dwarf Geckos and an annoying boss fight, and the last one has almost no gameplay.
The codec is absolute garbage compared to what came before, both in terms of content, people to talk to, and conversations.
The Drebin store giving you pretty much free ammo, all those guns that you aren't supposed to use, and that even if you use, the TPS mechanics are below average...
The only good thing is not having to crawl around menus to change your camo, I didn't like anything else.
And the story feels so fucking half assed, as if Konami was pointing a gun to a half-asleep Kojima and forcing him to write a closure to the story.
Seriously?
Big Boss' codec team is the fucking illuminati?
The 20 year old nigga who was midly interested in guns?
The adorable movie-lover who talked to you constantly and begged you to watch movies she liked?
The goofy commander who suggested you should carry a snake-shaped gun?
What's worse, Zero, the one who reminded you every time you talked to him that you have to kill The Boss, suddenly wants to follow her ''will''?
Terrible fucking game that I will never, EVER replay.
imo soild deserved a better game, mgs4 ain't bad but more gameplay would soften the blow from the amount of cutscenes
Damn kojima trying to be post mordern in 2 made him hate solid for no good reason.
>When MGS gives you control, it's pure and legit, even videogame-y gameplay.
Shame the gameplay in MGS1, 2, 3 and 4 is pure garbage.
He wasn't half asleep
he wanted to kill the franchise
>Shame the gameplay in MGS1, 2, 3 and 4 is pure garbage.
No, it's not. It's sheer brilliance, and I miss the times when games gave you that much of strategic freedom and pure, sometimes single-use-only TECHNOLOGY to fool around with.
Sorry that they do not play like your wannabe stealthy shooter games of 2010s.
>he wanted to kill the franchise
he outdid himself with V, in any case
>clunky as fuck in general
>only MGS4 allows you to walk crouched
>retarded, indie game-tier menu
>literally the worst shooting mechanics ever made
> that much of strategic freedom
What fucking freedom?
You have a bunch of corridors, and you have to sneak through, that's it.
Going lethal is only a viable tactic in MGSV because the controls in previous games are pure shit.
>sometimes single-use-only TECHNOLOGY to fool around with
Development time wasted on making the game in general play good.
Not at all, massive critical success, massive sales success, microtransactions that probably made mad money.
If Kojima was still in Konami, and made another MGS, everyone would get hyped and buy it again.
brain damage
A mediocre game that doesn't stand out in absolutely anything.
If it wasn't called MGS, nobody would have cared, and it would have flopped.
>massive critical success
Yeah, except with series' fans. There's plenty of people who think V's dogshit. And I don't just mean Sup Forums.
Considering the score in Metacritic, Steam and the sales, it seems the ''series fans'' are an irrelevant market, which is probably why they went ahead with MG Survive.
MGSV gave some people brain damage.
>clunky as fuck in general
>literally the worst shooting mechanics ever made
Just admit it that these two are synonyms and the only thing that matters for ya.
The games are NOT shooters. They are stealth games. Direct action should be challenging, and thus also rewarding, which is what MGS games did extremely well.
In fact, the unique control schemes made these games much more memorable. Shame that you don't have attention span to actually learn slightly different control mechanisms, that don't follow modern "standards" of Cod/AssCreed shit.
Crouch walk was never a requirement, even more so since you could literally sprint past guards without them realizing you were there. And in 3, you got camos + D-Pad sneaking.
>What fucking freedom?
The fact that you are even asking is a good proof that you are a shallow mouthbreathing casual that NEEDS to have all the choices spelled out for you. Combined with the fact that you see the only "options" being mere Lethal / Non-Lethal even further underlines your shitty Bethesda-tier binary way of thinking, and shows how little time you have spent with the games.
>Development time wasted on making the game in general play good.
Adding in things that make the game feel more alive, and generally more memorable, are not waste of time. In fact, what does that time even cost for you? Especially when the gameplay IS good. In fact, I'd state that MGS5 had shit gameplay, just good controls.
>it seems the ''series fans'' are an irrelevant market
From a financial standpoint, obviously. The fact that V is so popular with the "I haven't played the previous games, can I play this????" crowd speaks for itself, really.
Most normal people got over it quickly, though. From the trailers it looked like Kojima and his team got every single element down for this to be an objective hit. Too bad they shat the bed with magical parasite zombies, incompetent heroes and a villain that does fuck all.
>The games are NOT shooters
Then why even give you lethal weapons if you are not supposed to use them, and you literally CAN'T use them?
>The fact that you are even asking is a good proof that you are a shallow mouthbreathing casual that NEEDS to have all the choices spelled out for you
No seriously, explain.
There's two tactics in MGS1-4: ghosting, and tranquilizing everyone.
In MGSV you have three, ghosting, tranqing, and killing everyone.
>Adding in things that make the game feel more alive
Oh yeah, thank god we have this fucking ice cub melting, it literally fixes the fact that the gameplay is fucking trash.
MGS3 aged worse than MGS4
The controls in 4 are nice and fluid and the combat, stealth and other shit is still fun. Mastering the octocamo is a lot of fun
MGS3 is basically Zelda: Operation Snake Eater. The shooting in that game is a straight disgrace. The forest feels super super linear now, in 2004 it felt a lot bigger
>The shooting in that game is a straight disgrace.
Ah yes, the classic "I can't hold down two buttons without my brain shutting down" argument that casuals use to justify shooting being bad in 2 and 3. Never gets old, frankly.
What would it take for you to beat MGS3 on European Extreme? Does your brain even have the computing power to beat it on hard?
This. As much as I love MGS3, it really plays very linearly and awkwardly, compared to MGS4.
The stories are besides this point. Considering raw gameplay elements, smoothness, level design, etc. MGS4 is probably my favorite out there.
Hi, I beat MGS3 on European Extreme. I agree with him.
>Hi, I beat MGS3 on European Extreme. I agree with him.
That's great, too bad his argument doesn't make any sense. Do you people seriously think that controls that you have to learn to use (that said, they are pathetically easy to grasp, even for a child) are inherently bad?
>Then why even give you lethal weapons if you are not supposed to use them, and you literally CAN'T use them?
Nobody's stopping you, and you literally CAN use them.
>There's two tactics in MGS1-4: ghosting, and tranquilizing everyone.
There's numerous different methods of going both lethal AND non-lethal. There's often more than one route to take, and many ways to traverse those routes. There's different difficulty levels to choose from, which can greatly affect the way you initially need to play the games.
The fact that you count "Tranqing" the only way of going non-lethal is a fact that you've not experimented at all with alternative playing styles, and easily get stuck with your first run's behavior.
>Oh yeah, thank god we have this fucking ice cub melting
Way to trivialize all the impressive details through out the whole series with your limited knowledge of the games. And the gameplay is not trash, you are.
Again with the shooting?
Shooting is fucking fine. You're just not meant to spam it. Also, none of you fags know the ways of CQC ?
>Nobody's stopping you, and you literally CAN use them.
The terrible shooting mechanics are what's stopping me.
>There's often more than one route to take
Yeah, there's normally two corridors.
>and many ways to traverse those routes
Standing still and prone.
>There's different difficulty levels to choose from, which can greatly affect the way you initially need to play the games.
Yeah, you need to be stealthier.
>The fact that you count "Tranqing" the only way of going non-lethal
I literally mentioned ghosting.
>Way to trivialize all the impressive details
They are dumb shit like the ice cube or blowing up the food sheds in MGS3.
Who fucking cares, make the gameplay better instead of wasting your time in that stupid crap.
>And the gameplay is not trash, you are.
>no u
Great.
>make the gameplay better
=
>put in a chicken hat that makes the guards laugh at you
>remove the bosses entirely
>make stealth pathetically easy
>kill any sort of impressive level design
>kill any sort of impressive detail
?
>The terrible shooting mechanics are what's stopping me.
The mechanisms are fine. How about you just don't try to play it like a shooter?
>Yeah, there's normally two corridors.
lemme guess, you think MGS4 only ever has one route to take too?
>Standing still and prone.
No. Those are forms of movement. I'm clearly talking to an underaged wall.
>Yeah, you need to be stealthier.
Yes, and there's tons more to "being stealthier" than just tranq/walk past. Ever done a non-tranq playthrough of ANY of these games? Didn't think so.
>They are dumb shit like the ice cube or blowing up the food sheds in MGS3.
You're just proving your ignorance even further.
>Who fucking cares, make the gameplay better instead of wasting your time in that stupid crap.
I care. The developers cared. Most fans care.
The gameplay was already fine.
Are you suggesting i'm saying MGSV's gameplay is trash?
The controls feel good, but the gameplay of the entire franchise is still absolute shit.
And when a game fails to have good gameplay, it fails at being a good videogame.
The fact that story is the main drive of these says a lot about this, really.
Does kojima really hates solid
Not him, but MGSV, namely TPP, has terrible gameplay. It literally pales in comparison to its prologue game, GZ, alone.
The gameplay in most of the franchise is excelleng. Engaging, varied, fairly open, and just challenging enough to not be boring.
Yes, the story's ONE of the attractive points, but I always played MGS for their stealth gameplay mostly. Getting new gadgets and other gameplay features to try out and exploit in new games was always exciting.
>Are you suggesting i'm saying MGSV's gameplay is trash?
No, retard, I AM suggesting that it is trash. "Gameplay" is more than just how Snake controls, you fucking chode.
>And when a game fails to have good gameplay, it fails at being a good videogame.
Which is why I'm surprised that casuals defend V so much, it literally, objectively has the worst gameplay in the series. And a plot that's worse than Ghost Babel.
>The mechanisms are fine
No they are not.
>How about you just don't try to play it like a shooter?
I didn't, I never used a weapon because the way they control is simply bad.
The worst shooting mechanics ever made.
>lemme guess, you think MGS4 only ever has one route to take too?
In the first chapter you have many, then in the second one you just have one, wide corridor, except one house which is in your way.
Then 3 is linear since you need to follow a dude, the fourth is pretty linear too, and 5 has only about 5 minutes of sneaking gameplay.
>No. Those are forms of movement. I'm clearly talking to an underaged wall.
Then explain those.
You talk a lot about how there's a lot of freedom, but you never post any examples.
>Yes, and there's tons more to "being stealthier" than just tranq/walk past
Really?
>Ever done a non-tranq playthrough of ANY of these games?
You mean ghosting? AKA walking and sneaking past guards?
>You're just proving your ignorance even further.
Why?
>I care. The developers cared. Most fans care.
And this is why the franchise is a gigantic joke, because you care more about that stupid crap instead of what makes a videogame, a videogame.
I belated the game both stealth and by killing everything in my path, and I must say, killing everyone is amazingly fun, also, the game allows you to drive the greatest metal gear, the almighty rex, what is not to love in this game?
>*Are you suggesting i'm saying MGSV's gameplay is trash?
Sorry, typed wrong.
I agree MGSV's gameplay is pure shit, just like the rest of the franchise, but for different reasons.
>Peace Walker HD
>Don't even bother fixing the no-crawl gimmick
>WOAH DUDE YOU DRIVE THE FUCKING AWESOME METAL GEAR REX THIS GAME IS SO FUCKING EPIC XDD
See?
The only people who like this game are underage twats who kill everyone in MGS.
>what is not to love in this game?
Weird, this is a sentence used only by marketeers.
>Do you people seriously think that controls that you have to learn to use are inherently bad?
Yes. How is this even a fucking question?
The controls make up the physical interface between the game and the user. In what world is it not a good trait, to make this interface as simplistic yet versatile as possible? There's a clear difference between complex controls and bad controls. Bad controls makes simple tasks unnecessarily difficult, or at least not as easy as they could have been. Complex (but good) controls have multiple layers of functionality for the same core function (think different ways to aim, run, jump, depending on the controller input, providing nuance). That's just an example.
Bad controls is NOTHING to revel in.
>I agree MGSV's gameplay is pure shit, just like the rest of the franchise
You can't spout such stupid bullshit without backing it up with arguments. People have been constantly giving arguments why MGSV sucks since last year, yet you fucking people can never give ONE good argument why the gameplay in MGS2 or MGS3 is bad.
>controls are b-bad
>I'm literally too fucking stupid to press L1 and square
You enjoy the killing, that's why.
>No they are not.
Tell me how are they NOT fine then?
>I didn't, I never used a weapon because the way they control is simply bad.
You point them at the enemy, and pull the trigger = bad ?
>In the first chapter you have many, then in the second one you just have one, wide corridor, except one house which is in your way.
That's all I needed to know. You have not played these games enough / properly.
>You mean ghosting? AKA walking and sneaking past guards?
No. Especially in games like MGS3, there's tons of non-lethal (and lethal) options than your firearms. All of which seem to be totally oblivious to you. If you're too lazy and casual to replay the games, then go watch a good LP, like the Super Bunnyhop's non-tranq E.E. run from a year or two back.
>Why?
Because you keep talking bullshit, and don't know some very basic terms.
>And this is why the franchise is a gigantic joke, because you care more about that stupid crap instead of what makes a videogame, a videogame.
Tell me what is a "videogame" then.
Also follow that up with a good defense on why modern games are NOT way worse than everything 10 to 20 years ago?
you don't even seem to know what "gimmick" means. Also why the hell would you even need crawl when crouch-walk exists?
>arguments in favor of MGS controls being shit
>clunky as fuck in general
>only MGS4 allows you to walk crouched
>retarded, indie game-tier menu
>literally the worst shooting mechanics ever made
>arguments against it
>WOW YOU ARE STUPID
>Bad controls is NOTHING to revel in.
All that text and you haven't given one good argument why MGS3, for example, has bad controls.
Yes, Konami is paying shills to promote an obsolete game in a franchise they hate.
>clunky as fuck in general
That's not an argument.
>only MGS4 allows you to walk crouched
You haven't explained why the game lacking a crouch walk is automatically a terrible thing.
>retarded, indie game-tier menu
That's not an argument.
>literally the worst shooting mechanics ever made
Explain why.
When you leave the basement and start getting into "arguments" with your boss at work or your friends, the shit that you're doing here won't work. Just a piece of advice from an adult.
>Actually calling someone shill
>On a 10 years old game
Regardless, you just need to have fun in the game, if you think waiting 5 seconds every time you have to change camo is fun, so be it, no need to get mad
I answered your question, didn't I?
>Tell me how are they NOT fine then?
>the retarded recoil
>can't even move while aiming
>basically completely exposed when firing
>You point them at the enemy, and pull the trigger = bad ?
The fact that you think that's all there is to making shooting mechanics good says a lot.
>That's all I needed to know. You have not played these games enough / properly.
The fact that your argument now is
>YOU HAVE NOT PLAYED IT
says even more.
>No. Especially in games like MGS3, there's tons of non-lethal (and lethal) options than your firearms
CQC?
>Because you keep talking bullshit
>you are stupid
>why
>BECAUSE YOU SAY DUMB THINGS
Excellent argument.
>Tell me what is a "videogame" then.
For a videogame to be a videogame, you can do a simple test.
Strip everything, story, setting, characters, everything, leave only the gameplay sections.
If that stands on it's own, then you succeeded, if they don't, if it's a mediocre thing, then you have failed as a developer.
>Also follow that up with a good defense on why modern games are NOT way worse than everything 10 to 20 years ago?
That's a really random request.
Seriously, where did that come from?
This could have been a nice thread
You said something obvious in an entire paragraph, yes. There are complex controls which are good and there are ones that just needlessly complicate things, yes.
I agree with this, sure. Still don't know how that applies to MGS3 through. You want to run in circles a more or will you give me some arguments?
>That's not an argument.
How is it not?
>You haven't explained why the game lacking a crouch walk is automatically a terrible thing.
Because it's a FUCKING SNEAKING GAME, CROUCHING SHOULD BE ONE OF THE MOST BASIC SHIT YOU HAVE IN IT.
>That's not an argument.
Not an argument either.
>Explain why.
>can't move while shooting
>retarded amount of recoil
>for some reason, it goes into first person mode if you need to aim properly even though it's a third person game
EEENGUGHHH GAME FEEL
The fact that not having to crawl around menus is the only thing you can come up with says a lot about the laughable failure that MGS4 is.
...
The quality of the thread is directly tied to the quality of the game.
>the retarded recoil
How is recoil ever "retarded"? In fact, that's one of the most basic things that should be in ALL games.
>can't even move while aiming
False. Just stop typing already.
>basically completely exposed when firing
Negative. That's also all up to you and your positioning. Even if we'd pretend that was the case, we could always argue that it is kind of the *point* too; you take a risk trying to lethally take down foes. It's kind of the same thing with OG Resident Evil games.
>The fact that you think that's all there is to making shooting mechanics good says a lot.
Well, what else is there?
The fact that the OG games separate bringing up the gun for aiming & actually firing them is brilliant in my opinion, underlining the idea of them not being shooter games.
>CQC?
yes, that's ONE of them.
>excellent arguments
so are your "this and that are SHIT!"
>If that stands on it's own, then you succeeded
So the MGS games succeed? Great!
The VR games / training missions are great proof for this.
Also, you really love to diminish everything games can be, and have been. Videogames are a form of omni-media, that can combine just about ALL other media forms and formats into one lovely hotpot, providing extremely different kind of experiences.
Trying to apply Super Mario -tier design philosophy to all other games and genres is very counter-intuitive and ultimately destructive even.
>Seriously, where did that come from?
Maybe if you'd think more than 2 seconds, you'd figure that out.
>How is it not?
Because if you want to say that something is clunky, you have to back it up?
>Because it's a FUCKING SNEAKING GAME, CROUCHING SHOULD BE ONE OF THE MOST BASIC SHIT YOU HAVE IN IT.
But MGS3 has crouching? Crouch-WALKING makes the game easy as fuck and isn't a necessary component for the game to be good though, and I don't see you making any arguments why it would be.
>can't move while shooting
It's not a shooter, either you get good at aiming and shooting that's in the game and deal with the alert states or you approach things carefully and aim from a standing position. By the way, you can move while shooting, it involves pressing more than one button at the time though.
>retarded amount of recoil
Guns have recoil when you shoot them, do you want there to be none?
>it goes into first person mode if you need to aim properly
In a third person fucking game with set camera angles and different terrain height, yes.
As I said, you have no fucking idea how to use sound arguments to.. you know, argue for your own opinion. Don't they teach that sort of shit at school now?
I'm not defending the game, I just said that killing everyone is fun
MGS4 is the only game in the entire series I've never replayed.
It was forgettable as fuck and every scene just felt like forced fanservice in a bad way
>look at all the characters you know interacting with eachother! flashbacks to previous scenes! references to every other entry!
When you got references in MGS3 they were subtle foreshadowing, they didn't shove it down your fucking throat.
>How is recoil ever "retarded"?
Sorry, should have specified, the retarded amount of recoil.
Big Boss is the ''best soldier of the 20th century'', and can shoot an AK-47 properly?
>False. Just stop typing already.
It's true though.
>Negative
How is it not?
>Well, what else is there?
Let's put an example, do you think DOOM, Call of Duty, Battlefield and Titanfall have the exact same gunplay?
>yes, that's ONE of them.
How about, for once, you offer an example?
You say there's COUNTLESS of those, yet you simply haven't given a single one.
>so are your "this and that are SHIT!"
Because they feel like shit and control like shit.
>So the MGS games succeed?
It doesn't, though.
>The VR games / training missions are great proof for this.
Why?
I tried them and they have the same garbage mechanics from the main game.
>Videogames are a form of omni-media,
False.
A videogame stands out due to the gameplay.
Every single other part of it is unnecesary.
>providing extremely different kind of experiences.
With different genres that have different types of gameplay.
>very counter-intuitive and ultimately destructive even.
This is one of the cancers that MGS has helped implement in the industry, the ''cinematic'' games.
It's not, and if your game revolves around that, your game is a failure and you should focus on a different industry, because you clearly don't care about making a videogame.
>Maybe if you'd think more than 2 seconds, you'd figure that out.
So we continue the trend of you not explaining absolutely anything you say.
Gotcha.
>It was forgettable as fuck
No idea how anyone can say that.
MGS4 had that same "I'M NUCLEARRR!!" -tier hype and melancholic feels going on with it at the time, with the exception of #4 actually delivering with its promises.
People seriously seem to forget that MGS4 was indeed meant to be the very last MGS game / by Kojima, ever.
>Crouch-WALKING makes the game easy as fuck
That's why you balance games around that.
And even then, you have the goddamn tranq gun which makes being sneaky pointless.
>isn't a necessary component for the game
Not all.
It is if you are making a sneaking game, though.
>Guns have recoil when you shoot them, do you want there to be none?
I want the ''legendary mercenary'' to not handle a weapon like a 10 year old.
>In a third person fucking game with set camera angles
Not since MGS3, and even then, what prevents it from going into proper third person mode?
>different terrain height
What does this have to do with anything?
>People seriously seem to forget that MGS4 was indeed meant to be the very last MGS game / by Kojima, ever.
So was MGS3
OP you need to be 18 to post on Sup Forums
No, the game was a fucking chore to play through.
>with the exception of #4 actually delivering with its promises.
I wasn't there for launch, did MGS4 promise me a piece of shit full of hour-long cutscenes that would make me fall asleep, and also beg for gameplay to come back?
>People seriously seem to forget that MGS4 was indeed meant to be the very last MGS game / by Kojima, ever.
So what? It was fucking terrible and one of the worst written endings to a franchise ever.
>HEY GUYS, I HEARD YOU LIKED MGS3, SO HERE'S BIG BOSS TO EXPLAIN WHAT THE FUCK JUST HAPPENED, YES, BIG BOSS HAS BEEN REVIVED A SECOND TIME
>Hey, Boss, thank god I finally understood your message telling me that I shouldn't have done FUCKING ANYTHING AT ALL after Operation Snake Eater since the world just ended up the same
>Hey Snake, don't worry, FOXDIE won't kill you...
>you'll die in 6 months anyway due to the accelerated aging lol
>and now i'm going to die a third time lol
>And even then, you have the goddamn tranq gun which makes being sneaky pointless.
Don't use it or play on a higher difficulty, which will make you deplete your silencer faster and which will put you into positions where you'll reveal yourself without being good at sneaking. Thanks to the thought-out level design, that one thing that V lacks entirely.
>That's why you balance games around that.
Or you deal with the perfectly fine control scheme that they've set up for 3 without being a fucking crybaby. Your only argument for sneaking in 3 being clunky is that it doesn't have crouch walking?
>It is if you are making a sneaking game, though.
Another wonderful argument from a middle-schooler. Don't bother denying that, it doesn't matter.
>I want the ''legendary mercenary'' to not handle a weapon like a 10 year old.
Why is he handling a weapon like a ten year old? I played through 3 many times, never got that impression. Learned how to argue yet? I'll wait until you back this up.
>Not since MGS3
Not since Subsistence, you mean.
>what prevents it from going into proper third person mode?
The fact that aiming in first person allows you to aim down the sights of the weapon and be more accurate, and that a third person scheme isn't necessary for the game to play well.
>Don't use it or play on a higher difficulty, which will make you deplete your silencer faster and which will put you into positions where you'll reveal yourself without being good at sneaking.
AKA, instead of using the tranq gun, you ghost.
The two ways to play it.
>Or you deal with the perfectly fine control scheme that they've set up for 3 without being a fucking crybaby
>OH WOW YOU ARE A FUCKING CRYBABY
Kojimadrones, everyone.
>Your only argument for sneaking in 3 being clunky is that it doesn't have crouch walking?
The control scheme, the way the controls feel, the shooting...
Terrible, just terrible.
>Why is he handling a weapon like a ten year old?
Because when you shoot one of the automatic weapons in MGS3 you lose absolute control over it?
Even a fucking 50 year old in a shooting range can shoot better than Solid Snake and Big Boss do in MGS1-3.
Hell, this fucking almost 90 year old can shoot a M60 more accurately than Big Boss does in MGS3.
youtube.com
>Big Boss is the ''best soldier of the 20th century'', and can shoot an AK-47 properly?
But he can. Don't expect a flavor text of the character to mean that you don't need to compensate for recoil.
>It's true though.
It is not, and you'd know it if you actually played the game.
>How is it not?
I just told you. That's exactly part of the TACTICS I mentioned even earlier, but clearly all this amount of thinking fries your brains.
>you think DOOM, Call of Duty, Battlefield and Titanfall have the exact same gunplay?
Why are you bringing modern, shitty AAA console FPS games to this discussion in the first place?
>How about, for once, you offer an example?
-using poisonous animals
-using rotten food
-using environmental traps
-using KO-cigar / the chloroform towel
-using distractions
-Falling on top of guards
...
>Because they feel like shit and control like shit.
They do not. I've seen some literal girls play through them all, just fine on their own.
>I tried them and they have the same garbage mechanics from the main game.
That's your limited, subjective bullshit opinion. Apparently you are not really into stealth gameplay in the first place, so you couldn't even enjoy the engaging challenge they provide in the first place. No wonder all the other series turned into blatant shooters these last two generations.
>False.
No, you are false.
Many developers, specialists, researches and even plain gamers agree on this. You are just limited to your 1985-era thinking, trying to justify why you suck at games that require more than one button press to win.
>With different genres that have different types of gameplay.
yes, and you can have numerous games of same "genre", and still have vastly different gameplay. Does not mean that everything would have to follow one single mold; that's exactly one thing ruining so many modern games.
>the ''cinematic'' games.
MGS is nowhere near like modern "cinematic" shit games tho'.
You sound like you were born in 1997.
>No, the game was a fucking chore to play through.
It was not. It was enjoyable and smooth as fuck, with most scenes being memorable and emotion-loaded as hell.
>I wasn't there for launch,
...so why would we have to care about what you claim to know?
>did MGS4 promise me a piece of shit full of hour-long cutscenes that would make me fall asleep
Sounds like a severe case of narcolepsy, lack of immersion, lack of interest towards the ENDING of the long-running series, and overall shit taste to me.
>It was fucking terrible and one of the worst written endings to a franchise ever.
Negative. It was a damn good ending considering Kojima wasn't even allowed to have his original vision and really KILL Solid & Otacon as warcriminals.
Besides floor and wall textures it's fine.
>Don't expect a flavor text of the character to mean that you don't need to compensate for recoil.
Which he doesn't.
He just holds the gun, and presses the trigger.
>That's exactly part of the TACTICS I mentioned even earlier
Is there a tactic which ads the option of being able to fire from cover?
>Why are you bringing modern, shitty AAA console FPS games to this discussion in the first place?
To make a point.
Those weapons have different gunplay, better or worse, you know why?
Because there's more to it than just ''aim and shoot''.
>-using poisonous animals
>-using rotten food
>-using environmental traps
>-using KO-cigar / the chloroform towel
>-using distractions
Oh, so you mean different kinds of weapons, not tactics.
> I've seen some literal girls play through them all, just fine on their own.
Anecdotal evidence?
Seriously?
>Many developers, specialists, researches and even plain gamers agree on this
The ones who make terrible videogames, and casuals, of course.
>Does not mean that everything would have to follow one single mold; that's exactly one thing ruining so many modern games.
No, what's ruining videogames is focusing on anything but the gameplay.
>MGS is nowhere near like modern "cinematic" shit games tho'.
No, MGS simply has countless and long cutscenes, forgetting for some moments that it's supposed to be a videogame.
>You sound like you were born in 1997.
Ah, personal attacks, not surprised.
>It was enjoyable and smooth as fuck
Not really.
Only the first two chapters have actual gameplay, and the enviroment was boring as fuck.
>most scenes being memorable
Due to how cringeworthy, long and unnecesary they are?
>emotion-loaded
Sounds like a buzzword used by Tumblrinas.
>...so why would we have to care about what you claim to know?
Oh, so my opinion is not valid because my vision isn't distorted by your pathetic nostalgia goggles?
>Sounds like a severe case of narcolepsy, lack of immersion, lack of interest towards the ENDING of the long-running series
Yes, MGS was fine, and 4, and it being a piece of shit is what made me stop getting interest in the ending more and more.
>overall shit taste to me.
What's there to like in this snoozefest?
Le epic cyborg Raiden who listened too much to Linkin Park songs?
David Hayter's performance which makes it seem as if he's about to puke all the way?
Sunny burning eggs and suddenly making them fine and that being all the character development she has since she was just a plot device to beat the Patriots, something that shouldn't have been possible since they were necessary?
>OH, BUT SHE MANAGED TO SEPARATE THE PATRIOTS FROM THE SYSTEM
What the fuck?
Let's see, what else...
Nanomachines being the answer to every single mystery of the franchise?
A rusted, old, Metal Gear REX beating a brand new Metal Gear that was built to destroy Metal Gear REXes because of an epic overclock, despite the fact that it's piloted by someone who never piloted a Metal Gear, and that pilot being virtually a 70 year old?
EVERYTHING about the ending which I already explained?
The retarded Gears of War-tier boss fights and the cringeworthy and melodramatic stories of why I should feel bad for killing them?
Will continue in next post.